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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Except my new and shiny things aren't that shiny. They tend to be something new about mundane, repetitive tasks. But what I find strange is once I notice something new, these new things really stick with me.

One recent example was about bed sheets. I read an instruction on How To Make a Hospital Corner. Someone had shared it on FB and commented that that is the only way to do it. I thought that was ridiculous, I just tuck the sheet under the matress and get on with my life. I'd never bother to do it so neatly, I thought, must be a neurotic perfectionist invention (just look at the flowery sheets). Someone can't sleep unless the sheets are absolutely perfect. If I ever pay that much attention to the sheets, I've definitely gone crazy.

I thought about this for a few days, and then the next time I changed the sheets, I tried the Hospital Corner thing. I didn't remember what it was called and had to spend some time finding the instructions. I even watched an instructional video. I haven't been able to go back to simple tucking since then. Hospital Corners are here for good.

Another example goes way back to when I was working in a assembly line. Very repetive, simple task. There were different posts, one was packing. Grab a card board with left hand, turn it 90 degrees, open it with right hand, press down, grab items, fill the box, close it, push it back into the line and so on. Very fast work and not much time to think about what you are doing. I'd been initially shown one way of doing it and thought I'd learned to do it pretty smoothly.

One day I saw another worker grab the card board box a bit differently and turn it in different direction. I thought that seems unnecessarily complicated, probably not a good way of doing that since everyone else uses a different way At first I was a bit amused that I would pay attention to such a detail. I tried to forget about it. But everytime I saw that person do it, I was intrigued. How is it different, more or less moves. I had to try it to see if the new way was better, maybe a bit more ergonomic or slightly faster. There was actually even a slight risk involved, if I didn't get it right, I'd loose time and the items might pile up on the line and I'd be in trouble trying to clear them. I really couldn't figure out if it was better, but I still could not go back to the old way once I had tried the new way.

Usually I'm first amused by something like this, "why would anyone bother", then I think about it, eventually try it, and then I'm stuck with it forever. It's about finding something to improve or at least a room for a change in a surprising situation and, of course, having a system. I still don't care much about the sheets, I don't iron them or anything, but I need to make the Hospital Corners.

Does this happen to anyone else, or do your new and shiny distracting things lose their charm quickly?
 

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This stereotype is due to ENTPs being misdiagnosed with ADD/ADHD/whateveritisindsm5, and people with ADD/skjnfeker/NKJWEEFNKRE being misdiagnosed with ENTP.

As such I am insulted by teh shiny and demand recompense, most likely the shiny.
The pretty. pretty. shiny. shiny.

But seriously, tedious stuff requires a lot of will for me to power through, and I am not going to put myself through that if I don't have to.
And I am very convincing to everything, even myself.

Hey.
Some people think I'm a guy on the internet.

But I'm really.




AN OCTOPUS.
Fell for it for a split second didn't you?
 

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I was into new and shiny things when my Ne was still running wild and there was little to no Ti to speak of. With the development of Ti, I stopped appreciating things for how new and shiny they are, and started appreciating them for how much practical use I have for them.
 
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... tried tucking my sheets before. I couldn't get over the tedium and I leave them untucked, much like my button up shirts when I choose to wear them. On a repetitive note I trained to be a concert pianist which is repetition, repetition and more repetition. However each itteration of the same passage can be creative such that I can solve a technical problem to play it with more efficiency, an interpretive problem which opens up more greater possibilities for sound and once I get comfortable with the elements on the piece, the improvisatory problem because I don't like variety in my playing.

That said my challenge is the Liszt Sonata which is, by definition, a demanding work that requires some work in order to learn the notes and become technically comfortable with actually playing it. I am aware of what I am doing, I am thinking about improving control with what it is I am doing BUT I do confess to listening to lectures and audiobooks while doing pianistic hack work. Of course I'm on my electric with the volume set to a minimum so that I could hear what it is I'm doing in the background and not go completely deaf from bashing at the keys to aggressively. I like this set up much better than the grands we had in university; the volume was overwhelming.

