Are Spiritual Awakenings Actually Psychotic Episode's? - Page 6

Are Spiritual Awakenings Actually Psychotic Episode's?

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This is a discussion on Are Spiritual Awakenings Actually Psychotic Episode's? within the General Psychology forums, part of the Topics of Interest category; Words like spirituality or awakening should not be abused to describe quasi-psychotic states. Genuine spirituality means seeing yourself and everything ...

  1. #51

    Words like spirituality or awakening should not be abused to describe quasi-psychotic states. Genuine spirituality means seeing yourself and everything from the cosmic perspective, as if in the creator's view. Giordano Bruno, Albert Einstein, Olaf Stapledon and Carl Sagan were spiritual people in this sense, and they were more sane than the average Joe.

    Then, hardcore practitioners of Eastern and New Age "spirituality" shows some signs of schizotypal disorder:
    -strange beliefs or magical thinking
    -abnormal perceptual experiences (often happen during meditation)
    -strange thinking and speech (they often use illogical phrases which are supposed to be "profound" and "wise")
    -lack of interest in pleasure-oriented activities

    I don't call them spiritual or wise, I call them magical thinkers because that's what they are.
    AnneM and yippy nr 2 thanked this post.

  2. #52

    Quote Originally Posted by Spacenik86 View Post
    Words like spirituality or awakening should not be abused to describe quasi-psychotic states. Genuine spirituality means seeing yourself and everything from the cosmic perspective, as if in the creator's view. Giordano Bruno, Albert Einstein, Olaf Stapledon and Carl Sagan were spiritual people in this sense, and they were more sane than the average Joe.

    Then, hardcore practitioners of Eastern and New Age "spirituality" shows some signs of schizotypal disorder:
    -strange beliefs or magical thinking
    -abnormal perceptual experiences (often happen during meditation)
    -strange thinking and speech (they often use illogical phrases which are supposed to be "profound" and "wise")
    -lack of interest in pleasure-oriented activities

    I don't call them spiritual or wise, I call them magical thinkers because that's what they are.
    I'm fairly sure Einstein didn't have the omniscient pretence to assume the point of view of the creator.

  3. #53

    Quote Originally Posted by mimesis View Post
    I'm fairly sure Einstein didn't have the omniscient pretence to assume the point of view of the creator.
    None of the guys I listed did, but what I meant was a kind of distance from purely human concerns. Devoted Christians also try to see things from Jesus' POV without claiming they share his divine powers.

  4. #54

    Quote Originally Posted by Spacenik86 View Post
    None of the guys I listed did, but what I meant was a kind of distance from purely human concerns. Devoted Christians also try to see things from Jesus' POV without claiming they share his divine powers.
    That's because people can read narratives about his POV (on mostly human concern) and his illogical/divine powers in third person.

    My point being, Einstein was well aware about his limitations, what he didn't know. You seem to lack that humility.

  5. #55

    Quote Originally Posted by mimesis View Post
    My point being, Einstein was well aware about his limitations, what he didn't know. You seem to lack that humility.
    I'm sorry if I came off as arrogant. We can only attempt to be spiritual, and I'd be happy if my attempts made me 5% more spiritual.

  6. #56

    Quote Originally Posted by Spacenik86 View Post
    I'm sorry if I came off as arrogant. We can only attempt to be spiritual, and I'd be happy if my attempts made me 5% more spiritual.
    I wasn't offended and I am open to (specific) critique and to discuss, but I suspect your judgements are based on superficial and anecdotal information, and using a rather broad brush, esp with regard to your pathological attributions to new age and eastern traditions.

  7. #57

    Same thing only difference is one person keeps Thier experience to them self and says profound shit after. The other Tells people about it's as it's happening and gets put in the nut house.

  8. #58

    Having survived two NON-drug-induced psychotic breaks, I can only personally state that I did not consider them to be spiritual experiences. I'm aware of the connection that is often said to be between them, but if there is any basis for it, I was not intended to experience it.

    Any spiritual growth I might have developed was only ever related tangentially to my psychotic breaks and the proceeding struggle to regain control over my life again (i.e. working up the courage to take myself off of the crippling medications and treat myself with CBT).

    My first psychotic break, in particular, was brought about from an immense amount of stress in my personal life and it was, as far as I can tell years later, an attempt by my subconscious mind to dissociate me from reality in order to help me cope with what, at the time, I perceived to be an impending disaster, that was likely to conclude with a very untimely death.

    That said, there were some remarkable experiences I had leading up to, during, and after each of my psychotic breaks. I even met people who I considered to be spiritual teachers of sorts during both incidents. They appeared in the most bizarre ways with the strangest, uncanny ways of knowing something intrinsic about who I was and where I was headed (in life). There was a thread tying them all together that, to this day, mystifies me. Two of them, in particular, approached me and addressed me in the exact same way despite being separated by many miles and more than a 14 month gap in relation to time.

    There were more subtle metaphysical aspects to my psychotic breaks relating to how each experience shaped me as a person in ways I could never have comprehended at the time. It was as if each experience was intended to lead me in a certain direction to an ultimate destination of which I can still only make educated guesses about. I can't say that neither incident didn't come without its price: I certainly carry some residual trauma from each psychotic break with me to this day. It affected me on such a fundamental level that even my laughter was changed. One person who knew me before I experienced either event remarked that my new laugh made them highly uncomfortable. I suspect it was because the laugh itself carries the weight of my newfound experiences within it, a confounding mixture of great joy and great suffering coexisting within one vocalized expression at the same time.

    Even if there is no connection between psychotic breaks and spiritual awakening or development, it doesn't make too much of a difference to me in the end. For all the problems they have caused me, both short term and long term (even some I'm still dealing with today, all these years later), I developed as a person in reaction to those challenges. It is a fascinating mystery for me to explore time and time again. I might never know its true significance until I pass on into the next world, but for now I am content finding out where this road leads.
    Last edited by Free Man; 07-08-2019 at 06:12 AM. Reason: corrected a mistake
    Shrodingers drink and yippy nr 2 thanked this post.

  9. #59

    @Free Man As someone who has experienced a psychotic breakdown too I just want to say how much I appreciate your post. Thank you.
    Free Man thanked this post.

  10. #60

    There is a lot that western psychology does not understand. There are many practitioners of psychology, psychotherapy and counselling that understand this.

    they just do not have a solid "framework" to work from. Simply put, there is no "framework" they can present that will hold up to rigorous testing

    I'll be honest. For me, Us Western humans strayed of path in the late 1800s, early 1900s. This is a time that what many practitioners will recognise what I call the "pathology of unhappiness".

    To feel sad, angry or upset was suddenly "abnormal". IT was a "malfunction of the psyche".

    You may be surprised to hear that, despite Freud's, contribution to this "general malaise", and deeper explorations into the nature of "things", that he stopped. Abruptly.

    Carl Jung took up that torch but there was so much resting on his shoulders.

    The rest history?

    I don't believe so.

    Never.

    Find your heart <3

    Accept every aspect of YOU. No matter how hard it is.

    I will stop here. But please, do not hand your power over to some Guru.

    You're okay :)
    Last edited by Kintsugi; 07-12-2019 at 07:44 AM.
    mimesis, Anunnaki Spirit and big90cloud thanked this post.


     
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