Can your socionics type be completely different from your MBTI type?

Can your socionics type be completely different from your MBTI type?

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This is a discussion on Can your socionics type be completely different from your MBTI type? within the Socionics Forum forums, part of the Personality Type Forums category; Usually ILI's are INTJs, LSE's ESTJs and so on. Sometimes you see someone who's supposedly say an IEE and ENTP. ...

  1. #1

    Can your socionics type be completely different from your MBTI type?

    Usually ILI's are INTJs, LSE's ESTJs and so on. Sometimes you see someone who's supposedly say an IEE and ENTP. Does that work? Because I got SLE on a socioinics test but I think I'm an ESFP in MBTI. Should I consider the possibility of being an SEE in socionics then? Or should I just stick with what the test told me? Or are the two completely unrelated?

    Basically, how should I treat the two different systems in relation to one another?



  2. #2
    Unknown


    Quote Originally Posted by Kleop View Post
    Usually ILI's are INTJs, LSE's ESTJs and so on. Sometimes you see someone who's supposedly say an IEE and ENTP. Does that work? Because I got SLE on a socioinics test but I think I'm an ESFP in MBTI. Should I consider the possibility of being an SEE in socionics then? Or should I just stick with what the test told me? Or are the two completely unrelated?

    Basically, how should I treat the two different systems in relation to one another?
    It's plausible, if you're answering tests as how you wish you were instead of how you actually are.

  3. #3
    Unknown

    Depends on how you treat both systems.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kleop View Post
    Or should I just stick with what the test told me?
    No, you shouldn't. Socionics is not a test.

    You have to learn the system and how different elements operate with each other. This will help with figuring out your type. Model A is a good place to start.

    Or are the two completely unrelated?
    Both are related inasmuch as both derived from Jung.

    Basically, how should I treat the two different systems in relation to one another?
    It's better not to treat them in relation to one another at all. One cannot find their Socionics type through MBTI one. It's like trying to understand the essence of strawberries by looking at grapes.

    If you want to relate Socionics with something you already know, it should be Jungian cognitive functions (assuming you're familiar with cognitive functions).
    Entropic, fair phantom and Cataclysm thanked this post.

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  5. #4

    Quote Originally Posted by To_august View Post
    No, you shouldn't. Socionics is not a test.
    I've been told that the only thing more reliable than taking the test is getting assessed by a professional, but I guess that's bogus?

    You have to learn the system and how different elements operate with each other. This will help with figuring out your type. Model A is a good place to start.
    I've read a little about that.

    It's better not to treat them in relation to one another at all. One cannot find their Socionics type through MBTI one. It's like trying to understand the essence of strawberries by looking at grapes.

    If you want to relate Socionics with something you already know, it should be Jungian cognitive functions (assuming you're familiar with cognitive functions).
    Yes, I know about the functions, but aren't they a part of MBTI as well? Like an ESFP has Se-Fi-Te-Ni, and so on? That's how I've always treated it at least.

  6. #5

    The functions aren´t the same, the surface however is the same. Only one thing needs to be done and that is to change the last letter for Extraverted Socioncs Types and the translation to MBTI is complete oh and yea Duality is dead also. It is replaced by the same Club (NT, NF, ST, SF) from the other Quadra.

    The "program" function of LIE is alternative logic of actions - the logic of risky, extraordinary actions and undertakings. This is a "program" of a person who in any situation sees the most unexpected way out, who finds reserves where no one else sees them, who resolves his problems in the most unexpected way.
    Sounds awful like MBTI Ne doesn´t it?
    Last edited by Zero11; 09-01-2015 at 08:18 PM.

  7. #6

    There's no consensus; I think it's best to learn about socionics as a separate system and then draw your own conclusions.

    Some might argue that MBTI isn't valid, or not consistent enough, from a socionics perspective. The both being derived from Jung argument relies on them being both the same interpretation of Jung, whereas I think they evolved Jung in different ways and ended up different.

    You could use the (in)famous j/p switch to have a starting point for what your type might be, but don't rely on that, because as explained here it's not necessarily valid:
    J/P switch - Wikisocion
    Entropic, fair phantom and Cataclysm thanked this post.

