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I know they're quite different but still the fact that they are both Te dom confuses me. Other types I can definitely tell the difference despite sharing the same dominant function e.g. ENTP and ENFP.

I also noticed how famous figure in both reality and fiction that are typically portrayed as 'strong willed', 'organised', 'dominant' or has great leadership potential have conflicting views on between ENTJ and ESTJ e.g. Margaret Thatcher, Tywin Lannister, Princess Leia (that all I could think on top of my head).
 

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It's very hard to differentiate between healthy variants of these two types. They both look outward, want to see the right thing done, and will take on other people's burden in that vein. The only differentiating characteristic is what they do in their free time, to unwind, and why. ENTJs are more likely to be reading books or friendly debating while ESTJs are more likely to be engaged in cooking or lavishing in a cup of coffee (I know an ESTJ who does that). Video games and memes may be a constant in both. Basically, it's the difference between an idealist and a realist. ENTJs get tired of reality and seek relief in ideas; ESTJs get tired of ideas and seek solace in the very earthly reality. An ideal archetype for these two would be the Prophet (ENTJ) and the Monk (ESTJ).

ESTJs make the status quo, ENTJs change it.

On lesser levels, there's all kind of filth out there. I prefer to observe people at their best to see what type they are.
 
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It's really hard.

I knew this guy whom I just assumed was ESTJ, as he even said it himself ''I can't handle NOT being in control...'' and since ESTJs far outweigh ENTJs in number, I went with the former. But then I saw just how materialistic and pleasure-seeking he was. A Mercedes, expensive trips abroad every other month, recreational hard drug use, borderline depraved sexuality etc. Okay so it's a little intense and I don't think this will show up in every ENTJ, but it definitely reeked of Tert Se to me. His appearance was also impeccable, amazing clothes, ripped body, tattoos etc.

Point is, all of this seems a little ''too much'' for your typical ESTJ. Si/Ne is more everyday life, light-hearted kind of pleasures. Big moves, purchases etc. are more than often thoroughly examined before proceeding, unlike the ENTJ's more ''Go for it!'' mentality. Also ESTJs like all SJ types have a tendency to discuss their daily lives and daily issues. The ENTJ will discuss broader topics at large and likewise not mention all that much about their daily business.

Essentially, ENTJs have a ESxP (Se dominant) shadow to them, ESTJs have more of a ENxP (Ne dominant) shadow to them, so the former usually comes off as more intense. It's why your stereotypical fictional villain is often typed ENTJ, because they're.... ''scarier''.
 

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it's good to look into cognitive functions rather than behavioural traits that you may observe. the distinction is clearer there.

id like ESTJ with ISTJ (same cognitive functions but different order) and i've had fair share of working with STJ types
- focus on minute details/daily ongoings
- the way they talk about things starts with painting out detail by detail (ISTJ more than ESTJ)
but i'd imagine the ESTJ would be more focused on short term practicality and details vs bigger-picture ENTJ

both ESTJ and ENTJ like control, are decisive and decide early on (as opposed to xxxP), can not care about social niceties
 

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One prefers Sensing and one prefers Intuition.
 

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If they're actually utilising their auxiliary function positively - then the ENTJ will be more in-the-moment and acting on their hunches/perceptions more hastily due to Ni-Se (will act on hunch over facts), whereas the ESTJ will be more cautious and prefer to have everything together before proceeding (will act on facts over hunches).
Ties in with what @Stevester said about ENTJs being more "go for it" and ESTJs being more realistic about things.
 

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If they're actually utilising their auxiliary function positively - then the ENTJ will be more in-the-moment and acting on their hunches/perceptions more hastily due to Ni-Se (will act on hunch over facts), whereas the ESTJ will be more cautious and prefer to have everything together before proceeding (will act on facts over hunches).
Ties in with what @Stevester said about ENTJs being more "go for it" and ESTJs being more realistic about things.
^^^ YES!
The same applies with ESFJ vs ENFJ.
It's like a construction worker vs the captain of a ship.
The worker needs to have the territory surveyed and make sure the ground he/she builds on top of is solid and will rely on architect's plans and make sure everything is done right.
The captain of the sheep needs to have the sheep all arranged and filled with fuel, and once that's done he/she will face all sorts of different storms, engaging in more exploratory work, but still work.

