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Discussion Starter #1
I'm interested in learning more about the ENFP and ISTP duality relationship according to Socionics. I admit that I'm attracted to the idea, and also have done a lot of amateur internet research on the topics.
I've been totally trolling personality cafe reading about relationship experiences between enfps and istps, to gather a gist of what the common perceptions and complaints are. There tends to be a lot of negative opinions about enfps circulating amongst istps. What's up with that?

Also, there's this confusion with whether the socionics istp is actually an mbti istj? I have trouble believing that and wonder what thoughts are on that claim.

And, oh yeah, I do have a complete hidden agenda, I'm like falling in love with this guy who I think is an Istp D:


and


I WANT IT TO WORK!!!!
hahaah, ^_^

Aaaaah.
 

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Oh, boy! This again.

If you read around the subforum, you'll see that while the attraction is often intense, it is commonly doomed to failure. ISTPs are the most introverted of the introverts, and ENFPs are the most gregarious of the bunch.

Does that sound "compatible" to you?
If so, God be with you.

So here is how it plays out:
The challenge for you lies in getting us to open up.
Our challenge lies in getting you to shut up.

I just saved you 6 or more months of tears, failed expectations and the best sex you're ever likely to have.

You're welcome.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Haha, come on. That's so oversimplified. And, uh, what's this thing about enfps talking too much? Are we boring or something?

I think enfjs are more "gregarious", while enfps that are really loud are mainly attentiony and doing all this flamboyant stuff for showy purposes. In positive cases, though, I think enfps get super loud and wild when we're bored, and in that case, it's fun..well, in my opinion.
 

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ENFP and ISTP partnerships only work if the ISTP REALLY, REALLY wants it. Otherwise the ENFP fills themselves with irrational doubt and goes into a down-ward spiral.

A gung-ho ISTP will give an ENFP the attention and affection they need. One that isn't so gung-ho, will not.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Thank you. I really appreciate your insight. I think I'm just gonna go with it..I like talking to him.

I guess, another thing I was thinking about was this whole upper hand that istps tend to have in the dynamic with enfps, which I think is almost selfish?? And I just dont understand why istps end up coming off as more mature than enfps ALL the time?
 

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I guess, another thing I was thinking about was this whole upper hand that istps tend to have in the dynamic with enfps, which I think is almost selfish??
Why do you think it's selfish?

Haha, come on. That's so oversimplified. And, uh, what's this thing about enfps talking too much? Are we boring or something?

I think enfjs are more "gregarious", while enfps that are really loud are mainly attentiony and doing all this flamboyant stuff for showy purposes. In positive cases, though, I think enfps get super loud and wild when we're bored, and in that case, it's fun..well, in my opinion.
Perhaps I can offer a theory. I do so in the hopes that it will either be confirmed or denied by other ISTPs.

ISTPs spend a lot of time thinking, hence the Ti dominant complaints and praises you will come across. As such, they might already have a grasp on the information you are presenting. The ENFPs I know are not the most concise people. I also have read writings on the ENFP forum that I could severely shorten and still achieve the same motive. So this leads us to hear unnecessary explanations, which both excessively wordy explanations and explanations about information we already know falls under. And often I find that when ISTPs say boring, they mean you have nothing worthwhile to say.

And I just dont understand why istps end up coming off as more mature than enfps ALL the time?
I am going to assign a strong correlation to the Thinking and Feeling aspects. This doesn't suggest that Feelers are immature, it more so suggests that Thinkers are less likely to take things personally.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Why do you think it's selfish?
Okay, by selfish, I'm referring to this whole thing about ISTPs not being very accomodating, unless they want to, for whatever reason, and then dropping out when things don't suit them. Correct me if you have any personal convictions that counter that. It's just like, why do I have to be the one that understands what's happening between us, and adapt, and be patient, and be patient.
For example, I dated this guy who was an istp that ended a month ago. I initiated it by letting him know that I was attracted to him and that I had a huge crush on him. Right away, he asked me if I wanted to sit next to him, and then attempted to coax me into making out with him. We did, but I didn't want to go further and he wanted to do the sexual hook up stuff, and I made it clear, "No, I don't want to unless we're in a serious committed relationship." So, we had a conversation and we agreed to be friends with minimal expectations, and benefits. However, I was constantly the one asking to spend time, etc. Then, I met him at a party for a mutual friends birthday. He kept asking me to kiss him, in front of everyone, and I felt disrespected and said I felt uncomfortable but he kept on it. Then, I asked if we could go somewhere else, and he refused to budge. I left, pissed off. After that, I messaged him about it and when he responded a day later, he asked me to leave him alone. So I did. 2 weeks later, he apologized and told me that he "realized he really did like me a lot.." My analysis: He was stringing me along, and not until after I backed off LIKE HE WANTED, then he asks to see me again and expects things to be okay. And also, he was unwilling to discuss his actions. That's an example of how I think being stubborn and not willing to open up is selfish, especially because ENFPs are so open and willing to mend conflict.

but as @DustyDrill said, if someone, or an istp is gung ho about me, I'll know it. This guy that I'm currently into is also an Istp, and I haven't had to try or wonder whether he is into me. He's been pretty consistent about wanting to spend time with and make plans. Does that behavior last, or is it just a front?

