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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I recently had to let go of my ENTP...so now I've been back in the dating world again.

The man I've been seeing is an ESTJ, at least that's my strong guess. (He's a textbook case, lol)

That said, we adore each other. There's serious chemistry going on.

However, I'm picking up some odd vibes about him:

1. He wants to know EVERYTHING about me. If I don't tell him, he accuses me of hiding things from him. And he REMEMBERS everything. Maybe it's my lack of Si wondering why he'd waste valuable brain space to remember that the great aunt I mentioned briefly once was named Liz, but he does.

2. Seems controlling. HE picks the places, every time. HIS agenda. I always offer to split the tab, but he won't let me. Seriously, he won't - not just being polite. He says he values "traditional" values, yet he's only 25...

3. Overprotective? He won't let me drive to see him...he INSISTS on picking me up from at work or home (which he insisted on finding out), and insists on knowing what I'm going to do afterwards.
And then, he bitches that I'm not "prioritizing him", and insists on taking directly there, even though I really don't like this because it feels invasive. But even though I prefer transporting myself, he won't let me.

4. Gets funky with me if he calls me at random to check up on me, and I tell him I'm with friends.

5. 20 questions about every issue. Overanalyzing.

6. On a date to the beach, he got upset because I wasn't "dressed appropriately" for the cold weather, and insisted on taking us to another place. Yet I really wanted to go to the beach, and it's not his problem if I'm cold.

7. Gets VERY upset if I have to cancel/reschedule a date, or if I'm running late. He literally memorized each instance, and throws it in my face, every time.

Sorry for the rant, and it sounds bad, but the other 99% of our time together is so much fun.
But I've seen this guy regularly for a month, so I don't know whether I'm being overly paranoid, or if he really is a controlling ESTJ stereotype. I don't want to ruin something cool by assuming he's possessive/scary if he's not.
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
I'm honestly very close to just bouncing...I just want to be sure I'm not imagining things before I tell him to lose my #..

I told several of my friends, and half say he's bonkers, the other half say it's normal, that it's just the way guys are.
 

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Personally I resent the idea that wanting to pick up the paycheck makes a guy "controlling". Clearly though some of the behaviors mentioned could be cause for concern. My only advice would be to raise these concerns with him if you haven't already. I personally can can sympathize with not always understanding how others perceive me. After you raise these issues with him, if he persists, then it's a problem.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Personally I resent the idea that wanting to pick up the paycheck makes a guy "controlling". Clearly though some of the behaviors mentioned could be cause for concern. My only advice would be to raise these concerns with him if you haven't already. I personally can can sympathize with not always understanding how others perceive me. After you raise these issues with him, if he persists, then it's a problem.
I don't think it's the issue of him picking up the tab. I only mentioned that because I wonder if it's his way of manipulating control - because if I ever requested a compromise, he'd then be able to throw the "My wallet, my way" justification in my face.

I tried bringing most of the issues up with him, but like the stereotypical ESTJ, he thinks it's his right/duty to do things that I happen to take issue with.
 

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I would be so out of there if I were you. Those are a lot of red flags, especially considering that you have only been seeing each other for a month. If he is acting like this now, while he is presumably on his best behaviour, can you imagine what he is going to be like later?

It disturbs me that your friends think this is normal behaviour. All guys do not act like this and ESTJ or not, these are the signs of a pretty controlling and manipulative person. He sounds like the worst version of all of my ESTJ friends (who are pretty great people).

I suppose that you could talk to him about your concerns, but is it really worth it for someone that you have only been seeing for a little while? It seems to me that when you have concerns of this magnitude about someone you've only been dating for a short time, that it's usually best to cut your losses and run. You don't owe this guy anything and you're not responsible for fixing him. If this behaviour seemed out of character for him, then I would push the idea of working things out a little bit more strongly, but it doesn't sound like that is the case. Obviously his behaviour has rubbed you the wrong way for a reason if you've discussed this with your friends and are now discussing it here. Don't dismiss or try and rationalise that gut feeling. I say run. Fast.
 

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I'm a guy, and that is rather....holy crap. I understand refusing the tab part, because even I would do that. But 20 questions about everything is a bit insane. That is not controlling, that is just completely insecure and distrusting of you. He has a mixture of traditional values (which still do exist by parents embedding it in their children (I got it too)), and a massive lack of self confidence. He sounds like he just needs reassurance you won't cheat as it seems to be what he is mortally afraid of.
 

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You're not imagining things. The guy is nuts.

However, if you like him you might want to try reasserting your boundaries.

"I am going to drive myself to work and home. If you don't like that, you can piss off."

"I'm going to pay for dinner tonight. If you don't like that, don't come."

If you aren't the type of person who is capable of saying these things, then you cannot be with someone controlling. Because, if they're not put in their place, they will takeover more and more of your life.

So that's my advice: Either assert your boundaries and stick to those assertions, or leave immediately, because it will only get worse.
 

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@dagnytaggart

Run like the wind. In fact, don't run. Tell him to run along into the sunset whilst you sit back, relax, and celebrate his departure. I don't know about guys, but this guy thinks those behaviour patterns are disturbing and controlling. As @knittigan and @twoofthree said, follow your instincts. Plus, anyone who gets concerned their partner is out with friends, or subjects them to 20 questions behaviour sounds like the parent of a rebellious teenager; not a boyfriend IMO.
 

