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Batman's Enneagram?

  • 1w2

    Votes: 2 6.5%
  • 1w9

    Votes: 11 35.5%
  • 2w1

    Votes: 1 3.2%
  • 2w3

    Votes: 1 3.2%
  • 3w2

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 3w4

    Votes: 2 6.5%
  • 4w3

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 4w5

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 5w4

    Votes: 1 3.2%
  • 5w6

    Votes: 5 16.1%
  • 6w5

    Votes: 4 12.9%
  • 6w7

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 7w6

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 7w8

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 8w7

    Votes: 1 3.2%
  • 8w9

    Votes: 3 9.7%
  • 9w8

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 9w1

    Votes: 0 0.0%
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Batman is an 8w7, because he is the definition of a challenger. Enneagram 8 defines the very essence that is Batman, from his desires to his fears. "They are desperately afraid of being hurt emotionally and will use their physical strength to protect their feelings and keep others at a safe emotional distance. Beneath the tough façade is vulnerability, although it has been covered over by layer of emotional armor." We all know the origins of Batman. Looking at his alter-ego, he would be a seven wing considering his impulsive behavior and wealthy lifestyle.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Batman is an 8w7, because he is the definition of a challenger. Enneagram 8 defines the very essence that is Batman, from his desires to his fears. "They are desperately afraid of being hurt emotionally and will use their physical strength to protect their feelings and keep others at a safe emotional distance. Beneath the tough façade is vulnerability, although it has been covered over by layer of emotional armor." We all know the origins of Batman. Looking at his alter-ego, he would be a seven wing considering his impulsive behavior and wealthy lifestyle.
The alternative I could see is 1w9 due to his idealistic nature. He won't kill because he fears becoming a killer just like the scum he fights. 1's fear is corruption. And you could call him a perfectionist in the sense that he is trying to make criminals in fear to the point where crime, essentially stops.
 

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The alternative I could see is 1w9 due to his idealistic nature. He won't kill because he fears becoming a killer just like the scum he fights. 1's fear is corruption. And you could call him a perfectionist in the sense that he is trying to make criminals in fear to the point where crime, essentially stops.
These are some minute manifestations of his personality, but these aren't his key motivations. Enneagram ones' motivations are subjective, they want to become their ideal selves. For example, in The Dark Knight, Batman did not care about becoming the scapegoat for Two Face's crimes. It doesn't fall in line with the motivation to justify oneself in accordance with integral ideals.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
These are some minute manifestations of his personality, but these aren't his key motivations. Enneagram ones' motivations are subjective, they want to become their ideal selves. For example, in The Dark Knight, Batman did not care about becoming the scapegoat for Two Face's crimes. It doesn't fall in line with the motivation to justify oneself in accordance with integral ideals.
Well, Nolan's Batman is different from how Batman is portrayed in general. Nolan's is a more simple Batman. A more realistic Batman.
 

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Well, Nolan's Batman is different from how Batman is portrayed in general. Nolan's is a more simple Batman. A more realistic Batman.
Well, that depends on what you mean by "in general." Are you referring to Batman in the traditional or popular sense?
 

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Well, that depends on what you mean by "in general." Are you referring to Batman in the traditional or popular sense?
If you look at all the Batman mediums, games, movies (Counting the animated ones), comics, Batman is usually seen as aggressive and idealistic. He aims to become the embodiment of fear put into criminals, but he doesn't kill, as it is what makes him different and not the same as the criminals he despises. and he tends to want to learn the motives of the criminals he catches. Batman originally, knew psychology. Nolan's Batman just looked for the solution to stop the criminals that day. He wasn't the complicated, inquisitive Batman that is usually portrayed.
 

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I can't decide if he's 8w7, 8w9 or 1w9, but definitely Sp/Sx.

for his MBTI I could see either INTJ or ISTP
 

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As always, I'll play the contrarian, lol.


While the specific characterization of Batman may be somewhat pertinent, there are also lots of similarities. But I can't see any incarnation of Batman that would be an Eight. The drive for power and control just doesn't seem to be there, not even as something he masters and rises above.


Right now, Nolan's Batman is forefront on my mind, so I'll use his Batman as the example.


