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ENTP or ENFP?

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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
This is a repost from my intro, as I now realize there is a category for this. Silly me.

Hi, I'm new to the forum, but thanks for my impulsive need to know everything I can find about interesting topics, I've educated myself well enough to know the words and terms used here at least somewhat competently. I have a very hard time truly distinguishing which I associate with more. I truly do care about what other people have to say, and am not completely inept at caring for others, as I've heard ENTP's are, and although in the past, I've been called insensitive, I recently had a bit of an open your eyes moment when I realized I had been a special sort of jerk only for me and my care for things I have great disdain for, such as things I find both theoretically and practically useless, such as being endlessly bored in school by being taught things I already have a full understanding of and then being asked to think about such things, even though like a true prospective, have already to some extent over-thought and come to a mental conclusion about. I have a massively low tolerance for boredom, monotony, ignorance, strict rules, dogma, and the like. Though when I read about what an entp is, it seems like the entirety of their charisma is a facade or guise, used to its own end, and as I said before, any level of genuineness seems synthesized.
Until recently, I would have agreed to that with myself. Fair warning, this is probably terribly paced, but you've put up with me this long, hopefully you don't leave yet! I got more sick and tired of the status quo than I already was, which I didn't believe was possible, and decided to switch to an alternative school who's philosophy wasn't lacking in appreciation for the individualist or visionary, so I put my mind at ease knowing that the solution to my problems at the time, was time to settle in and relax. I got even more spontaneous than I already was, and slowly lost interest in actually pursuing a career in science, specifically physics, simply because I believed, in the grand scheme of things, how does that change anything if people still cannot agree to not shoot each other over having a different religion. Won't do us any good knowing how to get to a new planet if we still choose to pollute it and kill each other over such inane things. I still like science, because I agree with the philosophy that knowledge is power, and if I know of something I do not fully understand, I immediately put in the effort to change that.

Around this time is when I found myself intrigued by a particular emotional movement online, although I'm probably the only one to call it that, most others are in it for the escapism thanks to the world being a pretty bad place at times. I won't mention details simply because one, its arbitrary to the point here, as is probably much of this, and two, it's mere mention attracts blind hate from the ignorant, or semi ignorant, and I want none of that. Suffice it to say, the philosophy I take out of it is that mutual understanding and cooperation are desperately needed if the status quo will ever improve. Simply questioning it only makes it stronger if nothing is done afterwards. And our world sorely lacks optimism, or as I call it, the realist belief that an optimistic attitude is more effective in nearly anything than a pessimistic one. Anyway, this realization, coupled with me dropping adhd treating stimulants, made me competent for the first time as an F in general, although I have always been an intellectual and academic, loving the sheer usefulness of things like mathematics and science.

So to finally get back to the point, I now, a few months later, have this charisma I never had to work for, because when I was younger, far more introverted and self conscious, and filled with disdain for those "below" me, because I was "smarter" (I wasn't wrong, I'm smarter than 95% of the world population, but that's beside the point, as such an attitude can only breed bad things), I hadn't realized for a very long time that it wasn't only me that thought the way I did, probably because both my parents are ESFJ's, and I had always been told to do the right thing, and me always thinking that not doing what i'm told is inherently wrong could only be absurd, things like this probably served to make me a very cynical person, at least until now.

But, here's my issue, I cannot tell which of those is truly the dominant one, as I am sometimes absolutely brilliant when it comes to what I think about, and sometimes its just me losing myself in my new distraction of the hour. I do truly care about what others have to think and say, and how they feel, but I'm definitely a firm believer in if the end justifies the means, and care more about if the overall goal succeeds, as long as it's a good one, than if anyone is upset in the process. On that note however, I do love having mental debates for fun, but if its possible, I'd like to spare someone's feelings if nothing is inherently lost in the process, and I like making people smile and laugh, and be happy in general. I'm sad when others are sad, that kind of thing. I have fantastic empathy, but my sympathy at times is lacking.

Despite this however, I don't really use one over the other on a day to day basis, I really truly cannot say that I prefer one to the other, and I believe it works best when they're used simultaneously, where one thinks about something from an objective point of view, and also considers the emotional affect one's actions and thoughts have. I believe in logical thinking completely. So to all you veterans of typing, hopefully its painfully obvious with all these walls of text which type I really am. And if the tests got it wrong, and I'm something else entirely, I'd be elated if you'd point it out. I'm trying to use the feedback I get to get an idea of what kinds of professions I'd be able to tolerate as an adult, as it's no longer a question of can I excel and succeed at this as it is, will this lead me on a path where I can accomplish the goals I have and have a positive effect on the terrible state the world is in emotionally right now, relative to the rest of history. Thanks in advance for your help.