Perhaps I can offer a theory. I do so in the hopes that it will either be confirmed or denied by other ISTPs.

[/QUOTE]ISTPs spend a lot of time thinking, hence the Ti dominant complaints and praises you will come across. As such, they might already have a grasp on the information you are presenting. The ENFPs I know are not the most concise people. I also have read writings on the ENFP forum that I could severely shorten and still achieve the same motive. So this leads us to hear unnecessary explanations, which both excessively wordy explanations and explanations about information we already know falls under. And often I find that when ISTPs say boring, they mean you have nothing worthwhile to say.



I am going to assign a strong correlation to the Thinking and Feeling aspects. This doesn't suggest that Feelers are immature, it more so suggests that Thinkers are less likely to take things personally.[/QUOTE]

Well, what I mean by the whole mature thing is that ISTPs come across as already understanding and knowing what they want, and not finding anything alluring about enfps, while enfps are the exact opposite about them. For example, ENFPs fall into a relationship easily and willingly, and the ones that are sincere are always ready for something genuine. And it's like, with ISTPs. do you guys even look for that?

In retrospect, I'd say I do have my heart hidden under my sleeve, and it just seems unnatural to not. And, I'm always thinking about being in LOVE. UUUUGH.
 

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but as @DustyDrill said, if someone, or an istp is gung ho about me, I'll know it. This guy that I'm currently into is also an Istp, and I haven't had to try or wonder whether he is into me. He's been pretty consistent about wanting to spend time with and make plans. Does that behavior last, or is it just a front?
If you're a good match it will last. The biggest hurdle for ISTPs is trust. If he can easily trust you, you won't have any issues.
 

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Agreed with @DustyDrill , the challenge is the communication or lack thereof. Not that we don't communicate. We just may not do it verbally.

Anyways, don't date or not date based on MBTI. ISTPs are supposed to be most compatible with ENTJs, but that doesn't stop us from falling in love with ESTJs or ISFPs or ISTJs or... you get my point.

The only advice I can give is to give your ISTP guy some space. He'll really love you for that.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Perhaps I can offer a theory. I do so in the hopes that it will either be confirmed or denied by other ISTPs.

ISTPs spend a lot of time thinking, hence the Ti dominant complaints and praises you will come across. As such, they might already have a grasp on the information you are presenting. The ENFPs I know are not the most concise people. I also have read writings on the ENFP forum that I could severely shorten and still achieve the same motive. So this leads us to hear unnecessary explanations, which both excessively wordy explanations and explanations about information we already know falls under. And often I find that when ISTPs say boring, they mean you have nothing worthwhile to say.



I am going to assign a strong correlation to the Thinking and Feeling aspects. This doesn't suggest that Feelers are immature, it more so suggests that Thinkers are less likely to take things personally.
I've been thinking about this recently actually, because I know two people who are enfps, who really get on my nerves. I think, again, the reason why some enfps talk so much is because they want attention and want their perceptions to be valued. After I started using the advice on personalitypage.com for enfps "decide how you really feel about people, places, and things", I quieted down quite a bit, and am definitely more pointed in my behavior. Once I did this, that's when I started attracting ISTPs(2 guys and 2girls), I don't know if that's positively correlated, but my intuition tells me that's why my relationships with them are on an uphill. I don't talk that much. In fact, once I stopped talking and being so preoccupied with getting attention as much as I used to, I started getting bored with trying to impress other people, and became interested in actually hearing what they were saying, found their jokes funnier than mine, and ..this is the good part, I started hanging out with my parents more... haha. But yeah, this "ISTP" guy that I'm into is super interesting, and we definitely have an equal exchange of word vomit in our discussions with each other, which also tends to be very creative. Anyways, as an ENFP, I also find some fellow enfps really fucking egotistical. However, I 'm not going to play it off and say that I'm more mature than them, I'm still super silly, and frivolous.
 

