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Discussion Starter #1
I can effortlessly see how both might relate to these. The INTP part comes from my use of what I think is Ti. I recognize I've been doing it most recently because I've been going through a difficult time trying to revise my understanding of Myers Briggs objectively and really learning the proper implications and definitions so I can see how I fit and don't fit against the criteria of each type. I can't think straight and I bam my head into the wall trying to put up a good understanding on the logic of the subject. However, others say what I'm recognizing as Ti may be a critical parent shadow function of the INTJ. My INTJ understanding on the other hand, is that I work on a basic refining of my person and theories I enjoy like parallel universes and chaos effects (Ni). My Ne is weaker than my Ni which may explain why I don't believe I am an INTP as I can't relate to the idea of searching for knowledge or exploration. Some have suggested I'm an INTJ suffering from cognitive loop and an "in need of development of my auxiliary function (Te).Apparently my need to change myself and the way I go about it can be described as an Ni-Fi loop. I see what can get me to be a better person that is ideal for what I want and can change my values based on that, but I often sometimes circumvent any action related to that. This usually makes me angry and leads me to feel like I'm never making progress and see another way to refine myself to be better and do the same thing. I'm also terrible at using Fe harmony and its given me less friends over the years and left me feeling pretty alone.

If there is anything you want to know, I'll answer questions.
 

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What exactly do you mean by refining your theories yet not relating at all to searching for knowledge or exploration? I do not mean this in a confrontational way.
I mean I'm not interested in the ways in which INTps utilize Ne. I personally don't work with it. The term Exploration refers to the name of Ne. A far as redefining definitions, I like to work with concepts and change them as I learn new rules for their application and make sure its based upon agreed upon information. For example, learning about the Myers Briggs was like this. I started out with the basics and by finding more and more agreed upon information, I've significantly sharpened my knowledge of the misconceptions I had before.

*Also. hanks for following me. I've been working through MBTI wit myself and others so I apologize if everything seems different from where we were headed in my first post ever..
 

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Thanks, all that knowledge paid off. I'm probably an INTJ. But I'm curios, what type are you? Your picture has nothing on it or above it for me.
 

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I think your Ne not Ni.
Wow, strong post. I really like how solid your arguments are !



OP, what are your hobbies ? How structured and disciplined are you in your work/projects ? I think it's a good way to differentiate INTP and INTJ. INTPs looks like butterflies to me. They hop on a project, then after a few days/weeks, they get distracted and they hop on something else. For example, me and a friend (INTP) of mine was really interrested by powerlifting. We both trained a lot and intensively. However, I was following a strict plan and diet, I was waking up early in the morning to fit my trainings in my schedule and I had a coach to help me improve technical aspect of the sport. Him, on the contrary, was doing a different routine every week. He didnt want to do competitions (even though he was very talented). He had no discipline. He trained when he wanted to.

I tend to be obsessive about my projects, trying to master every aspect of my current passion. My INTPs friend seem more curious than serious about their project/hobby/work. They let their inspiration guide their work.
 

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Discussion Starter #10 (Edited)
Wow, strong post. I really like how solid your arguments are !



OP, what are your hobbies ? How structured and disciplined are you in your work/projects ? I think it's a good way to differentiate INTP and INTJ. INTPs looks like butterflies to me. They hop on a project, then after a few days/weeks, they get distracted and they hop on something else. For example, me and a friend (INTP) of mine was really interrested by powerlifting. We both trained a lot and intensively. However, I was following a strict plan and diet, I was waking up early in the morning to fit my trainings in my schedule and I had a coach to help me improve technical aspect of the sport. Him, on the contrary, was doing a different routine every week. He didnt want to do competitions (even though he was very talented). He had no discipline. He trained when he wanted to.

I tend to be obsessive about my projects, trying to master every aspect of my current passion. My INTPs friend seem more curious than serious about their project/hobby/work. They let their inspiration guide their work.
As far as hobbies, I have few things I'm really interested in. My life lately has really just been understanding the way the world works and I've been quite devoted to that. My interactions with the world and trying to positively affect it have always never worked out even if I was given the opportunity. I thought if I knew how things worked a bit better, it would be easier to deal with. I've been working through temperaments and other ways of life to understand people but realized I didn't understand myself which could have been the problem. I still enjoy reading theory based things and fictional stories about peoples interactions with certain things but besides that, my hobbies are pretty slim.

As far as projects, I can be pretty focused. The only reason I'm sometimes seem undisciplined in what I do is because I'm tired or my focus has slipped to this issue. I can lose things often though. I've never really had the ability to go after the things I wanted, I can be very impatient once I've realized a possible want for me or a skill. An example is art. When I was younger I pictured writing a book. I asked my teacher what it took and tried hard to do that. I wrote possible chapters and was hopeful until I realized how much learning of literacy, money, and other skills I was disheartened and quite believing that I would never be able to do that, ad I've had many similar experiences such as this. I tried to better myself in many different ways by improving upon qualities I already have and learn skills and ways to do this. I'm confidant for awhile, but rejection, failure, and reaffirmations from the world always pushes me backwards. I've always wanted to do muscle training in the past year as getting older is forcing me to feel being stronger and healthier is a good way to live, but the change is just so abrasive and fruitless I can't maintain.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Hmmm...

