wow... good luck.

its difficult to convince an esfj of anything. when in conversation with them, i usually just smile and nod. and talk about clothes. and the weather.

this isnt to say your situation is hopeless - as you should try to have good relations with your mother.

however, i think, quite honestly, that you have a huge personality difference between the two of you. just because shes your mother, doesn't change this fact. and frankly, just because youre related to someone doesnt mean you have to be friends with them.

i would do just as you have done. avoid conflict. and spend time away from her and out of the house.

 

LOL, we can't even talk about the weather or clothes.

If we talk about clothes, 3 minutes into the conversation, it becomes about how I need to dress more feminine, etc, etc. If we talk about the weather, it somehow turns into a discussion on how the weather affects health and how I'm a bad steward of my health... (I usually nod when she says all this stuff, though; I no longer try to explain that the weather didnt cause my surgery and that wearing frills/lace wont make me prettier)

Alas, I'm at a loss of what to do. In the past, I tended to approach my mom once she was calm, apologized sincerely and tried to engage in some activity with her (like tagging along with her grocery shopping, helping her around the house). Surprisingly, this keeps her angry longer. I don't know WHY.

 

I can relate. My dad's an ESFJ and it's pretty much the same. Unfortunately, I haven't found any solutions yet. He's been improving, though, at the goading of a lot of people around him to be more aware of his actions and with lots of time spent isolated from the rest of the family. Not sure if this will help, but try making your other family members talk to her about avoiding conflict because it's your last summer there?

 

To the poster above:
I sorta figured out a solution for when I'm away -- I send periodic (positive) updates about how my life is progressing, send cards on appropriate occasions, send gift cards to my mom's favorite stores with a thoughtful message. Never, never let them in on negative things unless you're prepared to face an endless bombardment of nagging and digging for details. Also, ESFJ parents tend to get really upset when they hear things aren't going well for their family, so they get really emotional and spark an argument about a completely off-topic.

BUT, I still haven't found a solution for head-on clashes that occur when we live together.

 

How to train your dragon....um..I mean your mother :laughing:I'll tell you what we do in our household. My older sister likes to mess with her mind, get her all worked up on a subject and then unleash her on someone else in the room. My brother just tells her what she wants to hear and then makes himself scarce...to the point that she is not mad or reminded of anything he did (unless my sister brings it up). I've learned a long time ago that if it is a sensitive subject with me...best just to keep it to myself until it's less so and can be discussed at least logically. Otherwise she does give as good advice as she can within her scope. I take what she has to say with a lot of salt, there will be conflict, there will be yelling at times on both parts but not to the point of tears. Tears means you have overshot that invisible line in the sand. Always there are apologies afterward for losing our cool....well let's be realistic on my part at least most of the time but it is important for the sake of maintaining a relationship and communication.

I guess at the end of the day we all know we can't change each other so don't bother trying, mom is "crazy" but she means well and if you have gotten the mild mannered INFJ in the family so upset that she "INFJ doorslams" you best change your technique and attitude the next time she enters the room. In a way, over time we have all trained each other as to how the other person is to be treated. The important thing is that everyone speaks their mind in the household whether we all like what the other has to say or not. I feel for you though....I don't care for the ganging up part. That never really happened in my family as there is always someone who will play the "devil's" advocate just for the sake of disturbing the balance of power. Sometimes disturbing that balance is just what you need to help a person to see things from a different perspective...just make sure you do it judiciously. :wink:

 

Learning about personality types has been helping me learn about our differences and avoid conflict (esp. after reading tons of articles about ESFJ moms), but I still feel like we're on completely different wavelengths and our relationship is marked by mutual misunderstandings and unspoken resentment. Although this has been going on for a while, it has escalated as of late.

Sweetie,

This is the reality of the situation.... you and your mother ARE on completely different wavelengths. And your job here is to become "OKAY" with that.--- I am 37 years old and a daughter of an ESFJ. My mother and I will never be on the same page, and trying to "get there".... only led to frustraition on both our ends. ---- I had to "accept her" the way she was, and her me. ---- (This takes time.) But, it does happen. It is getting to the point of the "sensor" and the "intuition": respecting each other equally.

This does come with moving out, and claiming your rights as an equal adult. :wink:

 

I've an ESFJ mother and can relate to so much of what you say - picking up after me, rigid advice, never accepting that she might have been wrong. Even the telling me off for not dressing feminine enough. Then, if I get annoyed, she'll burst into tears, I'll feel bad and end up apologising even tho I've done nothing wrong. It's tiring in the extreme. Then, sometimes I have spent hours talking to her, and we agree on a way forward, which she then instantly forgets and reverts to form.

