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Discussion Starter · #61 ·
got my vaccine ASAP.. felt great.. 2 days of arm pain for the first dose...1 day of arm pain for my second dose
My 1st shot (Pfizer) no reaction at all unless it was slight pain at shot sight. 2nd shot felt poorly. Had a slight fever if I recall. Complete recovery the next day. My understanding was it was the body's reaction to the foreign substance to my body (that's not a very good technical explanation, lol.)`

I found a post where I noted this: #2,601
 
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Mr. Blue Sky
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I haven’t been convinced that I need to take a vaccine. I suffer from no auto-immune diseases. Nor do I accept the argument that I should take it to protect others: historically, vaccines are to immunise the vaccinated themselves, and since they say vaccinated people can still be carriers & transmit even the delta variant, this argument doesn’t hold up by their very own logic. Plot hole much?
 
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Nor do I accept the argument that I should take it to protect others: historically, vaccines are to immunise the vaccinated themselves, and since they say vaccinated people can still be carriers, this argument doesn’t hold up by their very own logic.
Would you be more receptive to it if the terminology used was different and the historical associations with vaccines weren't there to interfere? Or would that make you even more suspicious of it all?
 

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Would you be more receptive to it if the terminology used was different and the historical associations with vaccines weren't there to interfere? Or would that make you even more suspicious of it all?
Changing the letters of a formula doesn’t alter the underlying logic. I’m not swayed by the presentation, but the actual substance of the argument(s).
 

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Discussion Starter · #65 ·
I haven’t been convinced that I need to take a vaccine.
Do you also not bother to look both ways when crossing the street? When the sky is darkening do you leave your umbrella at home? Do you drive exceeding the speed limit by 20 mph?
 

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Stealth Warship
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Do you also not bother to look both ways when crossing the street? When the sky is darkening do you leave your umbrella at home? Do you drive exceeding the speed limit by 20 mph?
Beyond obvious things like not walking out into traffic, do you feel your instincts have served you well in life?
 

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Discussion Starter · #67 ·
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Charge'n Thru The Night
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I haven’t been convinced that I need to take a vaccine. I suffer from no auto-immune diseases. Nor do I accept the argument that I should take it to protect others: historically, vaccines are to immunise the vaccinated themselves, and since they say vaccinated people can still be carriers & transmit even the delta variant, this argument doesn’t hold up by their very own logic. Plot hole much?
Not exactly...your knowledge of history is weak.. Measles required a population of 95% immunized people to provide herd immunity... especially for those who can't get the vaccine.

People used ring vaccination during the smallpox epidemic to prevent the spread of smallpox and eventually eradicating it...If we had to vaccinize everyone against smallpox, we would not have been able to eradicate it...
 

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Mr. Blue Sky
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Do you also not bother to look both ways when crossing the street? When the sky is darkening do you leave your umbrella at home? Do you drive exceeding the speed limit by 20 mph?
I’ve had COVID twice, the first time was pretty bad, but it was weaker than the flu the second time. Clearly I’ve built some resistance. I’m not at all convinced I need a vaccination.

I’m not belittling others for taking the vaccine, and I would expect the same decency and courtesy of others.
 

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Not exactly...your knowledge of history is weak.. Measles required a population of 95% immunized people to provide herd immunity... especially for those who can't get the vaccine.

People used ring vaccination during the smallpox epidemic to prevent the spread of smallpox and eventually eradicating it...If we had to vaccinize everyone against smallpox, we would not have been able to eradicate it...
And yet I still had measles several times as a child. I lived. They still mandatorily gave me the MMR jab.

Well there you go, if smallpox was eradicated without fully vaccinating everyone, I needn’t by pressured by ‘obligation’ and ‘duty’.
 

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Charge'n Thru The Night
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And yet I still had measles several times as a child. I lived. They still mandatorily gave me the MMR jab.

Well there you go, if smallpox was eradicated without fully vaccinating everyone, I needn’t by pressured by ‘obligation’ and ‘duty’.
how did you get measles several times? do you have an immunity problem? you had the MMR? yet you are here... how come the vaccine didn't kill you?

covid-19 is not the same as smallpox, ring vaccination is not possible....the bottom line is that vaccination was used to stop the spread of the virus and protect the community at large.

you keep on displaying more of your ignorance each time you reply.
 

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Mr. Blue Sky
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covid-19 is not the same as smallpox, ring vaccination is not possible..
I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt that I’m clueless about the history of vaccinations. Okay let’s get back in topic.

Assuming that I’ve had COVID twice, shown resistance, and would test positive for antibodies, what’s your argument that I should still get vaccinated?
 

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Charge'n Thru The Night
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I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt that I’m clueless about the history of vaccinations. Okay let’s get back in topic.

Assuming that I’ve had COVID twice, shown resistance, and would test positive for antibodies, what’s your argument that I should still get vaccinated?
you should still get the booster shot if they have one for the new variants.
 