It sounds more like INTP than INTJ. INTJ are commonly strong-will and arent easily disheartened. Do you consider yourself perseverant/resilient or more easily disheartened ?

It's hard to understand the difference between Ti/Te and Ni/Ne. Personality Junkie: Type, Careers, Relationships & More! on this website, the author explain the different function precisely IMO.
In Jungian Standards, Ti makes knowledge a means to an end as it build up knowledge through classifications and understandings that it has and is focused on objective knowledge. Te uses knowledge to help achieve goals and organize the environment to a standard.

Not sure about Ni/Ne though.
 

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In Jungian Standards, Ti makes knowledge a means to an end as it build up knowledge through classifications and understandings that it has and is focused on objective knowledge. Te uses knowledge to help achieve goals and organize the environment to a standard.

Not sure about Ni/Ne though.
Meh...trying to resume a complex and blurry concept with only 1 sentence is a good way to get confused. Someone who dedicate his life to seek knowledge (like a researcher in an university), is he a Te-user or a Ti-user ? Following your logic, that would make him a Ti-user. However, INTJs are common among academics.

INTJ vs. INTP: Type Differences
 

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Discussion Starter #14 (Edited)
Meh...trying to resume a complex and blurry concept with only 1 sentence is a good way to get confused. Someone who dedicate his life to seek knowledge (like a researcher in an university), is he a Te-user or a Ti-user ? Following your logic, that would make him a Ti-user. However, INTJs are common among academics.

INTJ vs. INTP: Type Differences
Nice link! I'm definitely an INTJ in that respect. My need to get to the over arching problem is something common in INTjs, not INTPs. I thought it was INTps that do that but they really just work via options and not really zeroed down, big picture solutions. I'm alot like that, so thank you. You have very good sources, what others do you recommend for INTj descriptions?
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Glad it helps !

I dont really have other sources. Personality junkie is one of the best described website I've come across.

INTJ vs. INTP | Prelude Character Analysis

Another interresting exercice is to compare 2 types and highlight the parts that fits you. You'll find that a description type fits you a bit more than the other.
Yep, its pretty clear. This cleaned up many of my misconceptions I had about both types. I'm an INTJ 5:12.
 

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@Octowave you're confusing Te/Ti and Ne/Ni, which is probably not your fault considering there is a lot of misinformation.

Te believes a decision should be made with efficiency and quickly looks for external data to confirm the efficient conclusion. For example, 90% of men who are accused of hitting women are guilty. When a man is accused, the efficient answer is to conclude he is guilty. Te tries to raise it's own standards, to where it isn't that simplified. So 50% are obviously guilty, 40% require 3 days of research, and 10% are innocent. Because of these new standards, when a man is accused, from now on, the protocol is to do 3 days of research. Te notices that this system can be improved, however, so etc....
Many Te users are highly intelligent and creative. The core focus of their improvements, however, is about improving an automated standard. When a decision needs to be made, Te prefers to look to experts, prior decisions, and current systems to efficiently make a decision and move on. Te can be very beneficial in large systems where we don't have time to research every nuance.

Ti sees each case as unique, requiring its own set of research criteria. Instead of 90% are guilty, Ti challenges that and wonders what data backs that up. While Te adds 3 days mandatory research, Ti says there isn't a limit to what can be considered, as Ti prefers a thorough analysis, of that current system. After several weeks of research, Ti concludes that 50% of the accused are likely guilty, based on the evidence. However, with the other 50%, there isn't enough evidence to conclude that any of them are either guilty or not guilty. Ti proposes that an investment team is created to look at each individual case to see what amount of research is needed.

Both Te and Ti users can relate to both of those up there, but preferences come through. As an employee, I'm fully capable of working in a system with automated decisions in place. I like to work efficiently, but that is more so because my personal thoughts prefer it. Te users tend to be more clustered, in terms of conclusions, while Ti is all over the place.

Getting tired of typing, so quick Ni vs Ne. Ni is deductive. It takes potential conclusions and selects the one that is most clear. Ni is much more of a "a-ha" moment than Ne, as Ni waits for the revelation to occur. Ne is inductive. I would describe it more as a "ripple effect". Ne considers A which connects to B, which connects to C, all the way to Q. From there, Ne sees a parallel between D, H, and M and concludes those 3 are related. Ni sees that parallel and concludes "D is what I'm looking for". The fun thing about Ni vs Ne accuracy is neither are guaranteed to ever be correct. Ni sees D and gets fixated on D. Ne, however, proposes D, H, and M as the likely answers. Ne waits for feedback, and then concludes H is the answer. Te and Ti are then used to uncover information to prove either D or H.
 

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Both types use Ti and Ni to the degree that they understand them, but INTP is Ti master and INTJ is Ni master.

INTP is much stronger at Ne and uses it all the time, whereas INTJ does the same with Te instead.
INTJs don't really Ne at least from what I've seen, and Te is a much much lower priority for INTPs than it is for INTJs.

Just decide your function strength priorities.


Also, INTJs' repressed Fi-Se can cause angry insecurities when faced with the idea that someone unworthy is better than them at something.

INTPs don't have that nearly as much, their intensity tends to instead lie in analysis so thorough that every seemingly unimportant detail is given attention, like each detail is their baby. But can also be hard on themselves in other ways.
 
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