  8. #7
    Unknown


    Can your socionics type be completely different from your MBTI type?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zero11 View Post
    The functions aren´t the same, the surface however is the same. Only one thing needs to be done and that is to change the last letter for Extraverted Socioncs Types and the translation to MBTI is complete oh and yea Duality is dead also. It is replaced by the same Club (NT, NF, ST, SF) from the other Quadra.


    Sounds awful like MBTI Ne doesn´t it?

    Wouldn't that description be referring to efficiency often associated with Te? Especially in tandem with Ni? Correct me if I'm wrong but I get the gist you might be saying Socionics IE and MBTI cognitive functions are the same standing alone, but when part of a TIM, they manifest totally differently, which wouldn't make sense. Or do you mean description wise (i.e. ENTj sounds like ENTP)?


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  9. #8

    Quote Originally Posted by Supaketi View Post
    Wouldn't that description be referring to efficiency often associated with Te? Especially in tandem with Ni? Correct me if I'm wrong but I get the gist you might be saying Socionics IE and MBTI cognitive functions are the same standing alone, but when part of a TIM, they manifest totally differently, which wouldn't make sense. Or do you mean description wise (i.e. ENTj sounds like ENTP)?
    I am not saying that Socionics Te is MBTI Ne I was just showing that translation works with the surface and the J/P switch for Extraverts.

  10. #9
    Unknown

    Quote Originally Posted by Kleop View Post
    I've been told that the only thing more reliable than taking the test is getting assessed by a professional, but I guess that's bogus?
    If you have an opportunity to be assessed by professional socionists, then yes, it would be great.

    Tests aren't reliable enough because, for example, answering certain question in a certain way you mean X (and you think that question asks for X thing), while test actually meant it to be Z-thing related to Z stuff. So what you answered may not be in line with what test creators had in mind coming up with their questions, trying to discern certain elements/dichotomies in the first place.

    Imo, it's better to study the system and have enough experience with other types in order to test how quadras, intertype etc work for you.
    Yes, I know about the functions, but aren't they a part of MBTI as well? Like an ESFP has Se-Fi-Te-Ni, and so on? That's how I've always treated it at least.
    Yes, and that's the point. Official MBTI is all about dichotomies, so obviously if one assesses system from this angle they can be any different type. The same happens if person relies on type descriptions - they can be any type in any given system.

    If you treat both MBTI and Socionics as systems which are both built upon Jungian cognitive functions, then it makes sense to assume one should have the same types in both systems (according to cognitive functions), because MBTI/Socionics Ne is derived from Jungian Ne, MBTI/Socionics Fe is derived from Jungian Fe etc.

    Then again, it depends on your point of view on the system and whether you trace MBTI cognitive functions back to Jungian ones. For example, standard MBTI definition of Si is worlds apart from Jungian Si. I think MBTI introverted sensing describes thinking, rationality and general focus on sensing as opposed to intuition, which is a weird mixture for irrational perception function to say the least.
    Entropic, fair phantom and Cataclysm thanked this post.

  11. #10
    Unknown


    Going by analysis of functions in MBTI compared to the Information Elements in Socionics, MBTI must use four functions to explain the psyche, and the definitions of the functions are written for such a purpose, but in Socionics eight Information Elements are used to explain the psyched, and the definitions of the information elements are written for such a purpose. Due MBTI having four per psyche and Socionics having eight, the definitions of the MBTI functions contain parts of the definitions for both the the introverted and extroverted Socionics elements. E.g., MBTI's Fe and Fi both contain emotions, to accomplish each type having a description of their usage of emotions, and both contain what is commonly described as ethical behavior, to accomplish each type having a description of their usage of ethical behavior; however, in Socionics, Fe contains all emotions and Fi contains all ethical/moral behaviors, and due to all eight information elements being in all types, the task of each type having both their usage of emotions and ethical behavior is accomplished.

    TL;DR: MBTI functions are squished-together, blurred versions of Socionics information elements.
    Cataclysm and Supaketi thanked this post.


     
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