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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Alright, so I have this character, who happens to be my favorite character of mine, and I'm wondering if he uses Fi (probably as an INFP) or if he uses Fe (probably as an ESFJ).

I think this is the right forum. I've seen a lot of people post threads like this, and in a variety of forums, but I think this one is the most common for these questions. I'll report it over to another forum if one would find that appropriate. (And I think in general we should have a topic for typing OCs in a set forum because quite a few people have their questions about OCs, but we can make that topic after it's decided what forum is best for those things.)

Okay, so this character in question (I'll just call him Adam even though that's not his name) was just... made by me, I guess. Most the other characters have been somewhat shaped by cognitive functions - like with Adam, I conceptualized them first, before I knew about MBTI, but then added cognitive functions - but with Adam he's still more of a concept to me than he represents an actual personality.

I actually first meant for him to be an ESFP, then an ENFP, and finally I decided "nope, he's an INFP." (But I also greatly misunderstood the cognitive functions myself, and I believed myself to be an Fi-dom at the time, so this might be way off.)

Also, I had no intention of Adam being exactly like me, or even like me at all. I just think he might've turned out more Fe than I intended.

Adam is essentially the central character of my story (everything revolves around him, even though he's not the main character and has very few POVs. Much of the story involves other characters doing their business and interacting with him.) He's a teacher to the main characters, but he also has a sort of Cinderella story where he becomes royalty (only like he doesn't want to become royalty and it's actually the worst thing that's happened to him... but) (I swear it's not based off Into the Woods)

He's supposed to represent goodness in the world, like incorruptible goodness. He goes through so much crap (like so much crap), but, unlike other lovely characters out there (Jay Gatsby, Winston Smith) he doesn't give up on his belief in humanity, and remains cheerful and optimistic and such.

But he's still flawed. While almost always well-intentioned, almost everything he does is a mistake. His innocence also just causes a lot of pain for him, and is definitely more of a hindrance than a strength.

I mostly saw him as Fi-dom because, while he is definitely a dominant feeler, he has no inclination for gagging social things. He's extremely awkward, he attempts at manners (tert Si?) but fails and forgets basic courtesies, and he is generally oblivious to how his many odd actions have an impact on others.

And he's an awful teacher. When I teach, I love the kids, and I am smiley, friendly, and optimistic, but I also set limits. I can love them, and the little five-year olds can hold my hands and such, but we can't be friends. I've never taken any teaching or classroom management classes, but I know how to discipline children, how to keep the, focused, how to engage them in the lesson. My character doesn't do any of that. He's just warm and friendly and excitable, but really he's more of a child himself than anything. He's very inspiring, but he lets his students have their run of the classroom and just babbles almost mindlessly when he wants to say anything.

But he also cares about others, and cares greatly for others. And by others, I mean like, everyone. The only thing is, he doesn't quite notice others. He's stuck in his own little world, and only picks up on others and wants to help them or notices their emotions or thinks of them if they're special to him.

But he doesn't seem to have a set of internal values. He's extremely non-judgmental, and only gets sad/slightly angry if someone hurts another person. He doesn't even care if someone hurts him (he'll let other characters do terrible things to him as long as it makes them happy), he just gets very upset (and by upset I mean internally upset --- he very very rarely shows his anger/sadness and always puts on a happy face) if he sees someone else being hurt.

And also, when he does become royalty (or almost royalty... it's a little complicated) he does pick up on social mechanisms, and grows more aware of his social place and starts obeying all these social rules he never picked up on before. He's also very courteous, just awkward. While throughout the first half of the book he doesn't seem to have any idea how others perceive him, in the second half he is acutely conscious of how others perceive him. (However, if he's INFP and this is out of character, I might change this. Unless it could be explained away by the Si?)

So yeah, I know that's a lot of information and it's hard to type anyone without them being like, a real person and answering a questionnaire, but I'm a little curious if this is Fi or not (since we Fe-doms tend to have a hard time doing Fi. I can so a TJ, but an FP is a bit more difficult.)

Thank you so much if you've read this far, and thank you in advance to those who comment.
 

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I'd actually guess that he might be an ENTP. I say that because it sounds like he isn't good at Fe, with the social skills/teaching problems. And feeling pain over others pain but no internal values definitely sounds Fe/Ti over Fi/Te. And being lost in his own world and being inspiring seem kind of Ne-esque. He also just gives me an ENTP vibe.
ESFJ seems possible too though.
 