I've left home now so things are not so bad. Also, I have a really close relationship with my dad - an INTJ - and he understands and has similiar frustrations. I guess I've just learnt to just let her comments be like water off a ducks back. I listen, don't respond and go do my own thing. When she calls, I let her talk, tell her what she wants to hear i.e. have you eaten - yes, are you keeping warm - yes etc

I dunno. I think I;ve just learnt to accept that we will never have the perfect mother -daughter relationship I would like. Instead, there are other older women in my life, an ENFP and an INFP, who are like second mums, and understand me much better. My ESFJ can't and never will fathom, and it cuts both ways, doesn't it!

 

Yes I have an ESFJ in family too. My grandma is ESFJ and mother is ISFJ and so they'd gang up on me with their nitpicking. Yes they can really nitpick on your appearance till you wouldn't know where to hide yourself. If fact I attributed the poor body image I had as a teenager to their never ending stream of criticism about it.

I took it personally when I was younger but after I moved away from them I sort of just dissociated from it. In fact I discovered than in a way they were right about some things that I typically disregarded - the world is mostly a sensor place an xSFJs are providing you with a sensor view point which you should not reject right away. I just took a bird's eye view of things and saw than the xSFJs are just trying to express their concern and love this way. They are not trying to hurt you but guide you the only way they feel is right.

Ultimately what your mother says is her own opinion and I am sure that deep down in her heart she is confident that she is just trying to do the best for you. So don't take her criticisms personally. They should not make you want to cry. You have your own opinion, be confident in it, but understand that conflicting over some things just wastes time and energy. It is very hard to persuade the ESFJ that what she is doing is wrong, so why even try and enter conflict? I just started to behave somewhat passive-aggressively with them - I would comply verbally but would not do much about it in actuality. Occasionally though I would agree with them and follow their advice as a way of compromising. Seeing that they could no longer get any reaction from me, they eased up on it.

 

No you really don't understand how mean an ESFJ may get or how an unhealthy ESFJ is. Maybe an ISFJ may give you a balanced answer. The ESFJ or the ESTJ are the most ego-oriented of all the types

 

are you comfortable with me poking you?

just ask a question to your mother. seems like she is very noseyyy.

 

Wow. It seems that we have something in very common: ESFJ moms!
Only reason I found this thread was becasue I typed "ESFJ mother" on Google and this leaded me closer than I excepted. It leaded me here, to familiar place – Personality Cafe!
It’s a shame that I miss so much in PC.. haha.

Anyway. Reading your story makes me even more sure about my mom's type and it's nice to "meet" people with similar issues.

I don’t get along best with my mom, she’s far away being my best friend. We get along kind of secondary, but I love her a lot.

When I was a little girl she was my idol. But now..wow… I still admire her but as a single person… not so much. She drives me nuts sometimes… I mean.. a lot!

I don’t know if there’s any right way to cope with ESFJ mom.. What I’ve noticed is that they’re very… stuck with your mistakes & faults. Make one mistake and she will remind it forever!

Muteness is a good way to avoid civil war with your ESFJ but… everytime I’m mute while she says something wrong or completely undue I feel that I lose some part of myself… or I just feel that I’m losing my way to breath…or she’s hampering it. It just sucks to hear something completely wrong and you can’t say anything. Well…you can… but it makes things only worse… and you are sick of hearing complainings about you, especially in bad day.
Sometimes I really desire to say something although it feels kind of pointless to say anything… because this only raises the volcano! And it’s scary if its erupts!
Even if I say something completely calculating she starts yelling at me.
Like yesterday..
My sister graduated school so she’s going to university. Unfortunately she’s still confused about what to study.
My mom pushes her with money and prestige but I said that she should study something she truly likes and wants to do… that it’s not about the money, it’s more about passion and likeness…
After saying that my mom start yelling at me(yeah-she has to be right)! And it was just odd… like usual.
Although I wanted to discuss about it I backed off and went to my room. There’s no point of discussion with person who thinks that only she has right and with someone who is clearly boiled up.
Later she came to me and said.“ Oh, I’m sorry, you were right.“ Hmm….then later again she started talking about money and prestige and how important factors they are! She’s very paradoxical.
Hmm… making some little to something so big, seeing ghost where there isn’t….molestation…some more things I dislike about my ESFJ mom.

Muteness is good way to hold eructance back but little war inside of you still continues..
At the same time: with talking you only start a war with ESFJ but at least truth becames into the daylight... but it’s kind of impossible to actually say how it’s right to deal with ESFJ mom.. I think that contiguous bootlicking suits her best..but… you suffer..

