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ok so alot of people like to say fe is superficial and in the background i also thought this untill i heard my esfp sister talking to our ma on the phone,she was pretending to be nice and all,bit it just seemed completly fake,then i realized that fe is genuinly nice and soothing,and fe users are generaly interested in people so they can appear too nice which makes it seem fake,but that is actualy there honest imnterest in people
 

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I am not completely sure of what I am going to say, but I think the S function plays an important role. In my experience for example ENFx seem to me less fake than ESFx (especially ESFP and ENFP compared). Maybe Fe users overall might be a little be less authentic but I reckon the real difference between Fi and Fe users lies in what pushes them into being fake; at the moment I can't clearly see that difference though lol... What I noticed is that maybe Fe users are more aware of their unauthenticity .
 

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An INFJ--at least, this INFJ--giving Fe the reins is like being a small unit manning a watchtower. The officer, scanning the horizon, sees an evidently lost stranger come into view, and sends out a patrol to look into the matter, telling the patrol to be accommodating. The patrol makes friendly contact with the stranger, gives itself over to helping him out, and makes the stranger's interests its own interests. Meanwhile the officer is still in the watchtower, scrutinizing through binoculars what's going on with the stranger and the patrol, looking on the proceedings with a cool and detached eye and making executive decisions based on the nature of what's happening. The patrol isn't inauthentic in looking after the stranger's interests, and meanwhile the officer (and thus the unit as a whole) isn't inauthentic in seeing what's going on and thereby deciding, more objectively, what's best to do in the situation. The user of Fe is both the officer and the patrol; but the officer is in charge, while the patrol is what most others see.
 

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Extroverted Feeling: voted most helpful function in regards to helping people (as a whole) on an emotional level and also the most efficient at getting everyone to work together cohesively year after painstaking year.

The Internet: Fe is fake! FAAAAAAAAKE!

sigh.

ME: yes, yes; a function that helps connect people on a genuine level is the fake function. And what does that make Fi? genuine? Real?

Come on, Fi can be fake too. The rebellious kids of my "generation" who wanted to be themselves by being "different" kinda prove it. Oh, the skull tattoos, outrageously colored hair and that rudeness is just "you being true to yourself"? Then why is EVERYBODY else doing it?

Maybe us Fi users are simply in denial and don't want to admit that Fe is only fake when our Fi pretends to have it. :kitteh:
 

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Maybe us Fi users are simply in denial and don't want to admit that Fe is only fake when our Fi pretends to have it. :kitteh:
You just have to keep showing them that it really is okay to cut off a finger every time the group doesn't comply with your wishes.
 

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Unlike what "Typology"-fetishtists claim, (Fe) and (Fi) haven't much to do with "authencity," as a persona -- and as such, it is not that (Fi) humanoids are "more authentic," than (Fe) users, because this makes no sense, but rather ("Fi") users have a fixation on, or bias towards 'what is authentic' as a concept, and incorrectly attribute this as some 'intrinsic' trait unique to the introverted-feeler, not that they are authentic themselves, even if such biases blind the humanoids to fetish authencity as a 'main aim', (Fi) by implication does not imply 'authenticity' any more then (Fe) excludes it. :facepalm:

Similar to the "aiming to be a perfectionist," bias, the humanoids that fall victim to this particular bias, are more often than not, substantially imperfect. I would not take any humanoid claiming, "I am more authentic - or 'obsessed with authenticity' than Fe users, because Fi," anymore seriously than the "I am a true perfectionist - and want perfection in everything," nonesnse.
 

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Unlike what "Typology"-fetishtists claim, (Fe) and (Fi) haven't much to do with "authencity," as a persona -- and as such, it is not that (Fi) humanoids are "more authentic," than (Fe) users, because this makes no sense, but rather ("Fi") users have a fixation on, or bias towards 'what is authentic' as a concept, and incorrectly attribute this as some 'intrinsic' trait unique to the introverted-feeler, not that they are authentic themselves, even if such biases blind the humanoids to fetish authencity as a 'main aim', (Fi) by implication does not imply 'authenticity' any more then (Fe) excludes it. :facepalm:

Similar to the "aiming to be a perfectionist," bias, the humanoids that fall victim to this particular bias, are more often than not, substantially imperfect. I would not take any humanoid claiming, "I am more authentic - or 'obsessed with authenticity' than Fe users, because Fi," anymore seriously than the "I am a true perfectionist - and want perfection in everything," nonesnse.
Many thanks--you anticipated this humanoid's question (and what you state "feels" right to me). I sat down at the computer saying to myself, "Perhaps it would be pertinent to ask 'Hm. What is this authenticity, to different types? Where does authenticity reside?'."
 

