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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Hi folks!

This is my first post here. Since discovering MBTI, this is something that has fascinated me.

However I have had difficulty determining whether I am an ENTP or an ENFP, since I often score 50/50 on tests on the T/F.

I have read about the differences between Ti and Fi, but I have a difficult time saying for sure what I am, since I see myself in both (at least in what I have read so far.)

Hopefully this form will give you guys an idea! :)


QUIZTIME:

1) What aspect of your personality made you unsure of your type?
I consider both the logic and my feelings when I am making decisions.


2) What do you yearn for in life? Why?
- (nearly) Everything has to be fun - Because I don't like being bored
- Creativity - I love drawing, graphic design, listening to music, making stuff with my hands
- Broadening my horizons - I love discovering new things and experiences.
- Be well liked
- Have a few deep relationships with some close friends
- Do something good for the world - I'm somewhat idealistic, but I think it would be very meaningful if you somehow made the world a better place



3) Think about a time where you felt like you were at your finest. Tell us what made you feel that way.
At a party when I am in super mood and out there talking to everyone and feeling awesome.



4) What makes you feel inferior?
Whenever I have to push myself to do things I don't like or through physical pain.



5) What tends to weigh on your decisions? (Do you think about people, pro-cons, how you feel about it, etc.)
For big decisions I spend a lot of time thinking about them and often draw a diagram of pros and cons. If it is a big decision I also often call my mother since she is really wise and open minded (she just says what she thinks could be smart, but is never pushy about it).

For small decisions I just use my intuition.


6) When working on a project what is normally your emphasis? Do you like to have control of the outcome?
I tend to come up with a lot of ideas in projects and I almost always take charge (not necessarily forcefully, but I make sure things are going in the direction that I want). I delegate uninteresting "details" and nitpicking to other people.



7) Describe us a time where you had a lot of fun. How is your memory of it?
I have a lot of fun at parties where I can talk to a lot of new/interesting people.



8) When you want to learn something new, what feels more natural for you? (Are you more prone to be hands on, to theorize, to memorize, etc)
I learn best when I can feel something hands on or if I can discuss it with others.



9) How organized do you to think of yourself as?
I have a plan for the long term and always reach goals which are important for me, but in daily life I'm usually not very organized.



10) How do you judge new ideas? You try to understand the principles behind it to see if they make sense or do you look for information that supports it?
Both.



11) You find harmony by making sure everyone is doing fine and belonging to a given group or by making sure that you follow what you believe and being yourself?
Both. It is important to be true to yourself and follow what you believe (otherwise you will become unhappy), but if you've got that in check, then you can focus on everyone else.



12) Are you the kind that thinks before speaking or do you speak before thinking? Do you prefer one-on-one communication or group discussions?
I almost always speak before thinking. I like both group discussions and one-on-one discussions. Though both can also be annoying if the person(s) are close-minded or don't have much to say.



13) Do you jump into action right away or do you like to know where are you jumping before leaping? Does action speaks more than words?
I can sometimes be rather impulsive, so I guess I jump before leaping. I agree with the saying "action speaks louder than words", but it is in many occasions a good idea to talk about things before anything is done.



14) It's Saturday. You're at home, and your favorite show is about to start. Your friends call you for a night out. What will you do?
Easy choice. I would join my friends. Wouldn't want to miss out on that and you can always watch the TV show later.



15) How do you act when you're stressed out?
I can become indecisive and insecure.



16) What makes you dislike the personalities of some people?
I dislike people who are close-minded or mean.



17) Is there anything you really like talking about with other people?
What they want to do with their life. What their plans for the future are. What they think about various political topics.



18) What kind of things do pay the least attention to in your life
House work, cooking, boring rutines.



19) How do your friends perceive you? What is wrong about their perception? ? What would your friends never say about your personality ?
Many people perceive me as extremely outgoing. This is true whenever I am social with many people, but I also spend a lot of time alone on the internet, gaming, thinking about stuff. I need time for myself as well.



20) You got a whole day to do whatever you like. What kind of activities do you feel like doing?
- Discuss various topics with people
- Watch a movie with friends or alone
- Surf the webs while listening to music
- Draw or play guitar
- Spend time in nature/hiking/on a boat (along as the weather is good)
- Do crazy/random stuff with friends for lulz


Thank you!
- Marac
 

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Well, an ENFP use Fi/Te and an ENTP use Ti/Fe. The best way to find your type might be to look how your descriptions corresponds with both these pair. I'm not enough of an expert to do that. I'm not much of an expert on intuition or sensing either, so can't say if you typed yourself right there.

