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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Heya, I'm having trouble deciding between the two types listed in the title. I'm a MBTI/Jung ISFP (Fi-Se) so my first assumption was ESI but Fi and Se seem to be different in Socionics. I relate more generally to the SEI descriptions, although I do relate to both to an extent. So a couple questions:

1. Is it okay for your MBTI and Socionics types to differ?

2. What are some telltale differences between the two? Real life examples using the functions would be helpful.


Thanks :wink:
 

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@Kito Socionics is generally a different system from MBTI (less so from JCF, but there are still major differences). Wikisocion is a good introduction to the functions (known as Information Elements or IEs generally) and you can click through the types to find general descriptions of them. Really, it's better to stick to looking at each IE in each position because, as stated by Wikisocion:
When a person is "using" an element he naturally goes into a corresponding state of mind, which is reflected in his body language and vocabulary, and tends to have a similar effect on the people around him, who will react based on which function that element occupies in their Model A, with interest (Ego), amusement (Super-Id), boredom (Id), or irritation (Super-Ego), etc.
So you can see there's a reason for the position of the IEs.
 

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I'm an ISFJ and an SEI for sure. I personally don't see a difference. I will say, ISFJs and ISFPs are capable of being equally as artistic and MBTI descriptions are terrible because they seem to be a mix of both. Introverts are highly complicated beings, and the ISFJ descriptions are too practical. But if you focus on the functions, do you prefer Si-Fe or Fi-Se? I HATE doing anything that hurts me or tires me, and I won't be able to tolerate it and I'd rather focus on internal comfort. Also, with others I try to compromise my beliefs through Fe more than convince others or hold on strong. Even if you're Fi-Se, you still have high Si. So focus on Se vs. Fe. For me, NO DOUBT it's Fe. I barely do Se or like doing it. I hope that helps!
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I'm an ISFJ and an SEI for sure. I personally don't see a difference. I will say, ISFJs and ISFPs are capable of being equally as artistic and MBTI descriptions are terrible because they seem to be a mix of both. Introverts are highly complicated beings, and the ISFJ descriptions are too practical. But if you focus on the functions, do you prefer Si-Fe or Fi-Se? I HATE doing anything that hurts me or tires me, and I won't be able to tolerate it and I'd rather focus on internal comfort. Also, with others I try to compromise my beliefs through Fe more than convince others or hold on strong. Even if you're Fi-Se, you still have high Si. So focus on Se vs. Fe. For me, NO DOUBT it's Fe. I barely do Se or like doing it. I hope that helps!
Hmm okay. I definitely relate to Si as I'm very focused on personal physical comfort, extremely sensitive to my surroundings and always cut corners when it comes to doing something boring or strenuous. What I don't relate to about Si is the projection of the past into the present; I like and even crave new experiences. Something to feed my senses, I guess. I like a nice mix of comfortable familiarity and exciting, new sensory information.

What I see a lot in ESI descriptions is that they're supposedly dutiful, conscientious and feel the need to call out others for slacking and immoral behaviour. I'm not like this at all, I have more of a live and let live attitude. I'm very quick to make moral judgments and immediately decide whether a person is 'right' or 'wrong' based on a gut reaction, however - is that Fi? I don't usually point out someone's discrepancy with my own moral code unless it seriously offends me.

As for Se, I like to push people to take action to achieve their own goals and often tell myself "the only way to get something done, is to do it". I still don't like pushing myself or dealing with mundane but necessary activities, however. The faster I can get back to doing whatever I want, the better. So I'm forceful when necessary but will often take the easy route. Manipulating my environment through force is something I do a lot, but hardly ever in a malicious way. Force is one of those things I'm willing to use (and am capable of doing s) but won't usually default to.
 

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So a couple questions:

1. Is it okay for your MBTI and Socionics types to differ?
sort of... mbti consider ESI (isfp) creative, in the moment sensor. And SEI (isfj) the nostalgic, in the past, by the book sensor

in socionics they are a bit different, they look similar but the motivations are different

2. What are some telltale differences between the two? Real life examples using the functions would be helpful.
In socionics:

the ESI and other 'introverted rationals' (Ti and Fi base), they naturally have some sort of big purpose, some greater ideal to their actions. Meaning, they ignore pain to reach an ideal they have identified with. Since ESI have Fi as base function, this ideal will be of a strong ethical nature. Of course other types have ideals but, like I said, the 'introverted rationals' don't tend to look outside to judge things, they naturally have their own structure to understand the world and in my experience they tend to be more head strong and unweaving because of that Ji base function.

