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Discussion Starter #1
Hi guys,

I am new to personality cafe and have been trying to figure out my personality type. When I first took the test, five years ago, I came out as an INTP. After that first test I figured out how it worked and cannot take it reliably because I can answer to get whatever letters I want. There are several reasons for my doubt as to whether I am an INTP or an ENTP. First, I enjoy socializing and get a charge from it when I talk about ideas. No matter the group size if it has that content then I have fun. However, if it turns to small talk and short conversations are encouraged then I get drained very quickly and need to get out. At home I can get energized by playing chess online, reading, listening to music etc. But, after a certain point, I soon begin to get drained in those activities as well. I enjoy debating with people, but I often take a less adversarial position in it. I have the view that it should be for the benefit for both and serve to arrive at truth. In fact, I love playing devils advocate because it lets me think about various possibilities and lead me to making a decision on ideas that I have been mulling over in my solitude. I think this could partly be due to the fact that the test questions are not effective enough. It could also be that having 16 types is too arbitrary and even if 50 types are made it would still be too arbitrary. Not to mention the unnecessary complexity of adding more types and identifying the differences. So in the interest of pegging someone into a certain sandbox, would I be a weird ENTP or INTP?

Thanks for reading and I look forward to some thoughts on this.
 

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It's well known that ENTPs are among the most introverted of Extroverts. When in doubt, you're probably an Extrovert, and that's what I think for you. I'm a pretty introverted ENTP, as well, and I know there are many others on this site like us.
 

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I'm pretty introverted. I only like to talk and interact with people I know. The only way to tell the difference is see how you do in a group of close friends who you are comfortable with. A regular person would never be able to tell if I was an ENTP unless they were an ENTP themselves because I don't play aggressively around with random people. In their eyes, I'm just introverted (INXX).

Here's how I separate myself and type. If you just talk non-stop, finding things and topics to say, joking, having fun, pranking, jumping around in the circle of close friends and all the while using your thinking to do these things, chances are you're an ENTP. Here's the most important point though, when the party you're at, which you enjoy, ends, do you want to continue the party or go home? That is the difference between extroversion and introversion.
 

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Thanks for that clarification. I have found that it is more the nature of the party that would determine whether I want to stay longer when it begins to wrap up. I wonder if there is a larger group of people who are in the middle with I and E, but have strong N,T and P tendencies.
There certainly is. I actually made a group for us on this site...
 

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I see ENTPs always come up with these introversion question ! We all wonder if we are truly extraverted at some point. My best friend is an INTP. I think, Im more adventure seeker, experience junky, impulsive than her. She's also better observant and better organised than I. She also tells story with much more details and need the whole context first thing than I who get quicker to the point. Beside that, we're like the same person.
 

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Thanks for that clarification. I have found that it is more the nature of the party that would determine whether I want to stay longer when it begins to wrap up. I wonder if there is a larger group of people who are in the middle with I and E, but have strong N,T and P tendencies.
That's true, I mean who the hell would want to stick around at a baby shower? But I think what the folks here are trying to get at is that for introverts, they can be having the time of their lives with friends, but they'll still end up kind of worn out. Tired. Though maybe in a good way.

Sort of like jet lag from flying to a country you've been dying to go to.
 

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Hi guys,

I am new to personality cafe and have been trying to figure out my personality type. When I first took the test, five years ago, I came out as an INTP. After that first test I figured out how it worked and cannot take it reliably because I can answer to get whatever letters I want. There are several reasons for my doubt as to whether I am an INTP or an ENTP. First, I enjoy socializing and get a charge from it when I talk about ideas. No matter the group size if it has that content then I have fun. However, if it turns to small talk and short conversations are encouraged then I get drained very quickly and need to get out. At home I can get energized by playing chess online, reading, listening to music etc. But, after a certain point, I soon begin to get drained in those activities as well. I enjoy debating with people, but I often take a less adversarial position in it. I have the view that it should be for the benefit for both and serve to arrive at truth. In fact, I love playing devils advocate because it lets me think about various possibilities and lead me to making a decision on ideas that I have been mulling over in my solitude. I think this could partly be due to the fact that the test questions are not effective enough. It could also be that having 16 types is too arbitrary and even if 50 types are made it would still be too arbitrary. Not to mention the unnecessary complexity of adding more types and identifying the differences. So in the interest of pegging someone into a certain sandbox, would I be a weird ENTP or INTP?