If there's anything that I should provide feedback on so you can attempt to type me, do ask, although i'd be surprised based on how much text there is here...
 

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Birdie Borracho
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@Pinina oh you ESTJ you haha. Always having to systemize everything to make it more efficient. I must admit, though, this is a difficult read, but I believe his type is revealed in there. You'd have to put your tertiary Ne into overdrive to grind it out. Of course, I'd have difficulty organizing these thoughts, which is why I love the ESTJ implementation experts in my life haha.
@the_Doc my guess is ENTP, and I'm fairly confident. Nothing is guaranteed, of course, but your post suggested more Ne-Ti logic, as opposed to Ne-Fi logic. First things first, ENTPs can have emotions, and sometimes get swept up in them. This might not be me, but not all ENTPs are the same. Some are realists, while others are idealist; romantics and stoics; optimists and cynics. What makes an ENTP an ENTP is their strongest function is Ne and auxiliary function is Ti; simple as that. From there, we all interpret ourselves in our own way.

Here are the main lines that show off your ENTPness.
-I truly do care about what other people have to say, and am not completely inept at caring for others, as I've heard ENTP's are, and although in the past, I've been called insensitive, I recently had a bit of an open your eyes moment when I realized I had been a special sort of jerk only for me and my care for things I have great disdain for, such as things I find both theoretically and practically useless, such as being endlessly bored in school by being taught things I already have a full understanding of and then being asked to think about such things, even though like a true prospective, have already to some extent over-thought and come to a mental conclusion about.
That's a special kind of run-on that only Ne people can love haha. Sure, you are in-tune with your feelings, but I think that is just the root of Fe. That last part of that monstrosity of a sentence is typical ENTP, in school. We are constantly analyzing everything and we hate having to go over things which we've already considered.

-Until recently, I would have agreed to that with myself. Fair warning, this is probably terribly paced, but you've put up with me this long, hopefully you don't leave yet! I got more sick and tired of the status quo than I already was, which I didn't believe was possible, and decided to switch to an alternative school who's philosophy wasn't lacking in appreciation for the individualist or visionary, so I put my mind at ease knowing that the solution to my problems at the time, was time to settle in and relax.
It's subtle, but this part demonstrates Ne-Ti logic.

-Around this time is when I found myself intrigued by a particular emotional movement online, although I'm probably the only one to call it that, most others are in it for the escapism thanks to the world being a pretty bad place at times. I won't mention details simply because one, its arbitrary to the point here, as is probably much of this, and two, it's mere mention attracts blind hate from the ignorant, or semi ignorant, and I want none of that. Suffice it to say, the philosophy I take out of it is that mutual understanding and cooperation are desperately needed if the status quo will ever improve. Simply questioning it only makes it stronger if nothing is done afterwards. And our world sorely lacks optimism, or as I call it, the realist belief that an optimistic attitude is more effective in nearly anything than a pessimistic one. Anyway, this realization, coupled with me dropping adhd treating stimulants, made me competent for the first time as an F in general, although I have always been an intellectual and academic, loving the sheer usefulness of things like mathematics and science.
-I have fantastic empathy, but my sympathy at times is lacking.
Ok final assessment, you have the typical young ENTP over-compensating vibe. I've talked about it multiple other times, and don't take it too harshly, as it's part of growing up. Basically you have probably have a low self-esteem, hence escapism. You know why you're unsure of T or F? Because you're full of shit. You know what real empathy is? I don't. personally, but I at least know sympathy is a part of it. Your "empathy" is you feeling good about yourself because you're playing that part for other people. It's called compensatory narcissism (PTypes - Compensatory Narcissistic Personality Disorder Criteria) and this post reeked of it, although in a way I had not seen, before. At your root, you really are an idealist, and that's great. You really do have genuine thoughts about how to make the world a better place and you really would like to see it become a reality. However, you're delusional in that you think you currently have something special to offer the world. Hate to break it to you, but you don't. Don't get me wrong, I agree with that philosophy, but I also recognize it's unrealistic.

The four letters indicates how a person is supposed to be cognitively balanced. Presently, you are not balanced, because you are unsure of where you fit in. Other people, who are also unbalanced, will say the four letters do not define who they are. Well they have special snowflake syndrome. Look, I'm an ENTP, too, I'm full of vibrant ideas. Hell, my IQ is in the top 98.5% which means I'm hypothetically brilliant. Realistically, I'm pretty useless unless I'm using my brain. A high IQ suggests you're capable of learning anything, quickly. I am, but I'm also mechanically challenged, I used to have awful tact, and I used to have trouble maintaining friendships. What is the value of being brilliant if you're fundamentally useless? I've come to realize that my smarts just makes me another person in the human race. Sure, I might be the brain, but would I say those hard-working ISTJ legs are useless. No, they take me where I want to go. We all need each other, collectively, but the world doesn't need you individually. It is a tough pill to swallow but acknowledging it has made my life better. Anyway, keep studying type and trying to discover yourself.
 