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From what you have explained it sounds like you've created a character with secondary Fe characteristics. So I would say he sounds like some kind of IFJ, it seems -- sort of like the lead protagonist from the Princess Diaries. If given a need for preference I could see Ni dominance from what you explained (not tethered to this world, dreamy), but I could also see inferior Ne. ISFJ's have a pretty vivid internal world and sometimes get mistaken for INFP's because of it. But I think you just placed Fe in a lower function order than create a Fi type. IJ's have that quality of being disconnected to the world but still apart of it due to their external judging functions being connected, operated and enforced in the external world. So while IJ's aren't as outwardly present as EP's and EJ's there is still a better forged connection with it than IP's. IP's are focused in their own world first, and will chime in when their inferior functions kick in. IP's want to matter in the world, but aren't necessarily the most apart of it. They kind of just end up doing their own thing as long as their internal needs and worlds are satisfied.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
@Arrow and @oliviakate thank you for your input! I would have never considered either of those types for him.

Oliviakate - I can see your reasoning behind that, but the thing is... he isn't really logical at all. He also doesn't behave much like an ENTP, mostly in that he doesn't have a spine at all and doesn't do the things I would stereotypically expect an ENTP to do (like he doesn't know/understand sass or sarcasm, he isn't witty, he does use a lot of intuition and can be dreamy so I can see and-dom but the Ti...) At the same time, he's a lot less concerned with himself than the definite ENFP character I have (both are imaginative and idealistic, and the ENFP character can be fun and cares about others, but the ENFP character will go out of his way to do what he thinks is right even if it opposes everything everyone else thinks should be done and Adam... would never do that. He would just dawdle and try to help the situation in his not-so-helpful way later.)

But I can see ENTP a little. I grew up with an ENTP, and while the ENTP I know is a lot more rooted in reality and can stand up for himself (or others), I can definitely see some common characteristics with him and Adam. Both would teach in much the same way.
@Arrow Thank you as well! I can see ISFJ as well, a little. He does seem to have secondary Fe - not that much Fe but more Fe than Ti - but I can't see him being an Ni-dom. Part of his problem is that he is just so oblivious, and he cannot piece together the truth of the world around him. Which, of course Ni doesn't quite pick up the truth of a situation, but Ni-doms I think at least try to figure out the world and, especially with the tert Ti, try to piece together the truths of life. Adam just more wants to help people directly. And he absolutely cannot figure out things literally to save his life. A ton of sketchy stuff happens around him, but he never suspects anything.

Also, his best friend is an (almost a definite) INTP, and the contrast between them is really significant. She has to look after him because he's so out of touch with reality, and he can't see anything that's right in front of him, and he wants to trust everyone even though they live in a very untrustworthy world. She's also constantly frustrated with him because he's not at all logical, he sees the world as it simply isn't (which I guess could be Ni). He actually doesn't believe the world is good and recognizes privately that the world is cruel and, while people are good, they all do a ton of bad things, but he still outwardly trusts others and can't have inhibitions about the intentions others have.

I'll have to think about it some more, and do some research into the types/functions suggested. It seems clear now that he's not really much of an Fi user, which will save me quite a few mistakes in wrongly characterizing him.

Thank you again for your help!
 
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Sounds like an INFP who will be fired by the DOE, very soon.

But like those Mathematics problems, option D. "Not enough information."
He's actually chosen for his teaching job because he is so incompetent, haha. It's a complicated story.

But thank you for your input!
 

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I agree that xNTP is not a bad call here - yet I am not adamant on such a typing. Though that's to be expected, seeing that we have a character with a few personality traits; actually one who seems quite well-designed.

I don't think xNFP is out of the question. At any rate, I'm struggling to see this character as a sensor, and I lean toward the Ne-Si axis.
 

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Sounds a bit like ISFJ? I have a feeling the character is not completely consistent or coherent. Dominant Fi and having no internal values doesn't really rhyme. You could take a look at Pierre Bezukhov from War and Peace, IMO has INFP preferences, is one of the best fleshed out characters and he also becomes a royalty by accident.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Thank you both as well, @babblingbrook and @Lord Fudgingsley

Babblingbrook - yes, I fear him being an inconsistent character which is why I'm a bit concerned with finding his type. The other characters are consistent - I can tell you their functions, and tell you how their characterization, while dynamic, is true to their functions - but I can't quite do that with Adam.

One thing is, I just don't understand internal value systems? I thought I did when I made him, but since I am Fe I've realized I... don't know what they're like, at all really. So for all I know Adam could have an internal value system and I just don't recognize it, or he could just not be Fi at all.

Do you know if there's an Fi character in Anna Karenina? I don't have a copy of War and Peace handy, but I am familiar with Anna Karenina. I think I've been told that Levin is INFP? (If Levin is INFP, I'm pretty certain Adam isn't - he's a lot less closed off, and not nearly as contemplative.)

