[teddy564339]

It may just be due to my experience on PerC, but it feels like INTJ's, at least the ones on here, are very satisfied with who they are as people and how they live their lives. INTJ's seem to be proud of who they are and see no point in changing themselves simply to please others. I'm just going by my general vibe here, I understand that I may be mistaken, which is partly why I'm making this thread.

However, I've also read that INTJ's also constantly seek to improve everything in their lives, including themselves. I guess that really interests me because I also like to improve myself, but I think I sometimes have a hard time thinking of ways to improve myself without getting different outside perspectives. I get the impression that INTJ's are more self-sufficient in that regard.

In one MBTI book I bought a while ago there are suggestions and advice given for all 16 types. The advice for ISFJ's has been extremely helpful for me and I try to remind myself of it as often as I can because it really helps me to improve my life and happiness.

So I was curious to see what the INTJ's on here would think of the suggestions the book offers for INTJ's. I'm curious to see if you believe these things are things you agree that you should do to improve or if you think these things either aren't issues for you or are things you see no need in doing. If that's the case, I would also be curious to hear what other ways you try to improve yourself, assuming that the idea of constantly improving oneself is generally important to an INTJ.


Advice for INTJ's:

-Solicit input from others and be open to having your ideas challenged.

-Avoid being self-righteous and defensive. Don't reject others' views outright just because they are different from yours.

-Pay attention to physical symptoms of stress before they get to the crisis stage. Recognize your limitations and slow down your pace.

-Show appreciation to others based on merit, not just on your standards of perfection. Don't demand of others the same intensity you demand of yourself.

-If you want to improve your relationships with others, beware of being aloof, demanding, or insensitive with criticism.

-In a negative situation, be willing to take responsibility for your part.

-Learn to be flexible. Be willing to give in on less important points and details with others.

-Consider working for yourself. Many INTJ's are too independent to work for others or in the corporate world and are good at creating something new.

-Make time for artistic pursuits or creative hobbies that have no immediate purpose or application.

-Let go of trying to control everything in life.

 

[Staryu]

Advice for INTJ's:

-Solicit input from others and be open to having your ideas challenged.

-Avoid being self-righteous and defensive. Don't reject others' views outright just because they are different from yours.

-Pay attention to physical symptoms of stress before they get to the crisis stage. Recognize your limitations and slow down your pace.

-Show appreciation to others based on merit, not just on your standards of perfection. Don't demand of others the same intensity you demand of yourself.

-If you want to improve your relationships with others, beware of being aloof, demanding, or insensitive with criticism.

-In a negative situation, be willing to take responsibility for your part.

-Learn to be flexible. Be willing to give in on less important points and details with others.

-Consider working for yourself. Many INTJ's are too independent to work for others or in the corporate world and are good at creating something new.

-Make time for artistic pursuits or creative hobbies that have no immediate purpose or application.

-Let go of trying to control everything in life.

1. i do that already, in fact i welcome feedback from others bc sometimes they have even better suggestions. and yes, i like teamwork too.
2. what are you talking about? i do not ever remember doing this..
3. thanks, will do
4. that'll be hard
5. i do NOT like to criticize others..in fact i hate criticizing people's personalities & accept them for who they are. every individual is unique & s/b treated as so.
6. ...
7. nice suggestion
8. i do that all the time. i LOVE art.
9. but i believe in the motto 'take charge of ur life & ur life is what u make of it'

 

[L'Empereur]

Advice for INTJ's:

-Solicit input from others and be open to having your ideas challenged.
I'll only ask for input from people who are more knowledge in an area than I am. I think most of us enjoy a challenge.

-Avoid being self-righteous and defensive. Don't reject others' views outright just because they are different from yours.
I believe I'm an open-minded person.

-Pay attention to physical symptoms of stress before they get to the crisis stage. Recognize your limitations and slow down your pace.
I suppose this is a good idea.

-Show appreciation to others based on merit, not just on your standards of perfection. Don't demand of others the same intensity you demand of yourself.
I only show appreciation. 99% is never good enough. Sorry.

