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Discussion Starter #1
Hello fellow ESTPs. This is probably dumb..but here goes!

There's something I've struggled with for the duration of my whole life - everytime I'm forced to follow SPECIFIC instructions (verbal, written) I fail to follow through. No matter what it is, the task becomes a chore and all my motivation for completing it is gone. And if I do try, my results turn out to be meagre. Allow me to improvise however-leave me in the dark, tell me it's impossible- and it's like I'm a hamster on coffee.
So, my question is - is this an xSTP specific thing?
 

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ISFJ 6w7 sp/so
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I don't know about others, but I prefer instructions with very clear expectations and guidelines, or else I'm confused and at a total loss about what to do. I guess my Thinking preference is weaker than other Thinkers, though.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Huh, didn't expect that..something to consider then..
Detailed instructions frustrate and provoke me to find a different way (it's contextual of course).
 

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Yeah, there's a line. Too many details overwhelm me. Tell me what to do but not how. I like to figure that part out by myself. My experience is that ESTPs and ENTJs are the best bosses for me. ENTPs are too vague and ESTJs are too bossy with the process. I plead the fifth for my experience with Feeler bosses.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Heh, my current boss is an ESTJ, and from what I've seen, he's pretty rigid in his demands, doesn't let anything slidexD
He's pretty gallant towards his wife, however his daughter is kept on a short leash (she's hyper, so no help therexD).
I've had the pleasure of working with/for who I considered to be an ENTJ - she knew just how to nudge things in the right direction, remained true to her vision, while giving me just enough leeway to do as I see fit. She was pretty emotional, but not many people could see that through her "neutral" exterior (except on one occasion - she actually started crying in front of my class when announcing our director's suicide). We saw eye to eye on most things, and openly argued about those we didn't.
 

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Is it an argument or a discussion of trying to make sense of things in different ways?
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I suppose we had differing views on some things - where I perceived certain issues as unimportant, she insisted I dedicate more efforts towards resolving them. I'm a fan of cutting corners, often omitting what I think of as "details". It's a double-edged sword:)

Do you respect your ENTJ bosses?
 

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As far as I know, I've only worked for one. He was great. He would tell me what he wanted me to do and didn't care about the process, and then because he's incredibly busy would leave me unsupervised to do the job, which I did. It's just that when I completed a task I wanted to be sure he was okay with it and he was hard to find.

Yeah it is interesting what Se users in different ways consider "details" or "important".
 

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Depends on with what.

For example at my work I am absolutely a stickler for the rules when it involves liability. (I work in health care). ie the specifics on med instructions and distribution. Oddly I think in that regard I can even be more of a stickler for following those kinds of procedures then the many SFJs I work with (alot of them can be careless). When it has to do with liability with myself or a bosses licenses hanging in the balance. Well yeah I follow instructions very clear and concise. This alone tho could actually be an inferior Ni thing, ie I dont trust mother fuckers and do not put much past many people, ie always cover your ass and dont hand people ammunition.

Outside of liability in procedures tho well yeah I just take everything I want into my own hands. I usually get away with it in work places because I go above and beyond in the end result. But yeah I totally do not follow instruction on steps usually. I say usually because honestly I will sound arrogant af. But seriously Its pretty rare that at most of my jobs I have encountered many others who are better with step by step process and procedure and productivity. I mean it is kind of my specific selling point in work environments. I know exactly how to get a job a done by not being careless with liability or omitting important things. But as well as know exactly what the hell is nonsense detail one can block out. OMGawd nothing more annoying then the few STJs I work with wanting to pull out stupid details that are not imminent (and yet some of these f'ers are really careless when they think no one is looking about skimming important shit).

I cannot follow a shit head into the desert nor can I just disobey something because I hate rules. I go with what makes the most sense. Some details are important. I skim and find the important shit and then set the manual down. Manual is a guide not an absolute.
 

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Hello fellow ESTPs. This is probably dumb..but here goes!

There's something I've struggled with for the duration of my whole life - everytime I'm forced to follow SPECIFIC instructions (verbal, written) I fail to follow through. No matter what it is, the task becomes a chore and all my motivation for completing it is gone. And if I do try, my results turn out to be meagre. Allow me to improvise however-leave me in the dark, tell me it's impossible- and it's like I'm a hamster on coffee.
So, my question is - is this an xSTP specific thing?
I am Exactly the same way. However if I'm being paid to do something with strict rules, I will still feel a heavy burden getting it done, and I will, but as last minute as possible. But like you said, if you say it's impossible or that it needs to be improvised, not only will I get it done, but I'll enjoy the work! And that's something that one of my past bosses figured out on her own with me. I worked at a restaurant and there were plenty of makeshift things to improvise on, and I really thrived in that.
But when it came to rules I would either break them and have better results, which my manager liked but my boss didn't, or follow them and do poorly, which my manager didn't like but my boss did. Glad I'm not there anymore!

Now I'm running my own blacksmith business and the thing I'm struggling with the most right now is not being able to take risks all the time. Because people don't pay for time spent remaking failed projects. Which most of them take a long time and can fail at any point. So not being able to improvise a way to do some things takes all the fun out of making whatever someone has ordered from me.

Where as my INFJ brother and dad don't mind following rules and even especially so if it's the hardest way to do things.

My INTJ sister and friend refuse to do things if it's "Stupid" but will feel the disorder of no rules and will take on the responsibility for making rules and will show through following their rules that they get work done better.

A ENTP friend of mine admittedly doesn't do anything with or without rules. That is probs just him though!

My ISFP sister and mother will feel burdened by rules but they get things done none the less. Especially if it's self sacrificing.

But yeah a ISTP friend of mine will breaks rules like me. He's just more subtle where I'm pretty obvious about it. But he can still get things done just fine without the need for risk or challenge. It could be just him though.


Glad I'm not the only one though!
 

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Discussion Starter #12
I think it makes perfect sense for you to actually follow instructions due to your line of work:) It's a helluva responsibility afterall, and only a complete retard would risk someone's life cuz he/she "doesn't play by the rulezzzz":)
 
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