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I'm guessing this won't be very popular. Forgive me if any of this is interpreted as disrespect.

I love this planet. The natural world is my favorite thing about this world. Humanity does a wonderful job of polluting the planet with our trash and ill-thought ideas. Having said that, I don't believe in the current popular story that is Climate Change.

The climate has been changing every moment of every day of every year since the Earth's beginning 4.5 billion years ago. Our penchant for making everything about us is a big part of why I don't trust the popular story. I also do not trust humans with the very real power and financial opportunity that climate change presents. I have a very hard time believing that we can steer the climate of the Earth, when there is a power source in our solar system that is so far beyond the capability of power that we ourselves can generate or even comprehend. To reduce the sun to a mere bystander while simultaneously insinuating that we humans have far more power over the climate of the Earth is preposterous to me.

Nature mimics nature. We ourselves go through ups and downs all the time. So to me it stands to reason that our climate would behave in much the same way. I do understand that we have an impact on this planet. When I get out on the trails on my hikes and runs I can see the trash that people leave behind. The invisible trash in our atmosphere is there too. I just don't believe in the man made story that accompanies it. Man has used fear as a means of control and continues to do so in so many ways. I simply think this is another one of those ways. However, I do believe in cleaning things up. I do believe in cutting down on pollution and trash. I believe in taking care of our Mother Earth as she has taken such good care of us. But the fear mongering that used to be Global Warming and is now Climate Change is nothing more than a story told to create a popular attitude that discourages any dissenting voice and encourages an atmosphere that allows people to take advantage of other people. A story as old as time.

Science cannot do itself, it requires people to interpret the data and come to a conclusion. My current interpretation of Science is that it posits itself as if it were God. Fauci is famous for saying "if you attack me, you attack science." What a load of bs. Anyone, regardless of field of study, can be a liar. And when an industry has much to gain from telling the kind of stories that might benefit it, I think it is only responsible to question it. I think it is also responsible to take care of the planet, regardless of my belief that the story of Climate Change is an opportunity, a power and money grab.

I do not know what the truth is. And neither do you. But I do know that human beings are opportunistic, and Climate Change presents a tremendous opportunity for those who stand to gain from the policy changes that are inevitably coming. When the US went to war with Iraq, it was because Irag had weapons of mass destruction. That they never had. And yet we, the people, believed it. Why? Well, why wouldn't we? Our political leadership told us it was so. The legacy media told us it was so. And yet, it wasn't so. Jussie Smollett tricked half the country with the dumbest story ever told. What do you think is possible when entire industries, government and media parrot the same story? I think what is possible is that we choose to believe the story, no matter what our own conclusions may have otherwise been. I mean, why wouldn't we?

Climate Change, in my opinion, is a terrific opportunity for those in the world who choose to believe it to be true. It doesn't make it the truth, but perception is reality. That is not to say that I believe everyone is "in on it". But I do believe that believing in the story creates an anchor in a sea of uncertainty. It feels safer to think that we can save ourselves and the planet from Climate Change. I'm just not so sure it's the truth.
 

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Discussion Starter · #22 ·
Yes for the “change “, but the global warming trend doesn’t look good:

Azure Organism Font Parallel Slope

Water Rectangle Font Parallel City
 

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Just wanna remind everyone that global warming or w/e only gradually speeds up the process, it doesn't solve the issue as planets have a natural cycle of environmental issues without any human intervention. Venus use to be like Earth, look at it now. All the ice ages etc that Earth has gone through, none of it were related to humans.
 

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Discussion Starter · #24 ·
Just wanna remind everyone that global warming or w/e only gradually speeds up the process, it doesn't solve the issue as planets have a natural cycle of environmental issues without any human intervention. Venus use to be like Earth, look at it now. All the ice ages etc that Earth has gone through, none of it were related to humans.
I think climate scientists are aware of the natural cycles, and also of the negative additional effects of emissions. In epidemiology we had many useful models before covid (they were ignored) that would be very helpful. So it’s not a good idea to repeat the same “anti-science” mistake with every crisis.

Climate action scenarios I saw (so far, I am not an expert on the topic) are mostly about removing the negative action, it’s could be called “re-action” for climate change, because it’s all human factor.
 