It seems like you are more energized by new ideas, than by new people. You also seem to like debating as a sport, looking at something from a multitude of different angles. You seem to be more about analysing thing, than about how something corresponds with your internal value system. So, I think that you're a thinker.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Well, an ENFP use Fi/Te and an ENTP use Ti/Fe. The best way to find your type might be to look how your descriptions corresponds with both these pair. I'm not enough of an expert to do that. I'm not much of an expert on intuition or sensing either, so can't say if you typed yourself right there.

It seems like you are more energized by new ideas, than by new people. You also seem to like debating as a sport, looking at something from a multitude of different angles. You seem to be more about analysing thing, than about how something corresponds with your internal value system. So, I think that you're a thinker.
From the descriptions on the site cognitiveprocesses.com, I feel that I am perhaps more Ti/Fe than Fi/Fe.

However whenever reading descriptions of ENFP, I feel like it fits better.

ENFPs are both "idea"-people and "people"-people, who see everyone and everything as part of a cosmic whole. They want to both help and to be liked and admired by other people, on both an individual and a humanitarian level. This is rarely a problem for the ENFP, as they are outgoing and warm, and genuinely like people. Some ENFPs have a great deal of zany charm, which can ingratiate them to more stodgy types in spite of their unconventionality.
This is true

ENFPs often have strong, if sometimes surprising, values and viewpoints. They tend to try to use their social skills and contacts to persuade others gently (though enthusiastically) of the rightness of these views; this sometimes results in the ENFP neglecting their nearest and dearest while caught up their efforts to change the world.
I do have some unusual viewpoints and I love to debate, but I can also see two sides of an argument (and sometimes I just take a standpoint for the sake of discussing).

ENFPs can be the warmest, kindest, and most sympathetic of mates; affectionate, demonstrative, and spontaneous. Many in relationships with an ENFP literally say, "They light up my life." But there is usually a trade-off: the partner must be willing to deal with the practical and financial aspects of the relationship, and the ENFP must be allowed the freedom to follow their latest path, whatever that entails.
I am known to be a very sympathetic person and the latter is true as well.

For some ENFPs, relationships can be seriously tested by their short attention spans and emotional needs. They are easily intrigued and distracted by new friends and acquaintances, forgetting their older and more familiar emotional ties for long stretches at a time. And the less mature ENFP may need to feel they’re the constant center of attention, to confirm their image of themselves as a wonderful and fascinating person.
Having a short attention span is true for an ENTP as well. I like to be the center for attention and I love positive feedback.

In the workplace, ENFPs are pleasant and friendly, and interact in a positive and creative manner with both their co-workers and the public. ENFPs are also a major asset in brainstorming sessions; follow-through on projects can be a problem, however. ENFPs do get distracted, especially if another interesting issue comes along. They also tend towards procrastination, and dislike performing small, uninteresting tasks. ENFPs are most productive when working in a group with a few Js to handle the details and the deadlines.
Last paragraph is true as well"
"ENTP

"Clever" is the word that perhaps describes ENTPs best. The professor who juggles half a dozen ideas for research papers and grant proposals in his mind while giving a highly entertaining lecture on an abstruse subject is a classic example of the type. So is the stand-up comedian whose lampoons are both funny and incisively accurate.
I guess.

ENTPs are usually verbally as well as cerebrally quick, and generally love to argue--both for its own sake, and to show off their debating skills. ENTPs tend to have a perverse sense of humor as well, and enjoy playing devil's advocate. This sometimes confuses, even angers, those who don't understand or accept the concept of argument as a sport.
I love to debate and sometimes do this.

ENTPs are as innovative and ingenious at problem-solving as they are at verbal gymnastics; on occasion, however, they manage to outsmart themselves. ENTPs can be prone to "sharp practice" – especially cutting corners without regard to the rules if it's expedient – or, their juggling acts may simply be so over-ambitious they collapse.
The latter doesn't really happen.

Both at work and at home, ENTPs are very fond of "toys" -- physical or intellectual, the more sophisticated the better. Once these have been "solved" or become too familiar, however, they’ll be replaced with new ones.
I used to be very fond of toys when I was a kid, but not so much anymore.