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ok so alot of people like to say fe is superficial and in the background i also thought this untill i heard my esfp sister talking to our ma on the phone,she was pretending to be nice and all,bit it just seemed completly fake,then i realized that fe is genuinly nice and soothing,and fe users are generaly interested in people so they can appear too nice which makes it seem fake,but that is actualy there honest imnterest in people
the functions for esfp are SeFi ...sounds like you got confused into thinking that esfp have Fe.

In anycase, I would say everyone is an different and you shouldn't use any individual to judge everyone of their type or expect an individual to fit into how you've stereotyped their mbti type. A tendency to be or striving to be authentic I would think is more an after effect of someone's mbti type... so a certain behavior that's authentic or attitude towards authenticity might be common among a type... but isn't going to be all the same for everyone fitting into a type
 

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Many thanks--you anticipated this humanoid's question (and what you state "feels" right to me). I sat down at the computer saying to myself, "Perhaps it would be pertinent to ask 'Hm. What is this authenticity, to different types? Where does authenticity reside?'."
As I see it, (Fe-users) are being authentic; anytime they are "just being (Fe)-users," or exuding their functions as they are meant to function..... So, I reckon (Fi)-specimens that claim there is a potentiality for (Fe) to be 'fake' -- are blinded by a particular self-defeating bias to see the authentic expressions in others distinct from themselves. It seems (Fe) sees multiple distinct 'authencities', and do not take it as something fixed to particular types of people, or something that fluctuates with the circumstance / state-of-affairs...

And, indeed, the Schizophrenics do mutter falsities and other gibber from time to time, but who am I to say this isn't a 'real' Schizophrenic, because he isn't speaking "my kind of gibberish," just right.. :facepalm:
 

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Extraverted feelers tend to modify themselves according to their sense of what might upset the general feeling situation.

I show an extraverted feeler my attempt at a Jackson Pollock-style painting and they think it's really ugly. It looks like dog vomit.
I say, "Isn't it beautiful?! I worked so hard to create this. What do you think?!"

The extraverted feeler's response will tend to be modified and filtered so as to not upset my feeling. They might just agree with me that it's beautiful even though their true opinion is that it's ugly. In that case the extraverted feeler is not being authentic. Compromising oneself in that way is not at all ideal. I can see how people would interpret those kinds of modifications as inauthenticity.

The tension between the contrary feeling evaluations of the painting (ugly/beautiful) can lead to the creation of truths which exist somewhere in between, e.g. "Well, you know what they say. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder."
 

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Extraverted feelers tend to modify themselves according to their sense of what might upset the general feeling situation.

I show an extraverted feeler my attempt at a Jackson Pollock-style painting and they think it's really ugly. It looks like dog vomit.
I say, "Isn't it beautiful?! I worked so hard to create this. What do you think?!"

The extraverted feeler's response will tend to be modified and filtered so as to not upset my feeling. They might just agree with me that it's beautiful even though their true opinion is that it's ugly. In that case the extraverted feeler is not being authentic. Compromising oneself in that way is not at all ideal. I can see how people would interpret those kinds of modifications as inauthenticity.

The tension between the contrary feeling evaluations of the painting (ugly/beautiful) can lead to the creation of truths which exist somewhere in between, e.g. "Well, you know what they say. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder."
But of course if you define the situation simply as "Fe thinks something is x and then says it's y," it's inauthentic pretty much by definition. But that misses the true whole paradigm that Fe is drawing on. What Fe already thinks is more like what you come to at the end of your posting: Fe-person might think it's ugly in the aesthetic estimation of the particular Fe-person BUT realizes that the entirety of the universe is not subsumed in the particular Fe-person, and so, noting that otherperson is of a different opinion, grants that there is a reasonable possibility that otherperson's opinion could be correct as far as otherperson's aesthetic goes, which overall has just as much right and validity as Fe-person's has. And so, rather than to in effect say, "I'm me, and everything I say or think is the final word," Fe-person, seeing the bigger picture, allows for otherly beauty. What's the point of insisting that it's ugly when it's already an established fact that no single person has a monopoly on such aesthetic decisions? Rather, it's being parochial and childish. Fe senses the larger world, respects it, and renders opinions and observations which are unselfish and authentic in representing Fe-person's view of the world. The question asked of the Fe-person was, "What do you think?" Fe-person thinks that all things can have beauty, and that, in considering things, it is desirable that self-absorption give way to selflessness, that narrow views give way to wider views. The way to truth doesn't come from little pointless squabbles between individuals but rather from personal and private epiphanies. Fe-person does not see that authenticity is bound up with selfishness; Fe-person's notions of authenticity are on another plane.

