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Discussion Starter #1
Say my fellow INTP and other alike. What do you think about those aura and spiritual stuff ? Like physics power or other supernatural thingy. Astral planes, whatsoever.

My personal opinion, those are shits. They don't matter anything, and just a belief.
I think i saw some articles about scientific proof of those things, related to vibration. May or might not be true, i don't know. But, i still see those are shits. Feel like people escaping from reality or something, by believing and practicing those stuff hoping to be a transcendent being or something. My higher-self or stuff.

Your thoughts ?
 

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Supernatural stuff, Those I don't believe. But as far as I know there isn't proof that those don't exist so why not.
Aura...I kinda believe it but it's more in the sense of magnetism than an actual spiritual thing.
Mainly I don't believe anything unless it can actually have a logical explanation. For example I am interested in lithotherapy and do believe that some of it is true because of chemical reactions between the rock and external elements (my skin, a computer's electromagnetism), ect...However all the magic stuff is beyond me.

My belief can be resumed in "I only believe in what I can see, touch or can logically explain. HOwever just because I can't doesn't mean it doesn't exist, I just won't be able to believe it". This is why I cannot have any faith
 

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I do not believe any of it, but with auras there is a possibility that they have visualized their own subconscious evaluation of a person. The brain is powerful and eyes aren't that precise, staring at something for a long time and things can starts giving off that sort of blue/purple imprint, changing that color based on a subconscious evaluation would only take a bit of training.

The thing about alternative medicine, is that if it was proven to work, it wouldn't be alternative anymore. Most of it is just snake oil, although a few things like hypnosis have a few merits, but aren't consistent at all.
 

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It is very difficult for me to belive in something. I need a lot of REAL evidences, best if double checked and reproducible in laboratory.
So I don't belive in any of these stuff.
Anyway, I'm ok if somebody belive in them, I find them a little bit naive and candid, but even intelligent people can be less rational than me.
 

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Ok. Don`t shoot me down please, but I have an alternative to give you here.

I dowse..not often..but I have demonstrated the measuring of a persons energy field by that means.
Science will support the energy field, as the human has a bio electric field.
Some people can sense more than others can. The dowsing is merely a tool to visually inform of what is being felt by the person .
In this modern world we no longer doubt just because we can not see things! e.g. TV and radio signals.

My little experiment was to get each person to dowse each others energy field. Each did, except for the skeptic. The skeptic ran the rods straight into the other and no response was found. Thus the reality for the skeptic remains valid...for him. That is his truth. It is true for him. For others, the rods responded strongly, so validating the effect for them, and it is true for them.

The skeptic was creating his own reality by his own belief system, which stopped all possible feeling and sensing of those available energies. This effect is to be seen right across the board in spiritual studies.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I do not believe any of it, but with auras there is a possibility that they have visualized their own subconscious evaluation of a person. The brain is powerful and eyes aren't that precise, staring at something for a long time and things can starts giving off that sort of blue/purple imprint, changing that color based on a subconscious evaluation would only take a bit of training.

The thing about alternative medicine, is that if it was proven to work, it wouldn't be alternative anymore. Most of it is just snake oil, although a few things like hypnosis have a few merits, but aren't consistent at all.
We see what we want to see.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Supernatural stuff, Those I don't believe. But as far as I know there isn't proof that those don't exist so why not.
Aura...I kinda believe it but it's more in the sense of magnetism than an actual spiritual thing.
Mainly I don't believe anything unless it can actually have a logical explanation. For example I am interested in lithotherapy and do believe that some of it is true because of chemical reactions between the rock and external elements (my skin, a computer's electromagnetism), ect...However all the magic stuff is beyond me.

My belief can be resumed in "I only believe in what I can see, touch or can logically explain. HOwever just because I can't doesn't mean it doesn't exist, I just won't be able to believe it". This is why I cannot have any faith
It's called a devil proof. To prove the existence of devil, you just need to bring one. If you can't, you can't say it exist or it doesn't exist. Truth is indeed relative to each person, we are a bundle of sensors afterall. Someone's truth doesn't apply to everyone.
 

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Ok. Don`t shoot me down please, but I have an alternative to give you here.

I dowse..not often..but I have demonstrated the measuring of a persons energy field by that means.
Science will support the energy field, as the human has a bio electric field.
Some people can sense more than others can. The dowsing is merely a tool to visually inform of what is being felt by the person .
In this modern world we no longer doubt just because we can not see things! e.g. TV and radio signals.

My little experiment was to get each person to dowse each others energy field. Each did, except for the skeptic. The skeptic ran the rods straight into the other and no response was found. Thus the reality for the skeptic remains valid...for him. That is his truth. It is true for him. For others, the rods responded strongly, so validating the effect for them, and it is true for them.