I don’t know if that was helpful.. it more about my experience too, hehe. It may sound that I hate her, well..sometimes I dislike her strongly, but… I still lover her, a lot.

And sorry... I just couldn't resist but I'm not INFJ though. I'm INFP actually.

 

Wow. It seems that we have something in very common: ESFJ moms! Only reason I found this thread was becasue I typed "ESFJ mother" on Google and this leaded me closer than I excepted. It leaded me here, to familiar place – Personality Cafe! It’s a shame that I miss so much in PC.. haha. Anyway. Reading your story makes me even more sure about my mom's type and it's nice to "meet" people with similar issues. I don’t get along best with my mom, she’s far away being my best friend. We get along kind of secondary, but I love her a lot. When I was a little girl she was my idol. But now..wow… I still admire her but as a single person… not so much. She drives me nuts sometimes… I mean.. a lot! I don’t know if there’s any right way to cope with ESFJ mom.. What I’ve noticed is that they’re very… stuck with your mistakes & faults. Make one mistake and she will remind it forever! Muteness is a good way to avoid civil war with your ESFJ but… everytime I’m mute while she says something wrong or completely undue I feel that I lose some part of myself… or I just feel that I’m losing my way to breath…or she’s hampering it. It just sucks to hear something completely wrong and you can’t say anything. Well…you can… but it makes things only worse… and you are sick of hearing complainings about you, especially in bad day. Sometimes I really desire to say something although it feels kind of pointless to say anything… because this only raises the volcano! And it’s scary if its erupts! Even if I say something completely calculating she starts yelling at me. Like yesterday.. My sister graduated school so she’s going to university. Unfortunately she’s still confused about what to study. My mom pushes her with money and prestige but I said that she should study something she truly likes and wants to do… that it’s not about the money, it’s more about passion and likeness… After saying that my mom start yelling at me(yeah-she has to be right)! And it was just odd… like usual. Although I wanted to discuss about it I backed off and went to my room. There’s no point of discussion with person who thinks that only she has right and with someone who is clearly boiled up. Later she came to me and said.“ Oh, I’m sorry, you were right.“ Hmm….then later again she started talking about money and prestige and how important factors they are! She’s very paradoxical. Hmm… making some little to something so big, seeing ghost where there isn’t….molestation…some more things I dislike about my ESFJ mom. Muteness is good way to hold eructance back but little war inside of you still continues.. At the same time: with talking you only start a war with ESFJ but at least truth becames into the daylight... but it’s kind of impossible to actually say how it’s right to deal with ESFJ mom.. I think that contiguous bootlicking suits her best..but… you suffer.. I don’t know if that was helpful.. it more about my experience too, hehe. It may sound that I hate her, well..sometimes I dislike her strongly, but… I still lover her, a lot. And sorry... I just couldn't resist but I'm not INFJ though. I'm INFP actually.

The problem with muteness is you start to build up resentment for yourself and your inner child no longer trusts you to keep him/her safe. It's deciding to keep peace with her or your inner child.

 

I can relate, as I have an ISFJ mother and they have similar tendencies to an ESFJ (plus, I've lived with two ESFJs... so it me it has felt like I have been unable to escape the world of SFJs). I will say that at least ESFJ's can systematically ask for your "daily report".. my ISFJ mother seems to do this on occasion, but a lot of times she's just checking to see if I'm getting all my daily details done. Like ask me and drive me crazy over where I am going to buy a mop for my apartment and when I am going to do that... even though I'm living 2 hours away and its not like she's coming to clean it. Its like she lives in this little box and is unable to see that there are other ways of living outside of this box that are perfectly okay.

I wish I could give advice, but right now I can't... I can just be empathetic.

 

Well would you look at that, my mother is also an ESFJ. A very unhealthy one at that.

I think water said it best- you two will never be on the same wavelength. The most you can do is accept that. You can't control how she acts towards you, so it's wasting time and energy to stress out over it. You can only control how you react to the situation.

I do understand how you feel tho :mellow:

 

I'm new to the forum and been looking for a bit of advice and yours is the very same conclusion that I came to after a heated argument with my ESFJ mother and that is that I will never see eye to eye with her... I love her and am grateful to have her in my life but she comes off as self-righteous and entitled at times and I often get frustrated at her for pointing out everybody else's flaws but never seem to bother to reflect on her own misgivings.

