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Discussion Starter #1
What are situations where you feel your not being authentic or are being viewed that way?

lol, people try to pull me into going to a party, and the enthusiasm of the moment I agreed. Later after I get thinking of how many unknowns there are about the whole experience, and how I'm going to have to manage to talk to these people for a while, even with the aid of alcohol its not something I think is enjoyable to subject myself to, I decided to back out. Going back on my words is something which makes me feel like a sham, but I know it was probably the right thing to do to enjoy myself. Nonetheless, the shame brings me an unauthentic feelings.

Whats your story?
 

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What are situations where you feel your not being authentic or are being viewed that way?

lol, people try to pull me into going to a party, and the enthusiasm of the moment I agreed. Later after I get thinking of how many unknowns there are about the whole experience, and how I'm going to have to manage to talk to these people for a while, even with the aid of alcohol its not something I think is enjoyable to subject myself to, I decided to back out. Going back on my words is something which makes me feel like a sham, but I know it was probably the right thing to do to enjoy myself. Nonetheless, the shame brings me an unauthentic feelings.

Whats your story?
I just did the same thing! I was at a friends house, ostensibly en route to a party. I ended up not wanting to leave (a large group of tipsy people cf my bestie - no competition), so I didn't... but I feel terrible about backing out at the last minute, even though I had a much better time at our impromptu anime marathon than I would have if I went to the party.
 

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Generally I believe ISTJ's are some of the least manipulative, and disguise our emotions toward people the least. Therefore we don't have large authenticity problems, but we know it and it hurts us when we do come across it.

I think my time in sales made for some unauthentic moments which I disliked myself for.
 

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Generally I believe ISTJ's are some of the least manipulative, and disguise our emotions toward people the least. Therefore we don't have large authenticity problems, but we know it and it hurts us when we do come across it.

I think my time in sales made for some unauthentic moments which I disliked myself for.


disguise our emotions the least???... I may have to disagree with that one.
 

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disguise our emotions the least???... I may have to disagree with that one.
I definitely don't disguise my emotions as something that they're not - for example, feigning approval in order to spare someone's feelings. But I almost never express my emotions to the extent that I feel them, so that could be considered a disguise of sorts.
 

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I definitely don't disguise my emotions as something that they're not - for example, feigning approval in order to spare someone's feelings. But I almost never express my emotions to the extent that I feel them, so that could be considered a disguise of sorts.

oh yeah. Well, I agree with this then. I thought he meant it that we express our true emotions the most...
 

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Discussion Starter #10
disguise our emotions the least???... I may have to disagree with that one.
was trying to say that we rarely decide to disguise our emotions, and are sometimes forced to. Guess it came out wrong and I didn't review my wording :(
 

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Well, I guess don't really know what you are getting at- I thought it was an ISTJ thing to hide their emotions and feelings, no?? Unless you mean disguise as faking our emotions?... but I don't see what that has to do with the topic- it seems more like a guilt for going against your word- unless you were faking your original desire to go to the party...?
 

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Discussion Starter #12 (Edited)
Well, I guess don't really know what you are getting at- I thought it was an ISTJ thing to hide their emotions and feelings, no?? Unless you mean disguise as faking our emotions?... but I don't see what that has to do with the topic- it seems more like a guilt for going against your word- unless you were faking your original desire to go to the party...?
To feel your putting on a show for people. It's fake, but you are poisoned with biases of your job, which were sales as I had mentioned. Playing up the positive attribute of a product while trying not to show the negatives. The actions don't show the truth, aren't authentic, and hard to stomach. I guess I believe a bit strongly that my job makes me who I am a bit much, and it gets to me. Regarding how that effects my emotions, I true feelings about the product being sold were different from what I was spitting out, and therefore felt unauthentic.

Hope thats a better description of my experience.
 

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I actually act differently at work versus at home or around friends. At work, I am more literal and sarcastic and co-workers think I know everything and wonder how my parents put up with me as a child. They also think all I do at home is play video games.