ENTPs are basically optimists, but in spite of this (perhaps because of it?), they can become petulant about small setbacks and inconveniences. (Major setbacks they regard as challenges, and tackle with determination.) ENTPs have little patience with those they consider wrongheaded or unintelligent, and show little restraint in demonstrating this. In general, however, they are genial, even charming, when not being harassed by life.
I'm optimistic, but generally don't demonstrate against people I consider unintelligent or wrongheaded (I just avoid them or don't talk to them).

In terms of their relationships with others, ENTPs are capable of bonding very closely and suddenly with their loved ones. Some appear deceptively offhand with their nearest and dearest; others are so demonstrative that they succeed in shocking co-workers who've only seen their professional side. ENTPs are also quick to spot a kindred spirit, and good at acquiring friends of similar temperament and interests.
I tend to bond very quickly.

ENTPs may sometimes give the impression of being largely oblivious to the rest of humanity except as an audience: good, bad, or potential. In general this is unfair – but it can be difficult to get an ENTP’s attention when they’re not immediately aware of you, especially for an Introvert.
Nah. I like people. However, they don't hold my attention for long if they don't have anything interesting to say.

The best approach in communicating with an ENTP is to be straightforward. No games – they’ll win. No "pulling rank" – they’ll just want to put you in your place. No apologies – you’ll undermine yourself. Try "I need/want to talk to you."
I like people who are straightforward (I dislike bullshit), but I rarely put people in their place."
So am I just an ENTP with a well developed feeling function, or something else?
 
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@Marac

1. Has someone heard or seen you work through a situation or do they see you stare off into space as you think it out in your head?
2. Do you give attention to what is going on around you or are you always comparing things now to what happened in the past?
3. Do other people tell you it's easy to know how you're feeling or is it hard for them to tell (It will be hard for people around you to tell but you will know exactly how you're feeling).
4. Has anyone ever heard or seen you make connections between different subjects or do she say something and they wonder how you got from point A to point B?

answer this set of question - it can tell us are you Fi/e, Si/e, Te/i, Ni/e
it helped me to figure stuff out it will might help you - i consider it some good questions by @StraightCrushin :)
but to be honest when i re-read your post now...it's clear as a day you are an ENTP :)
 

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I think it may be useful to remember, that Fi and Ti is more about internal value systems/internal logical systems, while Fe and Te focuses more outwardly. That is, Fi focuses more on internal harmony while Fe focuses more on harmony with other people. I think your attitude towards people shows you as more of a Fe-user than an Fi, which would fit with ENTP.
 

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@Marac - If you want my opinion, you seem to use more Ti+Fe. Disregard the descriptions for now - sometimes they can be rather misleading. Also, don't pay too much attention to tests. They cannot be 100% accurate and most of them online, while they can give you an idea of your type, can be off the mark in some places. View tests as a "guide". Also, focus on the cognitive functions. Here's a fairly accurate cognitive functions test: Keys 2 Cognition - Cognitive Processes No, this isn't going to be 100% accurate, but it does give you somewhat of a better "guide".

For a while as I was reading your post, I almost wanted to say that I saw more Sensing than I did Intuition. But I'm not entirely sure. There's a nasty bias against out there, so that does make me wonder whether people are simply mistyping themselves when they say they use Intuition. However, you could be completely right, as you know yourself better than I do. XD But out of curiosity, what makes you so sure you use Ne?
 

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Discussion Starter #7
1. Has someone heard or seen you work through a situation or do they see you stare off into space as you think it out in your head?
2. Do you give attention to what is going on around you or are you always comparing things now to what happened in the past?
3. Do other people tell you it's easy to know how you're feeling or is it hard for them to tell (It will be hard for people around you to tell but you will know exactly how you're feeling).
4. Has anyone ever heard or seen you make connections between different subjects or do she say something and they wonder how you got from point A to point B?

answer this set of question - it can tell us are you Fi/e, Si/e, Te/i, Ni/e
it helped me to figure stuff out it will might help you - i consider it some good questions by @ :)
but to be honest when i re-read your post now...it's clear as a day you are an ENTP :)
1. I can do both, so I'm not sure what to say.
2. I generally don't think too much about the past, but I'm often thinking about stuff, so I don't always pay attention to what is going on.
3. It seems like most people can tell what I am feeling (I'm also very good at seeing how other people are felling.)
4. I often make connections between different subjects, but sometimes they are so random that people wonder how I made that connection

I think it may be useful to remember, that Fi and Ti is more about internal value systems/internal logical systems, while Fe and Te focuses more outwardly. That is, Fi focuses more on internal harmony while Fe focuses more on harmony with other people. I think your attitude towards people shows you as more of a Fe-user than an Fi, which would fit with ENTP.
@Marac - If you want my opinion, you seem to use more Ti+Fe. Disregard the descriptions for now - sometimes they can be rather misleading. Also, don't pay too much attention to tests. They cannot be 100% accurate and most of them online, while they can give you an idea of your type, can be off the mark in some places. View tests as a "guide". Also, focus on the cognitive functions. Here's a fairly accurate cognitive functions test: Keys 2 Cognition - Cognitive Processes No, this isn't going to be 100% accurate, but it does give you somewhat of a better "guide".