... in the end it becomes a balance: innovation WITHIN repetition. If you think about it enough, life is repetition but it's what you do within a repetitive medium that matters. If you ever study mathematics and the philosophy of behind mathematics you'll find that behind the most rigorous system is the greatest freedom in its interpretation by virtue of ambiguity and in application and adaptation to evolve new ideas and new systems. Even in legislature and policy: if you want a constitution that maximizes personal expression and freedom of thought you want strict, rigorous definitions that will protect these freedoms and not give way to structural and moral relativism so that freedom becomes the freedom to imprison me physically or with pointless, irrational dogma regardless of ideology.

... that said, I am interested in things that are interesting -- love the truism. Some have been around since forever like the Homeric epics. Others are novel like a Russian information technologist getting a head/body transplant. What is important is that is it compelling and fascinating. And when something has longevity it remains so.
 
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I was into new and shiny things when my Ne was still running wild and there was little to no Ti to speak of. With the development of Ti, I stopped appreciating things for how new and shiny they are, and started appreciating them for how much practical use I have for them.
Would you say that in these boring tasks Ti is not involved and Ne clings to what ever it can grab?

The Hospital Corner thing is very practical though. The sheet stays glued to the matress. It's awesome. It's just that with many things I'm able to ignore the proper way of doing it - I'll just reason that the shitty way will do just fine even if it is so bad that it causes me more work in the future. But then there are these things that I can not not do. Like the sheets, I did not use to like changing the sheets. Now I kind of do, it's satisfactory to know that if I do it like this, it is going to be perfect. (Of course I don't do it perfect perfect, I do it as perfect as possible with minimum effort.) Still, just a little bit of effort and who ever sees it will go "oh my god how does this bed look so amazing, it's just like in five star hotels, I wish I had this kind of super power" (unfortunately so far no one has noticed). So yeah, very pompous.

Maybe it's that I think I should have thought of this improvement myself. And it probably only catches on if I think that not a lot of other people know it, so others will keep doing things the way I used to, but I'll be triumphant without much extra effort with this newly found knowledge of the ultimate way.

One other example that comes to mind is clipping the nails of a dog. The usual way of doing it is cutting one straight line. It leaves the nail too long or often leads to cutting into the quick. The ultimate way is to trim the nail all around, slicing little thin pieces off and getting as close to the quick as possible. Way better results and way more exciting.

I never did quite get the "distracted by new and shiny things" either, but maybe this is it for me.
 

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I do notice things like someone doing something I do differently, but it's just an observation, I don obsess over it, especially if it's a mundane task.

I used to do this OCD thing "my sheets have to be perfect or I can't sleep." I don't really do it anymore.

Now I might go and buy new sheets, even expensive ones, just because I like them or just because I'm bored with the old ones. I like change and I like pretty shiny objects. I'm such a pack rat, I collect completely useless things just because they're pretty. You should see my apartment. :p
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
... in the end it becomes a balance: innovation WITHIN repetition. If you think about it enough, life is repetition but it's what you do within a repetitive medium that matters.
Yes, agreed. I'm usually looking for the optimal, most cost effective way of doing unsatisfactory things. Sometimes I go beyond minimal effort if I see the end result has some value, like in social context. It depends on my motivation.

Unfortunately I don't have much to say to your beautiful text about sonatas and at the moment not much about metamathematics either, the sheet system and dog nails probably tell what my life revolves around at the moment. (I must say I should be helping with a maths thesis about cryptology, though, instead of drinking coffee and reading PerC, but the thesis person is taking a nap in our bed with hospital corners.)
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I do notice things like someone doing something I do differently, but it's just an observation, I don obsess over it, especially if it's a mundane task.

I used to do this OCD thing "my sheets have to be perfect or I can't sleep." I don't really do it anymore.

Now I might go and buy new sheets, even expensive ones, just because I like them or just because I'm bored with the old ones. I like change and I like pretty shiny objects. I'm such a pack rat, I collect completely useless things just because they're pretty. You should see my apartment. :p
About buying sheets, I've also learned a new word percale. I'm trying to not buy (adult) sheets until I can find affordable percale with high thread count. Another example of pompousness. I would go out and buy things more just because they are pretty if I had the means, but at the moment I'm pretty good at not buying anything.
 

