Personality Cafe banner

61 - 80 of 435 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
735 Posts
How do you recognize a healthy ESTJ without mistaking them for an ENFJ, or ISFJ via conservatism.
Look! *flexes her muscles* - I'm healthy ESTJ :proud:

Maybe there's scope for setting up t-shirts with front logos of people's personality type, that way you don't need to guess....which is not a ideal indicator...you cannot know someone's workings of the minds from face value.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
211 Posts
Blunt, aggressive/abusive towards close friends/family, slightly too confident, very very controlling, materialistic, and cares about safety/security/structure/rules.
aggressive and abusive towards close friends and family? are you sure?

it's the other way around for me. I'm definitely more careful with my close friends and family and make sure I treat them with respect.

i'm not controlling either. No one likes to be controlled.

Every ESTJ I've seen matches these stereotypes, but then I never really 'see' an ESTJ unless I spot these stereotypes, which is an unfair assessment criterion. How do you recognize a healthy ESTJ without mistaking them for an ENFJ, or ISFJ via conservatism.
this is new to me.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
32 Posts
I've been looking for more ESTJ's, but have only foun one active one (WickedQueen).

Where have all the ESTJ's gone?
my family has a few LOL

aggressive and abusive towards close friends and family? are you sure?

it's the other way around for me. I'm definitely more careful with my close friends and family and make sure I treat them with respect.

i'm not controlling either. No one likes to be controlled.

this is new to me.
New to me as well...

Its very easy to hold a grudge against any personality type. I know I for one have. However, it seems like I lot of you have had experiences with an unhealthy ESTJ, which although I am very sorry about that, is no excuse to generalize our type. My dad is an ESTP for example and he is a huge jerk, but I would never generalize his type because I know plenty of other ESTP's that are amazing individuals. My stepmom, also not a very good person, is an ISFJ, but again, that is her and not her type. In particular we are probably the most misunderstood by NF's because they are the ones we simply do not have as much in common with. My mom is an ENFP and my grandfather is an ESTJ and I know she misunderstood him for a very long time. It really wasn't until she had me that she could really appreciate him as a person.

Is possible that these ESTJ's you are having problems with simply dont know they're acting this way? Especially if they are family wouldn't you like a good relationship with them? We are extroverts, aka not good at listening, we're not always good at noticing when we do something that may seem offensive or controlling, and no we're not really that gushy. But I will tell you that we are complete suckers for those in pain, especially if it is because of something we said or did. It simply crushes us. All I can say is, I am way more of a softer person because my mom and sister (ENFP and INFP) both had the guts to tell me that what i was doing was hurtful to them. I could actually go into great detail about how some INF's are passive aggressive and I would say that's equally as bad as yelling in a straight forward manner, but I can understand that that is who they are and although it might not be the best way to handle things in my opinion, it is part of who they are. If my ENFP mother taught me anything its to appreciate all the good things and deal with the bad things when they come.

Believe me, I know a lot about being that mean bully that you all can see. But I never knew I was doing that until my sister flat out told me. We're kind of like the dog who barks really loudly and bares his teeth at you, but then will freely let you sleep on his stomach and guard you from all dangers once you've made friends. I have a chow dog and if you've ever met one, they're in particularly similar an ESTJ. I've never had a more loyal dog.
INFj's are your dual and match so I guess it makes sense that with a little effort you can learn to not only understand them but to also build a great relationship with them; they protect your emotions and you guard them...works out nicely, for the most part, I think.
 

·
MOTM July 2010
Joined
·
4,596 Posts
INFj's are your dual and match so I guess it makes sense that with a little effort you can learn to not only understand them but to also build a great relationship with them; they protect your emotions and you guard them...works out nicely, for the most part, I think.
I've been wondering why so many INFJs attracted to me...
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
944 Posts
Being an ESTJ, I've got some stereotypes that I'd like to debunk:

