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ENFP and criticism

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This is a discussion on ENFP and criticism within the ENFP Forum - The Inspirers forums, part of the NF's Temperament Forum- The Dreamers category; I generally welcome and seek criticism, if not directly then indirectly by gauging reactions and adjusting my behavior if necessary. ...

  1. #11
    Unknown

    I generally welcome and seek criticism, if not directly then indirectly by gauging reactions and adjusting my behavior if necessary.
    I agree with @Llyralen , when it's someone I care/look up to/love/admire and generally are close to, I prefer if their criticism (even if blunt) comes with some validation, because it's easy for their opinion to unravel in a full episode of self-questioning and feeling like everything is wrong. Sometimes this is a good thing, other times it's bad. However, if someone is being polite just to manipulate my feelings, I'll know, thought it may not matter in the end.

    I happen to be surrounded more by T types, family and friends and I've come to accept that their form of validation many times is not by being vocal, but just the mere act of choosing to associate/socialize/spend time/ etc with me. I think this is a challenge between T and F communication that often leaves many Fs feeling unsatisfied and Ts confused. In my experience, unfortunately, TJs tend to be far less sensitive and use speech that is more abusive, because they want their will to be done and a usual route for this is to hit where it hurts specifically. TPs will do this only when they're super mad, in my experience.

    The times I get annoyed by criticism is when the person comes to me from their subjective point of view, and having little to no will to actually understand mine and make constructive criticism. 99% of the time, these people are Js and they just want to have control, either directly to achieve their goal or to just make sure there's no divergence from what they view is right.

    The most caring and constructive criticism I've received so far has been from NTPs and my ESFP friends, and they're not always polite about it, but it works. My TJ family members on the other hand.. nope. So I guess it boils down to perspective.

    I did have an ETJ classmate in college who was pretty good at this tho, I don't want to say all Js will always suck at this for me, but perhaps because of the dynamic of our personalities it is rare for this to work well.
    Llyralen thanked this post.

  2. #12

    I don't care if someone is blunt, just don't be a dick about it. I'd rather hear all the problems people have with me than watch them be passive aggressive assholes. The issue I seem to have most is a conflict of interest. I haven't gotten close to one person yet who meshes well with my interests and area of influence, which sucks.

    "The true loneliness is nobody understands you." That one rings true with me...

  3. #13
    ENFP

    I like it blunt. Just say it how it is if you noticed I need improvement or could have done "it" better/ differently. Just don't ever say it in a condescending way unless you want a foot up your ... lol. And don't ever be indirect, it will annoy me and for some reason make me question if I can trust you.

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  5. #14

    I will quote my reply from here :

    A bit like secondpassing, it depends on the intent of the user of the criticism. After all a criticism is merely a tool. One which can be used either to help the subject of criticism to growth, or used to bring down the subject of the criticism and wither their self.
    I enjoy the former use and I loathe the latter one.
    I will develop because it is not truly the whole scope of how I react to criticism.

    I think that criticism in itself will always be a weak point of mine. Because I believed that no one is a better judge to my own self than myself I was pretty guarded about other point of views on myself. But I understood that the intent and way to deliver the criticism was what makes the difference.
    I'm better receptive to an honest and informative approach, where the person explain their opinion on the matter, and let me reflect on my own afterwards or brainstorm with me for solutions to improve, or give me their solutions if I ask.

    If the person come at me expecting to simply agree and do as they says, or worse try to bully me into it....big chance I will simply stubbornly argue my way even if deep down I can objectively see the merit of their criticisms. Not very mature but that the honest answer here. A "don't give me orders, say out my business, does I go about your own business myself ?" attitude.

    In short to reply your questions @Kommandant :

    -"What kind of criticism to you prefer?" : The one coming from a genuine interest to myself and allowing me to self reflect and grow.

    -"Basically what's the worst way to criticize you and what is the best?" : The worst way is the "You are (not)/do(not do) XYZ, now change it to ABC ways, I says so".The best way is "You are (not)/do(not do) XYZ in my opinion, can we discuss it to find ways for both improvement and better understanding of each others ?"

    -"How do you react when you are criticized (depending on the type of criticism)?" Depend on if I recognise the good intent of the other person, and if it pertain to something that can be impacting themselves too. Also, if the other can only give criticism but won't take any, I would be irritated because there is an inequality.

