Personality Cafe banner

1 - 20 of 20 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
40 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I posted on the "what's my personality forum" and was typed as an INFJ, which is what I originally thought I was as I knew I had Fe/Ti and thought I had Ni. The more I interact with ISFJ's though, I think I see more similarities.

I get upset and frustrated when people (namely boyfriends) don't seem to take responsibilities like school seriously and just don't seem to want to grow up. I am 21 and about to graduate with a Bachelor's degree in Nursing and have a job lined up because I want to be independent and self-sufficient and a "real" adult. I hated relying on my parents. Now, I used to think that maybe this was due to my Ni seeing future consequences in not taking things seriously and an NFness of not wanting to put a burden on my parents for having to support me any more than a few years out of high school.

I read an argument than an ENTP had with his ISFJ wife and I knew exactly how the ISFJ J was feeling. Again, I don't know if it's my NF identification with feelings and understanding (because I could see the ENTPs points as well) or maybe because I AM an ISFJ.

When I am upset with people, I can't tell them right away. I need to think about it and not let their feelings influence me. I need to calm down and think it through. When I get in a fight with my boyfriend and he calls me and calls me wanting to talk about, I have to say I need more time. This is probably the Ti of either type.

I guess I don't know weather my dom is Si or Ni. I get feelings that I just "know" things and things just "come" to me. I have a hard time knowing if I'm right and tend to doubt it at times. I feel like an intuitive because I am spacy and always in my head and can see connections and enjoy figuring people like INFJs do. But, I am very serious and take responsibilities seriously like an ISFJ. I can't help but judge people that want to live with their parents and not grow up. And I certainly can't date someone who doesn't value education. I know at my age a guy may not already have a degree like me, but, if they talk about "crazy" dreams like being a rock star or pro athlete or something, I think they are ridiculous. I can not support those kind of things, as bad as I feel about saying that.

I have researched Ni pretty well but what can you helpful ISFJ's tell me about Si?

Thank you in advance!

-Confused IxFJ
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
440 Posts
INFJs fulfill their dreams and support causes. ISFJs fulfill others dreams and support people.

INFJs are leaders, not followers. ISFJs are followers, not leaders.

INFJs value freedom and spirituality. ISFJs value security and loyalty.

Hope I helped. :proud:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,966 Posts
I'd say I fulfill my dreams, but help others along the way with theirs. As for values, there are a whole lot of words I could use.

In my experience they're adept at catching onto meaning and expressing it well. I'll be struggling to express something, and an INFJ friend will understand what I'm getting at, and say it concisely. I'm probably more comfortable with leaving the house and being spontaneous, or being silly and making a fool of myself. They express anxieties about work social situations, I feel little anxiety about this, as there are sort've clear social rules, whereas just socialising in my free time gives me anxiety as it's not so set.
-All relating to a friend so it might not be the same for all.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
2,886 Posts
Recently I've been discovering and learning that in ISFJs, Si is a huge filter (maybe even a gatekeeper) that really is used most easily in almost all situations in ISXJs. It kind of needs to be used to use other cognitive functions(Fe, Ti, Ne) too more appropriately if I am understanding right.

Sometimes it seems like Si can be intuitive with it's own inner preoccupations being the utmost importance. I know I value the inner world of sensing (facts, experiences, interpretations) more easily than most things comparing the present reality with what's known and previous experiences. This is one of the dead-ringers for an ISFJ coupled with the second function Fe which functions through Si too a lot of the time. This is where INFJs and ISFJs are very similar, and may be hard to distinguish between externally from bystanders. It's hard to tell the difference with both types being introverts from others' perspectives with both showing their Fe externally or basing their feelings on the external.

Si may struggle to see the big picture or how things are connected a lot of the time, and inferior Ne is another way to indicate an ISFJ. Our intuition is poorly developed and focuses outwardly on potential things that can wrong usually. I find personally that I have a static mind-set of information that has fear(and maybe even dislike) of things changing or becoming more complicated that isn't like the inner world perception of it.