For a while as I was reading your post, I almost wanted to say that I saw more Sensing than I did Intuition. But I'm not entirely sure. There's a nasty bias against out there, so that does make me wonder whether people are simply mistyping themselves when they say they use Intuition. However, you could be completely right, as you know yourself better than I do. XD But out of curiosity, what makes you so sure you use Ne?
I always score E N and P on tests (never scored anything else), so I am fairly sure that my N is more dominant than my sensing ability.

Your link gave me this:

"Your Cognitive Development Profile
The forty-eight questions you rated earlier tap into the eight cognitive processes. Some questions tapped into basic or developed use of a process used by itself, while other questions tapped into use of multiple processes at once. The profile below is based on your responses. The number of squares indicate strength of response. The equivalent numeric is shown in parentheses along with likely level of development.

Cognitive Process Level of Development (Preference, Skill and Frequency of Use)
extraverted Sensing (Se) *********************************** (35.1)
good use
introverted Sensing (Si) ********************* (21.7)
limited use
extraverted Intuiting (Ne) **************************************** (40)
excellent use
introverted Intuiting (Ni) ******************************** (32)
good use
extraverted Thinking (Te) ********************* (21.7)
limited use
introverted Thinking (Ti) *********************** (23.9)
limited use
extraverted Feeling (Fe) ********************************* (33)
good use
introverted Feeling (Fi) ********************************* (33.2)
good use
Summary Analysis of Profile
By focusing on the strongest configuration of cognitive processes, your pattern of responses most closely matches individuals of this type: ENFP

Lead (Dominant) Process
Extraverted Intuiting (Ne): Exploring the emerging patterns. Wondering about patterns of interaction across various situations. Checking what hypotheses and meanings fit best. Trusting what emerges as you shift a situation’s dynamics.

Support (Auxilliary) Process
Introverted Feeling (Fi): Staying true to who you really are. Paying close attention to your personal identity, values and beliefs. Checking with your conscience. Choosing behavior congruent with what is important to you."

:laughing: I'm confused. So, this means I am ENFP?
 

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Your either an ENTP with a well developed Fi or an ENFP with a well developed Fe, hum. Although its been said here that you appear to use more Fe, i will disagree with that. I don't see an over abundance of Fe coming from you. Many of our ENFP have tested very high using Fe, some much higher than Fi. So if we take that into account, it doesn't leave many ENFP left in our forum ;) The deal breaker will be watching you in serious conversations, or debates. This is when Fi/Fe seems to be more visible. I'll be watching ;).....and by the way Ne is DEF your leading function. Not because of the test results either, i see it in your words as you described yourself.

Ti and Fi are both subjective and true to their personal logic. Time will tell, start blabbing ;-)
 

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1. I can do both, so I'm not sure what to say.
2. I generally don't think too much about the past, but I'm often thinking about stuff, so I don't always pay attention to what is going on.
3. It seems like most people can tell what I am feeling (I'm also very good at seeing how other people are felling.)
4. I often make connections between different subjects, but sometimes they are so random that people wonder how I made that connection





I always score E N and P on tests (never scored anything else), so I am fairly sure that my N is more dominant than my sensing ability.

Your link gave me this:

"Your Cognitive Development Profile
The forty-eight questions you rated earlier tap into the eight cognitive processes. Some questions tapped into basic or developed use of a process used by itself, while other questions tapped into use of multiple processes at once. The profile below is based on your responses. The number of squares indicate strength of response. The equivalent numeric is shown in parentheses along with likely level of development.