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@sah6635 yes, why use a less efficient way if there's a better one available? :tongue: Well, I really just wanted more so I wouldn't have to work in the frames of Ne-dom, just to make sure that he didn't mistype as an N because of the stereotypes, as an E because they are "social", etc. I usually want to be able to do the whole typing myself when I type people, that's all.

I did see some things that indicated ENTP, even though in whole, I got the impression of ENFP. Unfortunately, I can't say what made me think of ENFP... :frustrating:
(Nice signature btw!)
 
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Birdie Borracho
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@sah6635 yes, why use a less efficient way if there's a better one available? :tongue: Well, I really just wanted more so I wouldn't have to work in the frames of Ne-dom, just to make sure that he didn't mistype as an N because of the stereotypes, as an E because they are "social", etc. I usually want to be able to do the whole typing myself when I type people, that's all.

I did see some things that indicated ENTP, even though in whole, I got the impression of ENFP. Unfortunately, I can't say what made me think of ENFP... :frustrating:
(Nice signature btw!)
I believe ENTP his his type, but he's searching to lock in his Ti. Our friend here clearly grew up with a low self-esteem which is actually common for Ne doms. As a result, he started developing his Fe where he just wants others to treat people well and he likes being able to empathize. I know this from experience, which is how I can recognize it so easily. An ENFP in this situation, would be using Te to brag about how efficient they are, how they always act a certain way, and complaining that people should be acting a certain way. The ENTP reaching for Fe is talking about he wishes others would treat people better, how important connecting with others is, and how well he treats people. And even then, Pinina, it's still hazy.
@the_Doc I know I'm dissecting you like a frog in science class, but it's for your gain. When people aren't being "normal", it's usually a sign of a cognitive imbalance. Nobody is supposed to be wishy-washy between types. My step-dad is an ESTJ who has great intuition. However, his Si is stronger and his functions stack like cell-phone reception bars. Is the logical foundation of your thoughts more important than emotional stability of your feelings. The former is what defines a thinker. If you are a thinker, act like one. Here's a good example of an ENTP with solid Fe: Jon Stewart. He is definitely empathetic about the world. But at no point, do you see his Ti take the back seat to Fe. His Fe is genuine because his Ti is strong enough to define it that way. I don't agree with him, politically, but I respect him a lot. Your escapism is a fantasy. The real world sucks, I know. I log onto PerC because psychology is my favorite topic to discuss, and very view people can discuss it in real life, but it is just a hobby.

Penina, I do want to point out that I believe Thorin is an ENTJ haha. Thanks for noticing the signature. It's a way to say I'm objectively not important while still retaining some of my subjective identity. Like a worker bee who collects the pollin, but still ponders why God is killing off bees because gay people are getting married.
 
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Penina, I do want to point out that I believe Thorin is an ENTJ haha. Thanks for noticing the signature. It's a way to say I'm objectively not important while still retaining some of my subjective identity. Like a worker bee who collects the pollin, but still ponders why God is killing off bees because gay people are getting married.
Why do you think Thorin is an ENTJ? Maybe of topic, and we should take this somewhere else... Anyways..
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I believe ENTP his his type, but he's searching to lock in his Ti. Our friend here clearly grew up with a low self-esteem which is actually common for Ne doms. As a result, he started developing his Fe where he just wants others to treat people well and he likes being able to empathize. I know this from experience, which is how I can recognize it so easily. An ENFP in this situation, would be using Te to brag about how efficient they are, how they always act a certain way, and complaining that people should be acting a certain way. The ENTP reaching for Fe is talking about he wishes others would treat people better, how important connecting with others is, and how well he treats people. And even then, Pinina, it's still hazy.
@the_Doc I know I'm dissecting you like a frog in science class, but it's for your gain. When people aren't being "normal", it's usually a sign of a cognitive imbalance. Nobody is supposed to be wishy-washy between types. My step-dad is an ESTJ who has great intuition. However, his Si is stronger and his functions stack like cell-phone reception bars. Is the logical foundation of your thoughts more important than emotional stability of your feelings. The former is what defines a thinker. If you are a thinker, act like one. Here's a good example of an ENTP with solid Fe: Jon Stewart. He is definitely empathetic about the world. But at no point, do you see his Ti take the back seat to Fe. His Fe is genuine because his Ti is strong enough to define it that way. I don't agree with him, politically, but I respect him a lot. Your escapism is a fantasy. The real world sucks, I know. I log onto PerC because psychology is my favorite topic to discuss, and very view people can discuss it in real life, but it is just a hobby.

