[Kynx]

I've been thinking about Fi and the decision process used since it is a judging function. Since I often make decisions that don't involve any emotions and I don't continually skip from Fi to Te and back all the time, Fi must be thinking as I know it, just using different data to the logical T functions.

Aside from the aspects concerning strongly held values and those concerning strong emotions which are often discussed, I wanted to separate emotions from the feeling tones that are always present day to day.

Jung stated that everything that can be said for Ti can also be said for Fi, only Ti is thought and Fi is felt.

I'm trying to emphasise on the process used for the decisions that seemingly come by way of what is often referred to as gut instincts. The judgements that are almost instant without any conscious weighing up of options.
For example, noticing inconsistencies in feeling tones that gives you the sense that someone is being fake or times when you immediately know which option is the best one without even considering any relevant pros and cons.
When I get an immediate, strong feeling about a decision I am extremely confident in that decision because up to now, I've never regretted the choice I've made using that sense of 'knowing'.

Is that Fi working at an optimal level?

I've concluded that if so, it must be due to constant feeling tones being collected as information and used to navigate our way through life.

What I'm asking is does any of this make sense to you and if so, can you offer any further insight into it?

Any feedback would be appreciated

 

[illicit iridescence]

Jung stated that everything that can be said for Ti can also be said for Fi, only Ti is thought and Fi is felt.

I think this is true - how Fi judges is not by your (current) emotions but by how you feel about the decision. Ti: "This is the most correct answer, for it is the most logical." Fi: "This is the most correct answer, for it is how things should be (/it feels right)." Sort of?

You're right to discern one decision from another, I think, since not all decisions involve 'having to feel about it', but one may instinctively feel about it anyways as an Fi-dom, even if the decision doesn't require a Feeling judgment.

I'm trying to emphasise on the process used for the decisions that seemingly come by way of what is often referred to as gut instincts. The judgements that are almost instant without any conscious weighing up of options.
For example, noticing inconsistencies in feeling tones that gives you the sense that someone is being fake or times when you immediately know which option is the best one without even considering any relevant pros and cons.
When I get an immediate, strong feeling about a decision I am extremely confident in that decision because up to now, I've never regretted the choice I've made using that sense of 'knowing'.

Is that Fi working at an optimal level?

Gut feelings may also be supported by Si. Si is usually a little more unconscious than conscious to INFP's, so it's processes are mostly veiled to you. It explains the 'guttery' part of the gut feeling, perhaps. The inconsistencies in feeling tones that you mention. This is all conjecture on my part, though.

But yeah, Quenk says that the more differentiated (/mature/optimal) a function is, the more mature, refined, fast, confident, energy efficient etc.

I've concluded that if so, it must be due to constant feeling tones being collected as information and used to navigate our way through life.

Perhaps Fi+Ne+Si?

 

[Kynx]

@eyenexepee
I could see how Si could also notice inconsistencies, looks like I also need an ISFP opinion then. You're right, I'm sure Ne has a major part in this too.

 

[illicit iridescence]

Sometimes we tend to zoom in on one function, while it is important to keep considering functions in their context (i.e. other functions or the psyche as a whole). "Justice without force is powerless; force without justice is tyrannical." :3

 

[Kynx]

@eyenexepee

I think it could be an Fi /Fe thing

:laughing:

 

[illicit iridescence]

@Neverontime, I think I love you and hate you. Yours truly not forever. xD

And yunno what, zooming in on an object is considered Ni, if we're going down for a stroll down Ne/Ni lane.

 

[Kynx]

@Neverontime, I think I love you and hate you. Yours truly not forever. xD

And yunno what, zooming in on an object is considered Ni, if we're going down for a stroll down Ne/Ni lane.

:laughing: let me get Ne under control because I can't let you see how weird I am just yet. :laughing:
Mine can twist just about any statement in order to lower the tone btw

Everyone, I was joking about the Fe/Fi btw

 

[illicit iridescence]

Everyone, I was joking about the Fe/Fi btw

Yayaya xD But what tone do you mean with:

Mine [Ne?] can twist just about any statement in order to lower the tone btw

 

[Kynx]

@eyenexepee lower the tone = make the conversation less suitable. :wink:

 

[illicit iridescence]

@eyenexepee lower the tone = make the conversation less suitable. :wink:

0_o

Oh! You mean, less suitable for the younger audience?

o_0

Hide yo kids, hide you wife!