Cognitive Process Level of Development (Preference, Skill and Frequency of Use)
extraverted Sensing (Se) *********************************** (35.1)
good use
introverted Sensing (Si) ********************* (21.7)
limited use
extraverted Intuiting (Ne) **************************************** (40)
excellent use
introverted Intuiting (Ni) ******************************** (32)
good use
extraverted Thinking (Te) ********************* (21.7)
limited use
introverted Thinking (Ti) *********************** (23.9)
limited use
extraverted Feeling (Fe) ********************************* (33)
good use
introverted Feeling (Fi) ********************************* (33.2)
good use
Summary Analysis of Profile
By focusing on the strongest configuration of cognitive processes, your pattern of responses most closely matches individuals of this type: ENFP

Lead (Dominant) Process
Extraverted Intuiting (Ne): Exploring the emerging patterns. Wondering about patterns of interaction across various situations. Checking what hypotheses and meanings fit best. Trusting what emerges as you shift a situation’s dynamics.

Support (Auxilliary) Process
Introverted Feeling (Fi): Staying true to who you really are. Paying close attention to your personal identity, values and beliefs. Checking with your conscience. Choosing behavior congruent with what is important to you."

:laughing: I'm confused. So, this means I am ENFP?
Just looking at those test results, you're almost certainly not an ENTP. However, the test is only as accurate as the person taking it.
 

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Honestly you really don't sound Like and ENFP or an ENTP.

An ENFP/ENTP never choose to use Se unless they have to. Se drains the heck out of them because its the shadow of their weakest function.

In fact, you seem to choose Se over your iNtuition.

In personality tests, the intuitive choice is always going to be the more attractive choice to pick, but is a poor example of what's really the bread and butter of the differences.

An Ne Dominant/Aux will generally learn by spending more time talking to people and receiving critiques from other people.

An Se Dominant/Aux will generally learn by spending more time looking at graphs and doing hands on work.

The tests are kind of crap, so I wouldn't bother with those.



I would probably roll an ESFP.

Intuition can be very take charge in a group, but being an extrovert and using a decently developed Te can also do the same.

A Te will strive for tangibility and quantitative data in a group. This has much less to do with close nit picking that a Ti usually deals with.

An Ne is for a lot of reinventing and messing about to change the idea of which we're looking at. An Ne also relies a lot more on the verification from others to be confidant in their idea.

Yours is less reliant and more take charge, which leads me to Te Ni.

You come across as a very strong Se and Fi seems quite likely.


Thus:

Dom: Se

Aux: Fi

Tert: Te

Inf: Ni


ESTP would make you an Ti, which seems quite unlikely.

ESFJ or ESTJ would make you an Si, which seems really unlikely.

Your preference for a hands on approach leads me to really think you're an Se, and that it is higher on your function order than Ne or Ni would be.

This would make you an S.


So yeah, you definitely seem like an ESFP.


Sorry for the messy reply, had a hard time drawing a line to my conclusion.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Honestly you really don't sound Like and ENFP or an ENTP.

An ENFP/ENTP never choose to use Se unless they have to. Se drains the heck out of them because its the shadow of their weakest function.

In fact, you seem to choose Se over your iNtuition.

In personality tests, the intuitive choice is always going to be the more attractive choice to pick, but is a poor example of what's really the bread and butter of the differences.

An Ne Dominant/Aux will generally learn by spending more time talking to people and receiving critiques from other people.

An Se Dominant/Aux will generally learn by spending more time looking at graphs and doing hands on work.

The tests are kind of crap, so I wouldn't bother with those.



I would probably roll an ESFP.

Intuition can be very take charge in a group, but being an extrovert and using a decently developed Te can also do the same.

A Te will strive for tangibility and quantitative data in a group. This has much less to do with close nit picking that a Ti usually deals with.

An Ne is for a lot of reinventing and messing about to change the idea of which we're looking at. An Ne also relies a lot more on the verification from others to be confidant in their idea.

Yours is less reliant and more take charge, which leads me to Te Ni.

You come across as a very strong Se and Fi seems quite likely.


Thus:

Dom: Se

Aux: Fi

Tert: Te

Inf: Ni


ESTP would make you an Ti, which seems quite unlikely.

ESFJ or ESTJ would make you an Si, which seems really unlikely.

Your preference for a hands on approach leads me to really think you're an Se, and that it is higher on your function order than Ne or Ni would be.

This would make you an S.


So yeah, you definitely seem like an ESFP.


Sorry for the messy reply, had a hard time drawing a line to my conclusion.
You might be right. I came over this:

"HOW TO TELL INTUITING FROM EXTRAVERTED SENSING
Author:
Judy Robb,
Linda Berens
Over the last four years, in the MBTI® Qualifying Programs, advanced programs and elsewhere, we found a disproportionate number of people who had reported preferences for the iNtuiting process while their behaviors seemed to resemble the Artisan-SP temperament pattern. This raised some questions such as: What is the relationship between temperament and Jung's typology? Can someone have one type and a different temperament? If not, what is going on here?

