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Maybe my perception is distorted, but I think NFPs are softer compared to NFJs. A while ago, an INFP poster told me he thinks he is too "blunt" for INFJs. Lol no. Every single INFP I've met IRL is more of a pacifist and less stubborn than I am. Maybe I'm getting this type completely wrong but I can't see how an INFP could possibly be too "blunt" for me.

There's no comparison between ENFJs and ENFPs as well. I think ENFJs can be tough and pushy AF compared to ENFPs, mainly due to Fe lead and terc Se.
My sister is an INFJ, and she is very blunt and stubborn. I’m an INFP on the other hand, and my family makes jokes about how I never get to the point. I’m afraid of conflict and I’m not very philosophical. My sister is much more deep and likes getting into philosophical debates and such.
 
I feel like Fe and Fi types both confront in different ways for slightly different reasons.

They both confront because something has been violated.

But I feel like for Fe types it's more to "air out" grievances and to confront behavior--they expect a result. They also want to get it done with so that you know where both of you stand. So it's almost like it's a necessary thing they want to happen to solidify the relationship a little too, and to make way for better experiences.

For me, Fi is more about...I don't think it's necessary unless I have to do it. And that's often times not about the relationship at all, but something completely different bothering me. If I get mad enough to confront it's already pretty advanced.

For Fe it's more like they also need to go through the drama. It can't be a neutral, unemotional, "so this happened, and we need to resolve it." Like I will sometimes resolve things for the sake of relationships, but then I try to present it in the most non-confrontational way and I don't want to have to get a lot of emotions involved.

Fe is like--it has to be done with the drama. It's like the idea of emotional catharsis or something. Once you get it out it is gone and just move on.

But for me it's usually quite different--if the damage is done, I sense it is not all finished. In fact you can just add little micro-injuries to the original injury if you are in a rush to "air out grievances" too bluntly or crudely.

That's also where you get back to Fe being blunt in one way where Fi is blunt in others. Fe is emotionally blunt so that it will make you upset on purpose.

Fi is blunt in thoughts--Fi doms express themselves bluntly sometimes, but not because they are anticipating an emotional reaction, but because they are just saying something impersonal. And it's interpreted as offensive or upsetting.

Fe--I think they actually want to say something that hurts because they anticipate a better result that way.

Anyway, that's my limited experience with Fe doms and also as a Fi personality type.

I don't feel like editing, so there's probably some redundancies.
 
I guess another way to look at it could be stereotypes (because how could MBTI not need more of those?) of like a highschool jock.

Fe is the highschool jock. His confrontations are treated like it's part of his nature. It's also, some of it, a show--and for group cohesion or solidarity. He confronts in order to achieve some kind of end for his group or his standing with another person. He does what needs to be done for his aims. Fe doms might not justify it the same way as a jock, but the behavior reminds me more like that--the assumption that it's just part of life.

Fi is probably more like the awkward kid who is really quite sensitive and weak in many ways, but who also tries to hide it and look like a tough guy if bothered too much. And he can be tough. But it just comes out more unexpectedly. It's more of a defense or an accident. It's not something anyone really likes--it's not pretty or anything either. It's ugly.

IME Fe, (though tbh I've only known SFJ not NFJ) likes drama to a degree. They admit it to themselves often. It's a tiny bit of spice of life. Fi is usually trying to avoid hurting someone or getting hurt...sometimes they like drama but it's not as common I don't think--at least not to consciously like it.

But both can underestimate/overestimate each other. My ex boss and I got into it once. She was sort of spouting out stuff she knew people would take offense to. I made a sarcastic remark and she replied--and I retreated. She then thought my retreat was because I couldn't respond or something, when it was actually just self-restraint and seeing the conflict as pointless.

So then she threw the gauntlet down hard and tried to rub it in my face (my retreat gave her confidence) and I came back at her with an even harder and more thorough response IN PUBLIC (bc tbh it's all there, just more contained with Fi and it gives it a bit more of a surprise and force), and she ended up crying about it. So that kind of thing can happen. But often times I do back down if it's someone who's really close--so they never see that side completely (or rarely do). Just because I value the relationship over showing I'm right.