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I only buy things for myself that are useful.

Sometimes I don't use them.
 
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I only buy things for myself that are useful.

Sometimes I don't use them.
I only buy exciting things :D.
Cars, clothes, books, Hitec, everything must be exciting. If it's not shniy or exciting I do not use it.
I've got a dozen of old camera (that I use sometime, depending of my mood), I change my phone every 6 months, I can't stand seing everytime the same object, may be I should use 3 or 4 differents and change them in order to limit these expensive and useless buy, I struggle with myself not buying every exciting things the indusry provide us. It's an everyday battle. Sometime I loose. And my ESTP closest friend laught at me :D.

But, stickingback to the originalpost and the hospital corner, I'll probablynever do a thing like that. Making a bed for me consist inthrowing the duvet above the bed and hoping it fall flat. If not, restart.

I often say to friends who can't understand me (and they are a lot) that 'the superfluous is luxuary, it's essential'. Life is not reasonable thing nor 'something practical', it must be exciting :).
 

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I only buy things for myself that are useful.

Sometimes I don't use them.
agreed

lol to me shiny new things refer to some topic of interest or challenge, not actual physical stuff. I detest shopping for clothes, or anything. I've been owed a phone update for over a year and haven't bothered getting a new phone cause fuck I don't care enough about that to waste the time it would take to go to the store to get a new phone, ain't nobody got time for that, I struggle to have clean laundry. I don't care about having physical stuff unless it's to accomplish some goal/interest.


I can be very obsessive about stuff when I get really into it. But if I don't find it interesting it can be tortuous. and I don't give 2 fucks about most things people care about and want you to do. The things I'll obsess over are things like playing guitar, which then turn into playing bass, into trying drums, then back to guitar, playing in a heavy metal band, then a pop cover band, then trying to make electronic music, trying to relearn violin etc.. learning about economics, which then turns into learning about political science, psychology, comparative religions, etc. I'll just go through phases were I spend a lot of time focusing on different things and it will sometimes gradually or abruptly be interrupted by learning about something else (the new shiny).

Ohmygod there's this commercial they keep showing on youtube with this douche bag bragging about owning a ferrari and a lot of books I want to smash his face in every time they try to make me watch it, I don't understand what they're trying to sell but some advertising agencies are idiots. I mean aight if you like that stuff, but fuck you for trying to force me to listen to you talk about how materialistic you are over and over anytime I want to watch something on youtube. god I hate commercials.
 

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One finds repetitive tasks of any sort unbearable; sleeps only when extremely tired. Routine is basically the reason the military was never a real option. That has nothing to do with 'new and shiny things', I'm basically an antiquary; cherish typewriters, straight razors, candlestick phones, the old wireless, though not too excited about electricity really... no telly, used Nokia 3310 until recently & considering doing away with the mobile-phone altogether. Even considered exclusively communicating by letter-writing, or using a goose-feather & ink. A definite preference for fountain pens. Tobacco - cigarette holders, cigarette cases, snuff-boxes. Zippo lighters & matches, considered switching to spill vases. Working on replacing my spectacles with pince-nez and acquiring a monocle. Forced to use an umbrella in place of a cane in everyday life. Lost my pocket watch last autumn, though it survived a mugging despite having started the whole thing (irrelevant). Naturally, never appear anywhere (public/private, not even when alone, sex and having a bath are the only exceptions really) in a state of undress of whatever extent (well, one does take the shoes off for sleeping sometimes).
 

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I only buy exciting things :D.
Cars, clothes, books, Hitec, everything must be exciting. If it's not shniy or exciting I do not use it.
I've got a dozen of old camera (that I use sometime, depending of my mood), I change my phone every 6 months, I can't stand seing everytime the same object, may be I should use 3 or 4 differents and change them in order to limit these expensive and useless buy, I struggle with myself not buying every exciting things the indusry provide us. It's an everyday battle. Sometime I loose. And my ESTP closest friend laught at me :D.

