[ohnoezitsjoez]

This is an odd thing to describe, and my subject may not be adequate. While reading this, please note that I am not talking about multiple personalities (I don't believe so, anyway). I am curious if anyone else can relate to this.

I find that I subconsciously follow conflicting agendas/convictions.

For example, I am looking up ways to furnish my "living room" in my apartment. I made a blueprint of the floorspace, and end up placing a couch next to a pile of unpacked boxes. The couch, and researching ways to furnish, is a sign of nesting; all the while the unpacked boxes are a sign of the exact opposite.

Another example is a couple folders I have on my computer. One folder is research on how to improve my life and health, the other is a folder with information about getting my affairs in order. These are contradictory agendas/convictions. One is focused on enriching and extending my life, one is focused on wrapping it up.

I honestly feel like I am more than 1 person, just not multiple personalities if that makes sense. Like each person has their own agenda. Like my life is a ship and I have several people fighting to navigate.

Now as an observer, I also take time to observe this circus and how contradictory it is. Just curious if anyone else does this.

 

[jd_]

just sounds like you are trying to find balance. For me, finding the sweet spot between balance is always impending on me.
One of my biggest has been balancing settling down with the need to travel.
Another is balancing career choice vs what I enjoy.
Another is basing where I need to live in the country vs where my family is and being closer to them.
All these have caused MAJOR conflict and way too much weighing things than most people should do, in my life.

 

[Arclight]

I believe it's called "multiple perspectives"...
There is value and flaw in more than just one thing.. you know?

 

[ohnoezitsjoez]

One of the things I found so interesting about it is I (subconsciously) end up investing fairly equal time and energy into both directions. I sometimes catch myself and think "If I am planning on staying, then I need to unbox my stuff. If I don't plan on being here, why am I worried about making it more homelike?"

It's like furnishing a home you want to move out of soon or polishing the brass on the titanic. Planning a route north while driving south. Another example is wanting to live and wanting to die at the same time and being very passionate about both.

I guess I need to try and focus on one of the things (since I can't do both at the same time) but the compulsion and desire for both is very strong. I really really want two conflicting outcomes at the same time and can't stop planning for both at the same time. Not only is it just incredibly weird, it is a colossal waste of time and resources.

 

[jd_]

One of the things I found so interesting about it is I (subconsciously) end up investing fairly equal time and energy into both directions. I sometimes catch myself and think "If I am planning on staying, then I need to unbox my stuff. If I don't plan on being here, why am I worried about making it more homelike?"

It's like furnishing a home you want to move out of soon or polishing the brass on the titanic. Planning a route north while driving south. Another example is wanting to live and wanting to die at the same time and being very passionate about both.

I guess I need to try and focus on one of the things (since I can't do both at the same time) but the compulsion and desire for both is very strong. I really really want two conflicting outcomes at the same time and can't stop planning for both at the same time. Not only is it just incredibly weird, it is a colossal waste of time and resources.

You just need to work on living in the moment and stop worrying about the future... what you are describing seems like inferior Se at work, I have this issue also.

In bold, I am the same way. I haven't felt "Settled" in awhile so I have refused to buy things like nice or even adequate furniture, art work, and have kept my books to a minimum. Heck, I even refuse to sign a lease b/c I might want to jump and leave. I will be in my current city for probably 2 years, tops. I know I don't want to be here permanently, so I am skeptical about "putting down any roots" or even getting into a relationship with somebody, b/c I wouldn't want to uproot them for a place they actually enjoy. It wouldn't be fair to THEM.

I have honestly yet to find a place where I wanted to spend awhile in. Though there is a nagging sense that "you should settle down a bit, you should have nice things because you have good taste, you should stay in one place to form a social group" and things of that nature.
If you don't know from my other post, I've moved 8 times in the last 7 years, most of these have been moves to new cities, "trying them on for fit" somewhat.

 

[ohnoezitsjoez]

Inferior Se... I am still learning the cognitive functions, still haven't wrapped my head around them, but it gives me something to start with, thanks!

I have always struggled with the concept of "living in the moment." It's value has never been sold fully to me. When it comes to something insignificant to me (such as choosing a meal), I have no problem with it. I can even see living in the moment benefiting those who worry about hypothetical "what if" scenarios. That would be like overvaluing the minute possibility of something happening instead of the overwhelming improbability of it. "Living in the moment" I could see relieving a lot of undue stress we put on ourselves. Even taking a step back from overwhelming circumstances to clear our thoughts and "live in the moment" I can see beneficial.

However those are very specific circumstances. If I may be honest without being offensive, as a general principle, I am not convinced of its usefulness. It could very well be that I don't understand it, but it honestly comes across as a bad idea to me; it feels like it is synonymous with neglecting responsibility and planning, and just sticking your head in a hole. However it isn't the first time I have heard the advice, so surely there is something to it that I'm not understanding. I want to consider it, but my brain just "kicks against the pricks" so to speak.

 

[jd_]

Inferior Se... I am still learning the cognitive functions, still haven't wrapped my head around them, but it gives me something to start with, thanks!

I have always struggled with the concept of "living in the moment." It's value has never been sold fully to me. When it comes to something insignificant to me (such as choosing a meal), I have no problem with it. I can even see living in the moment benefiting those who worry about hypothetical "what if" scenarios. That would be like overvaluing the minute possibility of something happening instead of the overwhelming improbability of it. "Living in the moment" I could see relieving a lot of undue stress we put on ourselves. Even taking a step back from overwhelming circumstances to clear our thoughts and "live in the moment" I can see beneficial.