In exploring type dynamics and type development with these individuals, we discovered that indeed, most of them had preferences for extraverted Sensing. Thus the match between the Artisan temperament and Sensing and Perceiving preferences still held. While research is still being done on this topic, we want to put forth some definitions and some hypotheses.

Definitions
The perceiving processes are ways of becoming aware. There are basically two kinds of information one can become aware of: concrete, sensory information or abstract, connections and meanings. Based on our readings of Jung and observations of behavior, we formulated the following matrix:


Perceiving Processes - Ways of Becoming Aware
What? Where and When?
Outside
Extraverted World
Here and Now Inside
Introverted World
Past, Future or Universal

Concrete;
Sensory Content Extraverted Sensing
(Se)
What is
Experience the experience

Introverted Sensing
(Si)
What is evokes what was
Images from past experience
or universal shared history

Abstract;
Connections and Meaning
Extraverted iNtuiting (Ne)
What it means
Conceive from the experience

Introverted iNtuiting (Ni)
What will be
Images of the future
or universal symbols


Both kinds of information are available at any one point in time. Those with a Sensing preference usually become aware of the concrete, sensory information - the content of the pattern - first. Those with a preference for iNtuiting become aware of the abstract information - the patterns of connections and meaning - first.

(Note: We chose to refer to the mental process of intuiting instead of referring to intuition, focusing on the mental processes, not types.)

Jung described each of the mental processes in terms of their attitudes. It wasn't just Sensing, it was Sensing in the extraverted attitude or in the introverted attitude. Functions used in the extraverted attitude have a here and now quality to them. Thus both extraverted Sensing and extraverted iNtuiting are in-the-moment perceptions. When we engage in either of them, our energy goes to either seeking more sensory input (Se) or to interacting to develop more ideas (Ne). In both processes, the focus is on the possibilities and opportunities. With extraverted Sensing(Se), the focus is on the immediate, sensory possibilities and options for action. With extraverted iNtuiting(Ne), it is on the envisioned possibilities, new ideas and meanings.

Functions used in the introverted attitude have a past, future or universal quality to them. Introverted Sensing has a past and sometimes universal sense with the focus on the evoked impression, usually of something perceived beforehand, or as Jung said, "...it would also see what was before their becoming and will be after their passing ..." (Psychological Types, p.395) Introverted iNtuiting is a process of becoming aware of what will be that hasn't yet been. Vision, foresight, and profoundly impactful symbols are often a result of this process.



How to tell the forest from the trees!
Extraverted Sensing - Notices the rich detail in the whole forest - the trees, their color and texture, their sounds, their smells, the pattern of light and dark...
Introverted Sensing - Notes that this forest has always been here and recalls being in a forest from childhood, smelling that smell and the fun of playing hide and seek behind the trees...

Extraverted iNtuiting - Thinks of the fractal patterns, the wide range of possibilities in the forest, how this forest is part of the ecosystem and is affected by polllution from the city...

Introverted iNtuiting - Recognizes that the forest is deeply symbolic of all of life in its interconnectedness and constant recycling and growth and foresees that this forest will soon be torn down for a housing development...

Sources of Confusion
Several descriptors used for iNtuiting misled these individuals to self-report on the MBTI® or self-select a preference for "N."

Big Picture - Many Artisans-SPs are interested in the big picture. They say they want all the detail, the whole story. One ESFP selected "spire" over "foundation," saying he saw himself on top of the spire seeing the whole picture.

Pattern - Likewise, most of these Artisans-SPs also indicate they look for patterns. Looking for patterns is different than perceiving the pattern first. The differentiating point is the starting place, not the ending place.

Extraverted Sensing and extraverted iNtuiting are holistic, analogic perceptual modes. In extraverted Sensing, the individual elements, like the trees in the forest, are seen in rich detail, all at once. Thus concrete patterns are quite likely to be perceived along with the discrete sensory information. This pattern is different from the abstract extraverted iNtuiting perception of the relationships and connections of the trees to the rest of the environment. Both pattern and big picture can be on a continuum from concrete to abstract.

