[ENTP] SJs in Asian culture in comparison to SJs in the West

SJs in Asian culture in comparison to SJs in the West

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  • 1 Post By grandpa2390
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This is a discussion on SJs in Asian culture in comparison to SJs in the West within the ENTP Forum- The Visionaries forums, part of the NT's Temperament Forum- The Intellects category; https://www.personalitycafe.com/infj...-sjs-west.html you can just reply in that thread to make it one thread....

  1. #1

    SJs in Asian culture in comparison to SJs in the West

    https://www.personalitycafe.com/infj...-sjs-west.html

    you can just reply in that thread to make it one thread.



  2. #2
    Unknown Personality

    Quote Originally Posted by dragonhead66 View Post
    I assume there are much more Americans here in this community.

    This thread is maybe about the difference between "SJs in Asian culture" and in the West.

    some people don't believe in temperament theory and/or personality typing, believing that environment is more influential in one's personality but for those of us who think that temperament/personality typing is overlooked more than people realize, what could we say is the striking difference between SJs in an Asian culture versus the West?

    Like there are people here who are Americans who have a thing or two to say about SJs (or how much they dislike them, really - I will say most people who come here have a thing to dislike about the SJs maybe because most of the personality types here are N or something) but what more in the Asian culture when they are more traditional and the likes?

    Is it fascinating that most people who come here and dislike the SJ temperament (ESTJ/ESFJ especially) are from the West? How about from the Asian culture where people are supposedly more traditional, conservative, family-oriented and is "expected to follow the path" ? You would think that people who have a thing against 'traditional people who don't want to disrupt the status quo' will be coming from an Asian culture so maybe they have learned to rebel or something but alas, if this is a personality type thing, SJs (the stereotypical symbol for tradition and guardianship- and also somehow a symbol of Asian cultures) seem to be universally hated (atleast in personality typing forums I assume)

    Discuss what you can say about the matter.
    I was unaware that SJs were hated so much. Amazing how much can change in two months.

    here's my take, and perhaps I am wrong. But I don't think anybody here hates the things you say they hate. SJs, traditional, conservative etc.
    Rather, I've always got the impression that people here see those things, not as evil, but as necessary elements of society and "not for them."

    I may not be traditional and family oriented, but I recognize the importance of such things and do not hate them.

    There has to be balance. at the individual level, but especially at the societal level. I'm reminded of Israel around the end of the 1st century BC. There were 3 major sects warring with each other. The Pharisees, the Sadducees, and the Essenes.

    The Pharisees were like the Republicans. They were ultra-conservative and believed that nothing should ever change. that in order to save society, it had to return to the way things were done and believed centuries ago.

    The Sadducees were like the Democrats. They believed that salvation was not found in the past, but in the future. that the old practices/beliefs were no longer relevant and needed to be changed to meet the new generation.

    each of these groups had a bit correct and a lot wrong. we should adapt and evolve to meet the needs and demands of the future, but we shouldn't forget our roots. To be on either extreme leads to ruin. you can't get stuck in the past. but you can't throw the past in the trash and start from scratch everyday either. The past holds too many lessons.

    The point I'm trying to make is this. Those people you are describing that hate the SJs for there conservativeness and so forth, are just as wrong in their liberalness. We may take issue with some SJs. but for at least some of us, that issue is with those who refuse to adapt, not for their unwillingness to completely, unhesitantly, throw the past out the window.

  3. #3

    Quote Originally Posted by grandpa2390 View Post
    I was unaware that SJs were hated so much. Amazing how much can change in two months.

    here's my take, and perhaps I am wrong. But I don't think anybody here hates the things you say they hate. SJs, traditional, conservative etc.
    Rather, I've always got the impression that people here see those things, not as evil, but as necessary elements of society and "not for them."

    I may not be traditional and family oriented, but I recognize the importance of such things and do not hate them.

    There has to be balance. at the individual level, but especially at the societal level. I'm reminded of Israel around the end of the 1st century BC. There were 3 major sects warring with each other. The Pharisees, the Sadducees, and the Essenes.

    The Pharisees were like the Republicans. They were ultra-conservative and believed that nothing should ever change. that in order to save society, it had to return to the way things were done and believed centuries ago.

    The Sadducees were like the Democrats. They believed that salvation was not found in the past, but in the future. that the old practices/beliefs were no longer relevant and needed to be changed to meet the new generation.

    each of these groups had a bit correct and a lot wrong. we should adapt and evolve to meet the needs and demands of the future, but we shouldn't forget our roots. To be on either extreme leads to ruin. you can't get stuck in the past. but you can't throw the past in the trash and start from scratch everyday either. The past holds too many lessons.

    The point I'm trying to make is this. Those people you are describing that hate the SJs for there conservativeness and so forth, are just as wrong in their liberalness. We may take issue with some SJs. but for at least some of us, that issue is with those who refuse to adapt, not for their unwillingness to completely, unhesitantly, throw the past out the window.
    I just get the impression that SJs (especially ESTJ/ESFJ) are more often than not to be discussed as the "least favorite" or "disliked" - especially in cases of "What types do you dislike the most?". For example, at the ESFJ forum one of the most popular thread if not the most popular is the thread "Why do people dislike ESFJs?". In real life probably that doesn't happen but I think my impression (which kinda surprised me because admittedly, I thought I was the only one who has issues with them) of that is happening mainly in typology forums since most of the people here are introverted, intuitive types.
    grandpa2390 thanked this post.

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  5. #4
    Unknown Personality

    Quote Originally Posted by dragonhead66 View Post
    I just get the impression that SJs (especially ESTJ/ESFJ) are more often than not to be discussed as the "least favorite" or "disliked" - especially in cases of "What types do you dislike the most?". For example, at the ESFJ forum one of the most popular thread if not the most popular is the thread "Why do people dislike ESFJs?". In real life probably that doesn't happen but I think my impression (which kinda surprised me because admittedly, I thought I was the only one who has issues with them) of that is happening mainly in typology forums since most of the people here are introverted, intuitive types.
    Well you would find threads like that on other subforms too. the INTP forum, ENTP, INTJ (probably the most hated type), etc. Everyone gets a little hate. I'd say the difference is that of security. INTPs, INTJs, etc. they don't care if everyone hates them (or they are too socially awkward to realize it). So you probably won't find too many threads about that. And when you do, you will probably find a lot of sarcasm and silliness.

    I will say that, while I don't find a lot of hatred for SJs here, they are often looked down upon. Particularly by the xNxx's They are the most common type. They get a bad rep for not being very creative or intelligent. Which is undeserved. I have an NF friend whose husband is an SJ. He hate MBTI and refuses to have anything to do with it because it paints him as being common, boring, etc. not special.

    He doesn't care that SJs are critical to society. Sure he likes the complement of being dependable and so forth. But in the end, It doesn't matter how important you are, everyone wants to feel like they are unique, special. and SJs don't really get that from MBTI. MBTI seemingly goes out of its way to paint SJs as being the all important Donkeys/Camels of society. They are not the traveler or the merchant. They play an important role as that of an obedient servant to the other types. carrying all the burden with none of the glamor.

    anyways...
    dragonhead66 thanked this post.


 

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