Personality Cafe banner

1 - 20 of 87 Posts

·
MOTM June 2010
Joined
·
2,507 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Function-Attitudes Applied In Differing Scenarios​


We tend to discuss function-attitude usage in theory, but I am unsure why we have not posted how they actually work in application. Below are examples taken from her booklet, “Dynamics of Personality Type: Understanding and Applying Jung’s Cognitive Processes”, where Linda Berens gives some examples of how the functions work. Granted the scenarios may be hokey to some, but I know her examples were very helpful for me in determining my auxiliary preference.


The first example is how each function-attitude may react to encountering an apple tree:

Se - You might look at the apple tree and notice the contrast of the ruby red apples and the deep green leaves, the rich brown-gray of the trunk and branches, and how the sunlight plays across the yard. You go to the tree and pick an apple, and bite into it with a crunch, savoring the tree ripened sweetness and the aroma of a really fresh apple. Sitting down on the ground you feel the coolness under you and the warmth of the sun.

Si – You look at the apple tree and immediately recall an image of an apple tree you’ve seen before and you were then become aware of the feel of autumn in the air and remember being in an apple orchard picking apples.

Ne – You might wonder why the former owner of your house planted an apple tree and why this kind of apple tree. Then you might consider why this kind of apple tree grows well in this climate but not in others. Or maybe it occurs to you that your life is like this apple tree in so many ways. Then you might be curious if apples represent the same ideas in other cultures and so on. Or you may even wonder, “What if the apple tree did not exist?”

Ni – If you did not even notice the apple tree this there, but instead go a sense that the orchards around will soon be cut down and replaced with a housing development, you have experienced Ni.

Te – You notice the fruit was starting to fall off the tree and make a mental note to get several containers to put the apples in. You would have a trashcan handy for the rotten ones and a basket for the ripe ones to wash and put on the table. You would also have a plastic pan for the ones that are bruised, but not rotten, to cut up for applesauce.

Ti – You might notice that the leaves are falling off early. You would analyze the situation and try to figure out what is wrong with the tree. You might use the principles of good gardening, or you might reference the scientific principles of plant disease

Fe – You might think about removing the tree because of the mess the apples make on the ground, but then remember that your family really likes having that old apple tree around. So you decide not to remove it. Besides you might think, Aunt Mary really likes apple pie made with those apples and make a mental note to bake an apple pie for her. In deciding what to do with the tree, the likes and dislikes of others are considered and adjusted to.

Fi – You might reflect on how much you really like that tree and the apples it yields. You might even consider the importance of having a fruit tree for the children to learn from.


The second example is a little different since it actually allows us to the differing function- attitudes used in the same person looking for a dog:

Se - Lenore was beside herself with joy as she played with the puppies in the pet store. She seemed to enjoy just being with them, petting them, making them jump.

Si - Lenore’s sister kept saying how much the standard poodle looked like the one they had as children. She said it reminded her of being at home and being young again.

Ne - During their conversation, Lenore suddenly recognized that the real reason her sister wanted a dog was because she was trying to replace the affection from her late husband.

Ni - Lenore was thinking about the dog she and her sister were going to get when she got a flash of a dog barking and crying. The she “knew” they needed to get a dog that didn’t mind being alone.

Te - Lenore listed criteria she and her sister needed to match in selecting a dog. She wanted to be sure the dog didn’t need a lot of attention since they were not home during the day. They lived in an apartment, so it was only logical it should be a small dog that didn’t bark much.

Ti - On the way home, Lenore went into the pet store with her checklist. She looked at a cocker spaniel and a standard poodle and found out how big each one grew and if it barked a lot. She decided the standard poodle didn’t meet her criteria but wasn’t sure about the cocker spaniel, she thought maybe she should consider a dachshund.

Fe - Lenore thought about what kind of dog her sister would want. She knew her sister would be disappointed if they couldn’t get a standard poodle, so she decided to not even mention that one in the pet store was still there.

Fi - Lenore’s sister came home with a stranded poodle. When Lenore asked her why, her sister said, “We’ve always wanted a standard poodle like we used to have. This one was so cute and was going to be sent to the pound, so I just had to bring it home.”
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
261 Posts
I'm not so sure how useful situational scenarios would be in describing cognitive functions. In the first one, I have had similar thoughts to the Se, Ni, Te, Ti and to a lesser degree Si, Ne, and Fi. For the second one, Se, Ne, Ni, Te, Ti and Fe.

What I mean is, since we utilize all eight cognitive functions, the situation may determine a non dominant function to play the role. Everyone is going use their dominant and minior functions differently towards different situations.

*bolded: functions I heavily identify with according to the situation
 

·
MOTM Nov 2010
Joined
·
10,402 Posts
Thank you for this!