-If you want to improve your relationships with others, beware of being aloof, demanding, or insensitive with criticism.
This is sound advice, I suppose.

-In a negative situation, be willing to take responsibility for your part.
I believe I already take responsibility for my actions.

-Learn to be flexible. Be willing to give in on less important points and details with others.
I agree.

-Consider working for yourself. Many INTJ's are too independent to work for others or in the corporate world and are good at creating something new.
I've been considering this since I was a child.

-Make time for artistic pursuits or creative hobbies that have no immediate purpose or application.
Again, I already do this.

-Let go of trying to control everything in life.
um . . . lol


I hope this is helpful to you. . .

 

[beth x]

Advice for INTJ's:

-Solicit input from others and be open to having your ideas challenged.

-Avoid being self-righteous and defensive. Don't reject others' views outright just because they are different from yours.

-Pay attention to physical symptoms of stress before they get to the crisis stage. Recognize your limitations and slow down your pace.

-Show appreciation to others based on merit, not just on your standards of perfection. Don't demand of others the same intensity you demand of yourself.

-If you want to improve your relationships with others, beware of being aloof, demanding, or insensitive with criticism.

-In a negative situation, be willing to take responsibility for your part.

-Learn to be flexible. Be willing to give in on less important points and details with others.

-Consider working for yourself. Many INTJ's are too independent to work for others or in the corporate world and are good at creating something new.

-Make time for artistic pursuits or creative hobbies that have no immediate purpose or application.

-Let go of trying to control everything in life.

The bolded one particularly applies to me.

There are aspects to all of the advice given that have merit. I tend to be fairly social and open to suggestions until I find out how very flawed the logic behind it is. I am quite happy with myself but admit that I am quite flawed.

Thanks for the post.

 

[ByzantineBird]

I am very surprised with this post, I expected sweepings generals on INTJ that were over simplified and hailing from stupid. Many of the advice, and attributes infered and mentioned by you, I find in myself very much. Except I reject them on that they are at the basis of who I am, but I do question my ways, and wonder of the stress in my life. I will post more on these issues later, for they are of utmost important.

 

[dalsgaard]

-Solicit input from others and be open to having your ideas challenged.

Only if the person speaking to me base his or her ideas on truth and how the world actually works.

-Avoid being self-righteous and defensive. Don't reject others' views outright just because they are different from yours.

Yeah okay. I promise.

-Pay attention to physical symptoms of stress before they get to the crisis stage. Recognize your limitations and slow down your pace.

That's what people keep telling me but I work best when I'm stressed.

-Show appreciation to others based on merit, not just on your standards of perfection. Don't demand of others the same intensity you demand of yourself.

I couldn't even be around others if I did that. But it is a good point. Merit.

-If you want to improve your relationships with others, beware of being aloof, demanding, or insensitive with criticism.

Yup! This one I think I have tackled already.

-In a negative situation, be willing to take responsibility for your part.

What? I always do that.

-Learn to be flexible. Be willing to give in on less important points and details with others.

Why? People need to prioritize. I can't honestly consider the ideas of someone when they are focusing on unimportant crap. I don't want the project to go down the drain just because I had to avoid hurting their feelings. They can come to me with their points and details when they actually matter.

-Make time for artistic pursuits or creative hobbies that have no immediate purpose or application.

If some pursuits pay off later I will consider them. But honestly, it's not going to help anyone if I start being artistic. Moreover I suck at it.

-Let go of trying to control everything in life.

Yeah ok, and while I'm at it I'll learn to defy gravity. Not going to happen.

 

[Razare]

-Let go of trying to control everything in life.

Yeah, stop being an INTJ while you're at this improvement stuff. ROFL.

 

[Isis]

Thanks, Teddy. Interesting (and I mean that in the best possible way)

I'm having trouble seeing how letting everything stay mildly crappy all the time is fun...

... and can someone please clarify for me how "merit" is different than "doing a good job"? I'm in a work situation right now where people are upset with me because I don't think people's work is "value added" if it takes me twice as long to get a job done with them than without their "help" (and whining about why they aren't getting a promotion).