But yeah, like you said. I can only control how I react to the situation even though it'll probably be a pain to bottle up your frustrations; in the long run I think we'll be able to cope. :happy:

 

Another problem is her constant nagging and treating me like a child, commenting on really touchy issues. Trust me, my ESFJ mom really knows how to hit all the spots that hurt. Although I rarely cry, my mom has made me cry SEVERAL times. It's frustrating because she picks out flaws about things I can't really change. Also, she has no sense of privacy and my sense of cleanliness essentially does not exist. Although I consider myself to be very neat, orderly and clean, she will pick at everything in my room that's not clean. It's frustrating because she tells my entire family and family friends that she's always picking up after me. That's not true! She does so for the rest of the family, but I am REALLY protective and careful with my belongings. It bothers me that she KNOWS how I am with my stuff, but tells everyone what a messy slob I am. Overall, her nagging, constant digging into my life leaves me yelling "leave me alone, leave me alone, please, just leave me alone."

I also have an ESFJ mother and she's always nagging and treating me like a child too, and I'm 34. She won't even let me make my own breakfast without hovering over me to make sure I don't screw it up.
This doesn't change.

Yes, No sense of privacy. That has never changed with my mother either

And YES, the nit picking about cleaning -- it's never good enough. EVER. And YES she makes a point of telling every single family member about how "messy" I am. Even though she says it's my "only " flaw, she beats it like a dead horse and never misses an opportunity to bring it up, even at special family occassions. she thinks she's being cute and teasing me, but it makes me really angry. I don't think she sees how it might be humiliating for me.

Another thing, she always gives me "advice" that is very rigid and black/white. Literally, there's no other way to say it -- it's always black and white with her. And I'm always in the wrong. If I even put forward a word of disagreement, she starts yelling at me, and all of a sudden I become the bad guy that picked a fight with her. It's how she blames me for arguments that frustrates me the most, especially because I'm the one always trying to avoid conflict.

O, my mom doesn't yell at me or push advice really. But she does blame me for arguments.

What's worse is how she usually retaliates. Usually after an argument, I need some time and personal space, but I will be willing to make peace, put effort in reconciling the relationshp. With my mom, however, she goes on and on how she was right and I was wrong. She drags the entire family into it and asks them who was right. She also plays favorites with my younger sister, an INTJ, and I have to admit, this REALLY hurts. After we fight, she intentionally plays favorites and gives me the silent treatment. Remember, because *I* was wrong, the entire family can't help but side with her and I'm like the black sheep of the family. Whenever I try to have some bonding time with other family members, she always butts in and points out negative things, flaws, etc, so a moment of bonding is really rare.

Yes, going on about how she's right... a little my Mom does this. Even when we've discussed the issue and come to an agreement she's still convinced she was in the right and feels like she's being "noble" by "letting it go". Though of course, it's never really gone.

My mother also drags the whole family into it, tries to be all diplomatic but if sb. disagrees with her, she throws her hands up and goes on a guilt trip that usually involves how ungrateful and unappreciative we all are.

When I was more naive, I tried talking to my mom about some of these things -- how I felt, etc -- but those resulted in a huge misunderstanding and resulted in a major argument (even though I was only trying to talk to my mom about how I felt about certain things). Nowadays, I walk around on pins and needles, but this has had a negative toll on my relationship with other family members who are only there to see me blow up since they don't understand everything.

O, noooo have to be very careful what you say to ESFJ mothers! hehe. They're very sensitive and take just about everything as a personal criticism.

Argh… I have a huge migraine right now so I'll stop here. But yeah... if anyone has had similar experiences, or could give me some advice on how to best handle this (other than a "talk") I would really appreciate it. After all, this will be my last summer with my parents. I'm planning on moving back (and never coming back) so I'd like to leave the last summer with positive times and memories. and I don't want to fight anymore.

I don't know what to tell you, I've never been successful at solving these "problems" with my mother. They only lessened when I moved out.

The cleaning was always a big issue, so I just make a big show of doing it and telling her what I've done and that helped a little...

Anyway, if it's any consolation it's not you and parents always stop nagging a lot more as you get older and get out on your own and prove to them that you really are capable of taking care of yourself.

As for getting along with her now, ESFJ's like to "punish" you by giving you the silent treatment and I've found when I tried to suck up it only makes things worse. My mother always turned around when I started realizing her emotional manipulation and didn't give in to it. Didn't try to "make nice" and ignored her back. They can't stand to think its you that mad at them.

 

I also have an ESFJ mother and she's always nagging and treating me like a child too, and I'm 34. She won't even let me make my own breakfast without hovering over me to make sure I don't screw it up.
This doesn't change.