Thanks for reading and I look forward to some thoughts on this.
From the way you describe yourself and the way you write I think you might be ENTP.

Ask your self this though, what do you tend to value more logic and consistency or future possibilities. Also how are you when it comes to focusing...
 

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For me key difference between INTPs and ENTPs is that T and F are judging, disjointing functions. These functions strive to make the ideal judgement. So somebody who is Ti dominant like INTP or Fi dominant like INFP would spend more of their thinking process basically taking a model of something and pulling it mentally apart into different pieces and coming up with the perfect label, perfect descriptor for each piece. As such INTPs tend to be sensitive to puns as form of humor and they can take things very literally in conversation. I once met a guy who was relatively outgoing and social and it was like he was on border of INTP/ENTP spectrum so I could not decide how to class him. It was not until we spoke some and he started clarifying and taking things I say too literally as in "this thing here can mean only this and nothing else" that I thought to myself "that's definitely an INTP". I later observed him pause and kind of drift off for a few seconds when somebody was playing with words in conversation, like he didn't quite understand it.

Intuition to the contrary is a unifying function. It takes a lot of random pieces and tries to pull them together into a single model. ENTPs may be somewhat sensitive to puns also, but not to the same extent as INTPs and they are by far less much sensitive to word play. In conversation you might also see intuition dominants rapidly jumping from one subject to seemingly unrelated other. It is because their dominant and well-developed intuitive function has already formed connections from whatever the subject was to a couple dozen other subjects. To an INTP conversation with an ENTP will probably feel somewhat confusing, muddy, a run-on of a lot of things together. While the clarity in conversation that INTP needs will seem frustrating and unnecessary to an ENTP.
 

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Well, my INTP best friend (who seems to have low T though) isn't quite like that.She is very detached and that's one thing I appreciate with her in a conversation. She analyze everything objectively and always comes up with a new and objective point of view of the situation. She doesn't take things litteraly or narrow... She is extremly open-minded and detached. So detached that she manages well to put herself in the mind of someone else to extract what the other person think and is able to explain to me. BUT when it's about writing an important email or something, she LOVES using exact words/sentences that convey exactly her opinion/thoughts or whatever she wants the other person know. she is very precise using words. But me too... That's why we correct each other's important mailing... Because the exact word/expression/sentence the one didn't find will be found by the other one... She's just sometimes a little more senstive on how people will get what we say and how to correct what we write in order to make the other person feel/think the exact thing we expect from them... Whereas I am more senstive on what I want people to know about me, however they'll take it. I don't always care...

Just sometimes, she's more naive than I about people and their motives. She doesn't see hidden motives. I don't always very much neither but still much better than her.
She doesn't make me repeat often what I say. Not even word plays or anything. She doesn't need to pause and think. She gets quickly what I think. To the point that we sometimes just need a few key words to communicate when we are in the midst of people we don't want to show what we are talking about. but maybe just because we both are NTP....
 

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Discussion Starter #11
In conversation you might also see intuition dominants rapidly jumping from one subject to seemingly unrelated other. It is because their dominant and well-developed intuitive function has already formed connections from whatever the subject was to a couple dozen other subjects. To an INTP conversation with an ENTP will probably feel somewhat confusing, muddy, a run-on of a lot of things together. While the clarity in conversation that INTP needs will seem frustrating and unnecessary to an ENTP.
That comment struck a tone, as one of my buddies loves to dance with me around subjects that are seemingly unrelated to the casual observer. I believe that he is an INTP or ENTP as well. My sister gets irritated to no end. She loves being able to figure people out as an INFJ. However, she quickly gets tired of trying to understand me and my random connecting of events/ideas:)

In your experience what kinds of people interest you conversationally? For example, I had some people over yesterday and they all talked about people they knew or things that they did. This was relatively boring, as this was a college setting, and I had to hijack things to spice it up. I do not mean to offend in those situations, so I was wondering, what strategies(probably tactics in this case) do you guys use conversationally with people who are more of a sensor or a judger?
 

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I leave the room or I get to their level...
My tactic is searching around me for something interesting and then bring it as a conversation topic ("Uh, look at this woman.. Her dress is so nice"... Or "Wow ! An old car ! This must be a lot of fun !" or "You have a lot of CDs ! Can I borow you one?"