But, stickingback to the originalpost and the hospital corner, I'll probablynever do a thing like that. Making a bed for me consist inthrowing the duvet above the bed and hoping it fall flat. If not, restart.

I often say to friends who can't understand me (and they are a lot) that 'the superfluous is luxuary, it's essential'. Life is not reasonable thing nor 'something practical', it must be exciting :).
Ha, sounds pretty materialistic. No judgement though. Maybe what you like about all those nice things is the experience they give you? Maybe not. But that's what kind of "shiny things" I like. Something that is an experience, or used to facilitate or improve experiences.

Would you say that in these boring tasks Ti is not involved and Ne clings to what ever it can grab?
Yeah, well said, I think. When our options are limited, we can find stimulating things, or create them, within a "boring" environment. Sometimes. I've taken a LOT of really cool photos of shit just lying around my apartment when I was snowed in a couple times.


My problem, I think, is that my Ne tends to make everything shiny and new :D
Good way to save some money :laughing:







Still not sure what this thread is, as the title and the post description seem different.


BUT an example:


I paid a pretty penny for this, arrived yesterday, but after MUCH research, I HAD to have it. Plus my diving buddy had the same one, so I got to see it in action.

I only drop money on high priced things of QUALITY and this puppy is built to last. Lifetime warranty. I love gadgets, even better when they're bomb proof.















and no ^^^^ that's not me : (



I bought this mainly for scuba diving and pulitzer prize winning selfies. Now before I bought it or even knew they existed, I needed a hand held grip mount for my GoPro but didn't see any to my liking on Amazon.com. I made my own. Don't laugh, it's totally ghetto.........ok you can laugh, but it would absolutely work for scuba diving (though didn't get to try it yet) though missing the pole extension ability.



















I didn't give a flying crap that it looked like a turd, ha, and made from an old paint brush handle I sanded, sticky mount, zip ties, and paracord lanyard. It was/is functional and cheap.


Think I've got some ISTP blood in me.
 

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About buying sheets, I've also learned a new word percale. I'm trying to not buy (adult) sheets until I can find affordable percale with high thread count. Another example of pompousness. I would go out and buy things more just because they are pretty if I had the means, but at the moment I'm pretty good at not buying anything.
A sheets snob gaah!! :p

I like this percale though..

I can hardly buy all that shiny stuff that's why I've got a huge list of shinny things I want to buy/built one day (percale now included).
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 · (Edited)
I don't know what this thread was about either, but if I elaborate the topic based on these responses, this could be about how shininess and newness are very much subjective. Old stuff can be the shinynew, if it feels special somehow. A thing can be an idea instead of a physical object.

On physical things: I probably would slightly suffer if I would have to pick mediocre things. I don't mean that my things need to be the best or the most expensive, they most often are not. But if there is a choice, I usually feel drawn to things that have a little bit something extra. I don't think I would ever decide to go and buy a Golden Retriever. I do think this is a form of snobbism, but at the same time I don't really want other people to notice that I'm doing this. I don't want anyone to think that I'm high maintenance or that I'm despising usual stuff, and I really don't want to compete with anyone. I still don't think I'm a materialist, it's not about gathering expensive items and I can often switch focus so that I find value (aesthetic, functional, economical, egological, memorial...) in things that may not have been my favorite to begin with. Often I prefer happenstance instead of actively choosing things.

And if I do hand pick something, I'm usually happy forever with it. 10 years ago I bought a KitchenAid Classic Can Opener. It wasn't terribly expensive, I'm pretty sure it is not the best can opener in the market, but at the time it did feel like a bit of luxury. I still think it's a beautiful specimen of a tool that makes me happy everytime I use it (yes, it's black, rather big and has an oversized knob). Also it has a lifetime warranty, not that I would ever actually bother with such, but still that to me adds value since now I feel like this black can opener will stay with me and keep opening cans until I die (probably the same as johnnyyukon and his big, black selfie stick). Another can opener that I have is a grey Maus, it's for the times when I don't feel like reaching for the massive KitchenAid opener. Maus makes me happy too. If for some reason I was forced to let these two go and replace them with an electric can opener, I would be miserable and forever resent the electric opener.
 