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Just wanna remind everyone that global warming or w/e only gradually speeds up the process, it doesn't solve the issue as planets have a natural cycle of environmental issues without any human intervention. Venus use to be like Earth, look at it now. All the ice ages etc that Earth has gone through, none of it were related to humans.
If we look at the Alvarez hypothesis, then all life has already once been wiped out and like has been said in a great film:

"Nature always finds a way".

If we look at the amount of species gone extinct, hell the ones we made extinct, is it really a shocker that one day humans will probably be extinct also.
 

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If we look at the Alvarez hypothesis, then all life has already once been wiped out and like has been said in a great film:

"Nature always finds a way".

If we look at the amount of species gone extinct, hell the ones we made extinct, is it really a shocker that one day humans will probably be extinct also.
BRICS does not care at all about this global warming narrative. Russia will continue to sell oil and gas to China and its allies at "crony" prices.

For environmentalists there is not enough silver and other metals for the whole world to live happily on renewable energy.

What the scientists should be doing is to find a cheap and non-polluting form of energy, I saw somewhere that there are advances in this matter... I must do some research on this.

These climate change nuts don't understand the poverty and misery that their ideas can generate.
 

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AI solutions for climate change:

Remove all human activity 😅🤓

It is why we are both good and bad, it was probably always like this (in history). But now it’s kind of unpredictable and potentially irreversible consequences.
I don't believe any of this climate change crap anymore and this is why.
It always leads to "Remove all human activity" aka depopulation.
Call me a conspiracist all you want, I won't support any movement that can support this.
 

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BRICS does not care at all about this global warming narrative. Russia will continue to sell oil and gas to China and its allies at "crony" prices.

For environmentalists there is not enough silver and other metals for the whole world to live happily on renewable energy.

What the scientists should be doing is to find a cheap and non-polluting form of energy, I saw somewhere that there are advances in this matter... I must do some research on this.

These climate change nuts don't understand the poverty and misery that their ideas can generate.
The upper ones do, they're just taking advantage. Fear is a great manipulation tool.
 

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I don't have much hope honestly. The poor people of the world are already suffering the worst effects of climate change. The rich countries who are causing it will insulate themselves from the effects of it for as long as possible, after which we will be far past the point of no return. Scary to think too far into the future with ever growing population plus ever worsening storms, famines and whatnot. Maybe some advanced civilization will come and take pity on us.
 

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I'm guessing this won't be very popular. Forgive me if any of this is interpreted as disrespect.

I love this planet. The natural world is my favorite thing about this world. Humanity does a wonderful job of polluting the planet with our trash and ill-thought ideas. Having said that, I don't believe in the current popular story that is Climate Change.

The climate has been changing every moment of every day of every year since the Earth's beginning 4.5 billion years ago. Our penchant for making everything about us is a big part of why I don't trust the popular story. I also do not trust humans with the very real power and financial opportunity that climate change presents. I have a very hard time believing that we can steer the climate of the Earth, when there is a power source in our solar system that is so far beyond the capability of power that we ourselves can generate or even comprehend. To reduce the sun to a mere bystander while simultaneously insinuating that we humans have far more power over the climate of the Earth is preposterous to me.

Nature mimics nature. We ourselves go through ups and downs all the time. So to me it stands to reason that our climate would behave in much the same way. I do understand that we have an impact on this planet. When I get out on the trails on my hikes and runs I can see the trash that people leave behind. The invisible trash in our atmosphere is there too. I just don't believe in the man made story that accompanies it. Man has used fear as a means of control and continues to do so in so many ways. I simply think this is another one of those ways. However, I do believe in cleaning things up. I do believe in cutting down on pollution and trash. I believe in taking care of our Mother Earth as she has taken such good care of us. But the fear mongering that used to be Global Warming and is now Climate Change is nothing more than a story told to create a popular attitude that discourages any dissenting voice and encourages an atmosphere that allows people to take advantage of other people. A story as old as time.

Science cannot do itself, it requires people to interpret the data and come to a conclusion. My current interpretation of Science is that it posits itself as if it were God. Fauci is famous for saying "if you attack me, you attack science." What a load of bs. Anyone, regardless of field of study, can be a liar. And when an industry has much to gain from telling the kind of stories that might benefit it, I think it is only responsible to question it. I think it is also responsible to take care of the planet, regardless of my belief that the story of Climate Change is an opportunity, a power and money grab.