I'm Ne Fi Te Si.

The first example was hard for me to relate to. I wouldn't really notice an apple tree. My mind would be somewhere else. Probably focusing on analyzing people. And I don't know if my Fi cares all that much about apples. It can't "jump inside of them" and feel what they feel.

However, the second example is so spot on correct when it comes to Ne. I can also somewhat relate to Fi in the second example.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
247 Posts
In those examples, I'm all Se. Though if I was standing around the apple tree for longer than a few minutes, I'd start heading into Ti, and just stay there until something shiny caught my attention peripherally, or a litter of puppies was dropped in front of me. Then I'd be back to Se'in it. :happy:
 

·
MOTM June 2010
Joined
·
2,507 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thanks for the responses everyone. I was hesitant to respond too quickly because I wanted to get a few introverting types to give their input before responding. When I read these descriptions (by the way there were others as well) years ago it instantly put to rest any thoughts of being an intuiting type. I was confused however why my Se would be so pronounced and my Ti non existent. Did that mean I may be ESTP instead of ISTP? It donned on me that the examples here given are based on how the functions process in response to external stimuli. We should not recognize the introverted function immediately because the introverting functions do not react to external objects. This is most noticeable in how the extraverting thought process is directly related to the apple tree, but the introverting processes in what may be a universal way. There is no direct influence by the tree.

As for Gauntlet, your response reminded me of what Jung says about the Ne function.
But since intuition, in the extraverted attitude, has a prevailingly objective orientation, it actually comes very near to sensation; indeed, the expectant attitude towards outer objects may, with almost equal probability, avail itself of sensation. Hence, for intuition really to become paramount, sensation must to a large extent be suppressed. I am now speaking of sensation as the simple and direct sense-reaction, an almost definite physiological and psychic datum. This must be expressly established beforehand, because, if I ask the intuitive how he is [p. 463] orientated, he will speak of things which are quite indistinguishable from sense-perceptions. Frequently he will even make use of the term 'sensation'. He actually has sensations, but he is not guided by them per se, merely using them as directing-points for his distant vision. They are selected by unconscious expectation. Not the strongest sensation, in the physiological sense, obtains the crucial value, but any sensation whatsoever whose value happens to become considerably enhanced by reason of the intuitive's unconscious attitude. In this way it may eventually attain the leading position, appearing to the intuitive's consciousness indistinguishable from a pure sensation. But actually it is not so.
I waited to hear what other ISP types thought but I don't think the majority would wonder what their sister’s real motive is over a chance to play with puppies…. I posted Jung's thoughts just to say that I think many intuiting types will say they relate to the Se process as well, which is not surprising.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
261 Posts
I am curious to how our third function plays a role to situations as well as our life experiences. I know, I like knowing how people tick. I'm in a constant state of trying to understand people as if they were systems. Which very may be, Se feeding me during an event, then Ni making a leap to a conclusion (since I didn't have enough info store with Ti) instead of just pure Ne.

I wonder, how much can a combo of functions look like another function process?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
247 Posts
As for Gauntlet, your response reminded me of what Jung says about the Ne function.I waited to hear what other ISP types thought but I don't think the majority would wonder what their sister’s real motive is over a chance to play with puppies…. I posted Jung's thoughts just to say that I think many intuiting types will say they relate to the Se process as well, which is not surprising.
I really wouldn't care why she wanted a puppy - she wants a puppy, she wants a puppy. PUPPIES!

If, on the other hand, she already had eight dogs that she couldn't care for and she was just collecting puppies, I'd start thinking about her motives.

I mean, you could carry out umpteen scenarios, right?

But, generally speaking... my sister wants a puppy, I get to play with puppies, all's good in the world.

I've enjoyed this exercise :). You said there are other examples; care to post any of those, or direct me to where I may find them? It's good reading...
 

·
MOTM June 2010
Joined
·
2,507 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I really wouldn't care why she wanted a puppy - she wants a puppy, she wants a puppy. PUPPIES!

If, on the other hand, she already had eight dogs that she couldn't care for and she was just collecting puppies, I'd start thinking about her motives.

I mean, you could carry out umpteen scenarios, right?

But, generally speaking... my sister wants a puppy, I get to play with puppies, all's good in the world.