And if you ask me, "Well, then why didn't you just agree with me?", I'd answer, "Because we're here to engage in pointless squabbles."
 

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Extraverted feelers tend to modify themselves according to their sense of what might upset the general feeling situation.

I show an extraverted feeler my attempt at a Jackson Pollock-style painting and they think it's really ugly. It looks like dog vomit.
I say, "Isn't it beautiful?! I worked so hard to create this. What do you think?!"

The extraverted feeler's response will tend to be modified and filtered so as to not upset my feeling. They might just agree with me that it's beautiful even though their true opinion is that it's ugly. In that case the extraverted feeler is not being authentic. Compromising oneself in that way is not at all ideal. I can see how people would interpret those kinds of modifications as inauthenticity.

The tension between the contrary feeling evaluations of the painting (ugly/beautiful) can lead to the creation of truths which exist somewhere in between, e.g. "Well, you know what they say. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder."
What happens to those feelings that you wanted to express about the painting? Where do they go?
 

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What happens to those feelings that you wanted to express about the painting? Where do they go?
An unhealthy extraverted feeler will just continually self-suppress. They'll live a life where they're always subordinating their subjective feeling to the objective feeling situation.

If I find my feeling overextraverting and agreeing with something that internally I disagree with then I'll usually go back and reflect on the situation after the fact and pick apart all the elements to understand why it happened. There are always a variety of feeling-values being weighed and evaluated simultaneously so it's never quite as simple as the example I gave.

The ideal outcome for me usually involves a bringing together of seemingly incommensurable feeling-evaluations. The contrary feeling-values are somehow combined and transmuted into a view which incorporates and represents each feeling-value without compromising or upsetting any of them. This often happens unconsciously and in a fraction of a second.

There's something in me that leaps with joy when it finds a way to successfully reconcile contrary feeling-values. When it works there's a feeling of wholeness to it. My response will be felt as personal and heartful. Not clichéd. It's usually experienced by others as charm. It endears me to those around me.
 

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Well, no one is a singular function. I'm not Fe, I'm an INFJ. NF's in general, tend to all care a lot about authenticity. FP's tend to put an extra importance on it as well so it being even more so magnified in xNFP's.

All that being said, everyone is inauthentic sometimes. That's human nature.

I was helping out an ISFP one time and he was very suspicious of my kindness. He asked me if I am really this nice or if it is fake. And I was thinking "would you prefer for me to be an asshole?" lol But I said "well, no one is nice ALL the time" and went on how I genuinely enjoy helping people or I wouldn't be there. It's because I genuinely care about people. And yes, it would have been inappropriate for me to be an asshole in that context since I was counseling him. So no, it would have not been okay for me to just saying anything that popped into my head. Does that mean I was less authentic or just socially aware? I think the latter but you can call it the former if you're being silly.
 

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What happens to those feelings that you wanted to express about the painting? Where do they go?
I think this is a very good question. And I sense that attached to your question is concern, perhaps a concern for truth. But I may be wrong.

The thing is, as far as I'm concerned, people's opinions and feelings about stuff are not 'objective truth'. Of course, to say that one feels sad when one feels happy is a lie. But to say that a picture is interesting when one thinks it is ugly is not, in my mind. This is a presentation of the truth that I can live with, because there are many facets to the truth. And not all facets need to be expressed, or are helpful to anyone if expressed.

Moving away from the picture scenario now. Sometimes what people ask is also not what people mean, and there is wisdom and love in trying to understand the question behind a question before answering. An example "Do you think I am fat?" can mean just that, or it can conceal the real question "Do you think I'm a bad/worthless/good for nothing person?" (sorry to anyone who asks this question without that level of insecurity). I could answer the question bluntly with "Yes", but does that answer truly express my opinion on the issue? How can I answer both the express and underlying question truthfully? I think these are worthwhile types of questions to ponder, but tend to 'go over the head' of 'rationals'. Apologies, if this is not the case for you, and I mean no disrespect. I would be interested in your thoughts on this matter.
 

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@naren You've been posting a lot of interesting questions on our forum. Thank you. One polite request however, 'unorthentic', eurghh...

Orthentic is not a word. If we were INTPs I imagine we would have a field day playing with all the other things you could mean instead, like orthodontic. Fe and and how it messes up our smiles by twisting our teeth out of shape, etc (obviously, I'm not INTP, because I have no wit whatsoever). Pleeeaaase. I have a mind to avoid all threads with badly mispelled titles in the hope that they will disappear off our front page faster. I'm guilty of typos myself too, but still, at least try, spelling and grammar matters..
 
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