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Hello community. First, my apologies if am posting in the wrong place... I just joined this website although I have been reading responses here for a while. I am a loyal male ISTJ that is capable of rational logic and loves to debate. (I add this because it seems like there are quite a few ISTJ haters..and I wanted to draw the distinction) Further, this is a long post since I want you guys to know the details. If its too long and you want a condensed version, let me know and I'll edit!

Back on topic, I recently had the pleasure of meeting this wonderful INTP girl and for the first time, I considered pursuing a girl. (For multiple reasons that are not all related to her...) Basically, I am fascinated with the thought process of a girl with the T trait. And this girl is the one that I am the most interested in despite not knowing her that well yet.

I met her last spring and simply didn't have the guts to talk to her. I thought she was cute and felt physical attraction, but I had a gf at the time so I didn't do anything. Well, it turns out my gf(who is an F) didn't give me the same courtesy and when I found out, I decided I really want to get to know a T girl really well. My ex (ISFP) and I def. had problems with the T and F and I am sure that her F is what led her to do what she did. Anyways, this INTP girl fascinates me and I want to become closer with her.

We met in class last spring and I only talked to her in a few group study sessions. This year, I recently asked her to study for finals with me. (just as a study buddy which might be slightly weird since we aren't in any classes together) However, we both had to take finals the day we decided to study. (and she wanted to study after we took those finals...[for other finals]) So when we ended up meeting to study at 5PM, there was actually very little studying done. We started talking about school and the semester in general when she arrived. I was still under the impression that this was a study session so I started to read my textbook when the conversation "ended." (we were talking about random things for like 20 min and there was no clear ending to the convo)

I would like to clarify this is the first time meeting her and talking to her in about half a year and we weren't close before. So that is why I was cautious and was actually trying to study. However, throughout the beginning of the study session, she would start talking about random things. Like I would read for a few min, and then she would start talking about something. (for example, she would talk about things relevant to the previous conversation...like halloween in her hometown) However, she didn't really ask questions. She just made a comment or observation. I took this as a hint to continue the conversation and would ask questions and provide some related experiences I had. This went on and off with no conversation finding closure until I figured that perhaps she may just want to talk to relieve the stress of finals that day. I know that I would want to.

So then after an hr and a half or so, I closed my book and just started talking to her. I'm quite nerdy and introverted so I'm not exactly a social mastermind, but I really do enjoy learning about how other people think. So I ended up asking her thoughts about politics, religion, parties...ect. I don't really know how to steer the conversations into typical fun talk so I just did what I usually do. I play video games and watch anime so I avoided these topics since I doubted she has the same interests. That being said, I can easily expand my interests to any topic that is intellectually stimulating. (Not sports nor cars)

Anyways, we talked until about 7:00 ish and I asked her if she had any plans for dinner. To which she said she probably will cook some vegetables or make a salad. I don't believe she realized I was asking her to dinner indirectly until after she answered. Anyways, time passed where we were actually studying for about 30-40 min. I then asked her how long she planned to stay. She then said, "Good point, I was just getting hungry myself." I took this as a hint and directly asked if she wanted to go get dinner. She said yes, and we ended up walking to the nearby mexican place. We ate and talked till 10PM. There, I found that we had many common views (lack of interest in sports and cars) and she seemed so much different than the typical girl stereotype. (Strong F) We parted ways outside the restaurant since our apartments were in different directions. I definitely had fun, but am quite lost as to how she felt.

Afterwards, I have been messaging her on Facebook every few days. I've probably done this 4 times with a 2-3 day break in between each conversation. I have made the following observations

-she has never approached or texted me first

- she has not talked about her interests

- she seemed to switch topics or revive the conversation if I could not find something to say (I really appreciate this since I was forced to always create topics and keep the conversation going with my ex)

-She seems to not care about having an ending to a conversation. It ends when it ends. (this is completely fine with me, just worried she might find it awkward that we just suddenly stop saying anything)

-She rarely asks me questions (usually I ask her opinion on something and share my opinion/experience after she talks)

- She doesn't really joke around (albeit I haven't asked what she finds funny)

-I sent her chem/bio puns and jokes (She is premed), she seemed very disinterested-for example, one pic I sent her said to describe the reaction to this chemical formula and the student wrote "Surprised." Her comment was "That first guy neither understands chemistry nor is very funny" This happened like 2-3 times in that one conversation and I can't help but feel I messed up.

Can you guys share your thoughts regarding what happened and how to proceed? How do you guys respond to texts/messages? How do you suggest I try to make this happen? Any help appreciated!
 

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I'm not an expert in this, but I'll go off on how I see relationships.

