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Back again. Thought my gut fix was 1 but it could be 8. I'm having trouble distinguishing these two types. It seems 8's have their own integrity that they stick to, and it's not just a 1 thing?

I felt 1 fit me perfectly because I can be a perfectionist in some things, I'm always concerned with being true to myself (but apparently that's an 8 thing too?), and I don't really see myself as aggressive like an 8 (though everyone else seems to think I am). But I really relate to the 8 desire to be independent (though I actually thought this was a 1 thing), to have power, and also I have this inner innocence that rarely anyone sees. I'm not really protective of people though.. only when I see an occasion to be arise. It's not like I go out trying to pick fights with everyone, especially because of my 3 core. I realise these are probably really bad stereotypes, and I don't really know much on 8's, but the more I read up on it the more confused I am because it seems to me to have a lot of similarities to what I thought 1's to be.

So, can anyone help me out? I score high on both these fixes.. but I don't know which one drives me more out of the two.
 

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Back again. Thought my gut fix was 1 but it could be 8. I'm having trouble distinguishing these two types. It seems 8's have their own integrity that they stick to, and it's not just a 1 thing?
In my experience, ones are associated with morals, whereas eights are associated with integrity. Ones try to morality = perfection, whereas eights are very relative and flexible in applying their integrity (usually only if they perceive an "innocent" is involved).
http://personalitycafe.com/body-triad-types-8-9-1/373962-morality.html

When you're high enough on the integration ladder, you acquire the virtues and lessons of the other types, and highly developed people start to resemble each other more and more.

Which of these make more intuitive sense to you?
Ones
The Spiritual Enneagram: Type One - Sacred Goodness
The Spiritual Enneagram: Type One - Sacred Perfection
The Spiritual Enneagram: Type One - Sacred Repair

​Eights
The Spiritual Enneagram: Type Eight - Sacred Omnipresence
The Spiritual Enneagram: Type Eight - Sacred Expanse
The Spiritual Enneagram: Type Eight - Sacred Resistance
 

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@ScarlettHayden

A type 1 is about competency, discipline, and criticism. They tightly focus their anger into a laser beam. Being influenced by 9 and 2, there's an almost passive/aggressive quality to a 1. The rules are far more binding on a 1. Goodness and right matter to them.

A type 8 is about reaction, conflict, and intimidation. They loose their anger more like a cannon. Being influenced by 9 and 7, there's a more openly defiant quality to an 8. The 8 will break the rules more readily, if they feel justified in doing so. Fairness and justice matter to them.
 

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These two are a lot easier to get confused than most people realize. In fact, I was convinced I was an 8 for several years, largely because I don't relate much to most descriptions of 1s as idealistic do-gooders or moralists.

Another problem with 1 descriptions is all this about rules and laws. @tanstaafl28 mentioned 1s hesitating to break rules, but that's completely wrong as a defining trait of the type. Some 1s definitely *do* fall in that category, but the key point here is only if the rules are aligned with the 1's internal convictions. If not, the 1 will bend or break/disregard rules as much as they have to, in order to follow their internal convictions.

The biggest difference I've seen between 1s and 8s lies in restraint. 1s restrain themselves to a degree that 8s don't. In my experience, they're much more self-aware than 8s, with the 8 on average probably being the least self-aware of all types and 1s usually being very aware of themselves. Both are generally very straightforward and easy to figure out, but the difference is that the 1 weighs their own actions a great deal more. Despite being a gut type, 1s generally reflect before acting, which can actually make them appear outwardly very similar to a head type like a 5 or 6. Most 8s that I know aren't prone to reflecting to begin with, and when they do, it's only after acting.
 

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@Grau the Great

"The rules are far more binding on a 1."

I don't think any type is prone to blindly following the rules, but of all the types, you'll see 1s on average following them more often than you will most other types; particularly when comparing 1 with 8.


 

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@Grau the Great

"The rules are far more binding on a 1."

I don't think any type is prone to blindly following the rules, but of all the types, you'll see 1s on average following them more often than you will most other types; particularly when comparing 1 with 8.
Yeah, but the trick here is that ones make the rules that they're following. Eights don't really bother.
 

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@Grau the Great

"The rules are far more binding on a 1."

I don't think any type is prone to blindly following the rules, but of all the types, you'll see 1s on average following them more often than you will most other types; particularly when comparing 1 with 8.


Yeah, but the trick here is that ones make the rules that they're following. Eights don't really bother.
Yeah, that's the difference right there. 1s are definitely "weighed down" and constrained in their actions, but it's almost entirely self-inflicted. 1s will follow their own code tirelessly. I don't know if it's the case that 8s don't really bother, but they're definitely more inclined to act first, rather than make sure their actions are in line with their convictions.
 

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@Grau the Great

"The rules are far more binding on a 1."

I don't think any type is prone to blindly following the rules, but of all the types, you'll see 1s on average following them more often than you will most other types; particularly when comparing 1 with 8.


