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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
First of all; this post will contain talk about drugs. Should you feel offended; well, don't. I try to use drugs as responsible as possible. Legal drugs like cigarettes(way more addictive than anything other I have done) or alcohol(makes me do way more bad wacky stuff) are in my opinion a lot worse. However, not everybody treats drugs with as much caution as they should and they end up getting a bad name.

Why do I do drugs? I like to feel different. I don't know if it's an INTP thing, but I feel apathic a lot. Whenever I'm interested in something I'll focus on it hardcore for a few days, maybe a few weeks, but that's it.
To be able to delve deep into my mind I have used psychedelic mushrooms, salvia, LSD & DMT. Those last two could be considerd my favorites.

About 3 years ago we were with some friends, just hanging out and talking about what drugs who had done. 3 of us had tried truffels(mushroom like) and one of the 3 had done some other stuff. The 4 others had never tried anything but weed & alcohol. We ended up making plans to go to the countryside; eat the truffels(which are legal in Holland) and just enjoy nature and eachother.
Huge succes, everybody enjoyed it. It was a great weekend.
The year after we did the same. Personal relations within the group had changed and so did the group the second time. We were 10 now, instead of 7, but had so much fun once again.
Mister popular was the centre of attention and made everybody laugh for a solid 3 hours. I'm not amused as easily and just enjoyed it by listening to my music, using headphones.

This year(this week) we were 14. Basic same group as last time, except some couldn't make it as they still had exams. And new people joined. Friends from friends.
Monday we arrived, and everybody drunk and smoked until they were wasted. I was gone pretty far, decided to observe and felt weird. Why would people want to feel like this? Everybody was saying retarded shit and doing stupid things.
Do we do this just to feel? To feel differently? To feel stupid? Because we need to let go of control?
I do not know.

The day after(Thuesday) 3 people were leaving. Two of them were friends of friends, so I didn't really care. I was glad they were gone. The group had slinked down to a more comfortable crowd for me.
They were going to take the truffels wednesday, but I had to leave in the evening. I needed to be somewhere Thursday for my internship. I didn't want to trip the day before an 'important' thing, so I took 1/8 of a tab of acid, just to see if I would feel it. After about an hour Popular Guy asks if he and his girlfriend can share a tab. Sure
I take another 1/4.
We make a walk to the spot where we're going to trip the next day and it starts kicking in. Not too heavy, but noticable. I walk a lot near GIRL(I shall just call her girl). Share music with girl.
When we get back and have eaten girl is lying in the hammock. I've been eyeballing that hammock for half an hour and it looks so comfy. When she leaves I steal her place and feel like I'm floating.
She comes back and looks a bit upset.
"I'm sorry Girl, I really wanted to lay here. But if you really want to, you can have my place"
-"I'm good"
She's good.
I continue to lay there for a while, observing and enjoying the world.
After a while Girl comes to me and asks if I'm comfy. I'm cold and could use some music. She brings me my laptop and a blanket and sits next to me. We share earplugs and listen to beautiful romantic music. We're so close to kissing; but my tripping mind tells me not to kiss her. There's too many people. I don't like to explain my actions to other people than those involved. How would it continue? Would we kick Girl#2 - who is Girl's best friend - out of the bed and have sex? With 10 more people in the house? How would our relationship evolve?

I feel I need to add the following: Girl was my best female friend in highschool. I always made her laugh, and her smile made me happy, but I never felt anything remotely sexual for her. I sat next to her in lots of classes for 2 years. In college we hung out in the first year. Less in the second. And now that I changed colleges I've barely seen her in the past 2 years.

I didn't want to kiss and then do nothing with it. I didn't want to kiss and do something with it - at the time. It felt like anything I would do, would ruin the moment. So we just listened to music. She rocked me very gently in the hammock. I nearly jizzed in my pants. Yet. I did not make a move. I just wanted to listen to music with someone and feel close.

We all just went to bed. I couldn't sleep because the acid was still going. Ended up in the bathroom with my laptop, making a crappy drawing that is kinda cool, but really bad. Managed to sleep about an hour or 2; maybe 3?
The day after they all were going to trip. Everybody's eating there mushroom like thingies. And we start walking towards the field on the hill we were going to occupy for a couple of ours. The scenery was amazing although the weather could've been better. Once we're up there I take a quarter tab of the acid(180µg, so about 45µg) and smoke a sticky joint with some DMT in it.