The fact that Bruce Wayne is so careful to manage his image, the fact that he is so attuned to how he is seen (both as Bruce Wayne and his alter-ego), and how heavily he relies on manipulation of that image (and the reaction of others to that image) to achieve his goals, leads me to think of him as being in the heart triad.


The fact that he operates so independently while driven to be "out there", that he makes himself so impervious to pain (emotional and physical), his inherent benevolence, and his unflinching willingness (even longing) to play the martyr, if necessary, all leads me to think he would be a Two. The fact that he puts societal justice and the common good ahead of his own needs and desires would have me attach a One wing. As Bruce Wayne, he was probably more of a 2w3 - transforming into Batman might have been him developing his One wing, lol.


He also has a faith in the goodness of humanity that can sometimes look almost naive - that would be a Harmonic triad characteristic of a Two.


Creating such a powerful alter-ego image for himself but in service to humanity seems like something that a Two who has integrated to Four might come up with.


Maybe he is an Eight who fully integrated to Two, but I would think an Eight would, at some point, want to exact some extremely personal vengeance on some particularly loathsome villain, particularly if that villian had inflicted pain on someone he cared about. At some point, I feel like he would want to see them pay for their crimes in a very personal and painful way that would leave them absolutely crushed, body and soul. He could justify that as a way to not only right a very grievous wrong, but as a way to benefit his cause - sending a signal to his enemies that crossing him would be a worse fate than any other. But he never does (sadly - I would have loved to have seen that happen somewhere in all the storyline, lol).


He is branded a vigilante, but he's really not. He doesn't take the law into his own hands. Rather, he acts in a renegade law enforcement role. He is still always a law-abiding citizen, even though he could (and sometimes, given the problems with the Gotham legal system, probably should) become a true vigilante fighting for justice and order *his* way. He is often hamstrung by his allegience to society.


Not the most obvious typing, but I find the idea intriguing... :)
 

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To put a finer point on it, Batman puts himself into conflict with others all the time, but *always* shows a stupid amount of restraint. I feel like that quality could only come from having a one hell of a terrifying superego. I doubt even the most highly trained and disciplined Id type, let alone an Id/Anger type, would be able to pull that off so consistently...
 

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We are talking about a guy that refuses to use guns on principle and does also by principle not kill a psychopath that has countless life on his hands, fully being aware of the fact that said psychopath will escape from prison one way or another and does not feel remorse but rather excitement about his actions. A clear type 1.
 

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@DoubleDare
1) Batman is too strategic to be a 2. 2s typically have a pretty weak connection to the head center, and I can't see many 2s sitting in a lair all day. sure, you could argue he doesn't do that as Bruce Wayne, but that's really more of a front. Batman is his real personality, and Batman is detached, strategic and relatively impersonal.
2) 2's emotions surface more readily. Batman is always calm and composed. you mentioned restraint as a reason for him not being an 8, I would argue it's equally applicable to 2.
3) I have difficulty seeing Batman as an image type in general. he doesn't have any underlying issues with self worth and lacks the implicit self promotion of a heart type.
4) Batman is not positive outlook.
5) 2s want to be seen as the saint/"good guy". Batman does not care about any of this. think about the last scene of the second movie where he willingly takes on responsibility for the death of Harvey Dent for the sake of making him a martyr, despite the fact that the police would go after him instead.

you have convinced me that he is probably not an 8. at the moment, I think 1w9 or 5w6 Sp/Sx
 

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@DoubleDare
1) Batman is too strategic to be a 2. 2s typically have a pretty weak connection to the head center, and I can't see many 2s sitting in a lair all day. sure, you could argue he doesn't do that as Bruce Wayne, but that's really more of a front. Batman is his real personality, and Batman is detached, strategic and relatively impersonal.
2) 2's emotions surface more readily. Batman is always calm and composed. you mentioned restraint as a reason for him not being an 8, I would argue it's equally applicable to 2.
3) I have difficulty seeing Batman as an image type in general. he doesn't have any underlying issues with self worth and lacks the implicit self promotion of a heart type.
4) Batman is not positive outlook.
5) 2s want to be seen as the saint/"good guy". Batman does not care about any of this. think about the last scene of the second movie where he willingly takes on responsibility for the death of Harvey Dent for the sake of making him a martyr, despite the fact that the police would go after him instead.

you have convinced me that he is probably not an 8. at the moment, I think 1w9 or 5w6 Sp/Sx
http://personalitycafe.com/member-polls/166598-if-you-were-batman-would-you-kill-joker.html Look at this. People reflecting over Batman without thinking about typology concludes that his drive is ethical.
 

