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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So many things. I think I'll force myself to change into an ENFP.

Do you think INTPs can change their zero point?

How much do you think they might be able to sustainably modify their natural behaviors and train different personality traits?

Could it get to a point where they move to different types?
 

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I think I've grown my Ne enough to make the shift to borderline ENTP. Don't know if it's a chameleoning thing, though. I really can't tell.
 
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But how would you define chameleoning?
 

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No. If you can't find yourself it just means that you have some defense mechanism making it impossible for you to get in touch with yourself for whatever reason there is. Furthermore, while there is a correlation between external behavior and the functions, I think external behavior is much more attributed to say, enneagram.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 · (Edited)
But how would you define chameleoning?

I think this thread gives the best answer to what I mean by chameleoning:

http://personalitycafe.com/intp-forum-thinkers/14272-intp-chameleon-thing.html

It starts by choosing useful behaviors based around the people or the circumstances.

For these behaviors to change the an INTP, on whatever level, the INTP would need to choose to enter into these behaviors because of the enjoyment payoff. So thinking of whether, for example, there might be some cases where the payoff is repeated by being around circumstance and people and if that ever extends to the point where the base actually shifts.

The difference is that the shift is by choice and conscious decision, not by accident.
 
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No. If you can't find yourself it just means that you have some defense mechanism making it impossible for you to get in touch with yourself for whatever reason there is. Furthermore, while there is a correlation between external behavior and the functions, I think external behavior is much more attributed to say, enneagram.
I think the defense mechanism you're referring to is chameleoning :p
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I think the defense mechanism you're referring to is chameleoning :p
Interesting viewpoint. Chameleoning is sometimes defensive, but it's often strategic as well. I think that a change could occur where it is not only strategic in the external circumstances, but also to the INTP's continued enjoyment and strategic efficiency of the inner world.

As for continued enjoyment, it's possible that this shifts in terms of subject matter quite often for INTPs. What would be so worthy for there to be continued enjoyment of it? So it would have to be a giant payoff and sustained reinforcement for this to take place.

Another possibility is that the other functions just get practiced to the point where the shift may seem natural. Where it becomes a part of the INTP to the point where the INTP becomes unrecognizable for sustained time periods and can they can merge to become another type for a while.

This would be likely to take stubbornness, curiosity, discipline and close interaction with other personality types in a prolonged sink or swim situation. It would also take a somewhat detached view of the world.
 
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I think anyone can develop any function to the point of not having a clear "type." I think @Immerse is such an example heheh.

IMO, chameleoning is really faking functions based on stereotypes. So anyone using those skillz would seem like another type until the chameleon fuel runs out, then it goes back to natural self. Developing the functions is completely different because I see that as becoming a more well rounded individual. It may get to the point where someone can seem like they have some form of multiple personality disorder due to the ability to adjust to situations based the functions deemed necessary.
 

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Interesting viewpoint. Chameleoning is sometimes defensive, but it's often strategic as well. I think that a change could occur where it is not only strategic in the external circumstances, but also to the INTP's continued enjoyment and strategic efficiency of the inner world.

As for continued enjoyment, it's possible that this shifts in terms of subject matter quite often for INTPs. What would be so worthy for there to be continued enjoyment of it? So it would have to be a giant payoff and sustained reinforcement for this to take place.

Another possibility is that the other functions just get practiced to the point where the shift may seem natural. Where it becomes a part of the INTP to the point where the INTP becomes unrecognizable for sustained time periods and can they can merge to become another type for a while.

This would be likely to take stubbornness, curiosity, discipline and close interaction with other personality types in a prolonged sink or swim situation. It would also take a somewhat detached view of the world.
Well, I've always kinda thought that chameleoning develops primarily out of not having a natural method to work with people, more or less. Strategy comes later. Of course, it could be the other way around, but, strategic maneuvers often involve retreat, something defensive-minded, used to cover up weak points in order to regroup. Maybe INTPs try to plug up holes with the material that others are giving out.
 

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I do the chameleon thing when I'm with people I'm not really like. Just yesterday I had to do it because I had(ok, forced) to be around this girl I have nothing in common with & all of her convo topics are boring. To get through it I just started acting like her because she was doing nothing.
 