I do not know what the truth is. And neither do you. But I do know that human beings are opportunistic, and Climate Change presents a tremendous opportunity for those who stand to gain from the policy changes that are inevitably coming. When the US went to war with Iraq, it was because Irag had weapons of mass destruction. That they never had. And yet we, the people, believed it. Why? Well, why wouldn't we? Our political leadership told us it was so. The legacy media told us it was so. And yet, it wasn't so. Jussie Smollett tricked half the country with the dumbest story ever told. What do you think is possible when entire industries, government and media parrot the same story? I think what is possible is that we choose to believe the story, no matter what our own conclusions may have otherwise been. I mean, why wouldn't we?

Climate Change, in my opinion, is a terrific opportunity for those in the world who choose to believe it to be true. It doesn't make it the truth, but perception is reality. That is not to say that I believe everyone is "in on it". But I do believe that believing in the story creates an anchor in a sea of uncertainty. It feels safer to think that we can save ourselves and the planet from Climate Change. I'm just not so sure it's the truth.
Hello Oaktree (and welcome to the forum),

Even though I go out on less hikes than you, I too have felt the joys of being able to go out on a hike and enjoying clear skies.The earth is a wonderful place. I also think it's good to be skeptical of what the media touts as truth by examining evidence and following incentive trails.

You are correct, our sun's effect on our climate does indeed go up-and-down, so how can we differentiate this natural variance and man-caused variance? I actually wrote a post referencing some data a while ago: https://www.personalitycafe.com/thr...s-ready-for-the-change.1354923/#post-44119385
Please take note that the effect of the top two bars (long-lived greenhouse gases) far surpasses the amount of influence of the variance of solar irradiance. Yes, the Sun will heat the Earth in varying strengths, but greenhouse gases has a much much much larger effect. Are humans causing climate change? Upon review of the models, it is safe to say yes.

Let's investigate the second one, because it is also good to acknowledge human beings are opportunistic. Incentives push humans to manipulate others to their own ends. Before the war in Iraq, special interest groups in the US (like those with connections to oil industries) had much to gain from sending troops to "stabilize" the region and exert influence so that oil can be profitably extracted in the middle east. But for climate change, who actually stands to gain from policy changes? There are, of course, some— electric car companies, renewable energy companies, etc. ... but who stands to gain from no policy changes? Oil companies, coal/natural gas companies, most car manufacturers, forestry, agriculture, etc. Oil companies regularly pay for advertising that shows 'exciting technological advancements that can combat climate change!' and they also advertise their own involvement in "trying" to solve the problem.

I won't say whether or not I believe we can solve climate change, but I believe I know that it does exist, is caused by humans, and that there is more manipulative behavior trying to hide it vs trying to just fear-monger.
 

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Hello Oaktree (and welcome to the forum),

Even though I go out on less hikes than you, I too have felt the joys of being able to go out on a hike and enjoying clear skies.The earth is a wonderful place. I also think it's good to be skeptical of what the media touts as truth by examining evidence and following incentive trails.

You are correct, our sun's effect on our climate does indeed go up-and-down, so how can we differentiate this natural variance and man-caused variance? I actually wrote a post referencing some data a while ago: https://www.personalitycafe.com/thr...s-ready-for-the-change.1354923/#post-44119385
Please take note that the effect of the top two bars (long-lived greenhouse gases) far surpasses the amount of influence of the variance of solar irradiance. Yes, the Sun will heat the Earth in varying strengths, but greenhouse gases has a much much much larger effect. Are humans causing climate change? Upon review of the models, it is safe to say yes.

Let's investigate the second one, because it is also good to acknowledge human beings are opportunistic. Incentives push humans to manipulate others to their own ends. Before the war in Iraq, special interest groups in the US (like those with connections to oil industries) had much to gain from sending troops to "stabilize" the region and exert influence so that oil can be profitably extracted in the middle east. But for climate change, who actually stands to gain from policy changes? There are, of course, some— electric car companies, renewable energy companies, etc. ... but who stands to gain from no policy changes? Oil companies, coal/natural gas companies, most car manufacturers, forestry, agriculture, etc. Oil companies regularly pay for advertising that shows 'exciting technological advancements that can combat climate change!' and they also advertise their own involvement in "trying" to solve the problem.

I won't say whether or not I believe we can solve climate change, but I believe I know that it does exist, is caused by humans, and that there is more manipulative behavior trying to hide it vs trying to just fear-monger.
I like your argument. Food for thought. Cheers.
 