Yes, No sense of privacy. That has never changed with my mother either

And YES, the nit picking about cleaning -- it's never good enough. EVER. And YES she makes a point of telling every single family member about how "messy" I am. Even though she says it's my "only " flaw, she beats it like a dead horse and never misses an opportunity to bring it up, even at special family occassions. she thinks she's being cute and teasing me, but it makes me really angry. I don't think she sees how it might be humiliating for me.



O, my mom doesn't yell at me or push advice really. But she does blame me for arguments.



Yes, going on about how she's right... a little my Mom does this. Even when we've discussed the issue and come to an agreement she's still convinced she was in the right and feels like she's being "noble" by "letting it go". Though of course, it's never really gone.

My mother also drags the whole family into it, tries to be all diplomatic but if sb. disagrees with her, she throws her hands up and goes on a guilt trip that usually involves how ungrateful and unappreciative we all are.



O, noooo have to be very careful what you say to ESFJ mothers! hehe. They're very sensitive and take just about everything as a personal criticism.


I don't know what to tell you, I've never been successful at solving these "problems" with my mother. They only lessened when I moved out.

The cleaning was always a big issue, so I just make a big show of doing it and telling her what I've done and that helped a little...

Anyway, if it's any consolation it's not you and parents always stop nagging a lot more as you get older and get out on your own and prove to them that you really are capable of taking care of yourself.

As for getting along with her now, ESFJ's like to "punish" you by giving you the silent treatment and I've found when I tried to suck up it only makes things worse. My mother always turned around when I started realizing her emotional manipulation and didn't give in to it. Didn't try to "make nice" and ignored her back. They can't stand to think its you that mad at them.

I think the ESFJ shares this exaggeration thing with the ISFP. It indicates a love for drama for both types. My mother, an ISFP, can say the most outrageous things

 

ESFJ mother here as well. I can't wait till the bitch croaks.

 

Oh wow, thanks everyone for your responses and support. It's been encouraging.

I understand that we will never be on the same page and I honestly appreciate my mother's more admirable qualities, especial when we are getting along. Deep inside, I know she's just trying to do what she thinks is best for me. Even her nagging, and all her motherly nosiness and inquisitive demands are fine with me now.

However, what bothers me is that whenever she has any minute grievance of my behavior, she airs them all out to our entire family. I think in general, this is what bothers me about ExFJ's, not just my mom. I think as FJ's, we react with similar feelings and emotions, but the only difference is that ExFJ's have to air them out to everyone whereas we IxFJ's tend to internalize our thoughts.

Most of the times, I let my mom go on and on and on about some grievance of my behavior. But sometimes… I have to take out the STOP sign. I understand if my mom is in a bad mood and something I did pissed her off, but my mom tends to exaggerate what I did and embellish on the details. I absolutely cannot stand to be accused of embellishments from her imagination.

However, at this point, my INTP dad reacts with "Don't talk back to your mother. She's your mom. Stop being so selfish and ungrateful." and my IxTx younger sibling treats me like the plague. My dad used to take time to hear me out and advise me, however, these days, he goes along with whatever it is my mom complains to him about behind my back. He's been treating me way differently, and I feel hurt that my family ostracizes me like this. I'm tired of trying to connect with my dad and brother on an intellectual and emotional level now. Every time I try to improve things, my mom's complaints supersedes how our relationship becomes defined.

I just feel like the entire world is against me these days. :sad: Yes, I know that is cliche, but nothing is going right! and at the very least, I need the support and emotional bond with my family to have the confidence.

 

I'll just comment that its not just the EXFJ's that vent outward to people and the IXFJs that don't. I've been friends with a few ENFJs and they don't do that -- it always seems to end up being the ESFJs that go out and tell everybody about all of your living situation problems and it drove me insane. Ended up making me feel like everybody is against me and I can't trust anyone to vent because after they heard the ESFJ vent I now look like the bad person.

That being said, my ISFJ mother will do this as well but on a milder way in that she will only vent to a few people rather than like EVERYBODY he/she knows. There have been several times growing up where my mother would start venting about some stupid little thing that I did yesterday to our friends of the family after church and the entire time I just want to go stick my head in a hole.

At least I can say that my father luckily stood up for me in the moments where it was really needed because otherwise I might have ended up living in a box on a street corner.

 

First off...I really really feel for you. I actually understand exactly your frustration since I too have an ESFJ mother. In fact your post sounded as if I wrote it myself. I don't really know what to say other than I can share what has worked for me.

I keep things light and simple. I do not share anything that would be perceived as an invitation to criticism or advice. I can be honest though I have only been trying this "technique" for the last few months. I am 31 and still have a difficult time with it. Mostly because old habits die hard. I have been training myself on catching when I have said too much so now I quickly change the subject.