(Okay, enough derailing... xD )

 

[Hycocritical truth teller]

I have a question now here - we all know here that in this theory feeling is not emotion.
But in many cases i had people who are less into the theory telling me "i would never say you are an F person". Ofc i waited to hear their argument on it and they said "well you know...emotions...you get to be rather calmed about it...".

So i got thinking...do you believe that F person if more prone to be emotional then T person?

@eyenexepee
@Neverontime

 

[Kynx]

@Hycocritical truth teller when did you sneak in?
That's a difficult question, what do you think?

@eyenexepee I think it's still safe to derail

 

[illicit iridescence]

I have a question now here - we all know here that in this theory feeling is not emotion.
But in many cases i had people who are less into the theory telling me "i would never say you are an F person". Ofc i waited to hear their argument on it and they said "well you know...emotions...you get to be rather calmed about it...".

So i got thinking...do you believe that F person if more prone to be emotional then T person?

Well, assuming you're an INFP, your F is introverted, inwards. Your F cognition tends to stay inside of you, rather than being brought to the external world. So that's one thing: you don't necessarily wear your heart on your sleeve (just a saying, a generalization even). Another thing is that judging is a rational process: it serves an end (Jung said perceiving functions are therefore irrational, sort of). People who aren't much into MBTI don't know that you can be perfectly calm and still be a Feeler.

Being a Feeler = you prefer judging things by how you feel about them, more than how things fit with your logic.

So it's absolutely not about how explosive you are, considering emotions.

As for your question... No, I don't think so, I don't think either is less prone to be emotional. That is, if with "emotional", you mean: overtaken by / filled with / experiencing emotions.

Let me try to put that more precisely.

* An xxFx has Feeling as dominant or auxiliary function. Which only says something about preferring to evaluate by how something feels. Keyword: preference.
* An xxTx has Thinking as dominant or auxiliary function. This person prefers to evaluate by how something fits in their logical framework. Keyword here also: preference.

You see, preference does not exclude or rule out the opposite. You may prefer vanilla ice cream, but you could probably still eat chocolate chip ice cream. Just because you prefer to think, doesn't mean you do not feel, and vice versa.

However, if you prefer a function, you use that function more often. You get better at it. At the same time, you are not developing the opposite of that function. Because you prefer vanilla ice cream, you get better at discerning one brand of vanilla ice cream from another, but you may be bad at discerning different brands of chocolate chip ice cream.

* An xxFx becomes pretty good at using Feeling, while Thinking is the third or inferior function. This person's Thinking judgments are therefore not really developed.
* An xxTx becomes pretty good at using Thinking, while Feeling is the third or inferior function. This person's Feeling judgments are therefore not really developed.

Does that mean one of these two is less prone to be emotional? No... It means that one of these two is better at judging through Feeling, and the other better at judging through Thinking.

However, the person who is better at using Feeling for judgments than Thinking is more in contact with her/his own feelings, aware of her/his feelings. Therefore this person is probably better at handling emotions - but not necessarily less emotional.

Vice versa, the person who is better at using Thinking for judgments than Feeling, is more in contact with / aware of her/his thoughts. This person is probably better at guiding her/his thoughts than handling his emotions - but not necessarily less emotional: not necessarily less overtaken / experiencing / filled with emotion.

See what I'm saying?

@Neverontime, shush, lemme get some Te done here first xD

 

[Kynx]

@eyenexepee I'm shhhed
*nods and agrees*

 

[Belovodia]

I find that a very interesting question "Are feelers more prone to be more emotional"?
I have often wondered about that and based simply on observation, it does seem to be
so. But, of of course my observations might be incorrect and I don't know how to
substantiate whether it is true or not.

I'm surrounded by feelers and they all seem to be extremely emotional so I just put
two and two together.

 

[illicit iridescence]

I'm surrounded by feelers and they all seem to be extremely emotional so I just put two and two together.

It does depend on what you define 'emotional' as. I've came up with another definition: to be mostly preoccupied with one's feelings or emotions. In that sense, I think yeah, Feelers are 'emotional'.