Penina, I do want to point out that I believe Thorin is an ENTJ haha. Thanks for noticing the signature. It's a way to say I'm objectively not important while still retaining some of my subjective identity. Like a worker bee who collects the pollin, but still ponders why God is killing off bees because gay people are getting married.
Haven't gotten to filling out that thing yet, I'll probably get to it tonight.
Thanks for your insight, it's greatly appreciated. I've seen online the supposed distinction between Te and Ti, could you possibly explain the difference in terms that someone like me who only barely understands that ENTP doesn't just mean your personality is a combination of those four traits? Thanks. Also, you say I had a low self esteem, which I did, but only when I was very young, because I wasn't aware of my own intelligence, I thought everyone else liked to spend time with each other, and I didn't, and that made me doubt my worth, but I presume that doesn't have anything to do with my idea that I have something unique to bring into the world? Just asking because those at first glance and when I think about them sort of sound contradictory, as one must think quite highly of themselves to believe that they can be better than others, but they're probably not.

I'd like to say that the reason I think that in the first place is that in recent years I've come up with some workable ideas for inventions that solve problems people probably think they won't live to see solved. One of them was a design for a fully functioning computerized suit that would make the wearer appear invisible, and unlike the ones seen on the news some months ago, it doesn't require the equivalent of a camera crew walking in front of you. I had others, but that's the one I think has the most promise as actually being workable. It's probably worth noting that although I've come up with the idea, the closest I've come to actually doing anything about it is speculating the cost of a prototype. I attribute that to my age, but somehow that feels like a lie. It feels like all the thoughts I think might be the most brilliant thoughts ever thought, but that's worth two in the bush when they are never realized. Start 100 things with the best intentions, finish 1 and its barely decent, it feels like this a lot. This ties into the fact that I'm at the age where my personality really isn't set in stone, but when I think about it, its important for things to be logically sound to me, very important, but it feels like its worth a whole lot more when they feel right as well. If you're familiar with the personality test on 16personalities.com, a lot of the questions ask something that obviously is trying to pinpoint whether you're a T or F, such as: "I care about other people, and expressing this makes me really happy." I don't dispute this, but that simultaneously doesn't mean I care about my emotions being sound over my thoughts' logicality, as you said.

That's the dilemma I'm trying to decide on, but you're on to something with the narcissism, I am probably a bit too critical on myself because of others, and due to that, I attempt to rectify that, until I tire of trying to find and/or execute my latest way to, and move on for a time, and repeat. A lot of my life so far can be summed up in that last sentence.

Also, I failed to mention that I am clinically hypomanic most of the time, and they end with bouts of anxiety, and then back to hypomania, no real depressive cycle, other than a greater than usual disdain for the things as you said, "having to go over things which we've already considered." to the point where no thought or feeling on earth can bring me to even try doing them. And it doesn't last as long as a typical depressive cycle, not nearly, nor does it actually replace the hypomania, it just makes it a bit more mild. So I guess that, which I'd call a form of bipolar. Another thing it might help to mention is I have some of the most minor of traits from aspergers, such as obsessiveness, and that's about it for that. I probably am also a bit uncertain of all of this because I'm also perseverating over what profession I want to pursue, because I have the talent for a lot of things, but my 3 concerns are will it be repetitive and cause the dilemma I currently have with some school subjects, will I make enough money so that at some point I'll have enough to implement some of my ideas, and will I truly love what I do? Two years ago and earlier I had always wanted to be a scientist, because of how my intelligence would have a direct benefit to the world, but more importantly, because I had always enjoyed science a great deal, and mathematics too, but to a slightly lesser extent. That almost flew out the window because I wasn't sure that I'd be the man I wanted to be by simply pursuing the biggest intellectual challenge I could think of, theoretical physicist. I thought figuring myself out might help me solve some problems I face, such as this one.

Also, I was thinking the other day, and it might help if I provided my own understanding of my personality. I'm either the guy who's having fun and enjoying your company if I think you're the kind of person I approve of, or the one who endlessly berates you with logical reasoning as to why you're meaningless tautology "it is what it is" of an answer can't hold any weight and only can be described as dogmatic and conformist. Because they always think that's a real reason. Clearly far more of the former happens than the latter. But enough of my rambling. I'm just trying to learn how to better be genuine, because I'm sure it shows as you said that probably 2 or so years ago I could care less about how others felt, and that's only a recent addition because of how I see the world to be currently. Before, I was as laughable as you can get when it came to being truly mature. I was probably the most negative realist at that point, and now I consider myself to have made a metaphorical "180" in this sense, where now not only am I, despite my uncertainty and confusion about my own future, I'm far happier and fun to be around when anxiety isn't a problem whereas 2 years ago I would have had no true fun and basically was the most uptight jerk you would have ever met, with the occasional crappy joke. I wasn't happy with anything but myself at the time, now it's a bit of the opposite, though I'm not what I'd call happy about myself, I'm really more uncertain than disappointing or anything, and I'm certainly seeing the world as something I can do something about than a sad reality, what that really means I'm not sure. Now I'm the guy telling jokes, making references, loving it when people smile and laugh back. I do enjoy this, but I suppose I'm still transitioning from who I used to be, and I'd say most of it is done, but there's still work to be done, finishing touches if you will. Oh, and as much as I might be a bit immature in that I'm not quite ready to be normal or whatever, I did smile at your signature. Hopefully all of this helps make this blurry picture a bit clearer.
 