I say I am a newly discovered INFJ because for the longest time I thought I was an ESTJ, and then an ESFJ myself. My struggle with my "type" ran so deep. Those types never sat well with me and I never truly felt a connection, but I took the inventories a few times and even worked with Linda Berens and went through the Self Discovery Process. Type was my world for 2 years and I still never got it. I settled on what I thought was me. Yesterday, I was rummaging through some old stuff and found my MBTI from when I was 17, pre-life changing surgery and the death of my sister(which happened at 18). My MBTI at 17 was INFJ. I took that in a time in my life where I felt most like me. I feel relieved. I have been reading up a storm now about INFJ and I finally FINALLY feel at peace. Ok, now this is a "title" I can live with.

Also, both my parents have stabilizer temperaments. Mom is ESFJ and dad is ISTJ. I see now how their types sorta took the place of who I was due the events that took place in my life at such a young and critical age. But as I read your post it is clearer than it has ever been. I get it now. I get why my mom and I have NEVER seen eye to eye.

Her black and white viewpoints are represented by a myriad of colors in my mind, although my "ideals" are set. Unfortunately, they 99% conflict with hers.

I wish you luck. But I think the only thing I can say is to separate yourself physically (i.e. move out) and then keep things light. "Things have never been better" should be your motto when talking to the mom.

GOOD LUCK!

 

Her black and white viewpoints are represented by a myriad of colors in my mind, although my "ideals" are set.

like this description. i think it describes the conflict between SJs and NFs very well.

 

I'm sorry for your experience :sad:. I too as an INFJ have an ESFJ mother. We get along fairly well and I think I'm lucky to have as mother like her. However, there is a huge difference with how we see the world, I understand her way, but I think it's beyond her capacity to understand mine - my Ni and Fe, as opposed to her Fe and Si. I hate that she second-guesses my motives and decisions all the time by assuming my decisions will be a. wrong, b. childish and c. uncaring of other people. She just assumes that no-one could be more reliable and correct than her. She says she picks up after me too, but doesn't get that stuff on my bedroom floor isn't anything I have a problem with and it's my space in MY room. Worse still is my ISTJ sister always rallies with her, and with my ENFJ sister living away sometimes I feel victimised and misunderstood by two very scary SJs. My ISTP dad doesn't help as he keeps out of any conflict. SJs do not read between the lines, I always read between the lines, they never trust my insights as they don't have their own. They make me feel like a stupid, naughty child when I'm 18 years old..Just yesterday me and mum had an argument over a martini and lemonade, she insisted it would be a tiny drink, whereas I knew it would be half a pint. She kept saying in a condescending manner, "that was my drink when I was young and it was tiny" and she wouldn't believe me when I had had two in the last few weeks that were a half pint. I mean for goodness sake she was referring the 1980s for evidence. Well I was pretty pleased when my half a pint arrived, and she didn't back down even then - trying a bit and saying "well it's much weaker than what I had". UGH. I could go further on the complaints but I'll shut up now.

The best I can say is explain clearly in literal language what she has done wrong and explain what that does to you (try to keep in calm so she doesn't brush it off as your temper). Also say you understand that she sees things in a certain way, but in order for you to respect that, she needs to value your perspective.

 

I've tried talking to her clearly in literal language before, but she usually brushes me off and says I live in a fantasy world and everything is in my head. Yes, she literally says this. Maybe it's the difference between an N and an S -- maybe it's that I read between the lines or understand the emotional undercurrents of the situation, whereas my ESFJ mom only sees THE lines.

Bleh, I don't even want to go further into details of what's been going on recently. I think I just INFJ "door-slammed" my entire family today. For some reason, I don't even feel angry or frustrated anymore. I'm just blocking everything right now. I think my dad (INTJ) is affected by this negatively; usually I would've responded to my dad at the least, but right now, I just can't deal with everything.

There's something peaceful about being alone in my room today, not having to deal with all this. I think I've had temporary INFJ door slams before, but usually I would feel emotional and frustrated and helpless, and the door slam wouldn't last long. However, today something is different. I feel like yesterday's argument was just the last straw. It's not that I'm angry at them right now or feel spiteful, but I definitely feel the distance I have put between us now. I've definitely forgiven them and "moved on," but these incidents have permanently been engrained into me. I think right now, my mentality is "forgive, but don't forget. mingle, but keep an emotional distance." I feel emotionally numb to everything that happened, and at the same time I don't see any potential for change or understanding.

 

Well...I'm super late here. XD;

But I just want to say, I don't care you who you are, every single person that posted here, I LOVE YOU. Everything you've said is true to the letter!

