Personality Cafe banner

501 - 520 of 553 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
81 Posts
Well, you're Te-doms like us, so obviously you have a good head on your shoulders.

Other than that, I don't have many thoughts about it since I never did meet many of you. I think one of my classmates back in high school could have been ENTJ, and I admired her for a lot of the characteristics you'd attribute to ENTJs.

I also, despite repeatedly reading several explanations about it, don't really grasp what Ni actually is about. So I don't have a clear idea of how we're different from each other.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
57 Posts
a lot of sources say that estj's hate infj's and infjs feel the same. But I don't think that's true on my part, what is your opinion?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
Depends on stalking, but there are options:
1) If opponent is strong, attempts to hide. If opponent is weak, punch in the face, maybe no violence, but you get the vibe.
Wha?... opponent

Hmm...right. The ESTJ cannot conceive of stalking a love interest

2) Blushing.
Oh man, that's a lot nicer than being punched or getting arrested ^ ^ How cute would that be? :love_heart:
 

·
The spirit of the spirits
Joined
·
11,250 Posts
Wha?... opponent

Hmm...right. The ESTJ cannot conceive of stalking a love interest



Oh man, that's a lot nicer than being punched or getting arrested ^ ^ How cute would that be? :love_heart:
This was mostly a troll post, tbh. I'm against violence and the thing is that I wouldn't know how I would react. Also a lot depends on type of stalking. If someone wanted me dead, it wouldn't be nice. I may have some self defense stuff near me and be scared. Otherwise if intent are peaceful and possibly romantic, I dunno. A lot depends on stalker and personality. That can really turn out in many ways. Can make me uncomfortable, can make me feel flattered, can make me feel scared. It's not the act that decides something, it's the personality dynamics. Most of them can happen even without ever interacting, just by observing. If you wanna know something about ESTJ's emotions in general, then it's likely a thing they are most vulnerable at, completely their weakest part. In healthy manner emotional needs shouldn't be ignored by ESTJ, but rather be very personal and very unknown even to ESTJ himself. At least this is what I think. Using emotions makes me feel 'weak', it's just not my thing, but I appreciate them a lot. I surely feel them, but often don't really comprehend them completely, fail to express them, overall it's something to hide and to keep for yourself, because I wouldn't want to make a wrong step. Meanwhile dominant thinking function is complete opposite, it can be powerful, brash, outbursting and spitting logic, where it needs to. So if you think, you can read very subtle things and silent agreements, then relationship can start. I can say that after my grandpa's death, almost 5 months ago, I still haven't touched emotional conversations topic. Not because I don't feel anything, but because becoming vulnerable freaks me out. Similar to being naked in public. And the thing is that I probably felt the biggest emotional impact out of all of those people, but I never told that to anyone.
 

·
Registered
🌈🎹☮INFJ 666 sx/sp🇺🇸💃🏻💋
Joined
·
3,038 Posts
a lot of sources say that estj's hate infj's and infjs feel the same. But I don't think that's true on my part, what is your opinion?

Been married to an ESTJ for almost 17 years.

It hasn't always been easy but I don't think any marriage or relationship is always easy. Compatibility is more complex than simply personality type. And I think any two people who are willing to work together, communicate and compromise can be compatible, for the most part.

Relationships aren't two people who are perfect for each other finding each other, they are two imperfect people who have learned the art of patience, kindness, forgiveness and grace.

This goes for friendships as well.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
17,819 Posts
a lot of sources say that estj's hate infj's and infjs feel the same. But I don't think that's true on my part, what is your opinion?
Let's just say that my dad drove my mom to nearly madness and extreme depression - but they're still together after 44 years of marriage. Oh and of course, my mom emotionally detached from him probably about 30 years ago or something. They've been together and have made it work though. To the outside observer, we're a dream family.

At the same time, we as a family would never be where we are today without either of them.

