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Counsel for Counselors

[INFJ] 
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#1 ·
Welcome to the Counsel for Counselors thread :)


There's been some interest in this being started due to individual help threads and having no definite place to talk about our own burdens seriously. Depending on how it's received will determine if it'll be stickied.

This thread is for those that seek help, guidance or kind words and for those that like to give them.
So if either of those are you then welcome!


 
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#3 · (Edited)
Great ! thanks oxy. I think before we sticky this - let's see how it goes. Just wanted to add that feel free to vent, seek help in this thread. I know you guys will probably come in here, want to post something, and walk away. But do keep in mind that we're listening and like to listen.

Btw, this thread doesn't mean that new threads for more help/support cannot be created.

I don't speak for everyone, but personally, I'd like to encourage everyone to start by posting anything they want to get off their chest in here. And we'll take it from there :) Let's be open and frank.

Edit: Please don't mistake our help for professional help. We're just normal people like you trying to help each other out as friends would :)
 
#5 · (Edited)
Since this idea is relatively new, maybe people who are going to provide this service should have the address of this thread placed on your signature as ways to get people to come here. Just an idea

Good luck, counselors of the counsel. Your help will be greatly appreciated for those in need of an open ear.
 
#6 ·
I guess I'll break the ice.

It comes off as something that would go in the advice center, but I'd like it to stay here, in the INFJ forum.

I've noticed that there are a lot of people who don't have a grasp of who they are in their lives yet, and see them following me instead of making their own way. When I empathize with them, I feel like there's nothing there. Like their selves are missing from the embodiment they have. I feel that the acquaintances of mine that follow me are hopeless, and I don't know what I can do to help them if they won't make their own way. Attracting these kinds of people, how would one better deal with the problem between empathizing with them and actually helping them?

I've tried helping them in the past and they just took the ride and tried to take a mile. I denied some, who hurt themselves more for depending on me in the first place, and others just acted like leeches without learning anything from the help I've given. The ones that grew are still my friends, actually some of my best friends. I don't know what to do about the others, though. They seem to be in place with others around me and it's really odd to me how they get along yet console in me, risking their stability for what others think I can offer. It's like their insecurities speak, and it's nuts..

Is letting them be really the best thing to do? "Catcher In the Rye" reference says yes, but I would like to hear from you.

Also, is this empathy?

If you were to respond, I would be grateful. If not, that's okay too.
 
#8 ·
Is letting them be really the best thing to do? "Catcher In the Rye" reference says yes, but I would like to hear from you.
"So, tell me about yourself." Maybe that line? I suppose the goal would be is to get them to focus on themselves, even the hurt-y parts. I think the classic therapist line is "And how does that make you feel?"
 
#7 ·
When I empathize with them, I feel like there's nothing there. Like their selves are missing from the embodiment they have. I feel that the acquaintances of mine that follow me are hopeless, and I don't know what I can do to help them if they won't make their own way. Attracting these kinds of people, how would one better deal with the problem between empathizing with them and actually helping them?
It's a situation I've faced with people IRL before. My approach used to be try to make those people aware of what I thought was the cause of their hopelessness. I try to get people to talk and get more involved about themselves. This is not something that helps overnight or in one or two 'lectures'. For me it was tactful art where I would present myself emotionally when needed, and pull away when needed. I hate to call it a game - but having someone's best interests at heart means that sometimes you just have to watch them self-destruct because if you try to prevent that, and that person doesn't experience it - then their natural inclination would be to walk down that path again.

Also, is this empathy?
As for empathy, we can't help but feel the urge and need to sympathize with people in need. But what you can do is weigh that particular situation against a potentially more harmful situation. Not every scenario is the end-of-the-world scenario - and people are far more resilient than we are naturally inclined to give them credit for. Feeling for someone lies at the center of our beings as INFJ's but sometimes being too helpful can be detrimental as well. You just have to follow your intuition and come to the potential outcomes - and try to guide the other person down a path where they can learn and experience for themselves, while also receiving kindness and support - regardless of a good or bad outcome.
 