She sits next to me and I do not move. I feel the same sexual energy, but I don't do anything. I'm tripping. We listen to music. Sit. Laugh. Talk. Sleep. Laugh. etcetera etcetera etcetera.
We decide to go home. Some of the group have had enough of it. They want the tripping to stop. I claim the hammock and put my blanket over me. Best feeling ever.
Girl isn't feeling too well and wants it to stop. She's in bed watching the simpsons. Everybody else is tending to the barbecue or cleaning the house or trying to comprehend what this tripping thing is.
Occasionaly someone goes upstairs to Girl with some food. After a while I go as well. I bring her some ribs, but she already had some from Guy. He's lying on the bed with her, but there's room for me and we watch the simpsons.
Popular Guy wants his macbook back and removes the simpsons from the room. Guy leaves. We're on the bed, semi sleeping, gentle touching and I once again don't want to ruin the moment.
It's the same as the night before basically.
NOW
After all this venting and writing and situation describing I ask of you the following: what should I do?

I'm seeing her tonight(in about 4-6 hours) and plan on talking about it. The problem is that I have no idea how this conversation is going to go. But I don't like not being prepared.
What I'm going to say;
That moment, with that music and maybe the drugs and surely your touch made me feel perfect. As if I had found to essence of being. But I was afraid - at the time - that it was merely the drugs. And I didn't want to start something under the influence of acid, weed and beer. Also, there were lots of people and I didn't want to upset the group's harmony with something like that. Especially because you and Girl #2 were the only girls. You're best friends. And if we were to hit it off, things might have gotten weird. And it's not that I don't like you. I do like you. But I don't want to start something with you, realise it's not true and then break up, to never be able to talk normal with eachother again.
I mean, I don't care, I can be casual about it, but I don't know about you. And Guy#3(who she dated after senior year in HS and a while in college and who has been my friend since we were 8 or so). Look at how awkward you are with Guy#3. I wouldn't want that. Although we don't even see eachother that often anymore.

Somewhere in between that I might throw something like: "I don't know what I'm doing, but I don't care because it feels right" and then kiss her.
Maybe just hook up for summer(as we live in the same town). Try to make it work in college and break up as friends.

The problem is; that I know she is not THE ONE or one of THE ONES. We're both lazy, but I've been turning it around. While she probably never will. And I don't want to be the one who says: "you're getting fat, you should work out". I also don't want her to slow me down while I'm getting less lazy and stuff.

Oh well. Enough venting. I kinda know what to do. But if anyone would care to read all of this and give me some advice I'd be eternally grateful. If anyone should have any questions about anything. Feel free to
 

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Stop hurting my feelings you filthy drug addict.



edit: Are you making this up, you can't get high from LSD two days in a row, unless you take a lot more than you did the previous day.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Stop hurting my feelings you filthy drug addict.

edit: Are you making this up, you can't get high from LSD two days in a row, unless you take a lot more than you did the previous day.
1) that's a joke right?
2) I thought the same or atleast had read the same. Although I was going pretty strong day 2. Maybe it was the dmt cigarette that triggered me over the edge. I don't know. I felt perfect and saw shitloads of figures in the clouds. And I don't mean like the ones you have to imagine when sober. I mean full on visual hallucinations in the sky. But, I don't know really. Worked out for me.
 

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1) that's a joke right?
2) I thought the same or atleast had read the same. Although I was going pretty strong day 2. Maybe it was the dmt cigarette that triggered me over the edge. I don't know. I felt perfect and saw shitloads of figures in the clouds. And I don't mean like the ones you have to imagine when sober. I mean full on visual hallucinations in the sky. But, I don't know really. Worked out for me.
Could be the DMT yeah, never done it, so I don't know about that.
 

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Sweet Matrimony.
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Can you give us a TL;DR instead?