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I'd go ENTP as well. Your judgement criteria are, while emotionally based, more concerned with what you find logical than valuable. What you seek out in life, being a scientist/inventor, seems to me to be more of a quest for meaning and competence than a passion, which is what you would expect an ENFP to start an education for.

Also, I imagine a hypomaniac ENFP would be quite histrionic as well. Do you have a big interest in people and being liked or thought well of?
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
To a point. I find it preferable to be liked, as I'd think most would, but when it comes down to it, I'd rather be disliked for being honest than lying to be liked. I also could care less if someone I generally do not like doesn't like me. While I'd rather everyone play nice, there comes a point where being liked isn't as important as accomplishing something. The bottom line usually doesn't matter though, I'm pretty good at getting people to play nice.
 

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Birdie Borracho
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Haven't gotten to filling out that thing yet, I'll probably get to it tonight.
Thanks for your insight, it's greatly appreciated. I've seen online the supposed distinction between Te and Ti, could you possibly explain the difference in terms that someone like me who only barely understands that ENTP doesn't just mean your personality is a combination of those four traits? Thanks. Also, you say I had a low self esteem, which I did, but only when I was very young, because I wasn't aware of my own intelligence, I thought everyone else liked to spend time with each other, and I didn't, and that made me doubt my worth, but I presume that doesn't have anything to do with my idea that I have something unique to bring into the world? Just asking because those at first glance and when I think about them sort of sound contradictory, as one must think quite highly of themselves to believe that they can be better than others, but they're probably not.

I'd like to say that the reason I think that in the first place is that in recent years I've come up with some workable ideas for inventions that solve problems people probably think they won't live to see solved. One of them was a design for a fully functioning computerized suit that would make the wearer appear invisible, and unlike the ones seen on the news some months ago, it doesn't require the equivalent of a camera crew walking in front of you. I had others, but that's the one I think has the most promise as actually being workable. It's probably worth noting that although I've come up with the idea, the closest I've come to actually doing anything about it is speculating the cost of a prototype. I attribute that to my age, but somehow that feels like a lie. It feels like all the thoughts I think might be the most brilliant thoughts ever thought, but that's worth two in the bush when they are never realized. Start 100 things with the best intentions, finish 1 and its barely decent, it feels like this a lot. This ties into the fact that I'm at the age where my personality really isn't set in stone, but when I think about it, its important for things to be logically sound to me, very important, but it feels like its worth a whole lot more when they feel right as well. If you're familiar with the personality test on 16personalities.com, a lot of the questions ask something that obviously is trying to pinpoint whether you're a T or F, such as: "I care about other people, and expressing this makes me really happy." I don't dispute this, but that simultaneously doesn't mean I care about my emotions being sound over my thoughts' logicality, as you said.

That's the dilemma I'm trying to decide on, but you're on to something with the narcissism, I am probably a bit too critical on myself because of others, and due to that, I attempt to rectify that, until I tire of trying to find and/or execute my latest way to, and move on for a time, and repeat. A lot of my life so far can be summed up in that last sentence.

Also, I failed to mention that I am clinically hypomanic most of the time, and they end with bouts of anxiety, and then back to hypomania, no real depressive cycle, other than a greater than usual disdain for the things as you said, "having to go over things which we've already considered." to the point where no thought or feeling on earth can bring me to even try doing them. And it doesn't last as long as a typical depressive cycle, not nearly, nor does it actually replace the hypomania, it just makes it a bit more mild. So I guess that, which I'd call a form of bipolar. Another thing it might help to mention is I have some of the most minor of traits from aspergers, such as obsessiveness, and that's about it for that. I probably am also a bit uncertain of all of this because I'm also perseverating over what profession I want to pursue, because I have the talent for a lot of things, but my 3 concerns are will it be repetitive and cause the dilemma I currently have with some school subjects, will I make enough money so that at some point I'll have enough to implement some of my ideas, and will I truly love what I do? Two years ago and earlier I had always wanted to be a scientist, because of how my intelligence would have a direct benefit to the world, but more importantly, because I had always enjoyed science a great deal, and mathematics too, but to a slightly lesser extent. That almost flew out the window because I wasn't sure that I'd be the man I wanted to be by simply pursuing the biggest intellectual challenge I could think of, theoretical physicist. I thought figuring myself out might help me solve some problems I face, such as this one.