#13 ·
infj's, do you often feel despair and frustration by the lack of people you can connect with? by our inability to convey our deepest feelings and thoughts? by or inability to express ourselfs at work? by our inability to be understood by others? even though we are good at understanding. At times I feel rejected by society. For me, being an INFJ is tough.
 
#14 ·
This is true, but still I like to think that society makes a lot of people, not just INFJs, compromise with themselves in order to maintain group harmony... Perhaps they make sacrifices in order to live their daily lives and to keep food on the table. Most of people have burdens, they just come in different sizes and shapes. A typical burden for INFJs would be a lack of understanding, at least an understanding for our core self -- at least we can make up for it by reaching out to others.

What I like t do is to "push" my intuitive musings into conversations I have with others... Make them shift their perspectives a bit. Hopefully that way they will understand my point of view better.
 
#22 ·
OH I HATE when people do that..I believe everyone is entitled to feel bad about their own problems, and so many situations are subjective anyway.
 
#17 ·
I want to be close to people and have more friends and pursue my hobbies which include interacting with people, however, I always worry about the events and get overloaded pretty quickly. Often events go very well and I'm glad I participated, but it's hard for me to focus on the present and not obsess over events in advance. I also sometimes do have to leave early or start getting run down faster than most people. That is really frustrating because I want to accomplish certain things, and that means human interaction (often face-to-face). It's like I'm fighting myself and trying to overcome myself so I'm not totally avoidant and alone.
 
#18 ·
We need to put some sort of code at the top of our posts, to tell when we're the counselor or in-need-of-counseling, methinks



I run a lot of events for an MMO. I almost have a panic attack every time, with my nerves becoming physically painful. Then at the end of it, I get an ego boost because all of my hard work went into something people really enjoyed. It's like an addiction!

There are also times when the event is going well without me and I zone out. Like when I host storytelling circles, I almost never listen to other people's stories, because I'm so focused on keeping us organized and being the figurehead of the group, I don't have the interest or brain power to listen. I feel kinda bad about it--double standards and all--but it's there.

So, I guess the bottom line is, I know that feeling. It doesn't seem to get better, so I'm not sure what to suggest, except to keep putting yourself out there anyway. Or maybe find a way to get the same level of satisfaction, without the same level of interaction. Less people, different activities, different ways of going about it, things like that.
 
#29 ·
How does one forgive himself for something that happened over a decade ago that he still is traumatized by and won't let it go? I think this is affecting my ability to fix other aspects sometimes. Like trust, how does one really "trust" another person. I have this problem, I have major trust issues.
 
#30 ·
You have to just learn to let go. It not an easy process. I dealt with this too not long ago and I have to learn that I cannot continue to hurt and/or punish myself for something I choose to hang on to. Just forgive yourself or forgive the person that hurt you. Tell yourself it all over, you don't have to go through that anymore. Just picture yourself in white light, knowing that you are protected and that no one can hurt or harm you ever again. Remember, when someone hurt us, we are allowing them to do so. So don't allow that person to hurt you anymore. It's your life, only you have control over it.

Trust is hard but you will just know when to trust a person. In every relationship, when it starting, don't put everything out there all at once. Take baby steps. Give a little every time and see where it goes.
 
#43 ·
Hi..

I would like to help quite a few of you.
There seems to be an awful lot of broken on Fe on this particular forum.
I wonder how so many "people" people have come to dislike people.

The anti social and withdrawn INFJ is an INFJ under extreme stress.
Why are so many, so stressed out?
 
#44 ·
I think we may be seeing a significant number of INFJs who have become withdrawn or disillusioned by social interactions on this forum because of the very fact that we are on this forum. Meaning that they are seeking interactions online because it is a lot less imposing and there is less vulnerability. Though I feel like I may just be stating the obvious here.

As for why this happens, INFJs love people (possibly an over-generalization) and this makes them vulnerable. People don't reciprocate, or even take advantage of this love and the INFJ gets hurt. Get stung enough times and you adapt, you're trained to become wary of others. On the flip side of the coin it doesn't even have to be due to the ill will of others, I doubt that most people try to be mean to others, it could just be consistent miscommunication, or a lack of understanding one anothers perspectives.
 