Right, but ultimately, the only rules we care about are our own. I certainly don't feel any obligation to obey laws or rules simply because they exist -- if I obey them, it's because of some other consideration, like the reasoning for the rule or because disobedience would negatively affect someone I care about.

When it comes to the dutiful rule-follower, I think more of a Six than a One. Ones only follow the rules they have internalized as being "right", and feel obligated to disobey anything that doesn't conform with those rules. They always follow a sort of "higher calling". "Blindly" following rules is contrary to everything a One values. Everything is evaluated relative to that calling. If a One is going "by the book", that means she's examined the book and believes in the book.

Sixes on the other hand are locked out from their own internal sense of certitude and feel a need to seek that security in an external source, a desire they either embrace or counterphobically reject. In a way, they see a bit too much, and being able to close their eyes and to follow a leader or a creed without thinking offers a reprieve from that tendency and the fear it generates.

In other words, a One obeys the rules because (and only if) those rules are considered part of what it means to be a good person, while a Six obeys the rules because they feel they would have nothing if they didn't. A One would disobey the rules if they conflicted with the inner code, while a disobedient Six is probably trying to rebel against his own fear.

Fanaticism, a fear-based reaction, is Sixish in nature. Indignation, an anger-based reaction, is Oneish. It's the former, and not the latter, that drives obsessive obedience.
 

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I think a 1 is more likely to mistake themselves for an 8 than an 8 a 1, because a 1 may be more consciously aware of their anger than an 8. An 8 may feel anger in the moment, but less in tune with their existential anger overall compared to a 1 where 1 is more of a constantly simmering felt experience. For an 8 to admit existential anger, I think they need to become aware of their denial and thus also subsequent blaming of the world and I don't think most 8s are aware of that without doing some self-work.
 

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@ScarlettHayden

A type 1 is about competency, discipline, and criticism. They tightly focus their anger into a laser beam. Being influenced by 9 and 2, there's an almost passive/aggressive quality to a 1. The rules are far more binding on a 1. Goodness and right matter to them.

A type 8 is about reaction, conflict, and intimidation. They loose their anger more like a cannon. Being influenced by 9 and 7, there's a more openly defiant quality to an 8. The 8 will break the rules more readily, if they feel justified in doing so. Fairness and justice matter to them.
I resent that. Not a cannon.

A flame thrower.

1's will have neat tidy desks, everything under their control will be neat and tidy. A 1 defines what is their's, and tries to make ti perfect.

An 8 will make more things under their control. We grab more stuff, put stuff under our power. Not everything has to be perfect which is under our control.
 

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Right, but ultimately, the only rules we care about are our own. I certainly don't feel any obligation to obey laws or rules simply because they exist -- if I obey them, it's because of some other consideration, like the reasoning for the rule or because disobedience would negatively affect someone I care about.
When it comes to the dutiful rule-follower, I think more of a Six than a One. Ones only follow the rules they have internalized as being "right", and feel obligated to disobey anything that doesn't conform with those rules. They always follow a sort of "higher calling". "Blindly" following rules is contrary to everything a One values. Everything is evaluated relative to that calling. If a One is going "by the book", that means she's examined the book and believes in the book.
Sixes on the other hand are locked out from their own internal sense of certitude and feel a need to seek that security in an external source, a desire they either embrace or counterphobically reject. In a way, they see a bit too much, and being able to close their eyes and to follow a leader or a creed without thinking offers a reprieve from that tendency and the fear it generates.
In other words, a One obeys the rules because (and only if) those rules are considered part of what it means to be a good person, while a Six obeys the rules because they feel they would have nothing if they didn't. A One would disobey the rules if they conflicted with the inner code, while a disobedient Six is probably trying to rebel against his own fear.
Fanaticism, a fear-based reaction, is Sixish in nature. Indignation, an anger-based reaction, is Oneish. It's the former, and not the latter, that drives obsessive obedience.
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A type 1 is about competency, discipline, and criticism. They tightly focus their anger into a laser beam. Being influenced by 9 and 2, there's an almost passive/aggressive quality to a 1. The rules are far more binding on a 1. Goodness and right matter to them.
with the possible exception of some Self Preservation 1s, 1s are among the least passive-aggressive type on the Enneagram. passive-aggression is a tactic of the deceitful, the dishonest and those who are afraid to openly oppose something/someone. they will be more polite about it than your average 8, but 1s tell it to you straight.
 

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I think a 1 is more likely to mistake themselves for an 8 than an 8 a 1
I have noticed this as well (particularly because the justice-oriented tendencies of 8 in the average range are exaggerated, and not something the 8 himself is likely to be as aware of). either way, I've noticed that the mix up is usually between Social 8 and Sexual 1.

because a 1 may be more consciously aware of their anger than an 8.
sometimes.