When I get drunk, I just tell everyone how much I love them, how special they are and how much they needed to know that. Always works for me *shrugs*
 
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
But drugs are irrelevant right now. What about the girl? Basically we've spent 2 evenings lying together, listening to music, gentle touches. When I see her tonight I'm probably going to shut down again, just ignore everything and be casual. I feel like I need to break through this wall and just tell her how I feel. BUT HOW? I feel so authistic sometimes

Can you give us a TL;DR instead?

When I get drunk, I just tell everyone how much I love them, how special they are and how much they needed to know that. Always works for me *shrugs*
TL;DR is in this post, but I'll try and do another one:

- Take acid
- Chill in hammock
- Best female highschool friend comes over
- Listen to music while she's gently rocking me
- Almost kiss
- Afraid to kiss because it will change everything
- casually defuse the situation by leaving
Next day
- casual casual casuaaaaal
- everybody is tripping
- a bit much for girl when we return to the house
- she's in bed watching simpsons with whoever else was in the room at the time
- join her
- simpsons is removed
- sleep
- gentle touches
- sweet music from downstairs
- next morning I had to leave real early

Now I'm going to a part where she'll be
 

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Sweet Matrimony.
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But drugs are irrelevant right now. What about the girl? Basically we've spent 2 evenings lying together, listening to music, gentle touches. When I see her tonight I'm probably going to shut down again, just ignore everything and be casual. I feel like I need to break through this wall and just tell her how I feel. BUT HOW? I feel so authistic sometimes
By just... telling... her how you feel?

Don't make it into a thing. If you play it off cool, she's likely to too. Whatever you do don't shut down, that's not ideal, if you're going to do it, be bold.

It also depends how serious you are?

oh edit: urm, just kiss her? surely that way you don't have to talk about it? it's much easier to convey feelings when you do the business.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
By just... telling... her how you feel?

Don't make it into a thing. If you play it off cool, she's likely to too. Whatever you do don't shut down, that's not ideal, if you're going to do it, be bold.

It also depends how serious you are?
Well, that's the problem. I'm never serious. I goof around 24/7. It's in my nature I guess. And sometimes when everybody is goofing around I'll drop something serious to remind everyone I'm not just the silly guy, but also the smart guy. I guess.

I really like her, and for as long as it would last I would probably enjoy it, however I can't promise her that it'll last long. I'm not a relationship person. I like to be alone. Not 24/7. But I need my alone time. I don't like the feeling that someone is dependent on me or vice versa.
On the other hand, I haven't had sex in a REALLY REALLY long time. Which shouldn't be an argument when talking about your best friend, but still.

Being bold. Being bold. Being bold & playing it cool. I could do this. I guess I could only go for it.

But the problem is that I always think ahead. What will happen when we break up. Eventually. And I get sad about that before I even told her that I actually like her. My mind is weird that way. Thanks anyway, being bold & cool.
 

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Sweet Matrimony.
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Can you like... slow down a minute?

You're getting WAY too ahead of yourself here. Take every stage/step as it comes, you're not even sure if the feeling is actually mutual and if you go in all guns blazing like that, you're likely to scare her away... I know I would be :/

Just go for the kiss and let things happen naturally. Or try to. Just don't plan so much, you'll end up in analysis paralysis and f*ck up everything.

I've seen wayyyyy too many relationship posts in this sub where the break down of the relationship was probably produced by over analysing the situation, and forgetting to include the opinion of the other party into the decision making....don't be that guy.

Just get the kiss out of the way first.
 
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Omg.

Get off the drugs.


Flush them, down the toilet, not down the necks of the interwebs.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Be less selfish: Check.
I'm going to try and stop being a control freak. It's just that I try to think of all the possible scenarios that might happen, but her reaction would be to hard to calculate, so I just ignore it, I think. hah.
But I still feel weird about 'kissing'. I find kissing to be so intimate. Yet you do it as a first sign of affection. Except for the laughs and the flirty stuff I don't notice. That's why I'm bad at romantic crap. So; I'll just try to explain how I feel, listen to how she feels and work towards a kiss? if possible?

Anyway, you're great. Seriously. JungleDisco is a great name. The XX avatar and that signature. All of that with some decent advice. Thanks.

