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Thanks!

No, we went towards a relationship. We had sex, but after the 1.5 months not anymore, but she does string me along for validation and attention. And uses her seduction skills for that. She is dancing very intimate, with a hair away touching lips. She is looking very deeply in my eyes, touching me, hinting that others have met in the same way as us and they are now in a relationship, invites me in her bedroom, asking me to reassure her and we went through her 21 birthday photobook (she is now 26+).

I sent you an DM. Thanks for listening and helping.
We can take this to DM. I get you not wanting to share.
I replied.
 

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@Mr.Adrian yeah, I'm going to have to agree with @FueledByEvil here. She doesn't really sound ESFJ to me. Althought I could be wrong, but typically ESFJs tend to be a little more serious about finding a partner, as opposed to playing mind games.
 

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Hi I'm not so keen on posting my question here, but if an ESFJ/ISFJ would be willing to message me to answer it would be greatly appreciated! Thanks
 

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I have two questions for you (and for some reason I feel myself here as an alien on another planet):

1. What are your references when you want to think seriously about something abstract, e.g. Human Mind?

2. Do you hate people when they outsmart you in public?

(The second question is really important for me, personally)
 

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@Talee_eh I'm on mobile so please excuse any typos and for mentioning rather than quoting since it is easier

1. My reference is whoever I'm talking to about it (since I don't really think about that sort of thing unless someome brings it up in conversation). I have to bounce thoughts off of people and get their help in clarifying what I'm even talking about. Or if I'm thinking about it on my own then ai reference a past conversation I had with someone about it. Does this make sense? I wasn't sure how well I understood the question. I avoid the abstract and will always try to twist it into something that makes tangible sense.

2. No, unless they're a jerk about it. If it's at my expense, like making me the butt of a joke, I will resent them for it as I don't like being publically humiliated. But if they just realized something that I didn't and they're not a dick to me about it then I don't care. Being outsmarted doesn't affect me but being teased about it is what would upset me.
 

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Discussion Starter #86
@Talee_eh

1. I'm totally with Suntide on this one. My go to is always other people first. When it comes to abstract things, I usually go to my INTP husband before anyone else (for obvious reasons). We definitely have different ways of solving things as my go-to is usually to talk to other people who may be more of an expert in the subject and hear what they think. Definitely not his go-to.

2. Hmmm... no, definitely not hate at all. It doesn't really bother me unless they're being mean about it (which honestly rarely / if ever happens). I think I can hold my own pretty well in intellectual conversations but I think for me I get uncomfortable when I feel like someone is trying to show off or make someone else in the group not feel good about themselves. Or when I feel like the person is getting too deep down the rabbit hole and losing the group's interest. Those things annoy me more... basically when people can't read the crowd. Or when Thinker types try to act like the only true "facts" in life come from logic and that there's no room for emotional logic... so basically discrediting things that are important to others just because it doesn't feel right to them.

Since you mentioned #2 was important to you personally it makes me wonder if you feel like maybe you do this sometimes to other people since you're an INTP (I know, totally speculating here...). I know my INTP husband early on when he was younger would think he's just speaking normally / the truth and it ended up stepping on a bunch of toes without him really getting why. Over the years he's been able to figure out a more delicate way to approach having those conversations in groups. There's a way to bring intellectual conversations to all sorts of people without coming across as "outsmarting" someone.. instead it's more like showing you're interested and curious to learn more about why people believe what they do without basically telling them their idiots for believing that. I think anytime someone is asking themselves if someone might hate them for outsmarting them then they probably should have approached that conversation differently to begin with.
 

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I have two questions for you (and for some reason I feel myself here as an alien on another planet):

1. What are your references when you want to think seriously about something abstract, e.g. Human Mind?

2. Do you hate people when they outsmart you in public?
(The second question is really important for me, personally)

1. If I'm thinking about something abstract, I might think about something I've read on the subject, or I will try to come up with a real world example that I can work off of. For example, if I wanted to think about poverty in the USA and how it's affecting school children, then I would think about actual children I knew who have been affected, what people around me have said in the past about poverty and their opinions, and maybe an article I read on the matter (although I don't retain facts well, so this is usually a vague rememberance). Then I would try to verablize my thoughts, or maybe make a diagram on paper or write journal style about this concept. I find it hard to keep track of my train of thought and the concept at the same time, so this is something I might do to help me think about it.