Now, the SEI having sensation as base function is more concerned with the process of things in life, and ethics/feelings are of secondary importance. They look similar to the ESI in the sense of a more hands down on experience rather than theoretical/abstract concepts. But like other 'introverted irrationals' they just 'do things', they don't have too much of a structure. Not saying that SEI are disorganized but they have a dynamic of dealing with things in a more flexible manner. SEI deliberately affect your mood by going in your state and getting you out of it to keep a 'balanced' and harmonic environment, for instance: if you're angry, SEI will be angry with you and then move the overrall emotional flow of the interaction to a more desirable state, since you are both in raport now, you usually move along with the SEI. ESI on the other hand is more likely to give you a persuading speech instead of getting out of their way.
 

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sort of... mbti consider ESI (isfp) creative, in the moment sensor. And SEI (isfj) the nostalgic, in the past, by the book sensor

in socionics they are a bit different, they look similar but the motivations are different



In socionics:

the ESI and other 'introverted rationals' (Ti and Fi base), they naturally have some sort of big purpose, some greater ideal to their actions. Meaning, they ignore pain to reach an ideal they have identified with. Since ESI have Fi as base function, this ideal will be of a strong ethical nature. Of course other types have ideals but, like I said, the 'introverted rationals' don't tend to look outside to judge things, they naturally have their own structure to understand the world and in my experience they tend to be more head strong and unweaving because of that Ji base function.

Now, the SEI having sensation as base function is more concerned with the process of things in life, and ethics/feelings are of secondary importance. They look similar to the ESI in the sense of a more hands down on experience rather than theoretical/abstract concepts. But like other 'introverted irrationals' they just 'do things', they don't have too much of a structure. Not saying that SEI are disorganized but they have a dynamic of dealing with things in a more flexible manner. SEI deliberately affect your mood by going in your state and getting you out of it to keep a 'balanced' and harmonic environment, for instance: if you're angry, SEI will be angry with you and then move the overrall emotional flow of the interaction to a more desirable state, since you are both in raport now, you usually move along with the SEI. ESI on the other hand is more likely to give you a persuading speech instead of getting out of their way.
Wow that's an amazing way to describe it. As an SEI, I don't use force at all, I find it too harsh. I'm definitely more flexible than people think, especially internally... I still go through infinite amount of options about certain things that people around me think I've settled long ago. And WOW do I relate to that "going into your state" and then pulling you out. I do that all the time... Just recently my friend was disappointed by something and I wasn't, but I pretended like I was and then tried to push the friend out of their sadness and hopelessness by faking being a part of that journey. Crazy accurate. Also made me look terrible when they find out weeks later I had no reason to be disappointed. But I just wanted to help so you can't really blame me.
 

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ESIs sometimes can be sort of INTs in MBTi/Keirsey because their ethical valuations do not sound very soft at all. At least I can become very aversive to their expression. From Youtube look Sargon of Akkad. Another one was probably Christopher Hitchens. I can not listen them without some sort of discomfort.

I doubt it would happen for SEI.
 

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I'm an ISFJ and an SEI for sure. I personally don't see a difference. I will say, ISFJs and ISFPs are capable of being equally as artistic and MBTI descriptions are terrible because they seem to be a mix of both. Introverts are highly complicated beings, and the ISFJ descriptions are too practical. But if you focus on the functions, do you prefer Si-Fe or Fi-Se? I HATE doing anything that hurts me or tires me, and I won't be able to tolerate it and I'd rather focus on internal comfort. Also, with others I try to compromise my beliefs through Fe more than convince others or hold on strong. Even if you're Fi-Se, you still have high Si. So focus on Se vs. Fe. For me, NO DOUBT it's Fe. I barely do Se or like doing it. I hope that helps!
ISFJ description in famous mbti website is too shallow. They show ISFJs as housewives which is unappealing for people so real ISFJs deny being ISFJs. Both ISFx types are prone to and highly likely to be talented at visual art so it's understandable that artistic ISFJs mistype themselves as ISFPs. In addition, a very talented painter I love called Akiane Kramarik is also most likely ISFJ and if you search her you can see that she doesn't fit into "common" ISFJ stereotype. Every introvert is complex so it's not healthy to stick to shallow descriptions like "ISFJs are housewives, ISFPs are artists." as 16personalities.com emposes.
 
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