Terrible partners, but committed parents. It's a strange sort of relationship which wouldn't have resulted in any of us being where we are without their commitment to one another.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
300 Posts
Do ESTJs find emotional people weak or can they strike as cute to them too? What do you feel or what goes inside your head when you can not relate to other person's sensitivity?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
300 Posts
If you wanna know something about ESTJ's emotions in general, then it's likely a thing they are most vulnerable at, completely their weakest part. In healthy manner emotional needs shouldn't be ignored by ESTJ, but rather be very personal and very unknown even to ESTJ himself. At least this is what I think. Using emotions makes me feel 'weak', it's just not my thing, but I appreciate them a lot. I surely feel them, but often don't really comprehend them completely, fail to express them, overall it's something to hide and to keep for yourself, because I wouldn't want to make a wrong step. Meanwhile dominant thinking function is complete opposite, it can be powerful, brash, outbursting and spitting logic, where it needs to. So if you think, you can read very subtle things and silent agreements, then relationship can start. I can say that after my grandpa's death, almost 5 months ago, I still haven't touched emotional conversations topic. Not because I don't feel anything, but because becoming vulnerable freaks me out. Similar to being naked in public. And the thing is that I probably felt the biggest emotional impact out of all of those people, but I never told that to anyone.
I guess you are talking about this, but i would like to know what ESTJs think of other people's sensitivities. This seems to me that you are talking about your own emotions. The reason i am asking is, my mom is an ESTJ and whenever i try to explain a problem of mine she just can not comprehend why i don't do things in a logical manner. I can't seem to explain her that my emotions are in my way, she tries to understand me i can see that, but it also seems like something so unfamiliar to her. So i'm actually wondering how you guys perceive it, like what is really going on inside your head when you encounter smb like that.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
17,819 Posts
I guess you are talking about this, but i would like to know what ESTJs think of other people's sensitivities. This seems to me that you are talking about your own emotions. The reason i am asking is, my mom is an ESTJ and whenever i try to explain a problem of mine she just can not comprehend why i don't do things in a logical manner. I can't seem to explain her that my emotions are in my way, she tries to understand me i can see that, but it also seems like something so unfamiliar to her. So i'm actually wondering how you guys perceive it, like what is really going on inside your head when you encounter smb like that.
I believe I can help. With less self-aware ESTJ's, inferior Fi suppresses their own feeling based judgments and so they tend to consider that the same in others is also a weakness. It's a projection. They have spent their lives suppressing their feeling based judgements and that has given them success so it becomes a self-repeating cycle of suppression > validation - which then again gets projected to others because they had success with it. Emotions while not Jungian related in terms of psychology similarly also got repressed because repression for them reaps rewards over time ... Then comes the nature of Si where it's mostly projection of what worked for them would work for others - and since repression of emotion worked for them, it'll work for someone else too. Most (if not all) ESTJ's don't have the time or the energy or even desire to understand emotions of others at all because they're so busy repressing all of that F related "stuff" in their own mind. They need to be repressed because if they're not repressed then they get in the way of achieving what they wanted to achieve. My dad is a lot like your mom in that regard. Only after turning 73 has he started somewhat exploring his emotional side, but even then he'll share a few emotional things one day and then go back to his repressive state the next like nothing ever happened. Right now one of my cousins is dying of a stroke (he's only 51) and my dad has no emotion to speak of. None at all. It's clear that he's buried it so deep that it seems like it doesn't even exist - and he probably believes that it doesn't exist for him either.

The solution? Go and do it anyway. Succeed and then tell them. See, there are other ways of doing things that work as well.
 

·
The spirit of the spirits
Joined
·
11,250 Posts
I guess you are talking about this, but i would like to know what ESTJs think of other people's sensitivities. This seems to me that you are talking about your own emotions. The reason i am asking is, my mom is an ESTJ and whenever i try to explain a problem of mine she just can not comprehend why i don't do things in a logical manner. I can't seem to explain her that my emotions are in my way, she tries to understand me i can see that, but it also seems like something so unfamiliar to her. So i'm actually wondering how you guys perceive it, like what is really going on inside your head when you encounter smb like that.
To me it looks like type unrelated thing here. I think it depends more on upbringing, culture, past of that person. It's something like you don't expect thug to understand that, but you expect your psychologist to understand. Imagine similar thing mixed up and spreaded everywhere. Many people would be something in the middle. ESTJs in particular have it a bit different. Likely you see them dealing with their weakness. Some will deal, some not. In your example ESTJ (yet I would doubt that) somewhat tries to start up rusty Fi, but way superior Te just drives over it, completely takes over control. I personally would listen to what other's tell me about their emotions, but stuff gets complicated when there's a choice of Fi and Te. Te is default, "at home" way, Fi is something person needs to put more effort for it to work, comparable to "being with guests, you never knew before". It's probably the most what could be told, because jungian typology isn't a set in stone bible for people's behaviour. Most often you still have to think outside of it, you have to observe person and see how he/she works.