Possibilities - These Artisans-SPs frequently respond to "possibilities" as an accurate descriptor. When we probed deeper, they described seeking opportunities for action, usually what to do next and what will work to solve a problem. They like brainstorming and coming up with variations on a theme, until the process goes on and on and on and gets too far away from reality. Those who prefer extraverted iNtuiting are increasingly excited by the ideas sparked in the process regardless of how far abstracted from reality. Both extraverted iNtuiting and extraverted Sensing focus in the here and now and on possibilities and opportunities. The differentiating factor is abstraction or concreteness.

Hypotheses
Type Pattern vs. Mental Process - To understand extraverted Sensing, we consult those who have S and P in their four letter code, asking them what they would do, listening to their words and observing their behaviors. We frequently fail to remember that in the _S_P type pattern (hierarchy of functions), there is also iNtuiting. For example, someone with ESTP as preferences, also has introverted iNtuiting. Even though it is in fourth place, it is there. Those with ISTP have introverted iNtuiting as tertiary (following Grant's model) and as adults, probably have had much opportunity to develop and use it. The functions do not operate in isolation, but in dynamic interaction. Could it be what looks like extraverted iNtuiting is really extraverted Sensing, with an introverted iNtuiting perception of the near future? Could this be the attraction to "big picture," "pattern" and "possibilities"?

MBTI® Results are not equal to "True Type" - Since these Artisans-SPs have resonated to some of the descriptors for iNtuiting and reported themselves as "N" on the MBTI®, is it possible we have then reinforced "fuzzy" descriptions by assuming we were observing the behavior and words of someone with a preference for "N"? Also, it is well-established that the SN and JP scales are intercorrelated with those reporting preferences for S also reporting preferences for J and N preferences correlated with P preferences. Is the iNtuiting "preference" an artifact of the instrument?

In our experience, these individuals verify _S_P as their "true type" when we use the clear definitions based on Jung's Psychological Types as in the above matrix, Understanding Yourself and Others, An Introduction to Temperament, the Temperament Targets, Temperament Self-Discovery Descriptions and Alan Brownsword's Type Descriptions."


What do the rest of you think? Could I be an ESFP?
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Took the test from the previous page again.

"our Cognitive Development Profile
The forty-eight questions you rated earlier tap into the eight cognitive processes. Some questions tapped into basic or developed use of a process used by itself, while other questions tapped into use of multiple processes at once. The profile below is based on your responses. The number of squares indicate strength of response. The equivalent numeric is shown in parentheses along with likely level of development.

Cognitive Process Level of Development (Preference, Skill and Frequency of Use)
extraverted Sensing (Se) ************************************ (36.5)
excellent use
introverted Sensing (Si) ************************* (25.1)
average use
extraverted Intuiting (Ne) ************************ (24.1)
average use
introverted Intuiting (Ni) *************************** (27.1)
average use
extraverted Thinking (Te) ************************ (24.9)
average use
introverted Thinking (Ti) ********************* (21.1)
limited use
extraverted Feeling (Fe) ************************************* (37.3)
excellent use
introverted Feeling (Fi) ******************************************* (43.5)
excellent use
Summary Analysis of Profile
By focusing on the strongest configuration of cognitive processes, your pattern of responses most closely matches individuals of this type: ESFP

Lead (Dominant) Process
Extraverted Sensing (Se): Immersing in the present context. Responding naturally to everything tangible you detect through your senses. Checking with what your gut instincts say. Testing limits and take risks for big rewards.

Support (Auxilliary) Process
Introverted Feeling (Fi): Staying true to who you really are. Paying close attention to your personal identity, values and beliefs. Checking with your conscience. Choosing behavior congruent with what is important to you.

If these cognitive processes don't fit well then consider these types: ISFP, or ENFP

If these results are different from what you know of yourself, you might consider why your developmental pattern does not align with your expectation. You might also consider exploring this result as a possible better fit.

The Four Temperaments
Corresponding best-fit temperaments based on your profile: Improviser; secondly Catalyst; then Stabilizer; and lastly, Theorist.
To read more about the four temperaments click here."
 