Lord Fudgingsley, thank you for your input as well. I appreciate your kind words. I agree that he uses Ne - he's far from being an Ni user, I think - and he's very likely an NP, but now I'm having trouble seeing how he uses Fi if he does (and just understanding how an internal value system would work, what life would be like for an Fi-user, or an Fi-dom.) I'm probably just going to have to research it on my own, or start my own topic or something.

Thank you for your help!
 
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He sounds like an ISFP or and ISFJ to me! I lean towards ISFP though because it does sound like he has Fi first.

Fi is very common in characters that represent "incorruptible goodness" because Fi is all about taking in the world and allotting personal value to each object, and that personal value changes with each experience as time/the plot moves forward. Can you see how it translates to the incorruptible good? Because even though the Fi character, maybe not always the protag, has to go through trials and see horrors, they will still see good and not give in to thinking that the world is such an evil place. They prove that even though bad things happen and that the world ain't perfect, you can always find value in life and good amongst the bad - you just have to try, to stick to your beliefs in the face of adversity! Hope is something you foster internally and then express, not the reverse!

ENFP/ESFP tend to be the action hero protag who show that you don't have to give in, show you the worth of determination and hard work, but INFP/ISFP are more often a bit more of a tragic hero who learns to love themselves and/or that they can even create good in the world.

Hope dis helps lol!

O and ENFJ is the bestest type to be a teacher, I find. My mumma is an ESFJ and she's a swell teacher too. That Fe dominance is pretty magical at that sort of thing!
 

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Fi is very common in characters that represent "incorruptible goodness" because Fi is all about taking in the world and allotting personal value to each object, and that personal value changes with each experience as time/the plot moves forward.
I wouldn't characterize Fi this way, I would say Fi is constantly comparing the external world to it's own inner world with it's own ideal archetypal image. For example, I have an image of a perfect desk in my head, the perfect desk is Fi. I am judging every other desk that I ever encounter against the ideal image, and constantly picking at all of the things that are wrong with the other desks. The legs are short, the material is wrong, the coloring is bad, etc. Fi is constantly comparing the inner perfection of something, and projecting it onward to the external and making judgments against them, and upholding them for inner peace and harmony. In that way Fi is constantly denying the external world for what it believes it should be.

You are right that the ideal is not defiled nor corrupted because it comes from an inner place where the external world can't touch it or ruin it. In this way Fi can never be ruined unless the person themselves doesn't live up to their own beliefs and internal standards. Thus why FI types take failure so personally and don't do well with criticisms. When you criticize a Fi type, you insult the very essence of what they believe in, what they epitomize and who they are at their core.

Fi is internalized and perfected to a point where it is constantly being compared to the external, and often times the external world is lacking. I wouldn't say that Fi changes, in regards to it's judgments and feelings. The feeling I am sure is almost always there. I wouldn't say that inner system changes. Fi either likes, believes or responds to something or it doesn't. That sounds like Fe. Fi is projecting an inner value, ideal from inside that it wants to project to the outside world. Kind of like a window of their internal world.

they will still see good and not give in to thinking that the world is such an evil place.
Yes, they will still see their ideal perfection because that is what they are using to make their judgments, they aren't looking for the world to verify their feelings. They are looking inward towards their own inner beliefs, values and self.

Hope is something you foster internally and then express, not the reverse!


Yes. It'
s internally generated, not fueled from the external.

@Arrow Thank you as well! I can see ISFJ as well, a little. He does seem to have secondary Fe - not that much Fe but more Fe than Ti - but I can't see him being an Ni-dom.
I was trying to account for the absent mindedness and internal mindset -- from the way you described him he doesn't sound extroverted, but I am not sure if that is the way you have characterized him. Usually intuitive dominant types are the most unconcerned with what is happening in the present, but I guess a Si dominant type with a grip of inferior Ne could account for this behavior too. He doesn't seem to be very well adjusted or organized, and I am not sure if that is natural for him or not. You've explained that he gets better and becomes more ordered, more composed and more structured when he becomes royalty, that's what made me think he was some kind of disoriented SFJ, who finds help in building his life.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 · (Edited)
I'll respond to the new comments in a moment, but until then; this video basically sums up how I imagine Adam. Of course he wouldn't be in this situation, and he has unique things about him, and may not react precisely as this, but in general these are his mannerisms and such. Hopefully it'll help give a better idea of him.

Edit: sorry, this is a full video (for those who are unfamiliar with the short)
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
@Arrow , yes, I meant for him to be more introverted. I mean, he could be extroverted, but... he needs time alone? I guess I just have to figure out why he needs time alone. And if I can't figure that out, maybe I do need to make him more extroverted.