At times, I feel like a fraud and do not understand how they cannot see through the fraud when at home I am quite laid back and very shy and do not get out and do things with anyone unless I visit my parents. I was also a very well behaved child and teenager and did not get in trouble for anything.
 
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Due to the nature of my job, I'm forced to interact with clients MUCH more so than I would if left to my own devices. My NF coworkers (I'm literally surrounded by the NF types at work) think that it's a wonderful thing, of course.
 

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Wake--

It sounds like you are wrestling with authenticity as a concept, feeling like that you are lacking authenticity if you do things socially that are not really your desires, just to go along with friends and doing what is socially acceptable and expected. It gets worse because you sometimes decide to place your needs ahead of what is expected of you, even after you have committed to be somewhere or to do something with friends.

This struggle with authenticity has been with us forever and will continue to be with us forever. Authenticity must be bounded by what is moral and ethical in our treatment of others, especially in social situations.

It is not lacking in authenticity to change your mind. If you were on the way to the party and suddenly became ill and had to go home and lie down, you would not have this feeling of internal conflict about not attending the party--even though you gave your word you would be there. You would feel that the change of plans was justified.

However, in the situation above, you don't really feel that it is ok to change your mind, because you fear the opinion of your friends and you don't want to appear to be a flake--their opinion matters to you. So you waffle and agree to do things that you don't want to do and then mentally flagellate yourself for agreeing to attend the party.

I agree, you don't want to make a habit of this. It is bad form and can cause people to lose trust in you. And as ISTJs we are all about keeping our word. Super Dependable is what they call us. However, at times, it is in your best interest and in the best interest of your friends for you to change your mind and not attend a function that you've previously committed to attend. We can lose sight of the fact that if we force ourselves to do something, it will appear forced to those around us. It's ok to change your mind sometimes without having a concrete, life or death matter forcing you to change your mind.

So authenticity is bounded by our morals and ethics in these social situations.

Now this authenticity should not be confused with authenticity as in integrity. You should always be true to your values. Values which hopefully, you have established on firm principles.

So I understand your dilemma. I personally hate to change my mind, but I've found that sometimes it's ok to change my mind rather than force myself to do something that I am really gonna loathe.

HTH
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Wake--

It sounds like you are wrestling with authenticity as a concept, feeling like that you are lacking authenticity if you do things socially that are not really your desires, just to go along with friends and doing what is socially acceptable and expected. It gets worse because you sometimes decide to place your needs ahead of what is expected of you, even after you have committed to be somewhere or to do something with friends.

This struggle with authenticity has been with us forever and will continue to be with us forever. Authenticity must be bounded by what is moral and ethical in our treatment of others, especially in social situations.

It is not lacking in authenticity to change your mind. If you were on the way to the party and suddenly became ill and had to go home and lie down, you would not have this feeling of internal conflict about not attending the party--even though you gave your word you would be there. You would feel that the change of plans was justified.

However, in the situation above, you don't really feel that it is ok to change your mind, because you fear the opinion of your friends and you don't want to appear to be a flake--their opinion matters to you. So you waffle and agree to do things that you don't want to do and then mentally flagellate yourself for agreeing to attend the party.

I agree, you don't want to make a habit of this. It is bad form and can cause people to lose trust in you. And as ISTJs we are all about keeping our word. Super Dependable is what they call us. However, at times, it is in your best interest and in the best interest of your friends for you to change your mind and not attend a function that you've previously committed to attend. We can lose sight of the fact that if we force ourselves to do something, it will appear forced to those around us. It's ok to change your mind sometimes without having a concrete, life or death matter forcing you to change your mind.

So authenticity is bounded by our morals and ethics in these social situations.

Now this authenticity should not be confused with authenticity as in integrity. You should always be true to your values. Values which hopefully, you have established on firm principles.

So I understand your dilemma. I personally hate to change my mind, but I've found that sometimes it's ok to change my mind rather than force myself to do something that I am really gonna loathe.

HTH
I think thats always been a struggle of mine to be myself while fitting in or trying not to care. Authenticity is easy when I put myself in good situations.
 
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