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Actually let me reiterate my statement just to clarify the absurdity of typing Batman.

1st of all his type varies based on who is writing him. The Christopher Nolan version is very 1w9 ish. The Cartoon/Videogame version is very 5ish. I'm not sure about any other versions although I'm sure they exist such as the old movie verisions and the live action tv show with its signature theme song "Nanananana". Honestly though typing most comic book character is hard because certain writers emphasize certain traits. So generally speaking I see Batman as 5w6,1w9,3w4 or 4w5 his image is tough.
 

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He seems like a total 1w9 to me... 1w9s can look like 5s, I would think, considering that 1w2s often resemble the textbook 1 description more than 1w9s in that they are more demonstrably for the public good. 1w9s are considerably more introverted, immersed in nature... You'd probably have to talk to them just to discover how idealistic they actually are. It seems very fitting for a 1w9 superhero to spend so much time in their private lair, formulating a plan. I can see 5 for how calculated he is, but for one thing I think he is also an INTJ...Lucius seems like the ISTP, in the Nolan films anyway he goes to Lucius frequently for weapons and automobiles...and his motivation overall seems to "do good and avoid evil" more than to master a particular subject to transcend fear. He doesn't seem very motivated by fear at all, to me at least; he seems pretty fearless. He seems motivated more by his gut instinct, by rage at injustice and a coinciding sense of mission.
 

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Probably 1, maybe 6, definitely not 5 or 8. People who believe 2 are smoking something really strong.
 
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Hi everyone, first post here. Funnily, I was reflecting on this topic just some days ago, so I thought I could subscribe and share my view. English is not my mother tongue so sorry for any mistakes! :laughing:

First of all, I'd say is quite difficult to frame fictional characters into a specific type when they are portrayed by different authors, since they will be interpreted in really different ways. I don't know very well Batman comics but I have seen the 90s movies and the Nolan trilogy, so I will talk about those Batmans.

Nolan's Batman

I really like the first two movies, they have somehow a "Michael Mann" dark urban atmosphere. In this case I would say that Bruce Wayne/Batman is clearly an assertive (counterphobic) 6, as most of Nolan's characters are. I don't really see him as a 1, since he lacks many of the fixations related to that type: fighting/striving for justice is not something belonging exclusively to type 1, and he doesn't keep trying to perfect others or try to impose a "perfect" vision of the world. He has a conflicting relationship with his mentor/authoritative figure Ra's al Ghul, who is probably himself a really rigid 1 (he has to purify the world from corruption at any cost, human beings are disposable in order to reach perfection). Bruce Wayne is really focused on his sense of duty and self-sacrifice, and throughout the trilogy you can really see his 6ish connection to points 3 and 9 of the enneagram. I think that what makes the second chapter so great is the confrontation with the Joker, portrayed as a counterphobic, mad as f*ck 6 with an an insane anarchic streak. Last thing to add, I can't see this Batman as an eight: he is not driven driven by lust and he doesn't try to impose himself hierarchically on other people in order to feel in control of the situation (he just look for trustworthy people in a corrupted city).

Burton's Batman

My favourite ones. For those movies I think I can say without any doubt that Bruce Wayne is a blatant 5 (just like the director himself). Unlike Nolan's one, he is not focused on his fears (we don't even see him scared by bats, whereas on the others movies he embraces his own fears to use them against his enemies) and is somehow detached or uncomfortably overwhelmed by emotions. He has a taste for eccentric things (remember the party scene in the first movie), he lives retired alone in his mansion with just his completely trustworthy butler but has not really any problem about it. You can see the link with point 8 when he turns into Batman. As could be expected by Burton, villains are a parade of extremely-human freaks: the Joker, a killingly funny 7w8; the Penguin, a 4 in seek of revenge; Michelle Pfeiffer as the sexiest ever Catwoman, a 6 to die for.

I realize now that my post is long as f**k so I'll cut it here. :th_Jttesur:
 
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