I'm to the point where I'm OK with people who can do 30-40% of what they're supposed to be doing, but the -100% is still bit beyond.

 

[Immemorial]

-Solicit input from others and be open to having your ideas challenged.
Why? Why would I need to do this when I won't even keep an idea unless I've scrutinised it? Most people have nothing to add.

-Avoid being self-righteous and defensive. Don't reject others' views outright just because they are different from yours.
Umm.. I DON'T do this...

-Pay attention to physical symptoms of stress before they get to the crisis stage. Recognize your limitations and slow down your pace.
Easier said than done.

-Show appreciation to others based on merit, not just on your standards of perfection. Don't demand of others the same intensity you demand of yourself.
What the hell does the first part even mean? And I DON'T apply my standards to others. Leonardo Da Vinci would have trouble meeting my standards.

-If you want to improve your relationships with others, beware of being aloof, demanding, or insensitive with criticism.
I'm not softening it up just because they can't take it.

-In a negative situation, be willing to take responsibility for your part.
I do this anyway...

-Learn to be flexible. Be willing to give in on less important points and details with others.
What constitutes 'less important?'

-Consider working for yourself. Many INTJ's are too independent to work for others or in the corporate world and are good at creating something new.
Yeah, despite the current economic crisis, I should work for myself and struggle to survive...

-Make time for artistic pursuits or creative hobbies that have no immediate purpose or application.
No.

-Let go of trying to control everything in life.
No.

I'm not a fan of this advice... :dry:

 

[wealldie]

I failed after reading the first point.

 

[teddy564339]

Ha ha...unsurprisingly, the responses from different INTJ's have been somewhat similar and somewhat different. That's to be expected since people of a type are bound to have a lot in common, but everyone will be unique based on other factors in their life as well. But seeing where the similarities and differences are is what's interesting to me. I could comment on just about everything posted by INTJ's here, but I'll just choose particularly interesting ones to me to save me the time and energy.

And as a reminder to everyone, remember that I didn't come up with this advice myself, I read it in an MBTI book. There's no way I'd be able to advise any other type beyond my own. I was just curious to see what INTJ's would think about it.

I am very surprised with this post, I expected sweepings generals on INTJ that were over simplified and hailing from stupid. Many of the advice, and attributes infered and mentioned by you, I find in myself very much. Except I reject them on that they are at the basis of who I am, but I do question my ways, and wonder of the stress in my life. I will post more on these issues later, for they are of utmost important.

As I mentioned, this book gave advice for all 16 types individually, so I think there was a good understanding of each one. I was inspired to make this thread after hearing about a few ISFJ/INTJ relationships, which I find fascinating because the two types seem to be strikingly different and yet can sometimes end up in great relationships.

(I can send you the ENTJ advice the book offered if you happen to be curious).

-Learn to be flexible. Be willing to give in on less important points and details with others.

Why? People need to prioritize. I can't honestly consider the ideas of someone when they are focusing on unimportant crap. I don't want the project to go down the drain just because I had to avoid hurting their feelings. They can come to me with their points and details when they actually matter.

I think you must be interpreting this line in a different way than I am, because from your response it sounds like you agree with my interpretation of it. I took this as saying that if you have a disagreement with someone based on a minor detail, to let go and not argue over it with them...which is what I view as prioritizing. Basically, fighting hard for the important stuff, but choosing your battles so that you don't get hung up disagreeing on something that's not really important in the big picture.

To me the advice is saying not to focus on the "unimportant crap".

-Let go of trying to control everything in life.

Yeah, stop being an INTJ while you're at this improvement stuff. ROFL.

I find it fascinating that this was the one piece of advise that just about everyone who's posted has found to be either the hardest to follow, the one they are most unwilling to follow, or the one that they believe they should not follow.



So I'd be curious to hear if INTJ's believe they can control everything in their life or not. Personally, I've always believed that I can control all of my own actions, but that there are certain things in my life that I'll never be able to control...I just have to accept them and do whatever I can to deal with or improve them. For me, I'm much happier when I accept certain things are just beyond my control, and all I can do is choose my response to them.