Maybe? Would ESTJ's reading this agree?
I know that when I am myself in front of an ESTJ, he/she may disregard 90% of what I say or draw out an immediate conclusion on it.
When I am myself in front of an ENTJ, they'll judge the functionality of my ideas and actually tell me how to bring them about or how they make sense or not.
 

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From my personal experience, ENTJs tend to communicate via arguments and debates, they also like to talk about politics/philosophy etc., whereas ESTJs are more playful/light in their communication style and seem to be generally interested in more "practical" topics.
Also, from what I've observed about their relationship with control - ENTJs seem to take control over their world via controlling ideas (set of specific opinions that rarely change), ESTJs seem to take control by controlling their physical environment/people (always being 2 steps ahead of any disaster that could potentially happen).
 

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Basically, it's the difference between an idealist and a realist. ENTJs get tired of reality and seek relief in ideas; ESTJs get tired of ideas and seek solace in the very earthly reality.

ESTJs make the status quo, ENTJs change it.
Nice!

ENTJs annoy me less.
Ha!

the ENTJ will be more in-the-moment and acting on their hunches/perceptions more hastily due to Ni-Se (will act on hunch over facts), whereas the ESTJ will be more cautious and prefer to have everything together before proceeding (will act on facts over hunches).
Ties in with what @Stevester said about ENTJs being more "go for it" and ESTJs being more realistic about things.
Nice distinction!

From my personal experience, ENTJs tend to communicate via arguments and debates, they also like to talk about politics/philosophy etc., whereas ESTJs are more playful/light in their communication style and seem to be generally interested in more "practical" topics.
Also, from what I've observed about their relationship with control - ENTJs seem to take control over their world via controlling ideas (set of specific opinions that rarely change), ESTJs seem to take control by controlling their physical environment/people (always being 2 steps ahead of any disaster that could potentially happen).
Super good points.

To add to the mix I would say ESTJ seem more present to the environment -- more on top of what's going on, more generous with their time in tending to things that come up and oncoming questions. Seem to take more of a maintenance role or if in a leadership role, pushing for clear structure and playing it safe. Generally happy with where things are and want to just keep it that way.

ENTJ perhaps more removed from the happenings -- more interested in the meta-analysis and the highlights. Less interested in tending to the day to day, more interested in making decisions that pay off later. More willing to take risks, critically asking what on an organizational level is necessary and what can be thrown out or changed. Less happy with the way things are, more interested in what could be.
 

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Anecdotally, ENTJs prefer strategy, ESTJs prefer tactics. An ENTJ may focus more on what needs to be achieved and the ESTJ will focus more on how to actually achieve something.

Function wise, ENTJ utilizes Ni in support of their Te. Meaning they draw on abstract patterns to support their conclusions about the future (this process in and of itself is not an indicatior of how right/wrong those predictions are).

ESTJ utilizes Si in support of their Te. Meaning they draw on abstract interpretations of the physical world to support their conclusions about the present (this process in and of itself is not an indicator of how right/wrong these conclusions are).

ENTJ has Se tert. So they utilize physical space creatively. ESTJ has Ne tert. So they utilize abstract concepts creatively.


Personally, as an ESTJ, I can tell when someone is an ENTJ because although we think very similarly, our focuses are slightly different. The ENTJs I have worked with are less observant of the steps needed to get somewhere. They take less interest in the practical realization of an idea. We generally make good working partners provided the social skills are there, as we balance each other out in terms of strengths/weaknesses.

If I were to summarize, I would say the ENTJs I know want to know what to do, whereas I want to know how to do it.
 

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One other thing. Ni is more time sensitive. Si is very removed from time. So ENTJs tend to have better grasp of how long something will take to do. ESTJs can learn to accurately estimate based on past experience (Te), but it's not as natural an ability.
 