Also, I was thinking the other day, and it might help if I provided my own understanding of my personality. I'm either the guy who's having fun and enjoying your company if I think you're the kind of person I approve of, or the one who endlessly berates you with logical reasoning as to why you're meaningless tautology "it is what it is" of an answer can't hold any weight and only can be described as dogmatic and conformist. Because they always think that's a real reason. Clearly far more of the former happens than the latter. But enough of my rambling. I'm just trying to learn how to better be genuine, because I'm sure it shows as you said that probably 2 or so years ago I could care less about how others felt, and that's only a recent addition because of how I see the world to be currently. Before, I was as laughable as you can get when it came to being truly mature. I was probably the most negative realist at that point, and now I consider myself to have made a metaphorical "180" in this sense, where now not only am I, despite my uncertainty and confusion about my own future, I'm far happier and fun to be around when anxiety isn't a problem whereas 2 years ago I would have had no true fun and basically was the most uptight jerk you would have ever met, with the occasional crappy joke. I wasn't happy with anything but myself at the time, now it's a bit of the opposite, though I'm not what I'd call happy about myself, I'm really more uncertain than disappointing or anything, and I'm certainly seeing the world as something I can do something about than a sad reality, what that really means I'm not sure. Now I'm the guy telling jokes, making references, loving it when people smile and laugh back. I do enjoy this, but I suppose I'm still transitioning from who I used to be, and I'd say most of it is done, but there's still work to be done, finishing touches if you will. Oh, and as much as I might be a bit immature in that I'm not quite ready to be normal or whatever, I did smile at your signature. Hopefully all of this helps make this blurry picture a bit clearer.
What all would you like me to explain? I'm drunk so I'll forget about this thread tomorrow. But recap, for me, and I'kk get to it tomorrowa
 

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I'm drunk so I'll forget about this thread tomorrow. But recap, for me, and I'kk get to it tomorrowa
It's like you are really your avatar :p

@the_Doc I'll go with ENTP for you. In recent years I've been growing my Fe and moving out of asshat teenagehood I had, and that made me think that I could be a ENFP too. Fillinf one of 4 questionnaires that we have here can't hurt either. Just try to provide motivations and process you used to arrive to the answer.

Calling ENFP @TelepathicGoose You see some Fi-Te?

Also Thorin seems like ESTJ fruit to me.
 
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Birdie Borracho
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@the_Doc Te subjectively values objective rationale while Ti objectively values subjective rationale. Why Te is Inductive and Ti is Deductive | CelebrityTypes I like this website, because it always does a great job explaining.

-Also, you say I had a low self esteem, which I did, but only when I was very young, because I wasn't aware of my own intelligence, I thought everyone else liked to spend time with each other, and I didn't, and that made me doubt my worth, but I presume that doesn't have anything to do with my idea that I have something unique to bring into the world?
-I'd like to say that the reason I think that in the first place is that in recent years I've come up with some workable ideas for inventions that solve problems people probably think they won't live to see solved.
-That's the dilemma I'm trying to decide on, but you're on to something with the narcissism, I am probably a bit too critical on myself because of others, and due to that, I attempt to rectify that, until I tire of trying to find and/or execute my latest way to, and move on for a time, and repeat. A lot of my life so far can be summed up in that last sentence.
I understand this sentiment and I can relate to it, as well. However, the quote in my signature sums it up. It doesn't mean I don't have high intelligence, but it doesn't matter if we do. The inventions you described might be great ideas, but what worth do you offer if they never manifest? If they ever come about, do it because you're a part of the solution, not because you need validation.