#45 ·
On the flip side of the coin it doesn't even have to be due to the ill will of others, I doubt that most people try to be mean to others, it could just be consistent miscommunication, or a lack of understanding one anothers perspectives.
I beg to differ ... the thing is that if an individual knows another well enough, or is concerned about their emotions and feelings, then they will not indulge in behaviour that could potentially lead to hurting the other individual. Having deep convictions and beliefs about certain things is one thing, and communicating the same in a meaningful and unhurtful way is another. The most obvious example I have of this is hate speech. Do you really think that people who indulge in racial/religious slurs are doing it because they are bad people. I don't. But I do think that they are misguided and therefore being misguided they are ignorant and need to be taught how to interact with people.
 
#46 ·
I'm not saying that people do things to hurt one another because they are "bad people", I'm saying that I have encountered situations where people have ill intentions (in that they are consciously making a decision to hurt someone else), but I don't think that people generally behave in this manner. I think more often than not people get hurt from miscommunication and, as you pointed out, a lack of awareness/misguided actions.
 
#47 ·
Hi,

I have been 'swimming' around the INFJ forum a lot lately, and I feel a very strong connection to what a lot of INFJ's (or percieved INFJ's) here state. So much so that I am considering xNFJ for my personality type.

But that's not the point of this thread. I just wanted to throw that out there and let you guys be the judge of whether I'm actually E or I based on the scenario I'm about to tell (since this is a counseling thread right?).

Any who,

The problem is, my parent is very manipulative, to a point where they want to control me (my present and my future). I also feel like they have no respect for my opinions, and outlooks on what I want. In short, they are extremely selfish, they believe that by controlling me they will see the results that they want, and ultimately benefit from them. I feel like I am just a tool to their end. And I am not okay with that, and I'm scared of what may happen if I rebel, and say no. I have sacrificed so much of my life for their 'vision', have gone through so much pain and sadness, in order to please them. And it is all disregarded, as if they aren't pleased until I am completely obliterated.

How much time, and energy will it take until they realize that I am not a material, a means to end? I literally hate them. I have no other feelings but hostility towards them, and the most ironic thing, they know. And don't care, they are stubborn, as long as I accomplish what they want, it doesn't matter what happens to me, what I go through, how I suffer.

I just don't know how to deal and respond. And I would like some advice, I don't want to put too much detail on this post (due to my paranoia and trust issues) so if this is very general, I apologize.
 
#49 ·
The problem is, my parent is very manipulative, to a point where they want to control me (my present and my future). I also feel like they have no respect for my opinions, and outlooks on what I want. In short, they are extremely selfish, they believe that by controlling me they will see the results that they want, and ultimately benefit from them. I feel like I am just a tool to their end. And I am not okay with that, and I'm scared of what may happen if I rebel, and say no. I have sacrificed so much of my life for their 'vision', have gone through so much pain and sadness, in order to please them. And it is all disregarded, as if they aren't pleased until I am completely obliterated.

How much time, and energy will it take until they realize that I am not a material, a means to end? I literally hate them. I have no other feelings but hostility towards them, and the most ironic thing, they know. And don't care, they are stubborn, as long as I accomplish what they want, it doesn't matter what happens to me, what I go through, how I suffer.

I just don't know how to deal and respond. And I would like some advice, I don't want to put too much detail on this post (due to my paranoia and trust issues) so if this is very general, I apologize.
Take the plunge and speak out against it? Do you think they could be reasoned with? Sometimes parents can become controlling if they think you're headed down the wrong path (not to say you are, but that it may appear that way to them). If that's the case, sometimes talking to them about your plans for the future, your dreams, etc, can lay their doubts to rest. It can open a dialogue about what their concerns are, and forewarned is forearmed as they say--you can come to an understanding and agreement about how to treat each other. (With my parents, we would actually write up contracts, complete with penalties if one side broke their word.)

Other times though, you sort of have to knock them back on their heels until they start respecting you. By which I mean, don't be aggressive (usually causes more problems than it solves), but do build boundaries. Boundaries are flexible, but can become steel-strong in an instant when there's something that goes past your patience. The thing about boundaries, when you first begin to make them--they won't be used to it, and they'll (unconsciously) test you on it to see if you mean it. You have to have a no-exceptions rule until they get it.
 