I also like talking to someone about an abstract concept, especially if I'm with someone else who I deem to be well versed in the subject. I basically get to ask them questions, and they give me answers, and then I can form questions off of their answers. This is really good if its over a topic I have little to no experience of, or haven't thought about before.

As to what abstracts I think about, I don't usually. I focus on my life, how I can help people around me, etc. But I am interested in certain topics, like school (as a teacher). So if I decide it's an important topic that I should know about that will help me in some concrete way, then I will put in some effort to learn about it and form my own thoughts about it.

2. Do you mean in a debate setting? Cause I don't do debates lol. As long as they don't rub it in, or they aren't trying to make me appear dumb, I don't really care. I'm a big supporter in giving credit where it is due. If they are trying to shame me/publicly humilate me, however, then I would be pretty upset and would probably hold a grudge for a very long time.
 

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Y'all wanna be friends?
 
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Why are you and ISFJs the best types?

Also where do you like to spend your free time (as in, outside of work/school)?

Years ago when I was in college, I had an awesome ESFJ friend (in Socionics terms, probably ESE-Si). After undergrad, I moved and we only stay in contact sometimes. He is busy. He was always very smart, the kind of guy who could have studied anything he wanted to, and he loved plants, so he chose botany. He completed his PhD in botany about 3 years ago (we graduated from undergrad in 2013 so he did it pretty fast, actually). He was a direct entry PhD. That kind of smart.

He was wonderful, but we only talk occasionally now. We live far.

I would like to find another friend like him. I understand not all ESFJs are going to be the same, he obviously had some wonderful characteristics that are NTR (not type related).
 
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Why are you and ISFJs the best types?

Also where do you like to spend your free time (as in, outside of work/school)?

Years ago when I was in college, I had an awesome ESFJ friend (in Socionics terms, probably ESE-Si). After undergrad, I moved and we only stay in contact sometimes. He is busy. He was always very smart, the kind of guy who could have studied anything he wanted to, and he loved plants, so he chose botany. He completed his PhD in botany about 3 years ago (we graduated from undergrad in 2013 so he did it pretty fast, actually). He was a direct entry PhD. That kind of smart.

He was wonderful, but we only talk occasionally now. We live far.

I would like to find another friend like him. I understand not all ESFJs are going to be the same, he obviously had some wonderful characteristics that are NTR (not type related).
Why thank you, it's nice to be appreciated :proud: I don't know if your question was directed at ESFJs only, but my answer is home, home is where I go. But I'm introverted, so I might not be helpful.
 
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I don't want to upset the social-emotional atmosphere. I need it to be upbeat at all times. If other people bring up their problems, I will cheer them up, give them advice, whatever I need to do to 'fix' it so the atmosphere goes back to being upbeat. But I don't want to be the one putting all that negative energy out there. I don't know if other people even feel it the way that I do, but nonetheless, I feel like it's my responsibility.
ESFJs like connecting with people and feeling good vibes and not being in conflict. <--absolutely can't stand conflict because of the negative energy / vibe it creates in a group. Because we empathize deeply with people and almost feel what they feel, you know? So if we feel like someone is disrupting the group dynamic by inserting a lot of conflict (or being "rude" or going against other accepted social niceties / norms) it can bother us because we know that it'll have an affect on other people that we then will have to put more "social" work into making the environment better again or listening to that person's feelings to help them sort it out and feel better.
Hey, just FYI I really appreciate the work that those with strong Fe put into this. As a tertiary Fe type myself, I have enough Fe to sense the environment and not to disrupt it (i.e. I can enter an upbeat environment and maintain the upbeatness, I can match the environment well enough) but I don't have enough refinement with Fe to 'fix' an environment that has become negative.

But I certainly notice when someone else is able to repair the environment like you do. I'm truly in awe of it. The only time I can really 'fix' an uncomfortable social environment is in a very small group when something tense has been said, sometimes I can find the right joke + facial expression to reset the environment. But it is hard for me to do this because my Fe lacks refinement compared to the types with very strong Fe like ESFJ and often when I try to do this, it does not work lol.

(Of course the desire for an upbeat environment can also be related to enneagram type and not only MBTI type or Jungian type.)

:proud:

Also SummerRoads in the rest of your post, it sounds like you have a really good balanced relationship with your husband. Also some very good insights about the "gossip" thing and about how ESFJs recharge sometimes. Thanks!
 