 

[Hycocritical truth teller]

That is, if with "emotional", you mean: overtaken by / filled with / experiencing emotions.

I've came up with another definition: to be mostly preoccupied with one's feelings or emotions. In that sense, I think yeah, Feelers are 'emotional'.

So after defining it...i have to ask - since feeling doesn't have anything to do with emotions - seems like you find feelers to be rather occupied with not only their feelings but with their emotions.
It's often hard for me to say how i understand the term "feeling" as it seems that when i understood it i felt click but with no words attached. But i think for now im fine with this understanding even if it's hard for me to put it in words.
But in general @Belovodia has the same experience like i do. But i would like to add that not only pre-occupied with their feelings i also have experience when mostly all feelers i know have very strong intensity of emotions.
I personally understand feeling as guideline of some kind. A certain "feeling" to go this or that way, to make decisions according to a feeling instinct.

And i do understand the preference - this wasn't a theory question, it was mostly experience question and possibility to maybe connect experiences with this theory. But i like the way @eyenexepee defined feeling with feelers in her last post...it was insightful. So you boosted that Te in that in that post *claps*

However, the person who is better at using Feeling for judgments than Thinking is more in contact with her/his own feelings, aware of her/his feelings. Therefore this person is probably better at handling emotions - but not necessarily less emotional.

Ill be honest - i know many feelers unable to cope with their emotions. I personally had many internal preparations with myself to handle better things. But ti seems that some Fi friends i have also had but they didn't manage it quite well.
Im personally not very expressive - i keep it to myself and im guided by it but not openly and externally.
But it's gunny when you mentioned feelers don't have to expressive or not...cuz i know both cases (myself rather inexpressive and some who are very expressive).
Which makes me think...i was always confused when people would say Fe expresses his feelings but Fi is more closed about it. Which makes me think about definition of Fe and Fi. Seems like many people consider or clarify Fe as expressive feeler and Fi as unexpressive feeler. Any explanation here i would like to hear - cuz i am rather confused with it.

@Hycocritical truth teller when did you sneak in?
That's a difficult question, what do you think?

@Neverontime Like a ninja, i was watching and you haven't even knew *sneaky*

Also - i agree with @eyenexepee i wouldn't necessarily connect it either but i can't help to notice what im noticing and what ive been told.

What i personally think is that feeling is different word in here from emotion. I wouldn't necessarily connect it but i wouldn't completely disconnect it.
I wouldn't disconnect it because as you can see, my experience says smth but this, but in theory i would disconnect it to some point.
But i know thinkers who had pretty bad emotional reaction occasionally while i know certain feelers who handle it pretty well on their own or through talk with other people and seem easily calmed about it.
But since for example dominant thinkers i noticed reject their Feeling function putting it into inferior position, i noticed they are missing things in interpersonal relationships and often confuse people for not taking them into a consideration when deciding smth. And they hardly notice it even when you mention it to them. But that could be also lack of contact with others feelings and their own.
It's a tricky subject for me - i don't like to come and claim to people they can't decide they are feelers cuz they are emotional, cuz it could be also they meant to say "it's with what i prefer to occupies myself" - so i often have to put additional question here to see what they really meant with what they have said. And another problem - you can't completely go into someones head.

 

[Kynx]

@Hycocritical truth teller

I only wanted to separate emotions from feeling to discuss in the thread, otherwise lots of people start posting about feeling judgements made because of strong emotions and deeply held values.
Which is difficult to separate the two because they are so closely connected.

I was hoping to focus on the decisions made with what seems to me, less obvious feeling tones, that don't have names exactly. It's difficult to describe because all the descriptive words I can think of can be easily misinterpreted for a slightly different but closely related concept.
Now I'm just confusing myself
:laughing:
I need someone to come explain to me what I meant :laughing:
smdh

 

[Hycocritical truth teller]

@Neverontime shall i summon someone to help ya? lol sry if i messed with the thread but the question crossed my mind whiel reading this thread...for some reason
but this was also on Fi since i asked for a possibel connection aka opinion
but you wanted some abstract feeling tones maybe so i did got off the subject
so basically you want us to express Fi with words exactly because it's the hardest function express with words? *final realization of Fi in words*

 

[Kynx]

@Hycocritical truth teller

Haha, don't worry.
@eyenexepee and I had already derailed anyway