Congrats on about to graduate with a nursing degree!

And finally, I have no idea how Ni works at all myself. :p
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
40 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
I don't seem to struggle too much with how things are connected. If someone is acting mean or badly, I don't try to excuse it, but I can usually know exactly where it's coming from, why they are upset, and what they really mean and need.

I don't have as easy a time as some expressing these things, especially about my own feelings. If I know something is a certain way, I can't really explain why all the time. Like when I know a relationship won't work out, the reasons may not really make sense the way I say it but I just know I'm seeing deal breakers even if they aren't "obvious".

I think you guys have helped me realize that I am really am an INFJ. I have a preoccupation with how people work and how things fit into the big picture. I think the confusion comes because to a certain extent details have to make up the bigger picture. Both Si and Ni are introverted perceiving even though they are very different. But there has to be some kind of sensory trigger or "thing" that gets the Ni going. When we see someone acting a certain way, we don't really think about the exact words or exact expression or details, but all those details together just "click" and make us "know" what is going on internally with someone. Without the details, we couldn't see it, but because we don't "really" notice details, we can't explain what we're seeing.

Si being more detailed may go back to details such as specific things said when in arguments and explain how their feelings were hurt, ect., where as an INFJ is probably more focused on how it will impact everything in the future and an "overall" feeling of what is happening and have trouble being in the moment and dealing with it at that time.

I guess the posts about how ISFJ's talk in arguments made me think I could be one because I sometimes expect people to know how words will impact me and how to make things better and I want to project the emotions i'm feeling because i want them to really understand and try to see where I'm coming from. But this is Fe and not Si/Ni.

Thanks for your help everybody! Feel free to share anything else about Si that may help/stimulate more convo.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,966 Posts
My Feelings on getting a sense of things -
I'll have trouble seeing a whole idea if I see two, or a few tangible bits which don't cohere - due to a lack of information, or me just not having found the bridge by thinking about it enough. When I'm talking about my feelings I often begin on one point, then find another, look back over and see more connections when I've laid the feelings out, and the ideas can expand (Or, rather than when the feeling's laid out: when I've externalised that part of it; ideas are alive to me when I work through them, when it's laid out it's 'dead', knitted together, I've given it form). It feels like a straight line. but drawn in different directions.
When I'm analysing a text, I may get a feeling - about the general sense, or feel that something is significant, but not know why -, or the stub of an association, but it won't click and make sense straight away. I'll have to follow a string of associations - I will get a sense that I'm going in the right direction though -, and work through the feeling bit by bit. If a bit is missing (I have to see every piece and connection), or I go in the wrong direction, or if I'm too distracted, I'll get lost and loose it.
With people I need to see something tangible, and see other tangible bits which I can connect to it. I'm not inoften stumped in tv shows if a character acts in a way which I can't see the emotional logic/coherency to - if it's not been inferred or spelled out especially, because it's just not in the list of possibilities I'm used to. I could tell you what things could represent, but with actions and reactions, I'll get confused from time to time.
I can get a sense of a thing, but it'll be fragile, and I'll find it hard to relate it to exactly what I'm sensing in the real world 'It feels...kinda...sour...*perplexed by what I'm sensing*'. The dynamic (equation, if that's a better word, though I prefer dynamic) is summed up in that feeling, and I need to find each part (like the bits in a piece of clockwork, or a colour by number picture) to understand what I'm feeling.
- This is why expressing myself is such a rambly process, because I'm trying to hang on to/get a feel for intangible things, as I'm expressing myself, while not being sure of the direction they're going in.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22 Posts
I'm a lot more selfish than that. The only reason I would support other people is if it serves a quest of my own.
This thread intrigues me since I only scored as an ISFJ by one point- actually, my test was originally scored as INFJ but I forgot to answer one question, so when I went back to fix it, my score changed. I'd have to say I'm more of an ISFJ though, even though I don't volunteer at soup kitchens or save the world, it's in the little things- I manage my school softball team, I send out notes to my classmates, and I have a strange addiction to answering people's questions on Wiki Answers. I don't really see the big picture, and I get by day by day, week by week, and rarely plan ahead.
 