But imo Fe thinks it's playing sometimes and Fi sometimes takes it way more seriously, at least that's the issue I've had. But I'm also a pretty sensitive person. Not all Fi types are sensitive. But most of them do have a bent of seriousness when it comes to emotional values that Fe sometimes finds a bit extreme.

Fe also can value relationships, but they think of emotions more like "storms that pass," if you just vent them, and fighting is just something people do. Fi understands that in principle but holds onto pain much longer so it's more careful about not causing injuries because it is slower to heal and it assumes other people are too. IME
 
^^^ Hmmm. This doesn't ring true for me, at least as far as Fe goes (as far as I can construe Fi, I do think you're in the ballpark). Especially as an INFJ Fe, we don't like drama, no not one bit. We'll do anything to escape it, and avoid people who have a tendency to foment it. And we don't think of emotions as "storms that pass." Occurrences of emotional storms are entered, unerasable, into the eternal INFJ databank; every bruise required or received is remembered and resented until the end of time; and people who cause them are, as just mentioned, avoided if at all possible. INFJ Fe avoids direct confrontations (the exception would be if we're protecting some underdog, at which point we become samurai warriors); and should a need for intervention arise, we try to address it in an elegantly discreet way by stage-managing the situation/atmosphere so that the ill-doer or wrong-headed person will learn for himself without it being necessary for us INFJs to dirty our hands with overt intervention. And, really, learning for one's self is the only truly effective way to learn; learning perforce is just pretending to learn, out of submission.

And when the ill-doer or wrong-headed person shows no capacity to learn . . . ? Well, that's what the INFJ Door Slam is all about.
 
^^^ Hmmm. This doesn't ring true for me, at least as far as Fe goes (as far as I can construe Fi, I do think you're in the ballpark). Especially as an INFJ Fe, we don't like drama, no not one bit. We'll do anything to escape it, and avoid people who have a tendency to foment it. And we don't think of emotions as "storms that pass." Occurrences of emotional storms are entered, unerasable, into the eternal INFJ databank; every bruise required or received is remembered and resented until the end of time; and people who cause them are, as just mentioned, avoided if at all possible. INFJ Fe avoids direct confrontations (the exception would be if we're protecting some underdog, at which point we become samurai warriors); and should a need for intervention arise, we try to address it in an elegantly discreet way by stage-managing the situation/atmosphere so that the ill-doer or wrong-headed person will learn for himself without it being necessary for us INFJs to dirty our hands with overt intervention. And, really, learning for one's self is the only truly effective way to learn; learning perforce is just pretending to learn, out of submission.

And when the ill-doer or wrong-headed person shows no capacity to learn . . . ? Well, that's what the INFJ Door Slam is all about.
I mostly have experience with ESFJs so not sure why I decided to add to the thread? lol Just that I've been around ESFJs and their problem solving was interesting. But they aren't NFJs.

But I haven't noticed the same thing with ISFJs so not sure why I'd think it'd be INFJs stuff. Just most of my experience with Fe.

I thought the article on direct vs. indirect communication that used to be posted in the INFJ section as interesting.

I think it said INFJ tended to be directive--in that they tended to give orders in a way, whereas INFP tend to prefer simply informing and letting the other person choose for themselves.

But I also think that directive communication can be more discreet with Fe, where it's couched as some kind of hint.

And INFP can sometimes offer information that's offensive and appears more like a direct confrontation (especially if it's something that other people are avoiding saying.) And then perhaps appear more tyrannical when they are actually being directive.

Of course both types can do both, but maybe that's the crux of the difference--directive vs. informative communication style.
 
Oh here's an article--I didn't read it. It's not the same one about INFJs and INFPs I don't think.

But I remember it saying INFJs were more "chart the course" types of communicators, and honestly it makes more sense for INFP to be more behind the scenes or get things going.

 
I think it all depends on the person, I'm pretty soft, but I can also be pretty blunt, I'm an INFJ. I don't think bluntness upsets me as much as it did a few years ago. I've met some INFP's who were soft, while others were not soft at all. It all depends on the person, how they grew up, and their type of environment.
 
I mean i know an NFP who has an 8-fix if not is an 8-core, so it really depends.

About Fi users vs Fe users in general:
Softer: 2/4/6-fixes, phlegmatic, sanguine, SEI ESE IEI EII, ♋♎♓, 2E in attitudinal psyche
Harder: 1/3/5/8-fixes, melancholic, choleric, SEE ESI EIE IEE, 1E in attitudinal psyche
 
They have an Ni vision, but that strong moral conviction comes from F, not Ni.
In particular, it's the Fi's that will push their moral convictions harder because they're taking them way more seriously than Fe.