2. ESTJ's are bossy.
This isn't necessarily true. Sure, we can come across as domineering and/or demanding, but it's usually because the people we're dealing with are completely incompetent, or they're shirking responsibility. One thing that I hate (and I'm guessing other ESTJ's do, too), is irresponsibility.
This is bullshit. ESTJ are domineering just because they want to be domineering. They control, badger, nag, etc. just because they want to. You're making excuses. All you ESTJ on the forums are making excuses for your sadistic behavior. You're really just horrible people straight from hell.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
345 Posts
This is bullshit. ESTJ are domineering just because they want to be domineering. They control, badger, nag, etc. just because they want to. You're making excuses. All you ESTJ on the forums are making excuses for your sadistic behavior. You're really just horrible people straight from hell.
Ooh, I dont think that is true at all! ESTJs arent evil, they might be people who are a little more on the bossy side but they are also loyal, devoted friends or children or partners.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
944 Posts
ESTJ Stereotype:

ESTJ are part of the slave class of society, otherwise known as the SJ Guardians.
ESTJ want to live as slaves and want everyone else to live as slaves too.
In positions of power, they are very much slave drivers. They don't care if this makes you suffer.
They don't care if their slave driving causes people to get physically and mentally injured.
They only believe in taking care of basic needs, just like in a prison or bleak communist society.
Anything intellectual, cultural, or fun is to be shunned, prevented, and destroyed.
They consider those things a threat to basic survival, and basic survival is all that matters.
The only type of "fun" they approve of is to hang out with friends.
They are sadistic. They want you to be miserable. They want your existence to be bleak, consisting of virtually nothing but work. It's just a purely slave existence.
They are totally against emotional nurturing. They give no love and they want their children to be starved of love. They have hearts of stone.
They don't want their children to get love from other people or even from pets either.
They say the most cruel, hurtful things to people. They like to make you feel bad about yourself, undermine your self esteem, and drive you crazy.
They have this delusion that you're an incompetent, stupid fool and that they know SO much better than you what to do. They use this as an excuse to be bossy.
They're idiots but they think they know better than anyone anyway, even if you're a million times smarter and more knowledgeable than they are.
They are very closed minded, stupid, ignorant, and stubborn, like a mule but even more so.
They think they know everything they need to know already, but they know almost nothing because they hate to learn.
They want you to do everything their way, except their ways and ideas are idiotic because they're idiots.
They don't mind their own business. They interfere and try hard to take control of you.
They work really hard but most of them remain poor because they are stupid and have a slave mentality.
They work hard but they work stupid. They do stupid work.
They can't work smart because they don't have any smart ideas. Far from it, because ESTJ's believe in being very stupid as a way of life.
In fact, ESTJ's don't believe in intelligence or anything intelligent. It's a useless excess to them. It has no place.
They use the brute force method of getting through life.
They don't believe in letting people be themselves and live their own lives how they like.
One of the major reasons that it sucks so much to work in a job for other people is that there are often ESTJ's in charge.
They believe that just providing the most basic necessities of life means they are good people, but at the same time they kill you as a person and this means nothing to them.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
345 Posts
Ooh, someone has an axe to grind.

The MBTI is not an excuse for bad behaviour, you may have tendencies due to your personality type but you are in charge of your behaviour. This means an ESTJ has as much ability to be caring and loving as anyone else, they just have to work a little harder on it.

My ESTJ friend is always up for fun and silliness, he works hard and is good at his job, he is loyal, does what he says and is concerned about how his actions affect others.

Are INTJs known for making rash generalisations?
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
944 Posts
Are INTJs known for making rash generalisations?
I am aware that there are minor differences in details and there are exceptions to every rule, but my job is to find patterns amidst the chaos, to see the major trends in things. Many people refuse to see patterns. My job is to see the essence of things and not let minor exceptions get in the way.

I think the reason that ESTJ tend to be nicer to their friends than their family and subordinates is that having friends is important to them and they know they can't be too much of an asshole or else they won't have friends. So this means nothing to me. It is difficult for their children and their subordinates to escape them, so in those situations they feel free to be as bad as they want to be. What reveals their true character is how they treat people that they have power over.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
394 Posts
I am aware that there are minor differences in details and there are exceptions to every rule, but my job is to find patterns amidst the chaos, to see the major trends in things. Many people refuse to see patterns. My job is to see the essence of things and not let minor exceptions get in the way.