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Why thank you, it's nice to be appreciated :proud: I don't know if your question was directed at ESFJs only, but my answer is home, home is where I go. But I'm introverted, so I might not be helpful.
Haha, good point. It's true, it's why I meet so many more ESFJs than ISFJs. The ESFJs are actually outside haha.
 
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I saw a few posts in here from ESFJs who were married to INTPs. I am just curious, if you don't mind sharing, how did you meet?
 

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Usually, what are the top three areas in your life that you think about the most, that concern you the most? What do you value the most?
 

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Discussion Starter #95
Hmmm... I'd say the things mostly that concern me have to do with my family (e.g. Are everyone's needs mets? Do they all feel loved?), am I living up to my values (e.g. am I being a good citizen? Doing what I think is right? Am I being a good friend and staying in touch / caring?), and third is my home life pretty organized (e.g. do kids have clean clothes for school? Am I making healthy meals consistently? Are everyone's school forms filled out on time?).

So maybe that doesn't sound so interesting compared to other personality types but this is honestly what's on my mind a lot. What about you, SecondStar?
 

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Usually, what are the top three areas in your life that you think about the most, that concern you the most? What do you value the most?
My observations with an ESFJ wife and son.
When they are themselves and not in an undue state of trauma, be it physical or mental.


@SummerRoads has remarkably similar to my observations.

Top three prioritized (think about)

-Family (how they are viewed by family/family happenings)
-Community (how they are viewed by community)
-Self (how they view themselves/self improvement)


Top three prioritized (concerned about)

-Family (general wellness followed by ESFJ picture of what should be)
-Community (concerned about community as in not only how the community operates but also
how the community views the ESFJ and family)
-Self (ESFJ care enough about self to put on the show and are concerned enough to
want to be around longer to support. So self is important at this level)

Top three, no priority (value)
-Duty (hands down the one item no (healthy) ESFJ I know will sacrifice)
-Trust (Trust is the ESFJ judgment I would say)
-Harmony

Again, my anecdotal summation based on a the few ESFJ I really know.
 

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Usually, what are the top three areas in your life that you think about the most, that concern you the most? What do you value the most?
Well my answer might be a little different. I'm trying to think how concern and value would be different. I suppose concern would be what I focus on, while value would be the building blocks of who I am?

For me, my top concern is usually "What is my purpose? Am I living up to what I believe I should be doing?" (usually no, lol)

My second concern is community, having something to offer towards friends or family (which kind of stems from the first one). Half the time I end up too focused here and miss my first concern, so I'm working on that.

My third concern would be efficiency. I hate wasting time, but I'm also very good at wasting time. Even though I have a lot of goals I get easily distracted, and don't follow through as much as I would like. 😕 I should add I do see value in relaxation and free time as well, but I hate it when I procrastinate or waste my time on watching YouTube videos, etc. rather than use a creative outlet for relaxation.

As for values, I value harmony, being part of a strong community/friend group/family where I can support and help others, and serving my purpose.
 

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Hmmm... I'd say the things mostly that concern me have to do with my family (e.g. Are everyone's needs mets? Do they all feel loved?), am I living up to my values (e.g. am I being a good citizen? Doing what I think is right? Am I being a good friend and staying in touch / caring?), and third is my home life pretty organized (e.g. do kids have clean clothes for school? Am I making healthy meals consistently? Are everyone's school forms filled out on time?).

So maybe that doesn't sound so interesting compared to other personality types but this is honestly what's on my mind a lot. What about you, SecondStar?
No,I think it sounds very caring and selfless :). I would say what concerns me the most is being happy, having deep and meaningful relationships and living my life to the fullest. On a more practical note I would say I'm concerned with making money cause having opted out of university I am starting my career path directly so that comes with a lot of pressures.
 

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Posting this in here because some of you didn't seem to like the second Ask An ESFJ thread ;)

Why do you think everyone types their mom as your kind?
 

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Discussion Starter #100
I think it's because a lot of our qualities of caring, being helpful, organized, structured, etc. are things you see in other moms too...because you have to be when you have kids. I mean someone has to make sure the kids have some semblance of structure, get to school on time, do their homework, and aren't up all night, etc. So I think moms of all personality types end up having in many ways to fill the roles of enforcing rules whether that really comes naturally to them or not. I think people go down the stereotype route when they see the outward results of what their mom does but don't understand her inner process of getting there.

Also, people who are upset with their moms tend to throw shade our way because they think their mom is overbearing, too in their business, demanding, etc. and somehow that magically equals ESFJs....
 
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