So I guess my take on it for an INTJ would be...if you find your life to be better when you try to control everything you possibly can, then awesome, go for it, this piece of advice is worthless. But, if you find yourself continually frustrated due to things beyond your control and you hate this and find it makes your life worse, perhaps it would be helpful to learn to let things go sometimes and realize your own limitations.

But like I said, I'm not an INTJ, I'm just trying to learn about them more here...so if trying to be in total control is what's most important to an INTJ, I can accept that, and it's just one more thing that I can learn is different from myself.

... and can someone please clarify for me how "merit" is different than "doing a good job"? I'm in a work situation right now where people are upset with me because I don't think people's work is "value added" if it takes me twice as long to get a job done with them than without their "help" (and whining about why they aren't getting a promotion).

Well, like a lot of things in life, I believe there's a balance to it. The way I see it is that different people go about improving themselves in different ways. If I do the very best I can on a job, and I do a decent job on it but not a perfect job, if someone only offers me criticism and doesn't value my effort, then I'm not likely to improve...I'm likely to get discouraged and do an even worse job the next time. Now, would a thinker believe that this is stupid? Probably so. But that's not going to change the results for the next time. However, if the thinker can value the effort I put in and understand that I did what I could, and at the same time show me how I can improve upon the next time, I'm much more likely to do a better job the next time. Would the thinker believe they shouldn't have to do this in order to get the results? Perhaps. But it may be the only way to consistently do it...and that's where I believe the value is.

However, here's where that balance comes into play...that doesn't mean someone should be told that they did a fantastic and wonderful job when they only did an ok one. That won't help them improve either. But if a balance can be found in acknowledging the positives but trying to improve upon the negatives, this will most likely lead to improvement in the future.

In your situation, it sounds as though it's a matter of finding the right work for the right person to do. If someone is slowing you down, then they should be told that, and they should accept that they're not helping. But, if together you're unable to find a way in which they can help, even if it's doing a different task, then there's nothing left for them to do.

(This reminded me of an old Family Matters episode where Eddie hired Waldo at a fast food place. Waldo messed everything up with things like customers and inventory, and Eddie wanted to fire him. But Eddie asked Carl what he should do, and Carl recommended that Eddie try to find a job Waldo was good at. Turns out Waldo is a fantastic cook and was able to improve upon some of the food recipes. Yes, this is idealistic and fake, and it's kind of a silly example, but I still believe in the idea of trying to find the right job for the right person. Sorry for the sidetrack, but it popped into my mind, probably due to Si. )

-Consider working for yourself. Many INTJ's are too independent to work for others or in the corporate world and are good at creating something new.
Yeah, despite the current economic crisis, I should work for myself and struggle to survive...

Do keep in mind this advice was written many years before the current economic situation. It's based more on general principle rather than current situations.

-If you want to improve your relationships with others, beware of being aloof, demanding, or insensitive with criticism.
I'm not softening it up just because they can't take it.

Note that it says if you want to improve your relationships with others. If you have no interest in doing so, or if you've found another way to do it (which I would be curious to hear if you have), then it's to be expected that it wouldn't be of any value to you.

I'm not a fan of this advice...

Fair enough. However, as I mentioned in the OP, I would be curious to hear how you go about improving your life and things around you, assuming that this is something you have interest in. If not, then it would be another example of my experience with some INTJ's on PerC, as I mentioned in the OP. If so, then it would re-affirm what I read about INTJ's.

However, if you have other advice that you've given yourself and been able to follow in the past (or currently do), I'd be curious to hear that. Or if you have any for INTJ's that'd be interesting too.

 

[Isis]

In your situation, it sounds as though it's a matter of finding the right work for the right person to do. If someone is slowing you down, then they should be told that, and they should accept that they're not helping. But, if together you're unable to find a way in which they can help, even if it's doing a different task, then there's nothing left for them to do.

We're pretty specialized. So, there's no "other job" for them to do. You either need to do the job that's assigned or work somewhere else.

And there is no incentive to work with a person who does a bad job accompanied by complaints about how the assignment is "boring" and how they're not getting enough congratulations, bonuses and raises.