I've never heard a Dom Fe say "if you can't understand the importance of this moral, then we can't be friends". But I've heard MANY Fi Doms say things like that. And sometimes even worse.
:thonker: Either my INFJ relative is INFP, or you're just flat-out wrong.

Also, in socionics, Alpha is the quadra who will not cut off ties based on morals, while Gammas will do it in the blink of an eye.
 
Yes, you get my point. Few people understand Socionics around here, but you seem to do. The Beta quadra. Of all quadras, it is the most expressive quadra and perhaps the most sensitive to conflict. INFPs are in the Delta quadra, or the most chill quadra.

And I'm sorry these particular INFJs have been mean to you. They sound like jerks (and yeah, INFJs can be jerks) 🤷‍♀️
MBTI=/=socionics. They both DIVERGE from Carl Jung's work but are NOT exactly the same. I've noticed the P/J switch to happen about half the time, regardless if intratim or extratim.

Alpha is the most chill quadra. They wanna get along with anybody. Gammas are the least chill, having an extremely allies vs enemies stance, even if they aren't emotionally expressive about it. Have you ever watched an LSE in action with being domineering because they are NOT chill lol. And EIIs like me are judgy af.
 
I think I see a difference in that most INFJ I know can speak out and assert their authority against someone with a solid conviction that it's for the better and that they're contributing positively to enlightening the person or creating a better outcome while when I speak out it's just my short fuse switching, and I can't really justify it as being a good thing afterwards, there's only regret for having failed to see a different point of view on a subject.

INFJ are also slightly more sarcastic I think even without negative intent. My impression is when an INFP becomes sarcastic, it's more serious in the sense that by the time they throw some shade they have been annoyed by the other person for quite a long time before to the point that the relationship is in bad shape.

However, when it comes to being hard on the inside it's another story because of INFP being judger first, hard to manipulate and influence (in a lot of cases ) and I think a tad more skeptical of new persons entering their life.
 
I wonder if there might be a difference in how we handle ingroup compared to outgroup? I think my spouse is likely infj (though he is a bit all over the place...), and I am infp, and a difference I have noticed about confronting, is that when what he says is directed against the outgroup (opponents in views on things mostly), he can be more vicious than me, I would not go as far as say he is demonising, but more in that direction than I would (I can rant sometimes and be unfair then though...). But when it comes to his groups, family, friends, people in groups based on shared opinions etc, then he is much more careful to keep the peace then I am, and seem to want to agree, for all to agree. I sometimes feel uncomfortable when people agree a lot, and even play devils advocate, ruining the team feeling they are building, but often it is more unaware, just speaking my mind and first after getting it would be seen as a confrontation, as the threshold is much lower for that in the ingroup.
 
I wouldn't say i'm soft, and i'm an INFP. Perhaps i'm more & more becoming an INFJ dichotomically, but my Fi and Ne are much stronger than Fe or Ni. I also think Fe users tend to be more soft than Fi users, i guess? Although Fe will easier notice mistakes in social handling than Fi whereas Fi will usually care less, and focus more on theirselves, and certainly correct less people, but sometimes they will project their values on others. I think Fi is much more focused than Fe which is more harmony-based.

I definitely have strong Ne. Perhaps i'm ENFP instead of INFP. It's a possibility. Or i'm INTP which some have suggested here as well. Some have suggested NFJ as well. I don't know. I guess INFP is middle-in-the-road between all types that have been suggested to me and it's what makes most sense to me right now.

But back to the topic, i'm known to be hard, both on the internet and here, and I sometimes don't shy away from confrontations or an argument. I can't stand "losing an argument", and I most certainly win most of them. But I only go into an argument if i care, like if my Fi-boundaries are broken, but they are easily broken to be honest, because my Fi is very demanding, extremely demanding and exhausting for myself. I generally set very high standards to myself and others. Also because I don't use Fe, i have less skill to comfort others, so even while I think I comfort people, i'm not known as someone who can comfort known, so that's why i'm seen as rather cold and hard, but than again i think i have good advice, have high conscience of what I do, what others do, and how I try to help others. I'm just not sure if i can communicate it well enough to others.