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Yes, agreed. I'm usually looking for the optimal, most cost effective way of doing unsatisfactory things. Sometimes I go beyond minimal effort if I see the end result has some value, like in social context. It depends on my motivation.

Unfortunately I don't have much to say to your beautiful text about sonatas and at the moment not much about metamathematics either, the sheet system and dog nails probably tell what my life revolves around at the moment. (I must say I should be helping with a maths thesis about cryptology, though, instead of drinking coffee and reading PerC, but the thesis person is taking a nap in our bed with hospital corners.)
... nothing wrong with drinking coffee and reading PerC. Do that all the time. At least the coffee part. Speaking of which I was bored the other night (a few weeks ago) and tried to construct the Starbucks theorem. Meaning the time interval at which you walk past a busy coffee shop that will maximize your likelihood of finding a table. That said: I'm not a mathematician but I did take calculus and linear algebra for laughs in high school. Cryptology is a little to hardcore for what I can do but it's still wonderfully interesting.

And don't fret, my life isn't very exciting at this moment. I feel that practicing, teaching and reading books consume most of my time but it's something I enjoy presently. I do have to remind myself to have a social life at times. Tonight it's black tar and Gutenberg. Or coffee and reading. So what was this thread about again? :)

... edit. Oh man, I used to buy a lot of cool, random shit too until I realized I could work less, travel light and have all the time to do everything I'm interested in.
 
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Hey! I caught myself using Si Hurrayyy!!!

When I was a shiny young ENTP, new and shiny things could easily become a source of motivation for me to use my skills, as if I would challenged myself for that reward.

I remembered that the first thing that made me excellent in school was my dad (prolly an ENTJ) telling me that he would buy the pair of Nike I wanted if I was good at school... With a 97/100 score, 1st of the class, I eventually went in a shop with my dad and bought new and shiny pair of shoes. (apparently the most expensive, but I was too young to pay attention to this, and I felt entitled anyway).
 

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I don't really think much about new and pretty shinies, but sometimes I just try them out just for the sake of them being new and shiny.
It's very hit and miss however; if I like it, I'll continue to have interest in it, if not I'll probably forget all about it within an hour
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
I don't remember what I wrote here earlier, but I'm thinking now some of these "new tricks", that I've seen or heard other people use, stick with me because my "sensory abilities" are so weak I just can't tell if those things really are awesome, neutral or even counterproductive. And often the explanation of why something supposedly works, is vague. And because I don't know, it's difficult to let them go. Too much at stake, possibly a useful technique, opportunity to come up with a true explanation, opportunity to learn more about a person who uses the technique. But no matter how many times I repeat the procedure, I can't get a reliable end result because I forget. Most of these things are too insignificant to run standardized tests... (If something is truly amazing, i.e. adds significant value at low cost and works every time even when done sloppily, like the hospital corners, I stick with it - at least until I go back to not caring.)

Another one of these things came up. We use coffee filters that look like small pockets. I heard from a reliable source, that you always fold the seams of the pocket in opposite directions before placing the filter in the coffee machine. If you don't do the folding, the coffee will not brew as nicely and uniformely as it should. Needless to say I always just jam the filter in there somehow. Another new thing from the same source was that some people even rinse the filter with cold water to get small dust particles off. I was like "pffft, no one does that".

It took me a few weeks, but eventually I had to try. And the coffee did taste good. Maybe it was the folding, maybe it was the rinsing, maybe I happened to have freshly ground coffee or a different label. Or just the right ratio of coffee to water, or just the right ratio of milk to sugar to coffee. Or maybe it was that I actually drank the coffee this time before it got cold. Or maybe the coffee was just the same as before, but I just thought I noticed a difference. Anyhow, now I am folding and rinsing the filter. If I am planning on just jamming the filter in there, my brain goes "but you know it would just take a few seconds to do it properly..." and then "you know, now that you have folded it, it wouldn't be much more of an effort to rinse it..." So I fold and rinse. Pffft.
 
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