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OP, I hope this won't sound too harsh. I am just..at a loss here. This backward, controlling, manipulative pushy behaviour is so clearly abusive that there are no two ways about it. I am surprised that you're not following your instincts here. Anyone who rubs your mistakes in your face, controls your movements, aggressively hogs attention and does all the other shit you mentioned is so clearly not bf material, it's not even funny. And, ignore your friends who think this is normal. *shakes head* No matter how hard I try, even for the sake of argument, I can't find any way to rationalize his behaviour. Trust your judgment. How could you possibly be 'imagining' things? It's happening to you. It's hurting your feelings, and it's making you think twice..about the guy. So, yeah, something's wrong here. And, it's the guy. Besides, ESTJ=/= manipulative, pushy jerk who treats an able bodied grown woman as though she were an inept child.

I wouldn't waste time on him, and I certainly wouldn't care to put any efforts into making it work. Your time will be better spent scheduling a date and time for a break-up with this uber punctual 'gentleman', blessed with an elephant memory. I am sure he'll appreciate the timely gesture.
 

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Every item that you mentioned is a huge red flag. If it's bothering you this much, this early in the relationship, it's time to move on. His behaviour will only get worse as he becomes more attached to you.
 

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It sounds like he's just uptight and nervous and wants to impress you with his "good manners". I used to be abit like that when I was in High School. No.s one and seven are the only ones that sound like big issues. You should try and have a talk with him.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
It sounds like he's just uptight and nervous and wants to impress you with his "good manners". I used to be abit like that when I was in High School. No.s one and seven are the only ones that sound like big issues. You should try and have a talk with him.
That's why I gave him the benefit of the doubt.

But he's too pushy about it...I'm not going to deal with him anymore.
 

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I was just starting to see an ESTJ. There were obvious signs at the beginning he had control issues. And when they appeared, I gave him 3 chances. Here's how it went.

He told me he was in love with me on third date. :confused:

After 1 week and a half of dating, while I went to the store, I came home to his questioning me. He had gone through my phone and read all my text messages. He questioned me about other men. He later apologized for it and for betraying me trust. Even though my gf's reccomendations were to bail at that point, I still gave him another chance, simply because he admitted he was in the wrong and apologized.

He eventually "looked through" my mail that was "just lying there".


Of course there were other things, that weren't as big a red flag as these. He would tell me his ex wife cheated on him, etc. But that excuse only led me to believe more that he was not in a position to be dating someone. If he can't trust, the issues are with him and not with me.

Mine also paid for everything and everything was scheduled far in advance. Not necessarily bad. I just figured he was old fashioned. He also asked me right away about my finances which I felt was a little intrusive.

I'm proud of myself for letting this guy go sooner than later. It's harder to do it the longer you're with someone. All in all, I took an opportunity to bail after 3 weeks max. It wasn't that hard and pretty clean. No hard feelings. One of the easiest breaks I've ever had. And I think it's because I didn't let it continue for too long. Trust the signs. You're uncomfortable.
 

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It sounds like he's just uptight and nervous and wants to impress you with his "good manners". I used to be abit like that when I was in High School. No.s one and seven are the only ones that sound like big issues. You should try and have a talk with him.
It's curious that you see 2-6 as not a big deal, because from my perspective, #1 is the only one that could be ignored.

#1 - Could be written off as him just having a phenomenal memory. Taken with all the other issues mentioned it reeks of manipulation. It's standard procedure to throw past conversations and innocent slip-ups back at a person to emotionally blackmail or manipulate them.
#2 - Him always being the one to pick the place, activity, etc. That's not good manners, that's controlling.
#3 - Refusing to let his date drive is not overprotective - it's controlling. It allows HIM and him alone to determine when the date is over. He's taking away the escape route of having her own transport. Especially when he's insistent about it.
#4 - Why is he calling to "check up" on his partner? Calling to say hi, is not the same as calling to ask, "where are you? what are you doing? who are you with?" There is no place for that insecure and juvenile crap in a healthy relationship.
#5 - 20 questions is another huge flag. When you can't just say, "I'm going to the store for milk" without facing the Spanish Inquisition, it's a serious problem.
#6 - Not his decision to make. It's one thing to show concern for someone, but to arbitrarily make decisions for them because they aren't dressed to his standards is completely unacceptable.
#7 - There's no reason for him to be upset at a cancellation or running late is he has been informed about it. Being stood up is one thing, but getting angry because someone politely tries to reschedule is unacceptable. Throwing those occasions back in a person's face is also completely unacceptable behaviour.

I'm not saying you're wrong or that my interpretation is the only answer. Just offering a different perspective as someone who has been in an abusive, controlling relationship.
 

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Be VERY careful how you handle this no matter what you decide. #1 on your list is a bad enough sign without the rest adding to it. It took me a couple of months to formulate how I was going to lose mine but eventually I got an opportunity to have him do the breaking up and that's really the best way if you think they are capable of phsycial harm or retaliation.
 
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