On some topics i come across as very soft and forgiving, but the way i talk about it might sound it hard again ironically, and that's the way with many things. I choose the softer side on debates, but i'm quite hard in bringing that over and making the arguments for it.

I'm harder though on the internet than in real-life i believe.
 
is directed against the outgroup (opponents in views on things mostly), he can be more vicious than me, I would not go as far as say he is demonising, but more in that direction than I would (I can rant sometimes and be unfair then though...). But when it comes to his groups, family, friends, people in groups based on shared opinions etc, then he is much more careful to keep the peace then I am, and seem to want to agree, for all to agree. I sometimes feel uncomfortable when people agree a lot, and even play devils advocate, ruining the team feeling they are building, but often it is more unaware, just speaking my mind and first after getting it would be seen as a confrontation, as the threshold is much lower for that in the ingroup.
I don't know, i can be vicious to both ingroup and outgroup, although ingroup is more targetted towards individuals that annoy me, so I would guess i'm more vicious towards outgroups.

But last christmas, i celebrated christmas with my dad and step mom and their children. I can tell you we had an argument and i wanted to leave. I have not seen them since, because they crossed the line. Usually i visited them every week, and now i didn't in three months!!! so i think infp's are hard in that regard.

But yeah... i can sometimes forget about friends & family too, like my mom once was at my home because she thought i was dead...
 
Maybe my perception is distorted, but I think NFPs are softer compared to NFJs. A while ago, an INFP poster told me he thinks he is too "blunt" for INFJs. Lol no. Every single INFP I've met IRL is more of a pacifist and less stubborn than I am. Maybe I'm getting this type completely wrong but I can't see how an INFP could possibly be too "blunt" for me.
generalizing, of course:

infj, despite their stereotypes, can be quite abrasive... and that's without pissing them off. It's better to approach one with caution especially in the wild. How well reasoned they are depends on the environment and surrounding people. They've got kind of a jekyll and hyde thing going on.. people like to claim villains as intj but I rather believe infj fits the bill more.

They're quite opinionated.. well, I'd say at first... the more one interacts with them, the more adaptable some of those opinions become. However, yes, they're quite stubborn. . . particularly, in regards to, their self image... which tends to be either high or low with few resting between. One on one most are decent but groups of infj will link to create a minefield in which few others will survive unless you admit defeat and surrender... but once you surrender, you may be treated to a life of luxury. sure, you might have to wear a collar and perform tricks but given they're prone to guilt.. they generally will self destruct before making any serious demands of you.

however infp I would say are more difficult.. they can be far more bratty, they'll try to pass it off as being playful but it tends to be more obnoxious than anything... it's mostly the struggle of dealing with whiny wants or the various things they'll try to get out of. they tend to be the reverse to infj when it comes to opinions. at first, they appear more open but the more you interact with them the more obstinate they become... the infp is likely a henchmen at best, they tend to be either emo or happyhardcore; multiple layers of teenage wangst that they never entirely grow out of.

They're also more trouble than the infj because most people are convinced they're innocent and pitiful thus many others will go out of their way to try to protect them.. even if it means enabling their worst attributes or indulging their tantrums. pissing off an infp means you're likely pissing off anyone they're close to... and despite their henchman status, they're more likely to have a wide and diverse legion ready to fight to the death for them. . . but luckily, most infps are addicted to sweets and will inevitably suffer a crash for you to make an escape. they easier to deal with in private as in public they tend to go out as furries or within cosplay and tend not to hear when you're talking because they were busy with their fandom headmates.. their public behaviors are largely dependent upon their primary choice of fandom.
 
The Beta quadra. Of all quadras, it is the most expressive quadra and perhaps the most sensitive to conflict
WHAT? Have you ever been around STPs in your life? And NFJs too can stir up a lot of chaos if things don't go the way they want them to go.
As for expressiveness.. Bjork is an INFP and she's expressive and blunt. What's all this stereotyping about anyways? I personally know several ISFJs and INFPs that have been some of the most offensive and rude people I've ever met.
But keep on believing the lies you tell yourself.. "INFJs are the most blunt, expressive, thoughtful, caring, serene, introspective, daring, ingenius, respectful type, that's a fact"..
 
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