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Discussion Starter · #33 ·
I don't believe any of this climate change crap anymore and this is why.
It always leads to "Remove all human activity" aka depopulation.
Call me a conspiracist all you want, I won't support any movement that can support this.
This particular post was sarcastic/ joke. I don’t think we should remove all humans literally.
 

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Discussion Starter · #34 ·

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Discussion Starter · #35 ·
Extreme weather scenarios, not that optimistic views:

glimpse2-5 – 2052.info

In June 1992 heads of state from 108 nations, delegations from 172 countries, and 2,400 nongovernmental organizations gathered in Rio de Janeiro for the first “Earth Summit.” They established the historic UN Framework Convention on Climate Change (UNFCCC) —a formal international treaty that went into full force in March 1994. It is the treaty within which international climate negotiations and protocols take place—involving the 194 nations that have ratified the convention. The UNFCCC sets forth a framework for addressing climate change, and its central goal is stabilization of greenhouse gas concentrations in the atmosphere at a level that would prevent dangerous anthropogenic interference with the climate system. Such a level should be achieved within a time frame sufficient to allow ecosystems to adapt naturally to climate change, to ensure that food production is not threatened, and to enable economic development to proceed in a sustainable manner.
Since 1994, the UNFCCC has hosted sixteen Conferences of the Parties (COP) and succeeded in agreeing on a number of protocols, like the Kyoto protocol, and other formal agreements. The most recent were COP 15 in Copenhagen, Denmark, in 2009, COP 16 in Cancun, Mexico, in 2010, and COP 17 in Durban, South Africa, at the end of 2011.

The objective of the COP meetings is to negotiate an agreement to reduce global greenhouse gas emissions. As part of the negotiations, the 194 participating nations have periodically made public their current goals for emissions reductions and related climate change actions.

These 194 publicly available goals are tracked by a number of organizations and provide a possible starting point if one wants to forecast future emissions and the resulting global climate change.

In the following I describe the consequences if the current 194 national emissions-reduction goals were implemented.

This may well describe the climate situation in 2052, although I hope not."
 

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Discussion Starter · #37 ·
You don't, but some people do, in various ways and at various speeds...I used to line up with this way of thinking as a kid and teen.
People have much worse behavior than animals towards environment, it’s similar to parasitic behavior, which is not expected considering our intelligence level. So, AI program giving this answer (remove all humans) is only partly joke, because it could seem as a feasible solution to AI who optimizes the well-being of the planet.
 

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People have much worse behavior than animals towards environment, it’s similar to parasitic behavior, which is not expected considering our intelligence level. So, AI program giving this answer (remove all humans) is only partly joke, because it could seem as a feasible solution to AI who optimizes the well-being of the planet.
At some point in the future, I have a feeling that the planet (and its heavenly brethren) with optimize the well-being of itself.
 

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The upper ones do, they're just taking advantage. Fear is a great manipulation tool.
Humans are destroying the environment and causing mass extinctions, to what degree this will affect the whole biological balance and the outside world, who knows?

But some have faith in their politicians or leaders, these people are just psychopaths. We are going to have food shortages and then water shortages, Biden already said about food, this may cause mass migrations.

Also a criticism of climate theories is that they only talk about the problems but have no real solution, we have very little oil and it will only go up in price, the best thing to do is to make the energy change without affecting the social fabric.

The truth is that if we lower the consumption of oil and other types of energy everything falls apart, and poverty explodes.
If you want to eliminate poverty and save the climate, invent a type of clean energy that everyone can access cheaply, and not that Marxist religion.
 

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Discussion Starter · #40 ·
Humans are destroying the environment and causing mass extinctions, to what degree this will affect the whole biological balance and the outside world, who knows?

But some have faith in their politicians or leaders, these people are just psychopaths. We are going to have food shortages and then water shortages, Biden already said about food, this may cause mass migrations.

Also a criticism of climate theories is that they only talk about the problems but have no real solution, we have very little oil and it will only go up in price, the best thing to do is to make the energy change without affecting the social fabric.

The truth is that if we lower the consumption of oil and other types of energy everything falls apart, and poverty explodes.
If you want to eliminate poverty and save the climate, invent a type of clean energy that everyone can access cheaply, and not that Marxist religion.
In academic community many think that the solution is through smart (green & sustainable) investing, i.e. through financial actions. It makes sense because the corporations are the one who started the issue of emissions - I think top 100 companies are the biggest polluters, not individual people/cities, although I am not sure about the numbers.
 
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