·
Registered
Me
Joined
·
1,685 Posts
INFJs fulfill their dreams and support causes. ISFJs fulfill others dreams and support people.

INFJs are leaders, not followers. ISFJs are followers, not leaders.

INFJs value freedom and spirituality. ISFJs value security and loyalty.

Hope I helped. :proud:
.....Not sure about that.

Im no leader, in fact I hate it and people never listen to anything I say anyhow. I also dont mind helping others, but I can only do that for a short period before I get annoyed at how others expect some kind of obligation all the time just because I helped once.

I dont fulfill dreams or support causes.

Of course I know you were just being nice and poetic, but there is absolutely nothing you just said, either ISFJ or INFJ that I relate to.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,550 Posts
intuition is first for INFJ and dead last for ISFJ. Also ISFJs are cuter. that is all.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Fynest One

·
Registered
Me
Joined
·
1,685 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,721 Posts
Seriously? My entire theory of "IxFJs are absolute saints", is wrong? Wow... And I honestly believed that shit. :tongue:

I actually think ISFJs get a few stereotypes of being people who just follow and serve others all of the time...meek little doormats that don't stand up for themselves or think for themselves.



Here's what I think it is....I think ISFJs often follow their own dreams, but our dreams look very simple compared to other types'. INFJs dreams probably look a lot loftier than ours. We tend to have a lot simpler interests, and we can be really really satisfied with doing the same things again and again. It looks very boring to other types, but we get more satisfaction out of smaller things than most types.

It's the blessing and curse of Si...it's a hidden world that a lot of people don't understand.


Now, this is not to say that we don't feed into the stereotypes oftentimes. We do have a way of serving others and helping them out too. And I do think it makes us happy to make others happy.

But I think a lot of times we're serving our own interests simultaneously...it's just hard to see it.


I will say that ISFJs sometimes can get stuck in ruts of being too satisfied with the same old same old, and it doesn't hurt for others to push us out of our comfort zones to discover new things. However, in my experience, this works best when it's done gently.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
864 Posts
I think @teddy564339 pretty much hit the nail on the head. My sister is an ISFJ and I'm an INFJ. Despite that one letter, we are like night and day.

The biggest difference I would say is we simply cannot fathom how the other determines satisfaction with their life. My sister wants what she always 'knew' to be the best. A husband and home to care for, eventually children, to be active in her church. To have a happy, harmonious home is her goal, even though she is wicked brilliant and could make leaps and bounds in the science world. (She has a mathematics degree, I wish I could pull that off, lol.)

As for myself, I could never see myself just being happy with that. Granted, I want that same harmonious home, but I need to be out in the world doing something more. I want to save the homeless animals, I want to help homosexuals fight for rights, I want to change the world in the ways (I see) it needs to be changed. It's not so much that I see the larger picture, it's that no matter how hard I try, I can't get the larger picture out of my brain. Before, when we were younger and we'd clash, I'd say "how can you be so happy with JUST this?"

That isn't to say I hold one above the other. In my more immature days, I considered her closed-minded and short-sighted, but as we've gotten older and learned a little more about the 'real' world, I can appreciate the difference. I kind of envy her simplicity, even if she can't understand my eccentricity. It must be really nice to get married and think "I've made it." I'm am full aware that the majority of my goals will be out of my reach for my entire life because I set them ridiculously high, I know that she has a higher chance of dying happy and fulfilled.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
158 Posts
Character traits and behavior tendencies aside (because we can arrive at the same outward result by different means), I'll try to express my understanding of Ni vs Si. This is all just my impressions (I have some Si tendencies and my mom is an ISFJ), so I apologize if I'm just really delusional.