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hum, the blind leading the blind, so amusing, chuckles *
 

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1. I can do both, so I'm not sure what to say.
2. I generally don't think too much about the past, but I'm often thinking about stuff, so I don't always pay attention to what is going on.
3. It seems like most people can tell what I am feeling (I'm also very good at seeing how other people are felling.)
4. I often make connections between different subjects, but sometimes they are so random that people wonder how I made that connection
1. the first one is hard... i would personally also say both but i know work through the problems with people so i concluded im Te user
2. the second one says u are an N person then
3. Fe probs
4. also N

don't know what to tell you after this - i would say you are Fe more then Fi
Articles - Fi vs Fe 101 - you decide - this article is good

also i would go with N definitely - but i can't say are you Ni or Ne - thought Ne more
for the rest i can't say
it seems like you are more aware of your F functions then T functions...and i don't thing you are too strong on S functions...but you know the best - i might missed smth

according to your post i would say you are def E person
"I learn best when I can feel something hands on or if I can discuss it with others." - this can for example say you are an S ...Se especially - but i also like practice and i am strong N
 

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1. the first one is hard... i would personally also say both but i know work through the problems with people so i concluded im Te user
2. the second one says u are an N person then
3. Fe probs
4. also N

don't know what to tell you after this - i would say you are Fe more then Fi
Articles - Fi vs Fe 101 - you decide - this article is good

also i would go with N definitely - but i can't say are you Ni or Ne - thought Ne more
for the rest i can't say
it seems like you are more aware of your F functions then T functions...and i don't thing you are too strong on S functions...but you know the best - i might missed smth

according to your post i would say you are def E person
"I learn best when I can feel something hands on or if I can discuss it with others." - this can for example say you are an S ...Se especially - but i also like practice and i am strong N
Hmm. The inverse a lot of times applies here. It's probably likely that Marac uses both functions a lot, but I still would stress the S because he would have to be an Ne if he were an N in this case.

An Ne is usually very creative and spends a lot of time focusing on creativity in the outside world. Marac seems more adamant in his positions and less likely to bounce from idea to idea.

The whole in the moment thing, dependance on instincts, and speaking before thinking also caters very strongly to Se.

Fe would make sense if it didn't seem to contradict the idea of him being a Te in the case of dominant Se. Fi's can still be very fluently involved with their emotions, but how you react the outside world changes whether you're an Fi or Fe. This function is probably the one we can relate to the most, but is the one with the most overlap out of all of the functions due to it being so conscious.

Fi will still value the emotional needs of others greatly, but won't necessarily be so emotionally impacted by the feelings of others. It's generally how the emotions of others impact your own emotions, as well as your sensitivity to others that tells the difference.

A mature Fi will still be very supportive of the needs and the emotions that strong Fe's might have, and both types can just as easily be empathetic.


ESFP really still seems the most agreeable to me.


EDIT:

Oh, I couldn't tell from the OP, but the ethics of the Fi are usually very subjective to the person.

An Fe will generally draw ethics from social norms, whereas an Fi will generally draw ethics from their own personal view of things.
 
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Hmm. The inverse a lot of times applies here. It's probably likely that Marac uses both functions a lot, but I still would stress the S because he would have to be an Ne if he were an N in this case.

An Ne is usually very creative and spends a lot of time focusing on creativity in the outside world. Marac seems more adamant in his positions and less likely to bounce from idea to idea.

The whole in the moment thing, dependance on instincts, and speaking before thinking also caters very strongly to Se.

Fe would make sense if it didn't seem to contradict the idea of him being a Te in the case of dominant Se. Fi's can still be very fluently involved with their emotions, but how you react the outside world changes whether you're an Fi or Fe. This function is probably the one we can relate to the most, but is the one with the most overlap out of all of the functions due to it being so conscious.

Fi will still value the emotional needs of others greatly, but won't necessarily be so emotionally impacted by the feelings of others. It's generally how the emotions of others impact your own emotions, as well as your sensitivity to others that tells the difference.


ESFP really still seems the most agreeable to me.
Here is an issue mostly maybe with that Fi and Fe
as much as i noticed Fe dominants look a lot what is right for the other person. And are very much aware of how others feel and are very charismatic and can find exactly the right thing to say.
I think Fi connects a lot on how it makes them feel and they can get impression of others feelings on an image how would the certain thing make them feel. Also with them is very much a personal need to help, while Fe is maybe more about what other's needs are.
Also Fi knows how smth makes them feel, recognizing emotions within them.

He seems to be an S person not so little in touch with N side, but functions like an Se definitely...and he is an extrovert for sure.
and yes - ESFP would explain things. and he was simple in his answers, not too complicated...short simple, direct answers on 20 question. Unlike when i was solving them i couldn't be more complicated and random lol
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Thanks for the help guys! :happy:

I am pretty certain that I am an ESFP now.

What made up my mind was looking at this:



I am fairly sure Se and Ni is stronger in my case than Ne and Si.
 
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