    I usually don't deliver criticisms if not asked (if I do, something is very off and a big warning sign that I'm off balance or the other crossed a deep value), I prefer to explain how I perceive the situation, what can be the different impacts of this situation, solutions if the other party ask for it, and let them do how they want. At least, they know and can't pretend no one wanted to tell them anything and shift the blame.

    Hope it helps !

    Edit : Ah yes, also the "Let's discuss as good friends => the person barely know you, process to beat around the bush, so you lose time trying to figure what is the matter (turning more and more uncomfortable), and they try to bring yourself to do some sort of mea culpa and conform to whatever idea they have, and pretend they do it for someone else/the group when in fact it's because it self reflect badly on them and/or they want you to behave as theywish or cater to their emotions"
    I would rather take infinite amount of "You did it, that's not how to do it, here how to do it, now do it" than one single of this sort of "criticism" above.
    Last edited by VoicesOfSpring; 08-20-2019 at 03:09 AM. Reason: Typos +adding more content

  6. #15

    @Kommandant


    What kind of criticism to you prefer? Polite? Strict? Straight up honest? As nice as possible?
    Basically what's the worst way to criticize you and what is the best?
    How do you react when you are criticized (depending on the type of criticism)?



    Polite - honest would be the type of criticism that is most useful and I highly doubt this is type related. Highly doubt anyone enjoys or want to change if somebody was to yell/scream or nit pick their flaws for no reason
    I also find a being blunt different than being honest

    I tend to tell a person what’s wrong with them in a kind and calm manner - and my point does get across .

    Example my estp son is easily excitable and impulsive when finishing his words or jumping into conclusions or he would sometimes cross the line with words

    Instead of snapping at him “ you are so rude - you are so annoying , how dare you do that “

    I would tell him “ you know there is a difference between playing around and being disrespectful right ? “ and explain to him how disrespectful can hurt or offend someone’s feelings and I know you’re not a disrespectful child “


    When it comes to finishing his work sloppily I would either remind him of a time he did something precisely or provide the information of
    “ you don’t win by being the fastest - look at your end results - what do you think looks better something you put time to work on precisely or something you rush through without thinking ?”

    If somebody was to ask me what that can fix about themselves or what’s wrong with them - I list out their positive traits first - and then tell them what could be improved

    I used to criticize harshly when anger - however after 19 I learned that nobody enjoys hearing their flaws ( even if it’s true ) and there are kinder more effective ways to say things . In the end you want the person to realize and want to improve themselves not tell them what to do.


    I prefer honesty ( keep in mind honesty not bluntness ) kind manners as well, I treat others the way I want to be treated
    Katie Tran and Kommandant thanked this post.

  7. #16

    @Kommandant

    Off topic (sorry) but I made this thread a few weeks ago: https://www.personalitycafe.com/estj...men-women.html

  8. #17

    Quote Originally Posted by Katie Tran View Post
    @Kommandant

    Off topic (sorry) but I made this thread a few weeks ago: https://www.personalitycafe.com/estj...men-women.html
    A thread about ESTJs of course there is no response
    But thanks I feel so honoured, especially hearing this from an ENFP.
    This thread here was made because of an ENFP friend of mine. I agree ESTJ and ENFP fit well. You guys really bring out the best in us.
    Katie Tran thanked this post.

  9. #18

    @Kommandant Where you able to find the material you needed ? What are your own thoughts on criticisms ?

  10. #19
    ENFP - The Inspirers

    Honestly probably none of the above, depending on the source. Am I seeking critique on an art endeavour? Please give me a blunt and honest report, no worries. Am I just trying to do my job and as far as I know I'm doing it quite well? Then please be extremely polite in whatever your request is, and if you attempt any bossing around - I will do the opposite of what you ask.
    Katie Tran thanked this post.

  11. #20

    Quote Originally Posted by Drewski View Post
    Honestly probably none of the above, depending on the source. Am I seeking critique on an art endeavour? Please give me a blunt and honest report, no worries. Am I just trying to do my job and as far as I know I'm doing it quite well? Then please be extremely polite in whatever your request is, and if you attempt any bossing around - I will do the opposite of what you ask.
    Yup, I relate.

    This was the exact problem I had with my ESTJ boss before I quit my work this summer.


     
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