I think the reason that ESTJ tend to be nicer to their friends than their family and subordinates is that having friends is important to them and they know they can't be too much of an asshole or else they won't have friends. So this means nothing to me. It is difficult for their children and their subordinates to escape them, so in those situations they feel free to be as bad as they want to be. What reveals their true character is how they treat people that they have power over.
My Academic Mentor for my first year of college was a self-typed ESTJ. I think he fits more of what your version of an ESTJ is. A lot of people disliked him because he took his job way too seriously, but I also know ESTJs who aren't like that, for example one of my childhood friends. She had a little streak of it when she was a little girl, but she grew out of it a lot time ago. She takes care of children who aren't related to her and keeps an eye over them, but in all the time that I've spent with her, I never felt as though it was domineering or pushy, she just cared for their well being. I can attest to her goodwill, especially in comparison to a lot of people I know. Perhaps she does it because she wants to be liked, but is that really so bad? Most E's do things for people, it's kind of the definition.

Maybe it's a characteristic of immature ones, but I don't think it's fair to assume that they're all bossy.


Also, no one hired you to cruelly label people because you've met a few people who you didn't like, so don't quit your day job.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,058 Posts
ESTJ Stereotype:

ESTJ are part of the slave class of society, otherwise known as the SJ Guardians.
ESTJ want to live as slaves and want everyone else to live as slaves too.
In positions of power, they are very much slave drivers. They don't care if this makes you suffer.
They don't care if their slave driving causes people to get physically and mentally injured.
They only believe in taking care of basic needs, just like in a prison or bleak communist society.
Anything intellectual, cultural, or fun is to be shunned, prevented, and destroyed.
They consider those things a threat to basic survival, and basic survival is all that matters.
The only type of "fun" they approve of is to hang out with friends.
They are sadistic. They want you to be miserable. They want your existence to be bleak, consisting of virtually nothing but work. It's just a purely slave existence.
They are totally against emotional nurturing. They give no love and they want their children to be starved of love. They have hearts of stone.
They don't want their children to get love from other people or even from pets either.
They say the most cruel, hurtful things to people. They like to make you feel bad about yourself, undermine your self esteem, and drive you crazy.
They have this delusion that you're an incompetent, stupid fool and that they know SO much better than you what to do. They use this as an excuse to be bossy.
They're idiots but they think they know better than anyone anyway, even if you're a million times smarter and more knowledgeable than they are.
They are very closed minded, stupid, ignorant, and stubborn, like a mule but even more so.
They think they know everything they need to know already, but they know almost nothing because they hate to learn.
They want you to do everything their way, except their ways and ideas are idiotic because they're idiots.
They don't mind their own business. They interfere and try hard to take control of you.
They work really hard but most of them remain poor because they are stupid and have a slave mentality.
They work hard but they work stupid. They do stupid work.
They can't work smart because they don't have any smart ideas. Far from it, because ESTJ's believe in being very stupid as a way of life.
In fact, ESTJ's don't believe in intelligence or anything intelligent. It's a useless excess to them. It has no place.
They use the brute force method of getting through life.
They don't believe in letting people be themselves and live their own lives how they like.
One of the major reasons that it sucks so much to work in a job for other people is that there are often ESTJ's in charge.
Is this all based on a single person? Or have you encountered numerous ESTJs who were exactly like this? I think anyone has the potential to be such a person, despite their type, or equally as negative in other ways. An MBTI type does not tell everything about a person & two people of the same MBTI type can be completely different from each other in so many aspects. There are tons of factors in the making of a personality. Generalizing isn't a wise thing to do, it can close you off from meeting amazing people who can contribute a lot of good to your life. An ESTJ I know is the opposite of the things you listed. What you listed sounds like a tyrant, while he is a revolutionary, targeting specifically the slave lifestyle, thinking for yourself, being yourself & doing what you want. Just saying :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1 Posts
I think the reason that ESTJ tend to be nicer to their friends than their family and subordinates is that having friends is important to them and they know they can't be too much of an asshole or else they won't have friends. So this means nothing to me. It is difficult for their children and their subordinates to escape them, so in those situations they feel free to be as bad as they want to be. What reveals their true character is how they treat people that they have power over.
So true!