 

[teddy564339]

We're pretty specialized. So, there's no "other job" for them to do. You either need to do the job that's assigned or work somewhere else.

And there is no incentive to work with a person who does a bad job accompanied by complaints about how the assignment is "boring" and how they're not getting enough congratulations, bonuses and raises.

In that case, I'd say it's your employer's fault for hiring them and keeping them on. :tongue: Either your employer sees something of value in them that you do not, or your employer's an idiot. :tongue:

 

[Isis]

In that case, I'd say it's your employer's fault for hiring them and keeping them on. :tongue: Either your employer sees something of value in them that you do not, or your employer's an idiot. :tongue:

Maybe they can employ the "you'll be better at something else" method. I try not to comment on (or think about ) my managers and their relative intelligence to mine. Suffice it to say that I certainly do not get away with such nonsense, and that I respect my mangers' abilities and judgements (about work... lunch meat preferences is another matter).

But thank-you for answering my question. I was afraid my responses were all in "NT psychobitch" mode, but if the "F" impulse is that if you can't find a way together, there is no way, then we're all OK.

 

[akkadian]

Firstly, I want to thank you for creating this thread if you thought it would help us :happy:

-Solicit input from others and be open to having your ideas challenged.
If you're more knowledgeable/experienced in an area then I will come to you, otherwise just follow my lead.

-Avoid being self-righteous and defensive. Don't reject others' views outright just because they are different from yours.
I'm also an open-minded person.

-Pay attention to physical symptoms of stress before they get to the crisis stage. Recognize your limitations and slow down your pace.
First part, OK. Second, nonsense.

-Show appreciation to others based on merit, not just on your standards of perfection. Don't demand of others the same intensity you demand of yourself.
I think I'm a rare INTJ in that I expect very little from everyone (because I realize that most people are dumb and can't get shit done without their nanny to guide them). And I always express my appreciation for their actions.

-If you want to improve your relationships with others, beware of being aloof, demanding, or insensitive with criticism.
Ughh, fine.

-In a negative situation, be willing to take responsibility for your part.
Ok.

-Learn to be flexible. Be willing to give in on less important points and details with others.
I don't care for details, I'll gladly let you handle 'em.

-Consider working for yourself. Many INTJ's are too independent to work for others or in the corporate world and are good at creating something new.
On my to-do list.

-Make time for artistic pursuits or creative hobbies that have no immediate purpose or application.
Perhaps at a later time?

-Let go of trying to control everything in life.
I gave up trying to do this after I failed to shape clouds into giant boobies with the force.

 

[darlarosa]

I'm not a fan of this advice... :dry:

Maybe thats because you need to follow some of it :tongue:



Well I like this advice many I am highly critical and tend to hold other up to a standard...I guess thats why I'm easily disappointed :dry: . Yet I know I appreciate what others do even though I know I could do better. My friend paints a wooden van prop for a play it's good, but not like I would have it....it doesn't mean I slap them down.

Generally this is sound advice, however, I think the "Let go of trying to control everything in life." is mis-worded. I think it should be that INTJ's should accept that we can't control everything all the time and that we shouldn't crap ourselves over it.

 

[calliope]

Advice for INTJ's:

Being INTJ, the following is exactly what I constantly work to improve. So this is my worklist for living, yes.

-Solicit input from others and be open to having your ideas challenged.

Yes, I use listening to those I don't believe have value to challenge areas I might be closed minded about for an exercise, occasionally.
---------------
-Avoid being self-righteous and defensive. Don't reject others' views outright just because they are different from yours.
---------------
Point of INTJ is not to use my bias, so obviously...
--------------
-Pay attention to physical symptoms of stress before they get to the crisis stage. Recognize your limitations and slow down your pace.
------------------------------
Have had to learn through painful lessons. This is not a mental endeavor, so it's hard. If I don't listen, I get sick.
-------------------
-Show appreciation to others based on merit, not just on your standards of perfection. Don't demand of others the same intensity you demand of yourself.
--------------------------------------
Again, the very essence of being INTJ. I wouldn't be logical if I imagined others could match my standards.
-----------------------------------------------
-If you want to improve your relationships with others, beware of being aloof, demanding, or insensitive with criticism.
----------------------
I am fair and tactful. I want to improve my relationships with those appreciate my style. I would rather minimize my relationships with others.

