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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Hello. Haven't been here in a while. Long story short I've been typed by "professionals" and my boyfriend as a 4w3. Recently have been mistaken for a 9 a few times, and after reading through the chapters on 4 and 9 in the Dynamic Enneagram, I found that I relate keenly to aspects of both types and would like some help in noticing what I'm not noticing.


Main Questions


1. What drives you in life? What do you look for?

Relief. Moments when I let go of all the stuff I hold on to. I want to be fully embodied. Sensing and creating and at ease. To be fully me, whatever that is. Feel the flow of presence.


2. What do you hope to accomplish in your life?


To be exceptionally knowledgeable and talented in a couple of areas. I want to be a pure vessel for the flow of music and art to come through me. I want to move gracefully and with the solidity of being. I want to have a sense of self and purpose. And to be able to breath fully and easily (I tend to hold my breath).


3. What do you hope to avoid doing or being? What values are important to you?

I'm not sure on this one yet. I mean, it depends. I don't want to die this lifetime without realizing my true nature. If that's even a real thing. Sometimes I think I ought to leave this whole 'enlightenment' idea and do something real in the world. I've put off a lot the past few years trying to develop qualities that I thought would help me 'achieve' this. I think to myself that it's important to me to hone my skills in piano and singing, and violin for that matter, that I should be sketching or reading, and here I am 'wasting' my time doing this. Sorry for all the "'"s.


4. What are your biggest fears (not including phobias)? Why?


Not being able to truly transform/change, not having access to the foods that make me feel healthy, dying without accomplishing anything, not accomplishing anything before I'm too old (25, which just passed), being shunned or revealed, realizing I'm nothing and nobody, realizing that I am in fact selfish, manipulative, and worthless, my boyfriend finally becoming fed up with the fact that I am not relatable, interesting, or attractive (qualities he has alluded to, but I know that he loves me very much, and our relationship has been improving over time. I couldn't stand not being able to kiss his cheek or smell his skin). I would also greatly fear someone reading this and finding out who I am in real life and judging me based on this tiny fraction of writing.



5. How do you want others to see you? How do you see yourself?

I am not aware of thinking of how I want others to see me, though I imagine that I am not well-liked. I am conscious of adapting to work situations and half-heartedly trying to appear professional or concerned with work-related matters. I get lost at work a lot. I see myself as lost lost lost lost lost. My image of myself is curled up in a ball, hiding.




6. What makes you feel your best? What makes you feel your worst?

Best: Dancing by myself to some delicious music, smell and feel of my boyfriend's skin, playing or singing a song with smoothness and that feeling of no resistance whatsoever, feeling the rub of vocal harmony, drawing, sex, listening to music, kissing, intense physical contact. Worst: being dishonest, being consciously or unconsciously selfish, wasting time, wasting other people's time, having to be out all day, uncomfortable seats, hot or humid weather, being yelled at. Being yelled at is probably number one. I also hate feeling like I've eaten too much, and the feeling of being fat, or dehydrated.



7. Describe how you experience each of: a) anger; b) shame; c) anxiety.


Anger: at myself, or at myself after realizing that I am angry at someone else
shame: ashamed for existing and for being self-indulgent and manipulative and boring
anxiety: quiet inner anxiety



8. Describe how you respond to each of: a) stress; b) unexpected change; c) conflict.

stress: listen to music, curl up in a ball and think too much or not at all, physical harm at extreme times(very, very infrequent), eat, not eat, cry, breathe deeply and calmly figure out what I need to do, try to figure out what is happening with my body and thoughts, listen to hypnosis or meditation tape, do a Feldenkrais lesson, occasionally yell into a pillow, but usually am silently stressed
edit: and look at pleasing pictures

unexpected change: "Oh." I guess it depends on what the change is.

conflict: My first reaction is, what is meant by conflict? I guess it depends on the situation. Inner conflict is more likely. But if I'm being yelled at? When I was younger I would often yell back, and always tried to get the last word. Lately it's freeze up or go silent. Recently experienced numbing out totally, and started saying "Yes, I agree, you're right" in a robot voice, which made me wonder about type 9, but I think this may also just be due to possibly not having dealt fully with past so-called traumatic experiences. I'm not sure yet whether they were traumatic or not or if I am justified in thinking so. I know that many people have experienced far worse than I ever will, yet I can't help but feel hurt and confused.





9. Describe your orientation to: a) authority; b) power. How do you respond to these?

authority: not much thought on this. Authority based on what?

power: again, not much thought on this. I guess I would say that power comes from wisdom, awareness, and most of all, love.



10. What is your overall outlook on life and humanity?


Oh man. A beautiful mess I suppose? I think overall I believe that humans have the potential to return to a more natural state, at least one that is in line with the inner and outer environment. Could take a few disasters. I would like to see more body-oriented and arts-positive education. I don't belong in my vision of a better world though.