I actually wrote a scene from when he was little, and I can see him acting like an Si-dom. He has an ISFP mother and she didn't really care about how oddly they were being perceived, but he was aware of it. He was just so timid that he couldn't find anywhere to sit, and everyone saw him as "weird" (because of how his mother isolated them and drew attention to themselves) so he had a hard time fitting in, but he was really upset by it. And he wanted to be a teacher solely because he thought his father would be a teacher. Maybe those are stereotypical Si-dom things, but I can see where that would make sense. (He wasn't... an Ne-dom kid, he just had some Ne traits he used to adapt to his surroundings.)

I'll have to consider Ni though, because...

As @scintillating and you both described Fi, I don't think that's how Adam is? I know he has an idea of how he wants the world to be, but he doesn't actively think about how nothing is right, how nothing matches this or that, how nothing matches his "ideal". He might actually do that Ni thing where he thinks about the world and figures it out. But I don't know... I guess I have to figure out more how he is internally and deal with him from there.

Thank you both again so much! It's helped me a lot to figure out that I need to figure out my favorite character perhaps a lot of a bit more.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
@Luke Skywalker this is the first topic I would like to summon you to (as well as to a few typing threads when I'm at loss for how to figure out Fe of Fi, but we'll start here). Does my character seem Fi to you? I'm also just curious in general... what Fi is like for you, as an Fi-dom. It's honestly something I can't fathom, and, regardless if this particular character is Fi, I would like to understand Fi, if only so I can use it to write some of my other characters.
 

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@Arrow's definition of Fi is pretty accurate. I'd also like to point out that Fi is being constantly refined by us. Ne helps to see other possibilities and realities too.

Oliviakate - I can see your reasoning behind that, but the thing is... he isn't really logical at all. He also doesn't behave much like an ENTP, mostly in that he doesn't have a spine at all and doesn't do the things I would stereotypically expect an ENTP to do (like he doesn't know/understand sass or sarcasm, he isn't witty, he does use a lot of intuition and can be dreamy so I can see and-dom but the Ti...)
Actually dominant and auxiliary Ne-users are naturals at sarcasm and wit. Just watch any interview with an INFP and you'll see it. Ne is the first function we will show to the external world, so that's what you will see first. That's why so many of us are mistyped as INTPs, I think. We also have a tendency to either appear very serious or sad, or very bouncy and gregarious. Though the latter is a bit more rare.

Part of his problem is that he is just so oblivious, and he cannot piece together the truth of the world around him. Which, of course Ni doesn't quite pick up the truth of a situation, but Ni-doms I think at least try to figure out the world and, especially with the tert Ti, try to piece together the truths of life. Adam just more wants to help people directly. And he absolutely cannot figure out things literally to save his life. A ton of sketchy stuff happens around him, but he never suspects anything.
That's another problem. Our Ne works all the time -- most of the angst you hear about with INFPs is born when we get angry at 'blind people'. People that can't see the machinations of everything around them. People who can't see how people and society work. We look at the big picture and have a pretty good notion of what is happening around us, under the surface. How everything connects with everything. That seems to not be the case with your character.

We're oblivious to what's physically around us most of the time, but if something sketchy is happening behind the curtains, we probably figured it out already.

Also, his best friend is an (almost a definite) INTP, and the contrast between them is really significant. She has to look after him because he's so out of touch with reality, and he can't see anything that's right in front of him, and he wants to trust everyone even though they live in a very untrustworthy world. She's also constantly frustrated with him because he's not at all logical, he sees the world as it simply isn't (which I guess could be Ni). He actually doesn't believe the world is good and recognizes privately that the world is cruel and, while people are good, they all do a ton of bad things, but he still outwardly trusts others and can't have inhibitions about the intentions others have.
INTPs and INFPs are remarkably similar. In fact, our Ne clicks automatically. Whether it's the whimsical jokes or because INTPs and INFPs both have that understanding I mentioned. We're like twin brothers in the MBTI. And we're very logical when we're healthy -- and nerdy, that must be said. :tongue:

If you want to see a pretty realistic INFP character (besides Bran Stark and Bill Weasley) I'd recommend watching Hunter x Hunter -- watch out for Kurapika, the blond dude that looks and sounds like a girl. He exemplifies best how Fi and Ne work together, and even though he's been through a lot, he's still pretty healthy (at least in the first season):



PS: I'd define your character as over-trusting and oblivious. INFPs are best defined as reserved and contemplative (I haven't read Anna Karenina (but I will)).

And I'm sorry for not replying earlier, I've been awfully busy.

;D
 
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