As I kid I've always had this temperamental ESFP personality, and there were occasional INFJ workings in the background. So, I used to be that mother-clingy child where there was just this perfect happy mother-daughter relationship. Then I hit teen and started developing my true personality, and that was more like an ESFJ mom vs. rebellious underdeveloped temperamental INFJ. And now more into teens, I'm more myself and this mother-daughter relationship is just how all of you describe. And it's driving me insane. Whenever my mom is coming by I just think "KILL ME NOW." And every interaction (even without words, maybe she's just waltzing into my room an rearranging everything I have exactly how I want) I have with my mom just has me mentally screaming "LEAVE ME ALOOONE!"

It's come to the point that I've truly accepted that I don't love my mother (though of course I appreciate her loving and caring and dealing with this spoiled brat all these years) nor do I respect her. But I feel so bad for that, like I'm the most terrible person in the world for this. Especially with her always going on about how I don't show love to her, I seem like I hate her, I never hug or kiss her anymore like when I was a kid but I'm still her baby (?!?!?!), and she wants me to be her baby forever and ever. Well, now it drives me nuts and hurts me more than making me feel guilty. (Except for when she asks "Do you love me?" and I have to lie to her and say "...yes." Then I just feel like I'm going to fly into a million pieces)

Buuut anyway, I really need a better way to deal with this--though, it seems everyone else needed one too. XD; *sigh* All I can really do now is avoid her and avoid talking to her as much as possible. When she's driving me to school or home from school I just sit there looking out the window, have my hands over to the right where she won't be able to grab them (she's...er, very touchy-feely--drives me nuts also; kind of like what @Fira said before with "molestation" XDD) and I just stay silent. If she talks to me, I respond as briefly as possible. Then I'll just block her out as she lectures or nags me about everything I'm doing wrong, and starts going on about me not being loving, etc. I'm not even exaggerating. -_-

Sorry, I guess this sounded more like a rant (though, a small one compared to what I could say) than a plea for help, but I am wondering if anyone has some advice... I just know that attempting to patch this up is impossible and a lost cause--we're too different, we're completely disconnected, she hardly even knows me, she only knows about maybe one-third of what goes on in my life, and honestly...well yeah, you know what I mean. *sigh*

 

Sj's...

I have an ISTJ dad and ESFJ mom. It's fun..

 

I've had an ESFJ mother for 21 years and I'm STILL working on the solution to the problem.

All I know is that it gets better when you're able to move out. And move out ASAP. As much as I value logic, logic NEVER applies to my ESFJ mother.

Sadly, all her guilt manipulation towards me has taught me how to use guilt manipulation. But she's the only one I use it on. Just as she criticizes me, I turn it right back around and criticize her in the same. It's childish, immature, and mean-spirited, but right now, it's the only way I know how to communicate ANYTHING to her.

When she calls me a bad daughter, I try to "think" like she does on how I can turn her own idea of what people "should" be like against her. I'll call out areas where she has failed me as a mother. Then I tell her that I still love her, and that the pain she feels is the same pain I feel when she tells me I'm a terrible person.

I've also noticed that my mother never believes a word I say. Rightfully so, because I've lied to her almost every day since I was 10. (How can I be honest with someone who never takes the time to understand me at all?!) However, when I physically SHOW her evidence to the contrary of what she says, she shuts her trap. Like, when she says I can't hold down a job, I'll show her a copy of my yearly performance review. Or when she says that my split ends are ugly, I'll ask my boyfriend to compliment my hair in front of her face.

As much as I hate playing games, I feel as though I -have- to when it comes to my mother. As afraid of her irrationality as I am, I'm even more afraid of turning into her.....

 

Disclaimer: This is a really long post with 21 years of bottled up frustration.

This is probably my last summer I'm spending with my parents and things have been crazy, to say the least. I'm 21, done with college and until a month ago, I was living on my own. But because of a surgery and the long recovery time, my parents convinced me to move back for just the summer. However, my mom is an ESFJ, I am an INFJ, and well… we don't get along too well.

Where do I begin? First, my mom likes to micromanage the lives of our families whereas I have a very inward directed independence. I somewhat understand why she hates this. She's the type of person that likes the intimacy of when my family members report to her about their day, their motivations, their thoughts, etc, and give her the reign to control and direct their lives. (Me = INFJ = no way).