#48 ·
I moved this from the Venting thread, because I would like some insight on it. In the form of a rant, but here we go:

If a lot of people say that I'm a good person, why do I never feel that way? Fun, creative, awesome, great, like a sister soul...I blush at these compliments, because I know they're meant well, but some part of me...still doubts. Maybe because it's not who I want to be seen as? (Figure that one out, me!) It's as if they're still missing me, though. How can one feel so lonely and lost when surrounded by so much love? I don't get it.

It's like I don't want to believe it, because then I'd be...arrogant and stuck up? I already feel like I am posting this.... Any words of wisdom, INFJs?
 
#54 ·
I don't know where else to put this. I'm the counsel-ee I guess.

My family is unhappy and going through some hard times. I feel helpless because I can't lift them out of this situation, and I feel defeated because I guess it's just something we have to accept and live with. But personally, I cannot (no, I refuse) to accept this.

I feel like it's time to abandon ship, but my parents keep holding on even though it's making them all miserable on the inside. I don't know why. Maybe they think it is too late to be able to change anything. But what's the point of staying, if it is wreaking unhappiness into our lives? Sorry for the vagueness guys. It has to do with my parents workplace dynamics that is very unhealthy and toxic. It's difficult for them to just leave (financial....), so I guess they have no choice but to stay? but the more they stay here and go through more hardships, it also makes me sadder and more depressed.

I guess it's the INFJ in me that wants closure, and to get away from all the hurtful experiences. But I can't when my parents are still holding on - maybe it's the SJ in both of them... somehow believing that things will change and get better if they just work hard, I don't know. I want to move on, but I can't, when my parents are still also stuck. How do I move on without them? I feel so guilty at the thought of 'moving on' without them. I want to forgive and forget about everything that happened. When I am away from home, I feel this way, and released from all my worries. But when I return, I once again feel guilty and selfish for being able to feel happy and 'let go' when they are still struggling. And then I start feeling depressed because I can't do anything to help them. I think they will be happier away from here, too, but they somehow seem frozen and paralyzed.... how do I cope with this?
 
#55 ·
I am deeply sorry to hear about your parents, Curious. It’s not easy to see suffering. Often times we find that facing suffering ourselves is endurable but to witness the suffering of others around us is absolutely unbearable. Believe me when I say that I wish I could reach out and help them too for there have been times where I have had people close to me suffer also.

The details you give are few so I can only speak in generalizations, but please know that happiness is not a crime. Chances are, they endure because they want you to be happy. Take some heart in the fact that you feel guilty about leaving them; it’s a sign that you do love them dearly.

And as for moving on, consider this: Someday you may get a chance to help them, but I doubt that you will find the opportunity to do so by remaining at their side. You would have to go and venture out on your own to grow and learn on your own and then maybe you will finally find a chance to truly offer help. Set your mind to it and you will find a solution eventually even if its not immediately attainable or apparent. A huge fraction of your life still remains ahead full of pleasant surprises, seizable opportunities, and good chances. Your parents got you this far already, keep going.

-Take Good Care
Aegis​
 
#63 ·
Wrong way around lol

empathy and sympathy are often used interchangeably, a subtle variation in ordinary usage can be detected. To empathize is to respond to another's perceived emotional state by experiencing feelings of a similar sort.[1] Sympathy not only includes empathizing, but also entails having a positive regard or a non-fleeting concern for the other person.[2]
 
#65 ·
"It is not the quantity of events in our life that matters, but rather the manner in which we deal with those problems and better ourself from them." My philosophy

(Although i cant keep it to just one exact saying i seem to keep parts of it fluid so it can morph to most situations)
 
#67 ·
There's nothing wrong in wanting to take some time off to take care of yourself for a change. Being a full-time counselor for others is a draining and unappreciated job - and it doesn't have to define who you are. You don't have to do it all the time :) And no, it's not being selfish either. Sometimes you just have to protect yourself too, it's your right as an individual.

It's not about losing your INFJ-ness - it's about shifting your locus of control from others to yourself. Your personal equilibrium may be in a state of flux right now because of the negative experiences - but eventually it will return once you develop more meaningful relationships. Being good and kind to yourself is the first step towards wanting to do the same for others.
 
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