Ni and Si are often similar because they both coalesce information. But I think Ni gravitates toward the metaphysical and abstract while Si stays concrete and connected with the physical world. Ni really takes me deep into my mind. It's always hungry for clarity of interaction and association between any and all conceptions of the world. It thirsts for self-awareness, for the exactness of vague feelings and images, for an ever expanding understanding of one subject at a time. I often see it has an endless road into myself. There is always this innate aspiration towards something beyond my physical self, something subtle and symbolic. There must be meaning, there must be connection, there must be more than just disparate data.

Si is incredible in its preciseness. It's like a long chain of vivid memories and experiences that clearly organizes reality. It is acutely aware of internal physical states of the self and others, acutely aware of the need and the means to adjust to the environment. It tries to preserve and relay information about what is stable, constant, and known. How things should be in reality. The way Si manifests in my mom is her compliant and accomodating attitude (awareness of the situation of herself and others), her organized and healthy lifestyle (awareness of her physical conditions), and her default adherence to tradition and convention (preference for stability and security).

It seems like INFJs and ISFJs tend to behave similarly, but then why is it that INFJs often feel so out of place in the world? I think that's a major difference between the two types. ISFJs have that dominant sensing ability that is conducive to integrating with and taking action in reality. Whereas INFJs' inferior sensing function is Ni's pet.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22 Posts
@Noelle Interesting. When I was younger, I thought and acted more like your sister. I tried to follow exactly in my mother's footsteps, and I thought by doing that, I could achieve all the happiness in the world. But as I've gotten older, I've changed my view on this to one more like yours. I've discovered joy comes through more than perfection, and that you really can be whatever you want to be, do what you want to do, live how you want to live.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
864 Posts
@Noelle Interesting. When I was younger, I thought and acted more like your sister. I tried to follow exactly in my mother's footsteps, and I thought by doing that, I could achieve all the happiness in the world. But as I've gotten older, I've changed my view on this to one more like yours. I've discovered joy comes through more than perfection, and that you really can be whatever you want to be, do what you want to do, live how you want to live.
It's probably a learning/growth process for all involved. :) I'm still young, (though some days I feel 80 :confused:) so I might hit the point where I'm just happy to settle down and chill with the family, or at least appreciate doing so more. (I'm sure my husband would be wickedly happy if I decided to spend money on things like cars instead of making a plan for an animal rescue, but I'm not letting go of that plan until someone pries it out of my cold dead hands. :tongue:)

I've mentioned in another thread (I think it was on the INFJ board) that my sister and I gained a lot of respect for each other as we've gotten older. We have extremely different beliefs and took a very different path, yet somehow we ended up in pretty much the same "place" in life.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,721 Posts
I think @teddy564339 pretty much hit the nail on the head. My sister is an ISFJ and I'm an INFJ. Despite that one letter, we are like night and day.

The biggest difference I would say is we simply cannot fathom how the other determines satisfaction with their life. My sister wants what she always 'knew' to be the best. A husband and home to care for, eventually children, to be active in her church. To have a happy, harmonious home is her goal, even though she is wicked brilliant and could make leaps and bounds in the science world. (She has a mathematics degree, I wish I could pull that off, lol.)

As for myself, I could never see myself just being happy with that. Granted, I want that same harmonious home, but I need to be out in the world doing something more. I want to save the homeless animals, I want to help homosexuals fight for rights, I want to change the world in the ways (I see) it needs to be changed. It's not so much that I see the larger picture, it's that no matter how hard I try, I can't get the larger picture out of my brain. Before, when we were younger and we'd clash, I'd say "how can you be so happy with JUST this?"

That isn't to say I hold one above the other. In my more immature days, I considered her closed-minded and short-sighted, but as we've gotten older and learned a little more about the 'real' world, I can appreciate the difference. I kind of envy her simplicity, even if she can't understand my eccentricity. It must be really nice to get married and think "I've made it." I'm am full aware that the majority of my goals will be out of my reach for my entire life because I set them ridiculously high, I know that she has a higher chance of dying happy and fulfilled.