Omg.
Get off the drugs.
Flush them, down the toilet, not down the necks of the interwebs.
Thanks but no thanks. Drugs are tha bomb. If it weren't for drugs I probably would've been bored with life and killed myself by now.
And if this makes me seem like a lowlife suicidal druggie. Well. Meh. It's not true. mwuehehe. I just like to talk about it and how it affects the perception.
 

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No. It just makes your posts appear to be lacking maturity or real worldliness.
 

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lt's not that l don't like to read about drugs specifically, just that your drug experiences aren't really a universal NTP thing, you know?

Not to say that some of us haven't had an experimental phase but with all of that information included, your post is more self-referential. Which wouldn't be so bad, but you're asking for advice at the same time. lt makes my brain feel sad.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
No. It just makes your posts appear to be lacking maturity or real worldliness.
Maybe so. As a kid and an adolescent(which I still am, I think) I've noticed that maturity doesn't exist. It's a made up concept adults(most of the time) use in a condescending way. Everybody acts childish from time to time. And real worldliness, I don't really care about. What's real worldliness? Finding a job, buying a house, getting a wife to not be alone? Focus on my carreer? Fuck that. I want to have fun for as long as I can, while maintaining studies and learning about the world in my own way.

lt's not that l don't like to read about drugs specifically, just that your drug experiences aren't really a universal NTP thing, you know?

Not to say that some of us haven't had an experimental phase but with all of that information included, your post is more self-referential. Which wouldn't be so bad, but you're asking for advice at the same time. lt makes my brain feel sad.
I don't fully understand what you're saying, as 1) English isn't my native language and 2) I don't know a whole lote about the MBTI thingy, I just came here because I found people who have similair ways of thinking.

I tried to explain my situation, what I took, how I experienced it and what happened with the girl. Then I asked advice on how to continue to court this girl. Or atleast I tried. But if it makes your brain sad, I'm sorry. :)
 

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Sweet Matrimony.
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Anyway, you're great. Seriously. JungleDisco is a great name. The XX avatar and that signature. All of that with some decent advice. Thanks.
Whatever it is you're selling, I'll buy :tongue:
Thank you, kind gentleman, I hope you get enough liquid courage inside your balls to just go for it next time you see her!

Seriously.

Oh to answer your question - if you tell her you like her before you kiss her, you're asking to be friendzoned. She's probably not thought of you sexually yet (she might, but it's safer to assume she hasn't) so when you tell her you like her, she really has very little to go on in terms of seeing you as a potential romantic interest, the kiss seals that deal. After that she'll know if she likes you or not. And if you go in for it, she'll know you're willing to put some effort in to show her you're interested. This is sort of pushing her decision in the direction you want it to go in. That's the whole point of it.

I suppose if you're going to work up to it, go for it... but there has to be heavy flirting. She has to be thinking about you sexually first, it just makes her evaluation process a lot easier when deciding if she likes you or not - more information to go on, if you will.

Or maybe I just really like kissing and rarely turn it down, I dunno. Good luck either way!
 
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The tl dr version worked as a great spoiler so I have read it for the matter of getting to know an INTP´s on drugs perspective, it was really interesting reading :D

The passages about the tension moments were really really interesting, but I cannot tell if it was due to the drugs or there is really something, since I have no experience with drugs...

Not that I can help you... Helping other people with their feelings is not an INTP trait at all... If you put us in that situation we get confused and run :D

You should talk it up in "normal stage"... That is what people should do, I guess :D Just stay yourself ...
 

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I read the whole thing, and was strangely nostalgic for the days when I would feel such plain, uncomplicated, naive emotions about people.

I also wondered why you guys were doing drugs when you were 7, 10, and 14 years old. When I got to the part where you referenced senior year and college, I figured it out.

But yeah, you're getting ahead of yourself with the relationship-planning. I'm guessing the "talking about it" is the girl's idea? Ugh. I hate when there are PLANS to "talk about things." That shit should be so much more organic.

