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This is a discussion on Ask: The Forum's Fitness Freaks! within the Health and Fitness forums, part of the Topics of Interest category; Originally Posted by Scoobyscoob I disagree, not because of the technique but due to the amount of weight involved. Most ...

  1. #891

    Quote Originally Posted by Scoobyscoob View Post
    I disagree, not because of the technique but due to the amount of weight involved. Most people can deadlift 2-3 times what they can clean, so it's not as much of an issue on the knees. I used to deadlift well over 400 pounds but I stopped because I could feel the pressure on my knees and I could feel my joints being compacted. I think power cleans can aggravate an existing knee problem, but likely won't create knee problems on its own. Also, I've never seen anyone outside of the Olympics do squat cleans. Regular power cleans work out the desired areas just fine. Squat cleans are to go for maximum weight.

    I'm not trying to scare you or anything because if you have the joint strength for deadlifting 500lbs+ then you'll probably be fine, but I do think that a life time of deadlifts and full squats will eventually take its toll on the knees. And your knees are very important for mobility.
    It doesn't matter if you disagree because it's not a matter of opinion catching a sudden load will put more stress on your knees than picking something up provided they're both around the same RPE and you are using correct form. Deadlifts can fuck up your back pretty easily if you do them wrong but knees not really, that's more with squats. I know people with knee replacements who still deadlift. They definitely dont power clean or squat though. Also anything where your hip crease above your knee is a power clean technically speaking. If you mean not bending your knees at all of course it's less stress than a deadlift because it's an extremely sub maximal movement and comparing it to max effort deadlift would be ridiuclous.
    Last edited by soop; 08-04-2019 at 02:45 PM.
    birdsintrees thanked this post.

  2. #892

    Quote Originally Posted by DrEquine View Post
    Distance or speed?

    I can walk 4-5 miles at a 15:30 pace for each mile and be exhausted with leg pain, or 10 miles at a 17 minute pace and feel totally fine.

    Which would make me burn more calories and keep me in better shape?

    Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
    Do what is most sustainable. Both will work well at least for now.
    Quote Originally Posted by nonnaci View Post
    First time marathon training. Currently upto 13 mile long runs with one rest day / week. Weekly miles = 40. Towards the ends of long-run, there's some joint pain and the pace definitely drops. Is this typical and how do I improve the long-run mileage to the upper teens?
    It could be the surface you're running on, it could be the pattern of your stride. Or it could just be adjusting to the volume. I'm not an expert on distance running but it might be worth getting your stride looked at or taking s few days off if you think you are not fully recovering from your workout. 40 miles a week should be okay though. I will talk to my marathon runner friend tonight.
    Last edited by soop; 08-04-2019 at 03:03 PM.

  3. #893

    Quote Originally Posted by nonnaci View Post
    First time marathon training. Currently upto 13 mile long runs with one rest day / week. Weekly miles = 40. Towards the ends of long-run, there's some joint pain and the pace definitely drops. Is this typical and how do I improve the long-run mileage to the upper teens?
    Im nowhere near your mileage yet but am training for a half marathon and have been told to not increase beyond 10% a week to avoid injuries. I’m part of a runner’s community with women who do ultras and what not. They advised me to increase mileage by incorporating hill training, full body strength training and walk/run intervals. Are you hydrating/fueling on your longer runs?
    nonnaci thanked this post.

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  5. #894

    Quote Originally Posted by soop View Post
    Do what is most sustainable. Both will work well at least for now.


    It could be the surface you're running on, it could be the pattern of your stride. Or it could just be adjusting to the volume. I'm not an expert on distance running but it might be worth getting your stride looked at or taking s few days off if you think you are not fully recovering from your workout. 40 miles a week should be okay though. I will talk to my marathon runner friend tonight.
    The surface is mix of dirt and asphalt (bike trail) along a river. The pace is slow and the stride I think is even according to how even the rubber on my shoes are wearing away. Recovery takes about a day and half without feeling the aches in the joints.
    soop thanked this post.

  6. #895

    Quote Originally Posted by birdsintrees View Post
    Im nowhere near your mileage yet but am training for a half marathon and have been told to not increase beyond 10% a week to avoid injuries. I’m part of a runner’s community with women who do ultras and what not. They advised me to increase mileage by incorporating hill training, full body strength training and walk/run intervals. Are you hydrating/fueling on your longer runs?
    I can confirm the 10% rule as I started with 10 miles and have since gone to 12 and 13. 10 to 12 was difficult with regards to the last mile. I definitely hydrate although only with water at this point. I may switch to electrolyte and walk/run intervals as you suggested.

  7. #896

    Quote Originally Posted by soop View Post
    It doesn't matter if you disagree because it's not a matter of opinion catching a sudden load will put more stress on your knees than picking something up provided they're both around the same RPE and you are using correct form. Deadlifts can fuck up your back pretty easily if you do them wrong but knees not really, that's more with squats. I know people with knee replacements who still deadlift. They definitely dont power clean or squat though. Also anything where your hip crease above your knee is a power clean technically speaking. If you mean not bending your knees at all of course it's less stress than a deadlift because it's an extremely sub maximal movement and comparing it to max effort deadlift would be ridiuclous.
    Well, no. Simple physics would say you're wrong. I stated my experience as opinion because I didn't bother to do the calculations, but deadlifts put a proportional higher amount of stress on the knees, while the jerk required for a clean is the most stressful part of a clean, which due to the amount of weights used, the jerk (moment of force) will momentarily put as much strain on the knees as a dead lift our full squat would, except slow lifting puts sustained pressure on the joints and that obviously causes more wear and tear on the body than quick bursts of movement, which are what ligaments can handle very well.

    At any rate, thanks for responding soop. I was asking mainly to see if there's something I'm missing about deadlifts, but seeing as how I don't have a weak back and I'm predisposed to RA like symptoms, I won't be adding deadlifts to my circuit training. Stay classy.

  8. #897

    How much more effective would hitting each muscle twice a week as opposed to once a week be?

    Also how effective would adding a circuit once a week be?
    soop thanked this post.

  9. #898

    Quote Originally Posted by Scoobyscoob View Post
    Well, no. Simple physics would say you're wrong.
    No it would not.
    I stated my experience as opinion because I didn't bother to do the calculations, but deadlifts put a proportional higher amount of stress on the knees, while the jerk required for a clean is the most stressful part of a clean,
    Incorrect. Catching a sudden weight requires your body to absorb and incredible amount of shock.
    slow lifting puts sustained pressure on the joints and that obviously causes more wear and tear on the body than quick bursts of movement, which are what ligaments can handle very well.
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3535026/

    Don't ask questions when you don't want to consider the answers. If you only want to hear what you want to hear just tell it to yourself and leave other people out of it.
    Last edited by soop; 08-05-2019 at 04:40 PM.
    Dr Whoresy thanked this post.

  10. #899

    Quote Originally Posted by Aluminum Frost View Post
    How much more effective would hitting each muscle twice a week as opposed to once a week be?
    Significantly more effective.
    Also how effective would adding a circuit once a week be?
    wot?

  11. #900

    Quote Originally Posted by soop View Post
    Significantly more effective.

    wot?
    Hitting every muscle in a day, but only doing a fraction of the reps


     
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