I think what you're describing here is a really good example of how ISFJs and INFJs can learn a lot from each other.

I really do think it's good for ISFJs to be pushed out of their Si comfort zone, because I think oftentimes when we find something new that we really like, it greatly increases our lives...and we don't always seek it out. We probably end up missing out on a lot in life because of this. Of course, this is due to the fact that I think we also feel strong regret when we try something new and end up disliking or hating it..it feels like a strong waste of time and energy that we could have used to do something else.

So I think INFJs are a great type to help us with this, because they have the sensitive Fe force that helps gently push us to expand our horizons.

The flip side is that as you said, ISFJs can help INFJs hone down their goals to more realistic ones. An ISFJ might be able to help an INFJ see how they can break their goal into smaller ones that are more feasible...making it more sequential and therefore more doable. That way an INFJ is actually taking some direct action into their big picture goals, even if they're not achieving them on the scale that they would prefer.


That's why I always find it odd when INFJs and ISFJs butt heads...to me it seems like they would make a good pairing. I don't have much experience to speak of...I have one INFJ friend from college and another online INFJ friend. I only see my friend from college once every two years or so, and I never have to constantly interact with my online friend. But I get along with both very well, and there really isn't any friction between us.



It seems like INFJs and ISFJs tend to behave similarly, but then why is it that INFJs often feel so out of place in the world? I think that's a major difference between the two types. ISFJs have that dominant sensing ability that is conducive to integrating with and taking action in reality. Whereas INFJs' inferior sensing function is Ni's pet.
Well, I think ISFJs feel this way too, just not as strongly as INFJs do. I think a lot of it is down to the typical SF vs. NF difference...NFs have very idealistic goals and may often feel unsatisfied because their standards are so high. I think SFs tend to be able to get more satisfaction out of everyday interactions.

I think the flip side, though, is that ISFJs may be more dependent on others than INFJs. ISFJs may get more satisfaction out of giving to others in everyday life, but they also have more of a desire to receive affirmation and support for their actions than INFJs do. So it kind of goes both ways.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Noelle and Narrator

·
Registered
Joined
·
864 Posts
It seems like INFJs and ISFJs tend to behave similarly, but then why is it that INFJs often feel so out of place in the world? I think that's a major difference between the two types. ISFJs have that dominant sensing ability that is conducive to integrating with and taking action in reality. Whereas INFJs' inferior sensing function is Ni's pet.

Sorry I kind of missed this.

I have often wondered (well, every 'out of place' person does) why I felt that way, like I was so out of step and out of sync with the world. I don't even know if I can describe it in a way that doesn't sound crazy (oh Ni...:p)

I can't remember which page I read it on, but the best description I have read of Ni is "Dominant iNtuitives live in a world of possibilities." Even though, obviously, I am in the present, my brain is always in the future, looking ahead. It's just how it works, it's natural, always looking forward, seeing what needs changed, making plans to change them. Yet, I look around me, everyone is just living their lives, happy with what they have and happy with what is. Now, granted, everyone in my family (except maybe my mother, no idea what she is for a few reasons) are primarily Si users, so I got that from a very early age. There was a lot of frustration in me at a young age thinking "can't you see? can't you SEE what needs to change? It's so OBVIOUS!" Before MBTI/personality research/just general life experience, I never understood people's brains all work differently and are supposed to, I assumed everyone (except a few, maybe just me) brain was supposed to be the same. Heck, I spent many days wondering "am I the crazy one?" :p

As I've gotten older and gotten into a career field (student level) that I enjoy much more, I'm losing the sense that I'm so out of step with the world. There is lots of people like me, just not where I happened to be when I was a little kid.
 
1 - 20 of 20 Posts
Top