Another problem is her constant nagging and treating me like a child, commenting on really touchy issues. Trust me, my ESFJ mom really knows how to hit all the spots that hurt. Although I rarely cry, my mom has made me cry SEVERAL times. It's frustrating because she picks out flaws about things I can't really change. Also, she has no sense of privacy and my sense of cleanliness essentially does not exist. Although I consider myself to be very neat, orderly and clean, she will pick at everything in my room that's not clean. It's frustrating because she tells my entire family and family friends that she's always picking up after me. That's not true! She does so for the rest of the family, but I am REALLY protective and careful with my belongings. It bothers me that she KNOWS how I am with my stuff, but tells everyone what a messy slob I am. Overall, her nagging, constant digging into my life leaves me yelling "leave me alone, leave me alone, please, just leave me alone."

Another thing, she always gives me "advice" that is very rigid and black/white. Literally, there's no other way to say it -- it's always black and white with her. And I'm always in the wrong. If I even put forward a word of disagreement, she starts yelling at me, and all of a sudden I become the bad guy that picked a fight with her. It's how she blames me for arguments that frustrates me the most, especially because I'm the one always trying to avoid conflict.

What's worse is how she usually retaliates. Usually after an argument, I need some time and personal space, but I will be willing to make peace, put effort in reconciling the relationshp. With my mom, however, she goes on and on how she was right and I was wrong. She drags the entire family into it and asks them who was right. She also plays favorites with my younger sister, an INTJ, and I have to admit, this REALLY hurts. After we fight, she intentionally plays favorites and gives me the silent treatment. Remember, because *I* was wrong, the entire family can't help but side with her and I'm like the black sheep of the family. Whenever I try to have some bonding time with other family members, she always butts in and points out negative things, flaws, etc, so a moment of bonding is really rare.

By the way, all the things listed above make out my mom to be a pretty bad person. But, those are just the bad things (obviously), and overall, there are MANY great things about my mom that I'm thankful for. Learning about personality types has been helping me learn about our differences and avoid conflict (esp. after reading tons of articles about ESFJ moms), but I still feel like we're on completely different wavelengths and our relationship is marked by mutual misunderstandings and unspoken resentment. Although this has been going on for a while, it has escalated as of late.

When I was more naive, I tried talking to my mom about some of these things -- how I felt, etc -- but those resulted in a huge misunderstanding and resulted in a major argument (even though I was only trying to talk to my mom about how I felt about certain things). Nowadays, I walk around on pins and needles, but this has had a negative toll on my relationship with other family members who are only there to see me blow up since they don't understand everything.

Argh… I have a huge migraine right now so I'll stop here. But yeah... if anyone has had similar experiences, or could give me some advice on how to best handle this (other than a "talk") I would really appreciate it. After all, this will be my last summer with my parents. I'm planning on moving back (and never coming back) so I'd like to leave the last summer with positive times and memories. and I don't want to fight anymore.

My mother is an ISFJ but my situation is identical to yours. I mean, there's not one thing that you mentioned that she didn't do to me. Where to begin? It's a given that she's bossy and will try to invade your privacy and take control of your life, critisise you, blame you, say the things that will hurt you most, won't miss the chance to tell everyone how irresponsible and messy you are and how you don't help with the chores as much as she wants you to. There is not one time we've fought that she didn't run to tell it to the entire family and try to convince them that she was right and I am unforgivable. She absolutely favours my sister after all that.... The hardest part is that she always creates fights out of nowhere, she always yells and make it unbearable for me to live in my own house. She's hysterical, nobody can talk to her or explain to her how he feels or why he did something without having her yelling at him and hold him responsible for the fight. Unfortunately, living around my mother is something I can no longer bare. This is a reality for us, so as you I'm sure, I could continue talking about it and explaining the situation for hours, though it's exhasting and I'd rather not.

Good luck to you too...

 

These are difficult relations, called that of supervision: Supervision-relations where INFJ is supervisor and ESFJ is supervisee. Problem is that supervisee (ESFJ) hits INFJ's most averse area, Si, which in real life can come through as ESFJ demanding that INFJ performs upkeep and chores that INFJ thinks are pointless, but for ESFJ it looks like laziness on INFJ's part.

 

Everything. Literally EVERYTHING you said fits my mom to a freaking point! She's an ESFJ too. Not to mention my father is an ISTJ, so you can imagine the sort of They're both from India and so that exacerbates it because we have a lot of conflicting ideas. She's very narrow minded and it drives me NUTS. I don't wanna get into it right now, but, let me tell you, you are NOT alone!

 

Everything. Literally EVERYTHING you said fits my mom to a freaking point! She's an ESFJ too. Not to mention my father is an ISTJ, so you can imagine the sort of dynamic that our house has... They're both from India and so that exacerbates it because we have a lot of conflicting ideas. She's very narrow minded and it drives me NUTS. I don't wanna get into it right now, but, let me tell you, you are NOT alone!