Also, I failed to mention that I am clinically hypomanic most of the time, and they end with bouts of anxiety, and then back to hypomania, no real depressive cycle, other than a greater than usual disdain for the things as you said, "having to go over things which we've already considered." to the point where no thought or feeling on earth can bring me to even try doing them. And it doesn't last as long as a typical depressive cycle, not nearly, nor does it actually replace the hypomania, it just makes it a bit more mild. So I guess that, which I'd call a form of bipolar. Another thing it might help to mention is I have some of the most minor of traits from aspergers, such as obsessiveness, and that's about it for that. I probably am also a bit uncertain of all of this because I'm also perseverating over what profession I want to pursue, because I have the talent for a lot of things, but my 3 concerns are will it be repetitive and cause the dilemma I currently have with some school subjects, will I make enough money so that at some point I'll have enough to implement some of my ideas, and will I truly love what I do? Two years ago and earlier I had always wanted to be a scientist, because of how my intelligence would have a direct benefit to the world, but more importantly, because I had always enjoyed science a great deal, and mathematics too, but to a slightly lesser extent. That almost flew out the window because I wasn't sure that I'd be the man I wanted to be by simply pursuing the biggest intellectual challenge I could think of, theoretical physicist. I thought figuring myself out might help me solve some problems I face, such as this one.
Your case makes it sound like I'm talking to myself haha. I, too, am hypomaniac bi-polar with traits of aspergers. Hell, I'd say I'm really just a clueless psychopath. The point is that we are unique in category, but not unique in originality. When I decided that all I want in life is to take care of myself without bothering others, my goals became much easier and attainable. I don't worry about proving my uniqueness, because I'm already way too damn unique.

Also, I was thinking the other day, and it might help if I provided my own understanding of my personality. I'm either the guy who's having fun and enjoying your company if I think you're the kind of person I approve of, or the one who endlessly berates you with logical reasoning as to why you're meaningless tautology "it is what it is" of an answer can't hold any weight and only can be described as dogmatic and conformist. Because they always think that's a real reason. Clearly far more of the former happens than the latter. But enough of my rambling. I'm just trying to learn how to better be genuine, because I'm sure it shows as you said that probably 2 or so years ago I could care less about how others felt, and that's only a recent addition because of how I see the world to be currently. Before, I was as laughable as you can get when it came to being truly mature. I was probably the most negative realist at that point, and now I consider myself to have made a metaphorical "180" in this sense, where now not only am I, despite my uncertainty and confusion about my own future, I'm far happier and fun to be around when anxiety isn't a problem whereas 2 years ago I would have had no true fun and basically was the most uptight jerk you would have ever met, with the occasional crappy joke. I wasn't happy with anything but myself at the time, now it's a bit of the opposite, though I'm not what I'd call happy about myself, I'm really more uncertain than disappointing or anything, and I'm certainly seeing the world as something I can do something about than a sad reality, what that really means I'm not sure. Now I'm the guy telling jokes, making references, loving it when people smile and laugh back. I do enjoy this, but I suppose I'm still transitioning from who I used to be, and I'd say most of it is done, but there's still work to be done, finishing touches if you will. Oh, and as much as I might be a bit immature in that I'm not quite ready to be normal or whatever, I did smile at your signature. Hopefully all of this helps make this blurry picture a bit clearer.
Once again, that is me 5 years ago. Like an older gay guy to a younger gay guy "It get's better." Haha. I too strive to be genuine and like I said, earlier, I show that by always trying to take care of myself with burdening others. When you are independent of others, you are also independent of their judgment. Someone could call me a piece of shit or say I'm a great person. Either, way, I am not bound by what they say which allows me to be genuine. I have a great circle of friends, and they know my role is to be the guy that can say things nobody else can get away with. I'm not saying I make fun of people just to be a dick. But if a guy, for example, has a shitty girlfriend, or is being shitty to her, I have no qualms of telling that to their face. I take pleasure in their discomfort but I also know it has a purpose. That type of role might not be you, but it's good to carve out your own niche.
 
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
http://www.typologycentral.com/forums/the-nf-idyllic/59601-difference-ne-fi-enfp-ne-t

I stumbled across this(link in title, stupid post threshold is counterproductive here.), and it answered my questions about the difference between the thinking and feeling that are mutually exclusive to both types, and according to it, I'd agree I'm an ENTP, with the occasional "flare up" of someone's terrible actions making my less noticeable but present Fi show itself. Can anyone recommend any good books for being successful in the area of playing this to my strengths? I suffer quite a bit from the downfalls of the "visionary", like never finishing anything, and thinking too much and doing too little or not actually coming up with a plan when a plan is obviously preferable to improvising. Thanks for all your help everyone!
 

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@the_Doc Te subjectively values objective rationale while Ti objectively values subjective rationale. Had to take out the link.


I understand this sentiment and I can relate to it, as well. However, the quote in my signature sums it up. It doesn't mean I don't have high intelligence, but it doesn't matter if we do. The inventions you described might be great ideas, but what worth do you offer if they never manifest? If they ever come about, do it because you're a part of the solution, not because you need validation.



Your case makes it sound like I'm talking to myself haha. I, too, am hypomaniac bi-polar with traits of aspergers. Hell, I'd say I'm really just a clueless psychopath. The point is that we are unique in category, but not unique in originality. When I decided that all I want in life is to take care of myself without bothering others, my goals became much easier and attainable. I don't worry about proving my uniqueness, because I'm already way too damn unique.