The skeptic was creating his own reality by his own belief system, which stopped all possible feeling and sensing of those available energies. This effect is to be seen right across the board in spiritual studies.
EDIT: I guess this might have come across as shooting you down, but it isn't with ill intent =)

Have you heard of James Randy? or his foundation?

They test all sorts of supernatural claims and will give 1 million dollars to whoever proves anything supernatural, dowsing is among those. Yet nothing has been proven yet, when they test people who dowse in double blind tests (neither party knows the right answer), they are right just as many times as regular chance would have it. Yet people still chose to believe they could do it, because they had examples of it working and all claimed that it must be something wrong with the energies. It is positive reinforcement, if it is a truth then it would work both for skeptics and believers, not just the believers. =)

Sure humans might have an electromagnetic field, but measuring it with sticks seems not to work. It is an old practice and using new technology we can mostly do what they claim to do. Electromagnetism really is a weird one, because it has absolutely none of those magical effects which has been given to it, it just seems like the current scapegoat for much pseudoscience.

'in this modern world we no longer doubt because we cannot see things' - wrong, we do question it and we question it all the time. Anything can be manipulated and to my knowledge most people are aware of that, in this day and age almost everyone is a skeptic.


do believe that some of it is true because of chemical reactions between the rock and external elements (my skin, a computer's electromagnetism), ect...However all the magic stuff is beyond me.
Why would different kinds of dirt have any significant chemical reaction with skin? The skin is made to keep out unwanted chemical reactions after all. Also how is electromagnetism supposed to interact in any significant way? I am curious to how there is any logical connection? =)

If we see good chemicals in rocks, why wouldn't pharmaceutical companies be all over it? distilling or synthesizing the important chemicals into medicine? Most medicine is made by first observing chemicals in nature after all.
 

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I'm probably going to get slammed for this:

I actually find spiritual stuff rather interesting, if only to read about. I am, though, pretty selective about what I believe in...which isn't much. But I'd still like to learn, just for the hell of it.

I'd love to try and, say, induce an OBE or learn to lucid dream and I've been curious about herbal medicine and hypnosis.
 

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Well, if there are ghosts/spirits, I guess I'll never know, as it apparently takes belief to see them. I was told this by people who thought there were ghosts in the house where I was a monitor. So, I asked, as they tried to persuade me...

'Is this a good or fun thing? Do you enjoy dealing with ghosts?'
'No, it's scary.'
'And I won't see them if I don't believe?'
'Yes.'
'Then why try to convince me?!'

Then I noted, if ghosts can't be around me due to non belief, I can serve as ghost repellent.
 

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It's not really a matter up for belief. If you have the experiences and have no way to account for them resorting to materialism or causal closure, you've got to look elsewhere.

If anyone is interested in these experiences, you first need to cultivate an open yet skeptical mind that is capable of having them. That is the laboratory where you can conduct your own experiments. Concerning this, Sam Harris writes that we need to "build our own telescopes" to investigate the phenomena of our minds. Unless we do so, we won't have the capacity to say anything meaningful about the experience. If we want to, say confirm that there are moons orbiting Jupiter, we can use a literal telescope and can borrow someone else's. But if we want to explore our own psyche, we need to "build our own telescope."
 

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I think an aura is a vibe and I get "vibes" from people's body language and speech. I wouldn't say they're extrasensory that's stupid.
"Mirror neurons." Totally sensory, yet unconscious. Dumps info through weird feelings and unconscious images into the conscious sphere. Still an extraordinary experience.
 

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Hah the aura thing, this reminds me of the the "Indigo Children", I watched some documentary on it. It was interesting, what was more interesting is that their parents really believe their kids are special and the kids than believe they are really special too (supernaturally that is). It also gives the parents a reason for their child's learning disabilities. So maybe people like it so they can have a reason for their child's imperfectness.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Well, if there are ghosts/spirits, I guess I'll never know, as it apparently takes belief to see them. I was told this by people who thought there were ghosts in the house where I was a monitor. So, I asked, as they tried to persuade me...

'Is this a good or fun thing? Do you enjoy dealing with ghosts?'
'No, it's scary.'
'And I won't see them if I don't believe?'
'Yes.'
'Then why try to convince me?!'

Then I noted, if ghosts can't be around me due to non belief, I can serve as ghost repellent.
I never met them, and i can say proudly i don't scared shit of them. Heck ! we could ask them what's on other side !!
Mystery of universe ! What happen after death !? :D So, those who can see and talk to ghost is just missing the opportunity, if ever exist of course :laughing:
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Hah the aura thing, this reminds me of the the "Indigo Children", I watched some documentary on it. It was interesting, what was more interesting is that their parents really believe their kids are special and the kids than believe they are really special too (supernaturally that is). It also gives the parents a reason for their child's learning disabilities. So maybe people like it so they can have a reason for their child's imperfectness.
That hurt. :laughing: "Before fooling your enemies, fool your friends, before fooling your friends, fool yourself."
 
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