If you like anime, then you can watch School Rumble. Eri Sawachika is likely an ESTJ and deals with emotions. Or if you would like to see some tables, there's one, but about socionics, yet also works with jungian typology: http://www.sociotype.com/socionics/model_a/
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
This was mostly a troll post, tbh.
So was mine hah. I wasn't even thinking of antagonistic stalking when you mentioned "opponent". Because ESTJs are the type to directly ask out whoever they're interested in, unlike "certain" types who prefer a more ambiguous approach (too ambiguous as we can see from your response). Which is entirely what my post was alluding to. It was tongue-in-cheek - stalking is criminal behavior after all. But I'd be lying if I said I didn't have that tendency hehe What can I say, I'm an INFP!

If you wanna know something about ESTJ's emotions in general, then it's likely a thing they are most vulnerable at, completely their weakest part. In healthy manner emotional needs shouldn't be ignored by ESTJ, but rather be very personal and very unknown even to ESTJ himself. At least this is what I think. Using emotions makes me feel 'weak', it's just not my thing, but I appreciate them a lot. I surely feel them, but often don't really comprehend them completely, fail to express them, overall it's something to hide and to keep for yourself, because I wouldn't want to make a wrong step.
Sigh That's what I love about you guys. It's very innocent and brings out a motherly spirit in me.

I can say that after my grandpa's death, almost 5 months ago, I still haven't touched emotional conversations topic. Not because I don't feel anything, but because becoming vulnerable freaks me out. Similar to being naked in public. And the thing is that I probably felt the biggest emotional impact out of all of those people, but I never told that to anyone.
Firstly, I'm sorry for your loss. If I may offer a perspective on how...or rather who...to go about sharing your emotions to. This is my completely uneducated analysis of the cognitive functions at play ...What you're after is someone to understand how you'e feeling about your loss (satisfies Fi) and approve and validate it completely (satisfies Te). I believe this is the source of the vulnerability for ExTJs, especially since they can't always understand let alone explain the depth of their pain. If the Te approval is not met, it will severely hurt your Fi. Ti-Fe works in the reverse, to understand a concept (Ti) and for the collective to decide on how to feel about it (Fe). With Fe...the verbal etiquette surrounding death can sometimes feel hollow, and some people are dismissive and don't understand others' grieving process. And that's why it's important to have someone in your life that you trust completely, even if just one or two people. What that trustworthiness looks like is that even if they don't immediately understand what you're going through, they will believe you when you say you're hurting very deeply and ask questions if necessary. You want to find someone who takes an interest in your life and asks a lot of questions about you. Understanding is really the key to feeling comforted. I see ESTJs with people in their life who are just there because of what they can do for them, nothing more. But do they care to really know on a deep level who is the person who's doing all these things for them, and more importantly, how are they feeling? No.
 

·
The spirit of the spirits
Joined
·
11,250 Posts
So was mine hah. I wasn't even thinking of antagonistic stalking when you mentioned "opponent".
No shit, Sherlock.

Because ESTJs are the type to directly ask out whoever they're interested in, unlike "certain" types who prefer a more ambiguous approach (too ambiguous as we can see from your response). Which is entirely what my post was alluding to.
And why would ESTJs be so straight forward. This doesn't make any sense.


It was tongue-in-cheek - stalking is criminal behavior after all.
Unless you are in Chernobyl and are having cheeki breeki time. While having crush on man called Strelok.


But I'd be lying if I said I didn't have that tendency hehe What can I say, I'm an INFP!
That's type unspecific stuff.


Sigh That's what I love about you guys. It's very innocent and brings out a motherly spirit in me.
It can in other ways. If ESTJ is overconfident bastard, then Fi will be poorly controlled and making decisions about many things. Most of them will suck, would be black or white, but barely grey (that's hypothetical).


If I may offer a perspective on how...or rather who...to go about sharing your emotions to.
There's no need for that, but that can't be stopped now...

This is my completely uneducated analysis of the cognitive functions at play
I would say that cognitive functions shouldn't be integrated in our analysis as it's almost always better to just think like normal human. From what I have seen, integrating cognitive function theory often makes situations look very different and not realistic. I would stay away from those as that limits my human capabilities. Typology only is interested in very narrow field of human mind mechanics. And feeling like it's a big thing is foolish.



...What you're after is someone to understand how you'e feeling about your loss (satisfies Fi) and approve and validate it completely (satisfies Te). I believe this is the source of the vulnerability for ExTJs, especially since they can't always understand let alone explain the depth of their pain.
They can, but not with great stability. Not sure if Fi would like someone else intruding in their life. It's rather secretive and alone function, delicate to service.


