istj or istp! i think entj or estj would run them over.
This is a discussion on What characteristics do ESFPs women like in a guy? within the ESFP Forum - The Performers forums, part of the SP's Temperament Forum- The Creators category; istj or istp! i think entj or estj would run them over....
istj or istp! i think entj or estj would run them over.
The ENTJ and ESFP get along great. But at the end of the day the best partner for the ESFP is the INTJ, they both share the same functions but in complete different order so they cover up each others weaknesses perfectly.
I am an INTJ male that was married to an ESFP woman for five years. In our case, the relationship was terrible; as a rational, it is always my intent to not allow bias to affect my evaluation of this sort of thing and I can usually do this by default. However, years of an abusive and exploitative relationship with her actually makes this a bit difficult for me.
-She always needed to be the center of attention, which could sometimes mean insulting people and hurting their feelings if it could get her attention. She was particularly comfortable with insulting me in this context.
-I will be the first to admit that gift-giving is not my strong suit. However, her obsession with material things created a demand for me to be buying her things (usually junk) on a day to day basis, at the risk of being a terrible and selfish person if I forgot to do so.
-She compared me to other men and told me that she wished that I would be like them. The men she compared me to were loud, annoying, rude people that I am not even capable of imitating.
-She continuously accused me of not having a sense of humor. That is not true at all. For her, having a sense of humor meant adhering to a very narrow style of humor, which was loud and full of slapstick. I actually have a developed sense of humor, which involves subtle sarcastic jokes. She never got my jokes though. In reality, when we were in situations where my sense of humor was working, she got mad at me. If we were at a party, for example, and started making jokes that were successful (causing loud, almost rolling on the floor laughter), she would get mad at me because she got jealous not being the center of attention at the party. I would then get an aggressive lecture while driving home about how I wasn't really funny anyway.
-When I was getting ready to propose, I decided to dedicate the amount of money that I had set aside for buying an engagement ring to buying the highest quality diamond I could afford (as opposed to the largest). She began telling me on the day of proposal, even after accepting, that she was disappointed and wished that the diamond was larger. I thought it was a beautiful and fiery diamond but she always wanted the biggest, loudest things possible. She would have been happier if I had bought her a very large, moderate quality diamond. She would have been able to brag about the Karats, which is what mattered to her ultimately.
-When I got out of the Army, I began to use the GI Bill to go to college. She hated, hated, hated, hated it. She especially hated it that I was a dedicated A student. I received a stipend from the Army for going to school full time and making good grades, on top of a retirement check the Army will pay me for the rest of my life because of being wounded in combat. It was plenty of money for us to live comfortably while I was in school, studying to get a higher paying job. She directly told me though that she wanted me to quit school to go get a job at a factory IMMEDIATELY, which would have paid me more money right then. She needed immediate gratification and did not think about the future. She also had a compulsive spending problem so the reasonable income that I was bringing in for what I was doing was being expended all of the time on shoes, purses, and clothes. Therefore, she "needed" me to make more money at the time. She couldn't recognize the amount of money she was wasting. She could only see that we didn't have enough and blamed it on my refusal to get a job at a factory that would pay me more than my GI Bill/Retirement money. She also included with her arguments against me going to school a generic and meaningless "what's the point?" clause. "If you haven't gotten your bachelor's degree by X age, what's the point?" She never rationalized that argument. It's justification was "what's the point?"
I want to be fair. I am listing the issues as I see them, through my INTJ personality. I know what her arguments against me were so I will list them without my own modifications. Whether or not I feel like they are true, perhaps ESFP's reading them will be able to recognize something meaningful in them and identify with her arguments against my personality.
Her arguments against me, in her words:
-You are "boring."
-You dress "boring," like an old man.
-You have no sense of humor.
-You are an "elitist."
-You think you are smarter than me and you are not smarter than me.
-You don't want me to have fun.
-You want to stifle my personality.
-You don't care about anything. All you care about is stuff that doesn't matter.
-You never get mad; you have no personality.
-Why don't you call me a b!tch or something to let me know you have a soul.
-You have no soul.
-You make up big words to make me feel stupid.
-You don't act like a man. Why don't you get a "man" job? You just want to read stupid books about things that don't matter.
-Everybody thinks you are sooooooo smart. You are not smarter than me.