----------------------------
-In a negative situation, be willing to take responsibility for your part.
-------------------------------------------------

To not use bias, one needs to take equal responsibility for their part in all situations, so obviously
---------------------------------------
-Learn to be flexible. Be willing to give in on less important points and details with others.

-------------------------------------------
No. If I am in a conversation, bottom line is that we will be engaging in reality. I am not going to pretend something is true that isn't for their comfort... ever... I am not there to manage their emotions, period. If it's a question of getting something done and they don't like my style, they shouldn't be working with me. Those who actually want to get a job done are more than happy to work with me.
------------------------------

-Consider working for yourself. Many INTJ's are too independent to work for others or in the corporate world and are good at creating something new.

------------------------------

I have always had a job where I worked for myself.

---------------------------------

-Make time for artistic pursuits or creative hobbies that have no immediate purpose or application.

----------------------
I have always done this.
-------------------
-Let go of trying to control everything in life.[/quote]
----------------------------------

I do not try to control things that I cannot or have no business controlling. I am not frustrated in life because I am acutely aware that if something isn't going my way that I think should, that I have mistaken expectations. I have only gotten postive results from trying to control my life, and I see no reason to stop planning and refining and then achieving my goals. I wouldn't want to have the kind of life that people I see who don't try to control their life have.
---------------------------------

 

[teddy564339]

Generally this is sound advice, however, I think the "Let go of trying to control everything in life." is mis-worded. I think it should be that INTJ's should accept that we can't control everything all the time and that we shouldn't crap ourselves over it.

Yeah, I agree, I like your wording of it better. :happy:

Firstly, I want to thank you for creating this thread if you thought it would help us

Well, I'm actually very cautious about offering some INTJ's on PerC any help, because I've found that they don't want any. :tongue: So keeping that in mind, it wasn't my direct purpose of this thread. However, if anything I or any INTJ poster in this thread has helped anyone else, that's awesome! I'm an ISFJ, I love hepling people! :happy:

I try not to comment on (or think about ) my managers and their relative intelligence to mine. Suffice it to say that I certainly do not get away with such nonsense, and that I respect my mangers' abilities and judgements

Here's what I find interesting: From what I've seen so far in this thread, the one thing that INTJ's have had the biggest problem with is the idea of trying to control everything in one's life. Now, I know that all INTJ's aren't the same...but given this control idea, I would imagine that you would make every effort to let your managers know about your dissatisfaction with your co-workers, because that might have the potential to lead to them making an effort to improve your co-workers' attitudes or work ethics.

To not think about your managers' intelligence doesn't seem very INTJish, though of course, I would imagine that this would be in order to keep your own job and not risk accidentally saying anything disrespectful. But if controlling everything was so important in an INTJ's life, I would think that one might make every effort possible to improve upon the co-worker situation, even if it meant appealing to a manager in a respectful manner.


(Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to offer personal advice to your situation! That's the last thing I would want to do...I know nothing about the situation and don't want to come across as presumptuous. I'm making these comments purely based to understand the topic of INTJ's being so control driven, I don't mean to try to suggest anything to you.)

 

[ariana20]

It may just be due to my experience on PerC, but it feels like INTJ's, at least the ones on here, are very satisfied with who they are as people and how they live their lives....However, I've also read that INTJ's also constantly seek to improve everything in their lives, including themselves. ... I'm curious to see if you believe these things are things you agree that you should do to improve or if you think these things either aren't issues for you or are things you see no need in doing. ... what other ways you try to improve yourself, assuming that the idea of constantly improving oneself is generally important to an INTJ.
Advice for INTJ's:
-Solicit input from others and be open to having your ideas challenged.
-Avoid being self-righteous and defensive. Don't reject others' views outright just because they are different from yours.
-Pay attention to physical symptoms of stress before they get to the crisis stage. Recognize your limitations and slow down your pace.
-Show appreciation to others based on merit, not just on your standards of perfection. Don't demand of others the same intensity you demand of yourself.
-If you want to improve your relationships with others, beware of being aloof, demanding, or insensitive with criticism.
-In a negative situation, be willing to take responsibility for your part.
-Learn to be flexible. Be willing to give in on less important points and details with others.
-Consider working for yourself. Many INTJ's are too independent to work for others or in the corporate world and are good at creating something new.
-Make time for artistic pursuits or creative hobbies that have no immediate purpose or application.
-Let go of trying to control everything in life.