Once again, that is me 5 years ago. Like an older gay guy to a younger gay guy "It get's better." Haha. I too strive to be genuine and like I said, earlier, I show that by always trying to take care of myself with burdening others. When you are independent of others, you are also independent of their judgment. Someone could call me a piece of shit or say I'm a great person. Either, way, I am not bound by what they say which allows me to be genuine. I have a great circle of friends, and they know my role is to be the guy that can say things nobody else can get away with. I'm not saying I make fun of people just to be a dick. But if a guy, for example, has a shitty girlfriend, or is being shitty to her, I have no qualms of telling that to their face. I take pleasure in their discomfort but I also know it has a purpose. That type of role might not be you, but it's good to carve out your own niche.
I don't know either, really the only reason I feel like I have to step up and help using my position in life is because despite me being an E, I'm constantly introspecting if I'm not talking, and every time I revisit the issue that if no one does step up willingly, regardless of whether my endeavor bears any real fruit, the only way change can be brought on a large scale is by dumb luck. I've checked and re-checked that theory in my head hundreds of times, and I can't see it any other way. Looking back in history doesn't help either. Maybe I need to "grow up", or maybe I'm mature enough to choose to question this with zeal, I really don't know. I can agree, I highly value those times you choose to say something like it is, and open someone's eyes, because usually they're not even aware they're doing whatever silly thing they're doing. Maybe that's what I'm trying to do, find my niche, because to me, I could be a lot of things, rocket science is just another thing to me, probably to a lot of us, not something we can be sure that we'll never be able to even attempt. Maybe I'm still looking for what I truly do love. It's hard to tell sometimes if you're doing something because it sounds cool and impressive, or because you actually just like it. I suppose I have time to figure that out, I mentioned if anyone knew any good books for insight on the reality of the job world as an entp, because I've only ever had one job that I still have, which boils down to restaurant bus-boy, and it's just about the only thing I put up in its category, probably because my Ti dictates that making money is both a practical and worthwhile gain. The reason I can't seem to bring myself to give up the dream of doing something monumental for the sake of having the ability to better the world in some way later on is if not that, what else is there to hold over your head as a life goal, because simply being a successful whateverprofessionyoudo doesn't really appeal to me when I see it alongside the scale of the world, and everyone just discussing it, never doing anything about it. That's what I'm thinking anyway, maybe you can make sense of it.:tongue:
 

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I don't know either, really the only reason I feel like I have to step up and help using my position in life is because despite me being an E, I'm constantly introspecting if I'm not talking, and every time I revisit the issue that if no one does step up willingly, regardless of whether my endeavor bears any real fruit, the only way change can be brought on a large scale is by dumb luck. I've checked and re-checked that theory in my head hundreds of times, and I can't see it any other way. Looking back in history doesn't help either. Maybe I need to "grow up", or maybe I'm mature enough to choose to question this with zeal, I really don't know. I can agree, I highly value those times you choose to say something like it is, and open someone's eyes, because usually they're not even aware they're doing whatever silly thing they're doing. Maybe that's what I'm trying to do, find my niche, because to me, I could be a lot of things, rocket science is just another thing to me, probably to a lot of us, not something we can be sure that we'll never be able to even attempt. Maybe I'm still looking for what I truly do love. It's hard to tell sometimes if you're doing something because it sounds cool and impressive, or because you actually just like it. I suppose I have time to figure that out, I mentioned if anyone knew any good books for insight on the reality of the job world as an entp, because I've only ever had one job that I still have, which boils down to restaurant bus-boy, and it's just about the only thing I put up in its category, probably because my Ti dictates that making money is both a practical and worthwhile gain. The reason I can't seem to bring myself to give up the dream of doing something monumental for the sake of having the ability to better the world in some way later on is if not that, what else is there to hold over your head as a life goal, because simply being a successful whateverprofessionyoudo doesn't really appeal to me when I see it alongside the scale of the world, and everyone just discussing it, never doing anything about it. That's what I'm thinking anyway, maybe you can make sense of it.:tongue:
I'm working on a career in analytic data science, as our Ne & Ti would naturally love it. I don't actually have that as my job title, but it's just a goal of mine; I'm 26. There's nothing wrong with dreaming big. I would just invite you to accept the reality that dreams may never come true. As far as deep introspection despite our extroversion, I believe ENTPs tend to be a little detached, with some, like me, way more than others. There's a way to be noble while still acknowledging reality. My version of "humility" is to dream big/have goals, while never feeling entitled to see them achieved. People who don't know a lick about psychology still get pissed off at entitled behavior. I accept my natural intelligence is not enough to secure my goals. Rather, basic work ethic lays the foundation, and then people might notice the brainpower. After all, no point in bragging how fast a car engine runs if the brakes don't work, the oil is leaking, and the steering is shot.
 
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