I've enjoyed this exercise :). You said there are other examples; care to post any of those, or direct me to where I may find them? It's good reading...
You're just so lovable Chia.:happy: The highlighted title is a url. Just click on it. Dario Nardi gives examples of the function attitudes in his book 8 Keys to Successful Leadership. I may post some from his book.
I am curious to how our third function plays a role to situations as well as our life experiences. I know, I like knowing how people tick. I'm in a constant state of trying to understand people as if they were systems. Which very may be, Se feeding me during an event, then Ni making a leap to a conclusion (since I didn't have enough info store with Ti) instead of just pure Ne.
I think what you are referring to is motive. This is part of Se and is discussed in the SP-Improviser temperament description here. SJs and NTs focus on systems, NF and SPs focus on other peoples motives.
I wonder, how much can a combo of functions look like another function process?
Function-attitude combos based on these look a-likes can lead to mistypes such as these. I know I am always accused of being INTJ or INTP by those types.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
378 Posts
Si – You look at the apple tree and immediately recall an image of an apple tree you’ve seen before and you were then become aware of the feel of autumn in the air and remember being in an apple orchard picking apples.

Si - Lenore’s sister kept saying how much the standard poodle looked like the one they had as children. She said it reminded her of being at home and being young again.
I do not agree with the Si. I am more likely to hone in on one apple, and notice that it is greener then all the other apples. I may instinctively notice that the tree does not look as healthy as other apple trees, and verbally warn against picking apples from it, even if others do not notice it. Si seems to not be well understood, even by Jung himself. Its usually too closely associated with memory.

I like the post though, even with my reservation.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
5,240 Posts
Interesting post. All I could say is that with the apple tree scenario, I'd probably be just like this:

Me: Hey, is that an apple tree? Wonder what kind it is? ...Well, I guess it's not that important. *gets on with life*

:crazy:

Edit: It looks like I misread the Fe description for the puppy scenario. It seems to imply that a different dog was bought instead of the poodle at the store. I would get whatever my hypothetical sister wanted provided that she was able to care for it, but I would warn her about any possible difficulties she could face caring for the dog, and ask her if she is absolutely sure she that wanted this kind of dog. And looking at Ne again, I think that could happen to me too. And I would still help her pick out puppy stuff.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
601 Posts
In my opinion, well thought out. I really enjoyed the descriptions of Ne, Fi and Ti, as I can relate to the thinkning frequency that you depict in them.
Perhaps, you could do more justice to the Ni functions, which seems to be underscored, to me. :mellow:
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
3,417 Posts
First scenario I'd get

Se, Si, Ni, Te, Fe, Ne, Ti, Fi.

Which would just make me an uber P lol.

For the second one I'd get

Se, Si, Te, Ni, Fe, Fi, Ne, Ti.

:shocked:

My actual function order is Te, Ni, Se, Ti, Si, Fi, Ne, Fe.
 

·
MOTM June 2010
Joined
·
2,507 Posts
Discussion Starter · #17 ·
I do not agree with the Si. I am more likely to hone in on one apple, and notice that it is greener then all the other apples. I may instinctively notice that the tree does not look as healthy as other apple trees, and verbally warn against picking apples from it, even if others do not notice it. Si seems to not be well understood, even by Jung himself. Its usually too closely associated with memory.

I like the post though, even with my reservation.
As I alluded to in post #7, these scenarios call for extraverting function-attitudes since the apple tree and puppies are in the moment and call for us to focus on something outside the Self. When I initially read them many years ago, I became confused because I wholeheartedly chose Se in both cases and wondered if that made me an ESTP. After realizing the scenarios, I knew my Ti would not come into play in this situation. My Ti would probably wonder about pruning techniques to produce more apples. However the puppy scenario was spot on for me since after considering my two options, I would naturally consider a third option. People hate that when they give me a forced choice scenario I generally choose a third option.
First scenario I'd get

Se, Si, Ni, Te, Fe, Ne, Ti, Fi.

Which would just make me an uber P lol.

For the second one I'd get

Se, Si, Te, Ni, Fe, Fi, Ne, Ti.

:shocked:

My actual function order is Te, Ni, Se, Ti, Si, Fi, Ne, Fe.
Not to single you out Biscuit, but I notice that some of you are attempting to put the scenarios in some sort of pecking order of how your function-attitudes would work. I would caution you on doing this. The scenarios should be used to only discern which extraverting function-attitude you may prefer and to a lesser extent your introverting function-attitude. As state also, I would suspect that many would consider Se since it seems quite natural to want to play with the puppies and notice the vibrant colors of the apple tree. Is it really shocking that as an ENTJ, you would prefer the Se function-attitude? It's your tertiary and if you are quite extraverted, you may prefer it over your Ni. Besides remember ESTPs and ENTJs can be look a-like types as described here
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,523 Posts
for me in the apple tree situation, it would not be my Ne that responds first, but my Ti. I definitely would have thought more closely with that specific thought pattern. Maybe this also has to do with when I take walks by myself, I usually use the time for self-reflection and observation, therefore it is pretty much dedicated to my Ti.
As for the second scenario, Ne was definitely the first one to pop up.
 
1 - 20 of 87 Posts
Top