If the Te approval is not met, it will severely hurt your Fi. Ti-Fe works in the reverse, to understand a concept (Ti) and for the collective to decide on how to feel about it (Fe). With Fe...the verbal etiquette surrounding death can sometimes feel hollow, and some people are dismissive and don't understand others' grieving process. And that's why it's important to have someone in your life that you trust completely, even if just one or two people.
That doesn't explain anything. You kept talking about Fe and magically there's a need for understanding person. Maybe to Fi Fe approach can look shallow, but yet again it depends. I felt almost nothing in church, but when I got to that house. The house those grandparents were living and I spent my childhood summers into. I couldn't handle. Memories were fresh, I saw some of his things, like clothes, glasses. It felt like he should be here, but he wasn't. That was very hard to see, I sat down on chair in the kitchen (first room after little corridor in that house). I couldn't handle that and tears started to flow. That was my weakest moment. Now I sort of remember things that he did or how he did some stuff. It's a village, so lots of things had to be done outside. Even if it's wrong to say, I will say that he was to me more of father figure than my own father. I still know more about him as person than I do about my own father. I can tell you more, but I don't think I need. You can see that Fi here isn't handicapped thing at all, only not preferred way of dealing with things. I have told whole story to one person in perC. So I had a person to which I could tell everything. I can say that what I wrote about the death and my feelings, could qualify as art. Even if Fi 4th, it can shine more than some people's 1st.


What that trustworthiness looks like is that even if they don't immediately understand what you're going through, they will believe you when you say you're hurting very deeply and ask questions if necessary. You want to find someone who takes an interest in your life and asks a lot of questions about you. Understanding is really the key to feeling comforted.
Possibly, but person can't be from my relatives. Grandma almost needs help herself due to loss, mom doesn't have a good emotional support capabilities. Dad is too unknown person (this is his father who is dead).

I see ESTJs with people in their life who are just there because of what they can do for them, nothing more. But do they care to really know on a deep level who is the person who's doing all these things for them, and more importantly, how are they feeling? No.
I dunno if I want to agree with that. You may be a bit too harsh about other people, but what you say holds some truth. Not many are willing to investigate with what person they are with. I personally dumped natural human desire to reach for success, like money, house, car... All that stuff to low level or to sensoric appreciation level only. I hold feeling at higher value. I often feel not so good, when people only care about grades, what you achieve in your life. I feel that this is wrong to ignore the wonders of other people, that have no monetary value. Many things can't be counted with paper. We do enjoy many things that affect us differently. I think I seek that. I sort of started to hate school for not focusing much on anything else, but grades. It feels disgusting that the only thing we are trying to achieve in that place is just how to score higher on some meaningless stuff. I'm a bad student. I have no attitude to just learn, but I may have entered a secret stage of learning the stuff that many others don't even think about. I sort of became a vandal. Started to vandalise some property, destroy things. Not a lot, just a bit. Totally not a great thing to do, but still even in there I can only see the same pattern. You destroy property and you are bad person, but what's lacking is some thoughts about "bad people". No one cares if you have problems, somewhat want to express yourself. You can be either good or bad, based on way too simplicistic logic. No one cares to investigate those works that are bad as something more neutral, worth to be investigated further. Hell, even my username should suggest something. It's my best attempt at defining me and it's The red spirit. Deep philosophy of life with unique desires. I changed my type to ESTJ some days ago, not sure if I should have done that. My previous type was ISTP. I always feel like some great things about person aren't defined by type. Those noobs, who enter MBTI world and think this is some mega cool godsent stuff are likely the worst thing to happen. Some dudes wanted to touch the depths of the people, but rarely anyone wants to investigate further. Then later some people believe it's the greatest touch of depth to ever exist. That's not true. Not true at all, but who understand that? WHO!? Almost no one.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6 Posts
I guess you are talking about this, but i would like to know what ESTJs think of other people's sensitivities. This seems to me that you are talking about your own emotions. The reason i am asking is, my mom is an ESTJ and whenever i try to explain a problem of mine she just can not comprehend why i don't do things in a logical manner. I can't seem to explain her that my emotions are in my way, she tries to understand me i can see that, but it also seems like something so unfamiliar to her. So i'm actually wondering how you guys perceive it, like what is really going on inside your head when you encounter smb like that.

Hi Ariviel. I cannot reply to your message because I don't have 15 posts on personalitycafe yet. That's a rule. If you'd like to discuss what you had in mind then please contact me on Facebook. My username there is Ai-And Thou. The rules don't allow me to put my email address here yet either.
 
501 - 520 of 553 Posts
Top