Thanks for looking.

 

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You can try the test in my signature v

EDIT: After having read your questionnaire response, I am surprised that you don't have SP higher because you repeatedly mentioned the importance of bodily comfort and kinesthetic pleasures (food, physical contact, dieting, softness). There is definitely the 4 in the heart fix.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thanks Quang for your response. I did take the test, and ended up with 9w1. However, I've already taken many tests, and the problem with tests is that I'm the one responding. I consistently get scores of 4w5, 5w4, and 9w1. I can only give my own subjective, incomplete responses, which may or may not give me accurate results, and that's assuming that the test can test for subtleties of the Enneagram, which as far as I can tell, it can't. Perhaps you can point me to some resources for further discernment? I've read the Dynamic Enneagram, The Enneagram and NLP, and listened to several workshops by Condon and Palmer. It was in part due to the description of the so/sx 9w1 that I am re-thinking my type.

"so/sx 9w1

They want to contribute something new and passionate to society, but feel like too much of a social nonentity to do it. They may view themselves as 4ish due to issues around uniqueness, but these issues only arise because of how aware they are that others possess a sense of self, which only reinforces the 9's sense of nothingness....Since they know they lack a strong self, they lack hope about contributing something original. They resolve the quagmire either by spinning their wheels with fruitless and endless self-examination hoping to discover something deep about themselves or by conforming to various personalities and completely checking out. They are dispassionate in general but can seem more passionate, sad, or lively because they comply to a voice in the back of their head telling them how they should react and what's appropriate. They know underneath how internally unaffected they are. They are taken back by the possibilities of things they could imagine happening without stirring a real reaction in them and find it disturbing to think about how they could merge into anything... They can seem 7-like in their draw to books, people, beliefs, and adventures, but they are drawn to these outlets in hopes of receiving a sense of perspective and self. They have a nose for unconscious structures and may create a new language around patterns, themes, or archetypes in myths, traditions, history, and groups. They are easy to mistype because they can seem to run fully on the 'software" or agendas of different types. They may search for approval and validation like a 3, but reject the approval once they get it as if wondering why they would be worthy of admiration or attention in the first place. It's the 'agenda' 'software' itself they are addicted to, not the result."

I don't know who the poster's source is for that description.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·

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MOTM Jan 2014
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@nami

I would say 9. 9 is on a journey to find their inner voice and true self. 4 has too much of this to start with. 4 is a very self absorbed type and has a strong sense of purpose and self, but the journey is about becoming more connected and interconnected with the outside world. For 9, the journey is to discover themselves.


2. What do you hope to accomplish in your life?


To be exceptionally knowledgeable and talented in a couple of areas. I want to be a pure vessel for the flow of music and art to come through me. I want to move gracefully and with the solidity of being. I want to have a sense of self and purpose. And to be able to breath fully and easily (I tend to hold my breath).


3. What do you hope to avoid doing or being? What values are important to you?

I'm not sure on this one yet. I mean, it depends. I don't want to die this lifetime without realizing my true nature. If that's even a real thing. Sometimes I think I ought to leave this whole 'enlightenment' idea and do something real in the world. I've put off a lot the past few years trying to develop qualities that I thought would help me 'achieve' this. I think to myself that it's important to me to hone my skills in piano and singing, and violin for that matter, that I should be sketching or reading, and here I am 'wasting' my time doing this. Sorry for all the "'"s.
This bleeds 'self aware 9' to me. 4s also have a strong sense of identity and feel like they know their true nature and no one understands. Wanting to find something which you're excellent at sounds like 9's growth to 3. It's very different than how 4s see things, which is more "this is who I am" and it's about being perceived for who they already believe they authentically are.

I would agree with 4 fix. :) But I think you're a core 9.

Let me know if what I wrote makes sense or you want more elaboration.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thank you so much for your input. I found some new information regarding the therapeutic application of the Enneagram for 4s and 9s, and started to come to similar conclusions, but your post really helped me to differentiate between the two. I had thought that occasionally being very sensitive or emotional with my romantic partner meant that I could not possibly be a 9. But he is also most likely a 4w5, and he has sometimes jokingly called me a weather vane for his own internal state.

Thanks again though. Even just today, using the 9 growth recommendations has been much more helpful than the 4 recommendations have been over the past couple of years.
 

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Thank you so much for your input. I found some new information regarding the therapeutic application of the Enneagram for 4s and 9s, and started to come to similar conclusions, but your post really helped me to differentiate between the two. I had thought that occasionally being very sensitive or emotional with my romantic partner meant that I could not possibly be a 9. But he is also most likely a 4w5, and he has sometimes jokingly called me a weather vane for his own internal state.

Thanks again though. Even just today, using the 9 growth recommendations has been much more helpful than the 4 recommendations have been over the past couple of years.
Any person with blood in their veins will be sensitive and romantic with a partner. <3
 
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