An 8 may feel anger in the moment, but less in tune with their existential anger overall compared to a 1 where 1 is more of a constantly simmering felt experience. For an 8 to admit existential anger, I think they need to become aware of their denial and thus also subsequent blaming of the world and I don't think most 8s are aware of that without doing some self-work.
sort of. I think most 8s are aware of some degree of consistent anger, but they tend to underestimate it (particularly the more "jolly" Social 8, which often looks more like 7, 9 or even 2 than it does the other subtypes of 8)
 

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I
sort of. I think most 8s are aware of some degree of consistent anger, but they tend to underestimate it (particularly the more "jolly" Social 8, which often looks more like 7, 9 or even 2 than it does the other subtypes of 8)
hmmmmm. I'm not simmering angry at all.

I'm just normal.

then someone pisses me off, or i get happy, or i feel loved or a loved one gets attacked, and it is FLAME ON.

I don't FEEL when I cook off. I know when i'm calm and mellow.

I'm not a social 8, nor a 9 wing. i am older than most here though.
 

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hmmmmm. I'm not simmering angry at all.

I'm just normal.

then someone pisses me off, or i get happy, or i feel loved or a loved one gets attacked, and it is FLAME ON.

I don't FEEL when I cook off. I know when i'm calm and mellow.

I'm not a social 8, nor a 9 wing. i am older than most here though.
But it's not anger in the moment that is being referred to here, but more a form of existential anger where you are angry at/with existence, rather than something temporary or specific to the current occurence.
 

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But it's not anger in the moment that is being referred to here, but more a form of existential anger where you are angry at/with existence, rather than something temporary or specific to the current occurence.
And I'm saying I don't have the existential anger. I think the simmering anger and frustration is really common for a young 8, but it is not really something which MAKES an 8.

If I'm angry, I fix. I adjust my environment until the annoyance is fixed.

Is the world a dangerous place? not for me.

Is it dangerous for my loved ones? No. Can it be dangerous for people in general? Of course.
 

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And I'm saying I don't have the existential anger. I think the simmering anger and frustration is really common for a young 8, but it is not really something which MAKES an 8.
If I'm angry, I fix. I adjust my environment until the annoyance is fixed.
Is the world a dangerous place? not for me.
Is it dangerous for my loved ones? No. Can it be dangerous for people in general? Of course.
all gut types have a distorted relationship with anger.

Edit: @OP
here is a good example of a woman who could either be a 1 or an 8 (I think she's ENTJ 8w7 So/??)
 

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Do NOT differentiate these types based on morality. There is nothing innately moral about 1, and nothing innately immoral about 8.

Before I get into the differences, understand that 1's are NOT necessarily prissy perfectionist nitpickers. 1's do NOT have to have perfectly tidy desks or neatly organized homes, nor if you ARE perfectionistic does it mean you are a type 1. 1's also do not need to follow the rules of others - they can just as well follow their own rules with little to no regard for what others say is a rule or law. If any of the above is how you picture the type, you've been duped by poor resources.

Both types want "more and more" and will push their surroundings to get it, but of antithesis things. 8's want more and more intensity and are themselves outrageous, 1's want more and more alignment with their inner concept of what things should be, which is usually kind of an outrageous expectation. 8's find themselves filling in power vacuums and controlling, sucking more and more out of their surroundings, 1's find themselves correcting themselves and others more and more to force things to more closely fit what they think needs to be. What an 8 wants is usually just that - what they want. What a 1 wants may not be what they themselves really want, but rather what meets their inner demand (via Superego).

I believe the crude sides of these types are flipped. The behavior of an 8 can be brutish, and they can appear angry, overbearing, over-energetic, intense, and unpredictable but internally I have found most to be caring and big-hearted. 1's appear overcivilized, conscientious, dependable, and put-together, but internally they can be bigoted, aloof to anyone or anything that doesn't align with their inner framework, seething with anger, even animalistic in the desires they constantly put behind bars. People give "sadism" to 8 as a characteristic, but I think it also applies to the punitive, completely intolerant mindset unhealthy 1's.

You can sense the differences in a conversation with both types. 8's are much more in tune with how they can be engaged with their immediate surroundings. 1's always have an extra step in their process; there's more deliberation with their inner standard and a more methodological way they got to where they did, even if they end up just as revved as an 8. In angry modes, an 8 is more explosive, unmeasured and overtly forceful to others, and it runs its course quickly; a 1 begins frustrated and irritated, and finds more and more reasons to explode later, not finding it easy to let go of the violations that cause it. Both types are pragmatic, but 8's tend to dive right into their work while 1's tend to formulate a mentally-focused structure or it. Both types "get things done," but 8's tend to add more and more load to the people and situations they are a part of while considering everything a priority, while 1's pick one fundamental priority and reject everything that doesn't align with it.


On the whole Superego for 1's gives them an additional layer of separation from their immediate experiences that 8's do not pay nearly as close attention to. 8 is a more directly outward-focused type (not necessarily extraverted) than 1. 1 is a more controlled type, and deliberates more than 8.
 
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