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I don't think I could chameleon that much. It's exhausting, and I consciously know that it's happening, so I usually revert back to my normal depressing unmotivated INTP self. Sometimes it gets a bit confusing, especially when I look back and think, "Was that really me who went out with my friends and actually talked and was at least kind of funny?" but it never goes beyond the point where I can't change back. You can develop your functions but I don't believe that you can completely change your personality type. At the core, no matter how strong my Ne, Si, and Fe become, I'll still be an INTP.
 

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I think anyone can develop any function to the point of not having a clear "type." I think @Immerse is such an example heheh.

IMO, chameleoning is really faking functions based on stereotypes. So anyone using those skillz would seem like another type until the chameleon fuel runs out, then it goes back to natural self. Developing the functions is completely different because I see that as becoming a more well rounded individual. It may get to the point where someone can seem like they have some form of multiple personality disorder due to the ability to adjust to situations based the functions deemed necessary.
BLESS YOU. BLESS YOU SO MUCH.
That is exactly how I am. I just adapt to other people in order to keep myself safe and out of trouble. I cannot always be the INTP I am, though when I'm alone or with someone I know very well, I easily revert back to my roots -w- I think I'll now consider that a social skill.
 
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It kinda feels like INTP does not have their own identity. Maybe not that extreme but they need to be fueled by something because even in choosing a particular style they must use Fe and that Fe sucks. So chameleon is a defense mech and compensating for the lack of a strong identity. I don't want to use the word identity anymore because it doesn't fit what I am trying to convey. More like style. Identities change you may not be who you think you are in any given situation so thats that. It feels like INTP lack a strong baseline to jump off from and thus their style is somewhat ambivalent. When I am around black folks I become a gangsta and talk really ghetto shiiit ***** it gets awkward.
 

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I think the defense mechanism you're referring to is chameleoning :p
I disagree, because Ista's point is "beyond recognition" but there is no such "beyond recognition" in my statement. Your true self is always there, which is not what she is implying. She is implying that the actual ego will go away, that you can transform and metamorph it, indeed, beyond recognition. This is not what I am saying though. Veiling the ego and transforming the ego are two different things, and I'd also argue that veiling the ego is simply another expression of the self, while not necessarily the ego per se. By self I am referring to Jung's definition of self, including the shadow and anima/animus.

The day you decide to develop Fi you will also realize the power of an Fi backbone and how this reduces the need to chameleon. This is why I can't recognize myself with so many INTPs in here because my Fi just says "no" to chameleoning. Yes, I do compartmentalize, but every human does this to one degree or another, but staying true to myself is still godamn important regardless of what people I am with. If I'm with smokers, it doesn't mean I suddenly fake that I'm a smoker to fit in. I just. won't. do. it.

If people can't accept and like me for who I am, then they can as well fuck off.
 

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It kinda feels like INTP does not have their own identity. Maybe not that extreme but they need to be fueled by something because even in choosing a particular style they must use Fe and that Fe sucks. So chameleon is a defense mech and compensating for the lack of a strong identity. I don't want to use the word identity anymore because it doesn't fit what I am trying to convey. More like style. Identities change you may not be who you think you are in any given situation so thats that. It feels like INTP lack a strong baseline to jump off from and thus their style is somewhat ambivalent. When I am around black folks I become a gangsta and talk really ghetto shiiit ***** it gets awkward.
Fi. It's a good thing to have.
 

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I don't think that INTPs can consciously change themselves into another type, but as others have noted, it seems to be a social defense strategy, especially for people who haven't developed some of their lesser functions yet. I used to do this a lot in my teens and early 20s, where I would go along with the crowd so that I wouldn't be singled out so much (I got teased a lot for being different when I was younger) (In hindsight and with knowledge, I think in that situation I was unconsciously trying to develop Fe, but not in the best way). I think also that external behavior has lot to do, too, with the social milieu you're in and trying to conform with what's "acceptable. I don't think that you can consciously train yourself to "be" another personality type, but maybe just act like one for the reasons mentioned.
 
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