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I have two friends, an ENTJ and an ESTJ, we talk a lot. About video games, movies mostly.
- My ESTJ friend writes a lot, in short sentences. Presents a lot of hypotheses that never come true. Underlying logic: if something happened somwehere it is bound to happen here too. Pushes topics of interest like crazy: if he's interested in something he just pushes it no matter how many times you said to him it's annoying or childish.
Absolutely fond of his childhood and he loves anything that reminds him of it. He likes Nintendo.
- My ENTJ friend writes fewer, but longer sentences. He doesn't present hypotheses, but picks one scenario and sticks to it - often comes back to it later, saying "I told you". He readily categorize events, mostly by how things unfolded in the long run. He closely follows topics he cares about and likes to predict how they will go - often good about.
He also pushes things but not in a childish way: more in a boasting, powerful way.
He cares about technical details and knows everything about the latest tech - TVs, consoles, whatever. He likes Sony and Microsoft and often picks on my ESTJ friend for not caring enough about "essential" details like graphics or sound and sticking with Nintendo.

All in all I would say that they're both very pushy - and often annoying. I happen to side more with my ENTJ friend about how he sees the world, but side more with my ESTJ friend emotionally simply because he's more friendly and fun.
 

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My ESTJ dad and shitty assistant manager:

-Not time sensitive at all; You would think ESTJs are time sensitive and constantly uptight this and that, but nope. They're completely unaware. Their aux Si is too busy focused on whatever they're working on to worry about tardiness and it drives my mom crazy.

-They're extremely humorous and friendly people when they're in a good mood but when they're in a bad mood, they take it out on everyone.

-They're proud traditionalists. They love a good bit of humor and plenty of adventure, but it's important to them that they and those around them return back to what 'people are supposed to do.'
My ESTJ coworker says that it's her priority to be married in the future because it's traditional.

-They're more rigid to environmental changes and it is very difficult to get them to budge to a new method or way of things.
My dad is blatantly and proudly homophobic/transphobic/lgbt phobic in general.

Various ENTJs I know:

-They are more flexible when it comes to changes. I don't know any lgbt phobic ENTJs.

-They are extremely observant and keen with reading people and everything going on around them. The slightest change in my body language or mood and they notice immediately. They always know what I'm up to. It's scary.
They are time sensitive and need a move on to the next project. ESTJs can take their sweet time all they want.

-Love to shamelessly indulge in physical pleasures. My ESTJ dad does too but there's a limit.
ENTJs who know they're capable have no limits that it comes off as hedonistic. Look at Harvey Specter's lifestyle in Suits for an example.

Similarities:

-Both get shit done
-Both have thunderous voices that needs to shut the fuck up I have anxiety damn it.
 

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I'm sorry your dad is homophobic and such, but let's not attribute that as a characteristic of ESTJs.

But it's true though that they're not as organized and discipline as people may think. Te is confident they'll get things done, Ne can wing it, adapt or take it easier, sometimes make them look like they don't have a care in the world. Definitely poos on that ''drill sergeant'' image people have of them. Especially millennial ESTJs whom quite frankly, appear more like ESTPs.

I find SFJs to be much more organized and responsible than them, which is odd because you'd assume Te focuses much more on that than Fe. But I think FJs have this inner obligation to be seen as upstanding citizens by others, whereas Te simply says ''I know what I'm doing, I don't have anything to prove to you'' Making them look sloppy and undisciplined at times.
 

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LOL nice attempt at ''poor us misunderstood intuitives....'' but no. ENTJs are typically social beasts who exude effortless magnitude. (Yeah, I kinda have a thing for them).
Wow, thanks man, I didn't realize I was misunderstood until now.
 

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LOL nice attempt at ''poor us misunderstood intuitives....'' but no. ENTJs are typically social beasts who exude effortless magnitude. (Yeah, I kinda have a thing for them).
Well, many may be and most try to do something of that effect, but personally I find that ESTXs are better at seeming effortless in this manner, regardless of whether they actually exert themselves or not, which I would pin down as strong sensation overall-- plus they usually see right through the attempts of "Se tertiarys" in most instances. Wanting to uphold such appearances is no way near to actually managing it, after all.
 
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