-You are not smarter than me. Do you hear me?
-You never want to have fun.
-Why don't you act like X's boyfriend/husband? He is so fun.
-Why don't you buy me jewelry like X's boyfriend/husband? X has a two-karat diamond. He really loves her. You don't want me to have anything.
-You are soooo boring.
All of the above are things that she said to me.
I know this thread is about "what characteristics do ESFP women like in men." I don't know if my post makes a coherent statement about that. I mentioned everything that she said that she did not like in me but she also married me so must have been attracted to something about me at some point. From my perspective, admittedly having been burned, this particular ESFP likes a huge personality, loudness, unmitigated adventure-seeking, extreme masculine characteristics, and a propensity to buy her lots of shiny things and to allow her to buy lots of shiny things, and to not get embarrassed when she makes a scene in a restaurant while "performing."
I hope this doesn't come across like I dislike or judge ESFP's. I know that every personality type has an extreme/unhealthy possible expression.
It sounds like you made a lot of mistakes in your relationship. I hope that you've had a lot of valuable learning experiences and that you're capable of putting a genuine smile on your face. I mean, all these problems she had should've been very obvious to you before you even decided to get married. What was going through your mind? You should've left her a long time ago, but instead you proposed to her and after she disrespected you, you still didn't dump her.
Everything that happened to you is your own fault because you let it happen. I couldn't care less about her but I feel sorry for you. I wish you could go back in time and slap your former self silly for the huge mistakes he's making on a dailly basis.
I am only attracted to thinkers. I find male feelers very clingy and I hate to feel suffocated.
I love confidence but NOT arrogance.
I get bored of submissive men because I love to be dominated. But don't get us wrong; being massive analysers, power is very important to us ESFP's and we can tell when it is being used to manipulate us.
Being in a relationship with an ESFP may always lead to power struggles, so bear that in mind if you're planning on pursuing one in the near future.
Oh yes, I made many mistakes there. I tolerated far too much, which enabled the problem. Looking back on it, it is hard to say why I stayed for so long; it is kind of confounding. I think that I believed that she was capable of "more" and I thought that if I gave her stability, which she had never had in her life, that she would eventually change. One should never marry someone with the expectation that they will change later. In retrospect, I know that I felt sorry for her and hung around for at least the last couple of years because I did not think that she would be able to take care of herself without me there. It was sort of a paternal relationship. Also, I was young when I married her; she was my girlfriend from high school. I know that it works out for some people but I do not generally recommend marrying your high school sweetheart and I do not generally recommend marrying young.
I did learn a lot from that error. I have since remarried and am very happy in a stable relationship with someone I am very compatible with.
I tend to love men who are comfortable expressing their feelings (which is why my relationship with an intj didn't work), someone who is humble and respects me as a woman. A guy who isn't afraid to go on my adventures (traveling to exotic locations) and just a romantic. I love cheesy love gestures, they make me smile :)
But he must be intelligent and a deep thinker. I give 100 and I need him to give me the same.
Last edited by GoldiexCandyxStarz; 02-06-2014 at 08:54 AM.
I have had a very bumpy relationship with an ESFP woman for a couple of years. It has left me somewhat emotionally drained (still have a couple of pennys in the wallet… phew).
Her part was more or less the same as the girl Mountainroad described he was married to (But in a much more Histrionic Personality disorder way). My part was obviously quite different from his because I am an INFP with very strong intuition and communicative skills on different levels. If I wanted to I could have manipulated the shit out of both her and you so easily, because to me all your naive and most of the time childish “buttons” are fully exposed all the time; I can feel/see what's underneath the “skin” (read: polished appearance) you are wearing. The thing is: I don't want it. If it is not authentic it loses all it's value to someone like me. At the same time I envy your naive happy nature tremendously.
Intellectually and intuitionally it's was obvious to me that it was money, fame, status, etc – the things she wanted to get through me that was most important to her. But as a INFP I didn't want to give up on her or us because of what I felt/saw it could be if she was able to grow into a more mature person (classic introverted feeling/extroverted intuition INFP dilemma… that usually leds to falling apart piece by piece, from being a “functional INFP”… sigh).