Many people refuse to see patterns. My job is to see the essence of things and not let minor exceptions get in the way.
I don't really believe the world is a string of patterns. There are definitely some, though.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
4,477 Posts
ESTJ Stereotype:

ESTJ are part of the slave class of society, otherwise known as the SJ Guardians.
ESTJ want to live as slaves and want everyone else to live as slaves too.
In positions of power, they are very much slave drivers. They don't care if this makes you suffer.
They don't care if their slave driving causes people to get physically and mentally injured.
They only believe in taking care of basic needs, just like in a prison or bleak communist society.
Anything intellectual, cultural, or fun is to be shunned, prevented, and destroyed.
They consider those things a threat to basic survival, and basic survival is all that matters.
The only type of "fun" they approve of is to hang out with friends.
They are sadistic. They want you to be miserable. They want your existence to be bleak, consisting of virtually nothing but work. It's just a purely slave existence.
They are totally against emotional nurturing. They give no love and they want their children to be starved of love. They have hearts of stone.
They don't want their children to get love from other people or even from pets either.
They say the most cruel, hurtful things to people. They like to make you feel bad about yourself, undermine your self esteem, and drive you crazy.
They have this delusion that you're an incompetent, stupid fool and that they know SO much better than you what to do. They use this as an excuse to be bossy.
They're idiots but they think they know better than anyone anyway, even if you're a million times smarter and more knowledgeable than they are.
They are very closed minded, stupid, ignorant, and stubborn, like a mule but even more so.
They think they know everything they need to know already, but they know almost nothing because they hate to learn.
They want you to do everything their way, except their ways and ideas are idiotic because they're idiots.
They don't mind their own business. They interfere and try hard to take control of you.
They work really hard but most of them remain poor because they are stupid and have a slave mentality.
They work hard but they work stupid. They do stupid work.
They can't work smart because they don't have any smart ideas. Far from it, because ESTJ's believe in being very stupid as a way of life.
In fact, ESTJ's don't believe in intelligence or anything intelligent. It's a useless excess to them. It has no place.
They use the brute force method of getting through life.
They don't believe in letting people be themselves and live their own lives how they like.
One of the major reasons that it sucks so much to work in a job for other people is that there are often ESTJ's in charge.
They believe that just providing the most basic necessities of life means they are good people, but at the same time they kill you as a person and this means nothing to them.
Wow what a baised view. Cry me a river. ESTJ's at least have a good foundation to work from as you sound like your in a morning process. You have my pitty, there are you happy?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
122 Posts
Wow what a baised view. Cry me a river. ESTJ's at least have a good foundation to work from as you sound like your in a morning process. You have my pitty, there are you happy?
This thread is called "ESTJ Stereotypes" for a reason.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
838 Posts
The problem is that half the things he said are true about SJs; This is from my vast experience with SJs in my family and their friends. SJs seek to control and enslave because they're slaves to society; I've yet to meet an SJ that hasn't told me to stop being so weird and act like a 'normal' human being.

I'm not biased to them; I just try to avoid them because I know how they're going to treat me. However, if it makes them happy to live that way then I won't interfere with them either.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
707 Posts
Killionaire, I'm really sorry that you had a bad experience with an ESTJ somewhere along the line, but we're not all like that. Yes, we like order and discipline, but it exists for the better good. We have more important things on our agendas than to make you miserable. I find myself extremely intellectual and constantly on a search for ways to better myself. And hearts of stone? Really? I foster kittens for the Humane Society, I volunteer with children, and I am a very symapthetic person when I see someone who is upset...
We LOVE traditions and culture! Read up on our values!
We are HONEST. Don't ask questions you don't want answers to. We don't say things to be hurtful. Truth can sometimes be hurtful.
We generally only take charge if we think that we can do a better job than what is being done. If someone is more competent than we are, we let them do it. Effeciency is key.
I am not poor.

Sorry, but as long as you're in the workforce, you're probably going to deal with us. Having this perception of us is ultimately only going to hurt you, because we're going to be too busy doing our jobs to notice how you feel about us. You should probably try contributing more and we will respect you for it. Do a good job and we'll tell you you've done a good job. Don't expect warm and fuzzy compliments from us because we don't even give them to ourselves, much less you. We speak the truth. Earn your compliments.
 
61 - 80 of 435 Posts
Top