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Okay, by selfish, I'm referring to this whole thing about ISTPs not being very accomodating, unless they want to, for whatever reason, and then dropping out when things don't suit them. Correct me if you have any personal convictions that counter that. It's just like, why do I have to be the one that understands what's happening between us, and adapt, and be patient, and be patient.
Okay, there's actually a concept that I find very amusing about this. I'll explain it, just keep an open mind and understand that I am not making a personal attack.

You have never been in a different mind. Your thinking pattern is naturally understood while other people's thinking patterns have to be learned. After all, that's what you are doing right now - you're trying to learn about ISTPs' thinking patterns (aka thought processes.) Simple enough? Wait for it... wait for it...

Let's assume no through process is right or wrong. They're all equally right and equally wrong.

Your thought process naturally wants to accommodate other people. In other words, you do it because you want to, and you derive a satisfaction from it. Other peoples' thought process does not naturally want to accommodate other people. In other words, they don't do it because they want to, and they derive a satisfaction from it. It can be argued just as easily that you are selfish because you DO accommodate people.

(Of course this doesn't excuse them if they drop out or what-have-you.)

May I ask, sincerely, why you are on the forum devoting time to an ISTP's thought process when you feel injustice for having to learn and manage someone else's thought process at the sake of your own resources and coping mechanisms? And is this a coping mechanism, an outlet per se about the ISTP you like?

That's an example of how I think being stubborn and not willing to open up is selfish, especially because ENFPs are so open and willing to mend conflict.
Using someone is different than not opening up. You need to understand this, or you will not be able to tell between the two and will end up seriously hurt. Feel free to ask questions or ask me to tell examples from my personal life that demonstrate which I am doing with someone.

Does that behavior last, or is it just a front?
It's not a front. But the answer to does it last is tricking. Hot and cold usually comes into play at some point or another.

Well, what I mean by the whole mature thing is that ISTPs come across as already understanding and knowing what they want, and not finding anything alluring about enfps, while enfps are the exact opposite about them. For example, ENFPs fall into a relationship easily and willingly, and the ones that are sincere are always ready for something genuine. And it's like, with ISTPs. do you guys even look for that?

In retrospect, I'd say I do have my heart hidden under my sleeve, and it just seems unnatural to not. And, I'm always thinking about being in LOVE. UUUUGH.
I love how I can hear your speech pattern based on "And it's like, with ISTPs. do you guys even look for that?" The bolded is a fragment and not a sentence. It shouldn't have a period at the end. But I can tell that you would pause between ISTPs and do if you were talking face to face with me.

Also, the tags you are looking for are
and [ /QUOTE] (no spaces.)
goes at the start of the block of text, and the other tag goes at the end.
said:
(no spaces either) then their complete, correct username. When I say no spaces, I mean there are no spaces at all within a tag.

Mature doesn't equal independent. Do you have a Thinker parent, or a Thinker mentor?
 

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I've been thinking about this recently actually, because I know two people who are enfps, who really get on my nerves. I think, again, the reason why some enfps talk so much is because they want attention and want their perceptions to be valued. After I started using the advice on personalitypage.com for enfps "decide how you really feel about people, places, and things", I quieted down quite a bit, and am definitely more pointed in my behavior. Once I did this, that's when I started attracting ISTPs(2 guys and 2girls), I don't know if that's positively correlated, but my intuition tells me that's why my relationships with them are on an uphill. I don't talk that much.
You are correct.

In fact, once I stopped talking and being so preoccupied with getting attention as much as I used to, I started getting bored with trying to impress other people, and became interested in actually hearing what they were saying, found their jokes funnier than mine, and ..this is the good part, I started hanging out with my parents more... haha. But yeah, this "ISTP" guy that I'm into is super interesting, and we definitely have an equal exchange of word vomit in our discussions with each other, which also tends to be very creative. Anyways, as an ENFP, I also find some fellow enfps really fucking egotistical. However, I 'm not going to play it off and say that I'm more mature than them, I'm still super silly, and frivolous.
That's fantastic.
Equal exchange of word vomit, you say? That's a good sign.
 

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This is why I can't be with an ENFP.

ENFP: BLARGH! EMOTIONS EMOTIONS EMOTIONS FEELINGS!! 10 PAGES OF FEELINGS!! I FEEL THIS WAY ALWAYS AND FOREVER UNTIL YOU FIX IT!!!

ISTP: *thinks for 3 days* Ok, i thought about it, here's what I think

ENFP: Oh I'm fine now. I was just in a mood and needed to vent.
 

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It's just a subconscious strategy they use to reveal our true thoughts and feelings.
I wouldn't get too flustered over it.
 

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It's just a subconscious strategy they use to reveal our true thoughts and feelings.
I wouldn't get too flustered over it.
Flustered? No. Irritated that I wasted my time? Yes.
 
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