my first thoughts are that the intj's on this forum may well be satisfied with who they are as people and how they live their lives, now that they
a) have found out that they are intj's
b) have found other people here, like themselves who tell them its ok to be themselves (simplifying things a little i know but bear with me)

i suspect that the advice offered in your book is aimed at people newly learning they are intj (or other type), who may well have been wondering for quite some while why they 'were different' or 'didnt fit in' or 'were the way they were', and may have felt a bit unhappy with themselves as a consequence.

the advice is simply a list of extreme behaviours typical to one type, expressed as alternatives to being like that, highlighting some tendencies of some INTJ's and suggesting that you could maybe try something a little less extreme if you want to be a bit more of a rounded individual or if you are unhappy with the way your life is going right now

this advice may well be useful if you wish to appear to be less intj-ish, wish to be more 'accepted' by co-workers, friends, family members etc, and may also be useful to people newly discovering their 'type' and only just finding out for the first time that 'how they behave' is particular to their type, but not always helpful to themselves in the long run, and that there is 'another way', other than that which follows their natural inclinations

so when you say "if you believe these things are things you agree that you should do to improve", it depends what you mean by "improve" really

improving yourself may not be required, but improving your relationships with others or finding alternative ways of doing things may be useful or desirable in some circumstances, whether you ''should'' do them is another thing altogether

your words kind of suggest that you have taken the advice given to mean that in order to be a better person INTJ's should do this or that

i think perhaps the list of advice for INTJ's is 'to make your life easier you might want to think about trying some of the following suggestions'

 

[jbking]

Good stuff...

-Solicit input from others and be open to having your ideas challenged.

-Avoid being self-righteous and defensive. Don't reject others' views outright just because they are different from yours.

-Pay attention to physical symptoms of stress before they get to the crisis stage. Recognize your limitations and slow down your pace.

-Show appreciation to others based on merit, not just on your standards of perfection. Don't demand of others the same intensity you demand of yourself.

-If you want to improve your relationships with others, beware of being aloof, demanding, or insensitive with criticism.

-In a negative situation, be willing to take responsibility for your part.

-Learn to be flexible. Be willing to give in on less important points and details with others.

-Consider working for yourself. Many INTJ's are too independent to work for others or in the corporate world and are good at creating something new.

-Make time for artistic pursuits or creative hobbies that have no immediate purpose or application.

-Let go of trying to control everything in life.

While I'm open to having my ideas challenged, soliciting input just isn't an easy thing for me to do.

Self-righteous and defensive is a been there, done that so I do know to do that.

Slowing down isn't an easy thing for me to do. I tend to be a bit of an intense, "Go go go," type person so it isn't easy trying to find a good pace for myself. Physical symptoms are worth noting that isn't necessarily a simple thing for me to do.

Still working on appreciation of others and stuff like that.

Relationships are still an enormous struggle for me, really.

I'm starting to take more responsbility for some of the stuff in my life, though it isn't always easy or pretty.

Flexibility is another one of those struggles in a sense. I like having plans and structure and flexibility tends to conflict with that regularly which I generally don't like most of the time.

I never wanted to work for myself. I'd rather let others handle some parts of a company than try to be a one man company.

The creative stuff is an interesting idea though at times I question how well that works some of the time. If I do something that I don't find enjoyable and afterwards think, "What the heck was I thinking doing that for so long?" it just tends to feed some depressive cycles in my life.

I don't like letting go of control. I like to be the one calling the shots and writing the story that is my life.

Overall, I think they are useful suggestions some are easier to do than others of course. I do so have the perfectionistic INTJ sides to me, oh yeah.