That's the strategy I gave to my INTP friend who admires that I always find something to say, even with people I don't relate to....
 

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Sensors are quite dull to talk to, I think their main topic of conversation being to state the bleeding obvious. Extraverted sensors: let them do the talking, nod and smile a lot. They are still nice people, and they take the heat off you having to think up conversation. Introverted sensors: more difficult. I get on well with ISTx's, as a discussion on the logic of something is always possible and often interesting, but ISFx's...I don't feel like there is much common ground at all.

I think you're probably ENTP, OP.

(and hi, Callie! where you been?)
 

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Hi guys,

However, if it turns to small talk and short conversations are encouraged then I get drained very quickly and need to get out.
Drained or bored?

I don't really get drained from that situation, just bored. If I can't seem to get control of the conversation (ie. I'm not the center of it) then I leave that group and search for someone more interesting to talk to. If that doesn't happen then I go home.

But 90% of th time when I'm not doing anything important and an opportunity to socialize arises then I take it. Even now, at this very moment, I'm getting ready to get out of the house. Keep in mind I drove 10 hours in the last 2 days and am dead tired, I still want to go out because I know when I hang out with my friends then I will get energized.
 

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Introverted functions don't create content, extroverted functions do.

Ne Ti: Creates an idea and figures out how to piece it together with Ti.

Ti Ne: Looks at an idea with Ti and comes up with an idea for how it works with Ne.

So if an Ne dom creates 3 connections and then looks at the idea with Ti then goes back to Ne and repeat. A Ti dom would first look at an idea then create 1 connection and go back to Ti and repeat. This is why ENTPs have more content to share with the world and is why they're extroverted in converse to INTP.
I can sit around and refine an idea, or anything that I do, 20+ times until it's good enough. It makes me feel good, which is why I get energy from it. It sounds like you get your energy from creating and sharing your ideas. I like to do that as well, but not as much as an E. You also have Ti, and like some refinement activities but you eventually get bored of them.

Typing theory doesn't have anything to do with skill or ability. These functions are all based on the differences in size, shape and connections in different portions of the brain. So an Ne dominant will have more ideas to share, but that doesn't mean they're good ideas. Same with Ti spending time doing analysis, even though it might be incorrect. But while this is occurring, the brain will release neurotransmitters, so the person will feel good when they are using the largest portions of their brains. (I just made this up. Someone check for me.)

All of these behaviors that you can test for are just extrapolated from the functions and so they don't necessarily relate to your most used functions. Like you said, 16 types isn't enough for any population beyond 16 people. Almost everyone is a hybrid, with cognitive functions not in the correct order, and everyone shares behavioral traits with all 16 types. This is because we all have a fairly similar brain because we're human, just the parts of the brain can be slightly different.

When I'm intoxicated, I come off as an E. I tend to want to stay up all night. It's kind of like my Ti gets turned off, or something. I got talked into tagging myself as an ENTP for a couple weeks. I also come off as an E when I'm around people that I know and get along with. But if I don't think if they'll be open to my ideas, I'll be quiet, for the most part because it's not worth the effort.
 

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"devil's advocate"
"energized"
"drained"
"talk about ideas"
"debating"
"small talk"
ugh. too much MBTI, i'm getting hives.

tell us about yourself, not about the ENTP. all NTs love playing devil's advocate, and too often i hear it drop when people try to convince themselves they're ExTx. tell us about yourself, bar nothing, and we'll decide if it's relevant or not.
 

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Thanks for making this thread, OP. I'm currently trying to decide if I'm INTP or ENTP as well, and a lot of the ENTP discussions on this board really do relate to me. Especially since ENTPs are more "introverted extarverts" than most, and that they get bored rather than drained with small talk.

As for your question, I'd say you're ENTP. The drive to share ideas seems to truiumph over your Ti by what I gather.
If you're not completely satisfied with one of the other, then just peg yourself as an xNTP (although I completely understand the irritating thought of not knowing where you belong on the spectrum...=| ). Or an ENTP with one foot out of the sandbox.
 