However those are very specific circumstances. If I may be honest without being offensive, as a general principle, I am not convinced of its usefulness. It could very well be that I don't understand it, but it honestly comes across as a bad idea to me; it feels like it is synonymous with neglecting responsibility and planning, and just sticking your head in a hole. However it isn't the first time I have heard the advice, so surely there is something to it that I'm not understanding. I want to consider it, but my brain just "kicks against the pricks" so to speak.

You should read Epictetus, Marcus Aurelius, or even Machiavelli's discussion of the balance between "virtu" and "fortuna"...
basically the ideas boil down to letting go, and no matter how much you plan... you don't have the actual control over the future. You could lose everything tomorrow for instance. Thinking about this will make you appreciate your current state of affairs better.

The key here is balance..which is much different than the attitude of "not caring" or being "whimsical", but I see that these issues are causing you stress, so I am offering you a way to alleviate this a bit.

 

[ohnoezitsjoez]

I really appreciate the direction, you have given me a starting point so that is good for me. Thanks again.

 

[The Proof]

I think you're worrying about nothing that important, it's just a bunch of boxes...

and nothing more than that

 

[ohnoezitsjoez]

Well to be fair, I'm not worrying about the boxes; those are just a piece of one (of many possible) examples of this phenomena. I am concerned about spending time and resources (like money) into two mutually exclusive directions. time and resources are important to me, I dont like wasting time and spinning my wheels

 

[jd_]

Well to be fair, I'm not worrying about the boxes; those are just a piece of one (of many possible) examples of this phenomena. I am concerned about spending time and resources (like money) into two mutually exclusive directions. time and resources are important to me, I dont like wasting time and spinning my wheels

You can only control so much, i.e. the money lost now might seem fickle to a future raise you might get year which you can't predict. Time now, that is more important, so you should just let things be. A good way that I combated this was adopting a more minimalist lifestyle in general... with less stuff, I didn't have to have these conversations in my head of what to do, I could also focus on more important things without "stuff" accumulating that I had to figure out something to do with. Once you separate these as "your things" vs. "things", you won't have such attachments to them. You have to be willing to give all of your possessions away at a single moment and not think anything of it. It is also a good way to think about life and create meaning for things more valuable, and live more in the moment. I.E. you should imagine that anybody you know could be dead tomorrow, now how will you react in conversation with them? You could be dead tomorrow as well. And all of us will just be remnants and dust someday in the galaxy, so now how do we view these things we call "possessions"...

Cliche, but I'm sure you've heard the line from Fight Club...The things you own end up owning you.

Another good line is a poem by Rudyard Kipling...

If you can one heap from all your winnings
And risk it on one turn of pitch and toss
And lose, and start again at your beginnings
And never breathe a word about your loss.

Sorry if some of this seems maybe unrealistic for you or in the abstract, but I really do view life from those perspectives and it's made me see what is actually important more.

 

[MoonLight]

jd has put a finger on the issue, another way to look at it is that what you are doing consciously is sometimes conflicting with your subconscious. So even if consciously you want to do something indirectly your subconscious might cause you to do the opposite and you end up noticing the things you mentioned. Aligning both together helps and also being aware of what you enter into your subconscious and what is contains. Living in the moment as was mentioned (learning from the past and not holding on to it, not always having your head living in the future since it did not happen yet), meditation and developing your unconscious cognitive functions are starting points. After, things will seem to balance on their own. Yes this all seems abstract too but there is no other way to understand it clearly expect by experiencing it.

 

[ohnoezitsjoez]

you guys know what it is like to hear folks talk about something, and they are talking about it like it is the most normal thing in the world, all the while it sounds absolutely insane to you... and it turns out you just were missing a piece of information or something wasn't clicking and when it did click, it all made sense? I think that is what I am doing here lol. I am not trying to be stubborn, but when I read this, it sounds like I would be swinging to the other extreme, which seems contradictory to the idea of balance. I am definitely not clicking but I am trying! Is it common for this concept to be hard to grasp? I assume so since it is referred to as abstract. I am concerned that if my mind is unable to digest the notion and recognize the value of the concept, I may not be able to experience it.

jd has put a finger on the issue, another way to look at it is that what you are doing consciously is sometimes conflicting with your subconscious. So even if consciously you want to do something indirectly your subconscious might cause you to do the opposite and you end up noticing the things you mentioned. Aligning both together helps and also being aware of what you enter into your subconscious and what is contains.

This is part of what I found so odd about what I was describing, those seems to flip back and forth (and the flipping back and forth was itself subconscious). One day I could be consciously investing/researching in to making my apartment more homely while subconsciously thinking I shouldn't be doing this and I should stay light and mobile... and then a while later I am researching other apartments in my city and their rates as if I plan on moving (while subconsciously I am saying I shouldn't do this). This is just an example (and not entirely mutually exclusive) but the bizarreness is what led me to start this thread.

This is all fascinating to me and gives me stuff to research and study.

 

[MoonLight]

you guys know what it is like to hear folks talk about something, and they are talking about it like it is the most normal thing in the world, all the while it sounds absolutely insane to you... and it turns out you just were missing a piece of information or something wasn't clicking and when it did click, it all made sense? I think that is what I am doing here lol. I am not trying to be stubborn, but when I read this, it sounds like I would be swinging to the other extreme, which seems contradictory to the idea of balance. I am definitely not clicking but I am trying! Is it common for this concept to be hard to grasp? I assume so since it is referred to as abstract. I am concerned that if my mind is unable to digest the notion and recognize the value of the concept, I may not be able to experience it.

Concern just fills your mind with unneeded thoughts, everyone is capable of this. I found out it is an issue of habit, we are used to do certain things and whatever is different sounds out of this world. Second, being open to the idea and not sticking to the same old thing is important. If something does not work and causing you some issues then something is off, no? You already noticed it, this is the first step. Try finding out what is the cause of the conflict of the specific topic you are talking about, it might be more than what is known to you right now.