Are you guys attending the same college? How often will you see each other after this summer? Is the friendship really worth it to you? If not, I say go for it. You may like it more than you think you will. It's really sweet that she brought you a blanket and a laptop... I'm not sure why, but that detail stuck out to me. Just go for it; YOLO BRO
 
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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Whatever it is you're selling, I'll buy :tongue:
Thank you, kind gentleman, I hope you get enough liquid courage inside your balls to just go for it next time you see her!
Welllllllll, I didn't. But. I've been really busy, went to that party, she came a lot later than us, and me & some friends were drinking quite heavy(I had learned that I passed all classes, so no summerexams-no idea what the correct english word for summerexams would be-). She arrived and she was the designated driver for her friend. My ride left, but she lives near me. I went with her and her friend who was pretty drunk, we dropped the drunk girl off and were alone in the car. I don't really know why, but when we came to my house, she stopped, I jumped out and before I knew it, I woke up with all my clothes still on and a strange feeling in my stomach. Wether it was the beer, the gin or love, I do not know.

The tl dr version worked as a great spoiler so I have read it for the matter of getting to know an INTP´s on drugs perspective, it was really interesting reading :D

The passages about the tension moments were really really interesting, but I cannot tell if it was due to the drugs or there is really something, since I have no experience with drugs...

Not that I can help you... Helping other people with their feelings is not an INTP trait at all... If you put us in that situation we get confused and run :D

You should talk it up in "normal stage"... That is what people should do, I guess :D Just stay yourself ...
I don't really know if it's the drugs or the real thing either. The few times I've been with girls just kinda happened. Now when I'm talking with someone 1on1 I can feel the conversation rock gently within a few parameters: smoothness of the conversation, interest in the subject, changing of subjects, and probably a shitload more. But when the smoothness starts to suck a little, but you're both heavily invested in the conversation you can get some tension. Like, I feel this is the moment where you could do something like kiss. Obviously not with someone you've just met; or if you're tripping balls and you think it's not the best moment to kiss. But it was, only when I let that tension continue it became really intense. And I'm pretty sure that was the drugs, exagerating it, but, now I'm not sure what the actual feeling was. AAAAAAAAAAND I'm overanalyzing it again. But yeah, that tension. I've had it 2 times in the past 2 and a half weeks and it's a recognizable feeling.

I read the whole thing, and was strangely nostalgic for the days when I would feel such plain, uncomplicated, naive emotions about people.

I also wondered why you guys were doing drugs when you were 7, 10, and 14 years old. When I got to the part where you referenced senior year and college, I figured it out.

But yeah, you're getting ahead of yourself with the relationship-planning. I'm guessing the "talking about it" is the girl's idea? Ugh. I hate when there are PLANS to "talk about things." That shit should be so much more organic.

Are you guys attending the same college? How often will you see each other after this summer? Is the friendship really worth it to you? If not, I say go for it. You may like it more than you think you will. It's really sweet that she brought you a blanket and a laptop... I'm not sure why, but that detail stuck out to me. Just go for it; YOLO BRO
I didn't understand anything from the 7,10,14 thing you wrote about, until I reread my first post and it might be a bit unclear; but yeah 7, 10 and 14 people from 19-20-21-22 years old.

There aren't really plans to talk about things. It's just that me and this girl are good friends. Our relationship consists of me making silly jokes(I like humor, and sometimes you make good jokes, sometimes bad, but however bad they are, she always laughs. Especially if it's a bad joke, followed by me laughing with them ironically) and her laughing and building it up, then I give it another twist and she laughs again.
I think we're just flirting. But she actually likes my jokes and I honestly like to see her laugh.
Besides this nonsense talking/joking we do, we don't have that much in common. However, since these intimate moments, it felt a bit weird between us. It was so intimate, I wanted to kiss her when I woke up and pretend we had been married for 30 years.
Now it's still weird and talking sucks, so I wanted to talk about what had happened, to overcome that point. Whatever it leads to, doesn't really matter to me. I just want to be able to go on with us.
We live in the same city/village, and study in different cities. During summer everybody is back home and I spend most of my time with highschool friends. She's a part of that, so we're going to see eachother often, and I want it to be not weird.

And that blanket & laptop. Shiiit. Best thing anyone has done for me in a while. It's not a detail at all; it's what made the moment.

I'm too high to help you.
No problem :)
 
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