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Discussion Starter #18
"devil's advocate"

tell us about yourself, not about the ENTP. all NTs love playing devil's advocate, and too often i hear it drop when people try to convince themselves they're ExTx. tell us about yourself, bar nothing, and we'll decide if it's relevant or not.
Thank you for that Andrea. I will try to be more specific. I noticed that the way I learn concepts (especially math) were more pattern based. Memorizing the formulas and applying a step by step approach was a difficult task. For me, I learned by playing with a formula and learning how doing different changes to the equation would affect the answer. I used this play to relate to how the logic worked in the rules we were supposed to memorize( I often came up with my own steps to solve the problem rather than a precooked way of thinking about the problem). I took a more heuristic approach to problems and this helped me make connections and improved my understanding far more than the methods taught at school/uni. Also, I am far more interested in how people make decisions and interact than understanding basic physical laws. As for learning, I often would get into one subject only to see that I needed to learn about a separate field to improve my understanding of others. This led to several switches in my concentration from History to Political Science to Economics before I finally decided that I should just stick with one (Economics) and learn other things(like applying psychology to economics) in my free time. I loved integrating these into the overall picture of how we as humans respond to legal, social, or personal rules (follow them, don't follow them, change them).

As a young-ling I was in constant fear of being found out that I did not believe in god (parents were very Christian and it took me until the end of the seventh grade to tell them that I did not believe). This unhealthy family life left me with a huge fear of rejection (always thought that I would get kicked out of the house if I did not believe as they did). During High School I interacted with different groups of friends (geeks, jocks, hicks, punks, etc all too arbitrary for me I liked learning from them all). However, I often preferred a balance. I could say that I spent all of my weekends with friends, while my weekdays(after school) were more for myself ( I looked forward to the weekend, but I also enjoyed my alone time during the week after school). Many of these weekend get togethers were one on one interactions. However, I also partied with friends (alcohol involved) and soon grew sick of the new dynamic. I enjoyed other activities with friends, but grew to dislike the party scene. Many of my friends started to like parties more to the exclusion of other activities (sports, hiking, deep conversation, making something together, etc). Fast forward to college. I had already gotten sick of parties that revolved around drinking and hooking up in high school. But for many people it was a new experience. It was a party school and I transferred out to another school in the hopes that it would be different (sadly it was the same and now I was a transfer student without a common freshman experience). It began to be really hard to find people to relate to and there were few friends that I would "hang out" with. At this point, my social skills deteriorated and I became disillusioned with making relationships. There was a point where I felt that I had no friends (although several people probably thought that they were friends). In hindsight,(just graduated this year) I believe that I was shy ( self-centered too) and allowed this fear to sabotage my ability to relate to and enrich others. People that knew me would call me "introverted" or sometimes "anti-social". I began to see them as immature, shallow, boring, and less intelligent( there are different intelligences and I no longer judge along these lines as IQ merely shows how quickly you learn concepts as opposed to your motivation and sense of direction). My first assumption from the previous sentence may be true, but it is true for all of us, as I have come to understand, there is always some avenue where we have not reached our full potential. The third one has no relevance. I still have not figured out about the second one (beyond the fact that judging others to be shallow is in itself an act of being shallow, in fact all judging is shallow, there is more information/relations to be considered). Just because I do not find something interesting does not mean that another won't. What makes my interests better? After taking this new perception to heart, I have found that I may have used introversion as a way to make an excuse for my fear of rejection (ideas and as a person). People are interesting and I probably wasted four years as a loner because I did not want to accept that I needed to grow in my own way. It is not good to use others lower path of growth to justify retarding my own. It could also be what another poster mentioned and I am more of an XNTP.

Thanks for reading if you got this far.:crazy: I hope you found something useful in this.
 

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Wait, wait.
There are ENTPS that aren't weird?
Curious.:crazy:
 

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i read it fully. thanks for typing it out :)
INFJ is another strong possibility. like, if i read it cold, without the possibility of NTP already planted, i'd say definite INFJ. even though your behavior is very consistent with ENTP, your writing style doesn't hold strong for that at all. i didn't detect any xNTP bitterness, black humor or arrogance. you were clean and straight throughout the thread. the block of text was also consistent with this. (no problem though, i enjoyed reading it.) ENTP is typically short paragraphs or one-liners. INTP is either very brief, or extremely well-organized analysis. public communication varies depending on the culture in which you were raised, but if you were raised American, you're probably INFJ.
 
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