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People who do not want the experimental mRNA "vaccine", which if you got down to semantics, is technically not a vaccine since, it's not a milder form of the virus in order to help your body build antibodies, are not necessarily anti-vaxxers.This is an entirely new form of medical technology that has never before been testing by humans. Most people who don't want this experimental new treatment are not anti-vaxxers and generally don't appreciate being labelled as such.
I, for one, am all for vaccines. If I end up with kids, I will absolutely be sending them to get inoculated for all major childhood viral infections, even though I would refuse this treatment for the next 10 years.
Did you know it takes 10 years for a normal vaccine to be deemed safe. How long do you think it will take for this unprecedented form of vaccine?
883752


This vaccine wasn't even tested for as long as a normal vaccine before this current human trial. Here's a quote from the article this infographic is from:
The speed with which researchers and pharmaceutical companies have responded to the coronavirus epidemic has been described as "unprecedented" by Dr Jerome Kim, Director-General of the International Vaccine Institute.
“When we are used to five-year time frames, to see something go into human testing on March 17 is really a remarkable thing,” he told CNBC. “Does this guarantee success? Not necessarily. Vaccine development is characterised by a high failure rate – often 93% between animal studies and registration of a product.”
The discovery and research phase is normally two-to-five years, according to the Wellcome Trust. In total, a vaccine can take more than 10 years to fully develop and costs up to $500 million, the UK charity says.
My reasons are not political. I don't care what the governments or what right wing or left groups/conspiracy theorists say about the vaccine. If it became compulsory under the law, then I would take it, albeit reluctantly, as I do abide by the law of the land. Until then, I want to wait until the time comes that we can reasonably know what the actual risk of taking it is.

If everything looks mostly fine 2 years after the initial distribution, I'll likely take it then, because that will be sufficient time to have a better understanding of the short term/long term effects on the body.
 
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Charge'n Thru The Night
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People who do not want the experimental mRNA "vaccine", which if you got down to semantics, is technically not a vaccine since, it's not a milder form of the virus in order to help your body build antibodies, are not necessarily anti-vaxxers.This is an entirely new form of medical technology that has never before been testing by humans. Most people who don't want this experimental new treatment are not anti-vaxxers and generally don't appreciate being labelled as such.
I, for one, am all for vaccines. If I end up with kids, I will absolutely be sending them to get inoculated for all major childhood viral infections, even though I would refuse this treatment for the next 10 years.
Did you know it takes 10 years for a normal vaccine to be deemed safe. How long do you think it will take for this unprecedented form of vaccine?
View attachment 883752

My reasons are not political. I don't care what the governments or what right wing or left groups/conspiracy theorists say about the vaccine. If it became compulsory under the law, then I would take it, albeit reluctantly, as I do abide by the law of the land. Until then, I want to wait until the time comes that we can reasonably know what the actual risk of taking it is.
you know that graphic shows that most of the time spent in development and efficacy testing..not safety testing

safety testing is 1-2 years...

read your own graphic..it does not show that it needs 10 years
 

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Mr. Blue Sky
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you should still get the booster shot if they have one for the new variants.
That’s also unconvincing, & not a reasoned argument. If my doctor prescribed treatments without solid reasoning, I’d find another doctor. So far, the evidence is that my immune system has held up. I won’t live in fear of an endless amount of new variants.
 
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It still shows that it takes at least a year to determine safey.
In this country it hasn't been distributed a full year.
Also the accompanying quote shows that the vaccine was churned out unusually fast.

I edited and stated at the bottom, I'd wait a couple of years from initial distrubution. I'm aware that safety testing or even human trials takes up the entirety of the 10 years.
 

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Did you know it takes 10 years for a normal vaccine to be deemed safe. How long do you think it will take for this unprecedented form of vaccine?
Can you really compare these on the same level, though? SARS-CoV emerged in 2002, MERS-CoV in 2012. There has been time to research those viruses, so it's not like things started from complete scratch with Covid-19. Since it is highly contagious, mutates rapidly, and also has global implications, pulling all resources and cutting the regular bureaucracy to find a working "vaccine" as fast as possible is understandable. Obviously, your and others' concerns about the safety of it are understandable as well. Right now the world is divided into two - those who believe the virus is worse than the vaccine, and those who believe the vaccine could be worse than the virus.

But, as you said, it's technically not a vaccine. That's what I was trying to get at before, if the mechanisms were explained better with more accurate terminology, and not compared to normal vaccines so much, maybe it would yield better results and we'd also be able to get this under control faster as well. Or it could be worse, of course. So yeah, it will be interesting to watch how it all unfolds.
 

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those who believe the virus is worse than the vaccine, and those who believe the vaccine could be worse than the virus.
The problem with this divide, too, is that the answer to the question of "what is worse?" will vary from person to person. This is something a lot of people don't understand. For some people, chancing the vaccine is the option with less risk, while with others the risk of the vaccine might be greater, because they're at such a low risk of even catching the virus much less dying from it.
 
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