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MOTM Jan 2014
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6 is known as the "bullshit detector," a type who questions everything in a search for truth. Then, 6 disintegrates to 3 - the marketing orientation. In disintegration we can take on the 'low' traits of that type, so I would imagine, in their search for truth, a 6 might confront a tendency toward image manipulation or vanity and feel disgusted by it. Is this true?

I think of Amy Lee from Evanescence as a 6. Feel free to disagree of course. But IMO, this video portrays her feelings about disintegration to 3. I wonder if any of you can relate?



Disclaimer: I am not putting down 3s or falling prey to the stereotype that all 3's are inauthentic, fake etc. 3s are masters of image and very diligent about their work, and the 3s I know are authentically interested in everything they do. I am merely talking about a 3ish tendency in a 6, and how the 6 might react to seeing this in herself.
 

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Most definitely.

I have found myself being horribly passive aggressive in a strange attempt to enhance my image or ego. Ironically, this was to a friend I highly suspect is a 3, whose 3-like traits I find rather cloying. All the same, I am jealous of the image she presents to the world, despite knowing her beyond the pretty veneer. It's stupid and I hate that I want to be her, and yet I don't - all at the same time.
 

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i vacillate between doing it, and going against it.

seeing others trying to adopt something that i can tell isn't genuine makes me sort of go in the opposite direction: i'll purposefully try to destroy my own "image"--or at least, the one that others hold of me in day-to-day life; it's almost like a priest/devil duality. i know that people can usually see me as a nice person, or an abrasive dick.

there have been times, when i can see that i will able to gain something by adopting an outer notion of self, that i will indulge. it always feels empty, like the "me" that i partially know myself to be is no longer accessible--everything becomes "work, work, work", and i'm brought to a level where what was important to me isn't even on my radar any longer. it's very confusing...

it's like one way ensures that i won't succeed, but at least i'll be "human", while the other ensures "success", but by a standard where the word itself is something hollow that won't ever lead to happiness (i mean, how can you find success when the meaning is personal, and you have stripped yourself of your own person?).

the only way i've learned to deal with it is to imagine that i'm on a continuous see-saw, where each side is an extreme that can take me very high, but inevitably, it will bring me to a place that was lower than before. i try to imagine being in the center piece, the piece that doesn't move because it is immovable--and this allows me to have a better understanding and view of what i want to avoid. each side is a cookie-cut-out of what i'm "supposed" to be doing, but that center piece is actually who i am and will provide my direction--even if it's only illuminating a few feet at a time, those few feet are a genuine path.
 

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I tend to overcompensate for feeling sort of defective and it comes across to me like I'm bragging and distorting my self image...which imediately afterwards is followed by pain as I get disgusted with my lack of authenticity and honesty. Its like I'm wearing a mask and acting to other people, which ultimately ends up in self hate.

I also overcompensate in a 3-ish way when work competence is questioned and so on :/...
 

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It doesn't generally disgust me when I do it, I'm just very aware of exactly what I'm doing and why I'm doing it. Whereas for 3s, I think image manipulation is more natural, and they don't usually notice that they're doing it. I, on the other hand, watch myself from outside myself at all times. So when I image manipulate, it's like I've decided to play a character and read from a script. And I always choose to do it for what I believe to be a valid reason (i.e. to make someone else feel more comfortable, to just allow social interaction to continue smoothly, to do things the "right" way, etc.).

Interestingly, I think that I feel more comfortable when wearing a mask than I do when being completely genuine. I basically feel like in order to appear socially capable at all, I have to act like everyone else (and to wear a mask). This might be from having been raised by a 3. I was given very clear and strict direction as a child on how to perform socially...to the detriment of my self-confidence.
 

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Not really except when I become especially self aggrandizing to a nauseating degree. My ESFJ ex was a 3 and I always made sure to smack him down when he started to get too delusional about his own grandeur.

So when I do anything like that, and its not for humor or entertainment or self mockery I hate myself.

I have a really deep seated anger towards pathological narcissism and 3 is linked to less pathological narcissism, more like "narcissism lite" with out the disturbing lack of empathy.
 

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It doesn't generally disgust me when I do it, I'm just very aware of exactly what I'm doing and why I'm doing it. Whereas for 3s, I think image manipulation is more natural, and they don't usually notice that they're doing it. I, on the other hand, watch myself from outside myself at all times. So when I image manipulate, it's like I've decided to play a character and read from a script. And I always choose to do it for what I believe to be a valid reason (i.e. to make someone else feel more comfortable, to just allow social interaction to continue smoothly, to do things the "right" way, etc.).

Interestingly, I think that I feel more comfortable when wearing a mask than I do when being completely genuine. I basically feel like in order to appear socially capable at all, I have to act like everyone else (and to wear a mask). This might be from having been raised by a 3. I was given very clear and strict direction as a child on how to perform socially...to the detriment of my self-confidence.
Oh 3 is totally aware he or she is manipulating image. Two 3 people I have been close to talked to me about it openly. Its just that it comes very natural to them so it takes less energy from them and they don't care if it's fake, they may even be gleefully proud of it, and it may lend itself also to a preoccupation with things like fashion or winning trophies.

Im ok with images but to me it takes more creative energy I even considered I might be a 4w3 and it is my heart fix, but mostly I go into shadow self 3 mode to work out neurotic issues, like I have to give a 3 self aggrandizing image concious exaggerated performance to rid myself of inner demons that fuel six anxieties.



I do also shape shift for more practical reasons, but often times I am so me its effortless, like I go out side in my pajamas and live in oblivion to image of any kind.

Its like I have two selves.
 

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Most definitely.

I have found myself being horribly passive aggressive in a strange attempt to enhance my image or ego. Ironically, this was to a friend I highly suspect is a 3, whose 3-like traits I find rather cloying. All the same, I am jealous of the image she presents to the world, despite knowing her beyond the pretty veneer. It's stupid and I hate that I want to be her, and yet I don't - all at the same time.
The higher level of six you are the less it bothers you. I used to be either completely disinterested in my ESFJ female friends obnoxious preoccupation with her 3 image a other times felt outright like she was pathetic, and some times she sensed that and said things like she was almost jealous of women like me and one of her daughters who manage to be very sexy with out effort or seeming to not even be aware of it.

But then you know I also had bad days when I felt insecure for some reason, just any number of things, then I would wish I put more energy into my image like she did so that people wouldn't think of me as less than.

It's really about self perception. I ts my own disintegration point so when I hate myself ill be overly image conscious. Don't get me wrong sometims this can alert us to things that genuinely should be worked on,like career or relationships or health but if you linger there you will do it for the wrong reasons (what others think) instead of the holistic good that might come from doing it simply to enrich your life.
 

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I tend to overcompensate for feeling sort of defective and it comes across to me like I'm bragging and distorting my self image...which imediately afterwards is followed by pain as I get disgusted with my lack of authenticity and honesty. Its like I'm wearing a mask and acting to other people, which ultimately ends up in self hate.

I also overcompensate in a 3-ish way when work competence is questioned and so on :/...

Aye.
 

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Definitely, they remind of all the times I've been unhealthy and acted like a messed up 3.
 
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