The genuine up-part about the relationship was the physical attraction- and just happy fun times we shared together when I was “in the moment” with her, both of us being open-minded with ability to tune in on feelings. Being well defined as giver (not submissive, just getting pleasure of me myself pleasuring someone else. Roar!!) and taker (being totally fine with being focused on) is THE spicy shit for sex-life! Together with a INFPs passion and ESFPs natural energy, oh my!
Even though I recognize that every individual is unique, my experience and what I've read about you ESFPs leads me to this conclusion about ESFP-women:
As a man you will always be made used of, no matter what. They can let you in on “the ride” for a while but the end outcome is going to be the same unless you like being taken advantage of both financially and emotional the rest of your life (might not be to long living with a self-centered tornado, haha). To me ESFPs are children of nature och it's your nature to make us of- and experience your surroundings to the maximum. I can vision this inner child you have that is naive, true to itself in it's actions but also insecure which leads to a massive need to feel empowered hence the obsession with power. It's this child INFPs will see and forgive in hope of growth.
That is why the ISTJs and similar are the best match for ESFP women, because they are least likely to understand what is going on behind their back and most likely to accept it because of their lack of emotional and intuitive insight – as long as they feel they provide. The problem is that the IS*Js are going to be too boring and only offer a sense of security that the ESFPs seek, not much else. Less mature ESFPs will then “explore” to get satisfaction on other levels, so to speak… or just can't say no to an opportunity to “move up”.
I Think ESFPs and INFPs are super great together in short-term relationships. A burnt cynical “flipped” INFP would be the perfect short-term lover to an ESFP bored of it's long-term caretaker IS*J father-figure-provider. It just never end in a good way because of the FP we share.
On a side note: I find it quite interesting how different Mountainroad and I describe our similar experiences – He uses a factual logical list of events and actions. I am trying to paint a picture in your head that hopefully creates some understanding and insight on an emotional level of how it can be to have a relationship with an ESFP.
If it's one type of person you can neither live with our -without, it's the ESFP. Just by looking at your image I want to eat you up but after I do I know you're going to try to run me like a clock. And I'm going to try to make you mine, haha.
Last edited by humblerumble; 12-21-2014 at 02:17 PM. Reason: Was meant to be direct reply
@mountainroadwhy didn't you call her a bitch .-Why don't you call me a b!tch or something to let me know you have a soul.you dont find her loud jokes funny , in return its only natural if she does not find yours funny as well .-You have no sense of humor.read-you have no emotions .-You never get mad; you have no personality.a typical INTJ behaviour would make an ESFP feel so . no surprise here .-You don't want me to have fun.all intuitives make up big words to make sensors feel stupid .-You make up big words to make me feel stupid.sensation tendencies finding intuitive tendencies week and boring .-You don't act like a man. Why don't you get a "man" job? You just want to read stupid books about things that don't matter.you dont think you are smarter than her , but she thinks so , but you aint smarter than her anyway .-You think you are smarter than me and you are not smarter than me.you do have a soul its just an ENTJ an ENFJ or an ESFJ would see it better than an ESFP .You have no soul.you dont have to say that , just cause she did not get along good with you doesn't make her extreme/unhealthy ESFP.I hope this doesn't come across like I dislike or judge ESFP's. I know that every personality type has an extreme/unhealthy possible expression.
see you are making us look stupid by saying something like that and hoping it wont get detected by our SFP radars .
very well put by the way...i admire INTJ online comments they know what they wanna say and they deliver it
even better .
Personally I like someone who will let me be the star of the show. So cliche but oh well. I don't want to compete for the spotlight. So I like introverts. Not Si types though, that function usually rubs me the wrong way. Specifically
ESFP - could work if I am the center of attention lol, just being honest
ESTP - ^ and also they need to not be a complete jerk like some ESTPs are, there is an F in my name after all
ISFP/ISTP - I like but don't be too detached
INFJ - pretty intense but maybe given right circumstances
ENFJ - I also like
INTJ - could work but would require lots of effort
ENTJ - also could work but needs to not be an asshole like most ENTJs
ENFP - yeah maybe, but don't take my spotlight again
INFP - fuck no
ENTP - sure why not, just don't act like you're smarter than me
INTP - maybe, but might drag me down if too introverted
ISFJ/ESFJ/ISTJ/ESTJ - FJs maybe, they'd have to be really chill though; TJs bye, none of that, don't know why they are our "best match"