I'm not saying this is definite, but don't think she is interested. See, when I found someone I wanted to talk to (friend-wise), I'd talk to them non-stop. Because, I wanted to be around them. Though, I found a very few amount of people who I did that with.

However, I believe the best way to approach her, is to just ask her. We are known for our straightforwardness, and we aren't offended if you ask. So, if you ever build the courage, just ask her.
 

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Even though I'm INTP, I don't know a lot about INTP women. I do have an ISTJ friend who is presently dating an INTP woman. She has already let me know privately that she is interested in NTs more than STs and what few interactions I've had with her both in email and IRL she acts a little goofy around me when it's just her and I. I'm pretty sure she's got a little bit of a crush on me, but I'm not interested in interfering with her dating my ISTJ friend and I don't feel attracted to her, although I would be interested in INTP women in general.

 

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-she has never approached or texted me first

- she has not talked about her interests

-She rarely asks me questions (usually I ask her opinion on something and share my opinion/experience after she talks)

- She doesn't really joke around (albeit I haven't asked what she finds funny)
These are pretty standard red flags. Not saying attraction couldn't develop later, but I don't think she's feeling it currently. An intp will use their curiosity to their advantage in pursuing their prey, er crush, and her not asking you questions seems like a big tell to me.
 

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From personal experience: there is no way to know. At all. If they think they're making it obvious, your next-door neighbor might have a vague idea, but you will have no clue. I don't care if they're down on bended knee, it's a fake proposal unless they actually say they have romantic feels.

But lol. "How to date an INTP?"

*starts singing*

Fail fail fail fail try more fail more try try try try keep failing?????? --> profit


I'm sorry, you seem very nice and I'm very sleep-deprived. I will do an actual response in the morning if I cram through these four papers (four!!!! and I had three exams this week. What is my life and why did I come to this school) that are due Monday.
 
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I think INTP girls are much diff than the guys, and I think she might have found the puns funny, but didn't know how to express it so she commented on what she knew how to comment on. It might take a while before she cares to initiate convo I think. Also, it could be a while of just being friends.That's something I've observed of intj's and intp's. They don't rush into romantic relationships. Even when they feel it, or feel a connection. it doesn't happen quickly to move forward. So be patient and be chill.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Hi everyone, thank you for your input! Let me rephrase the topic. Regardless of how she is feeling now, I want to be able to attract her. I understand it is highly unlikely that she likes me at the moment. With these few encounters, this much I expect. The challenge is getting her to like me. Do you guys have any advice regarding that?

Edit: I do believe I can fulfill the drive for intellectual discussion and I have no qualms in theorizing possibilities. I really do enjoy debating with my family about almost anything as well. After reading countless threads about INTP's thirst for intellectual stimulation, I believe that these traits may give me a chance to court an INTP girl....at least one can hope!
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I'm not an expert in this, but I'll go off on how I see relationships.

I'm not saying this is definite, but don't think she is interested. See, when I found someone I wanted to talk to (friend-wise), I'd talk to them non-stop. Because, I wanted to be around them. Though, I found a very few amount of people who I did that with.

However, I believe the best way to approach her, is to just ask her. We are known for our straightforwardness, and we aren't offended if you ask. So, if you ever build the courage, just ask her.
I am also very straightforward person and I almost never lie. I don't think I'll ever have problems not being blunt enough.

I agree with you that she probably isn't currently interested. Though the "study session" turned into essentially a 4 hr talk gives me hope. I've read that INTPs usually keep to themselves until they feel comfortable with the other person. Seeing as there has been little interaction so far, I have hope for the future. I'm mainly looking to get her to be interested in me to put it plainly. For instance, how would you like to be messaged? Should I bother with greetings and small talk? Or simply rush in with a question?
 

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Hello community. First, my apologies if am posting in the wrong place... Blah... Blah... Blah... Blah... Can you guys share your thoughts regarding what happened and how to proceed? How do you guys respond to texts/messages? How do you suggest I try to make this happen? Any help appreciated!
Step 1: Offer exchange of information, preferably something she doesn't know.
Step 2: Make the exchanges gradually more personal
Step 3: ???
Step 4: Profit
 

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I decided I really want to get to know a T girl really well.
You might want to rephrase that.

Also, find what she's passionate about. certain topic she just can't shut up about once you get her started. That'show you bond with INTPs. Aside from that, you have to be really obvious. I've had girls tell me that they were into me, but since I didn't pick up on it they stopped trying.
 
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I am also very straightforward person and I almost never lie. I don't think I'll ever have problems not being blunt enough.

I agree with you that she probably isn't currently interested. Though the "study session" turned into essentially a 4 hr talk gives me hope. I've read that INTPs usually keep to themselves until they feel comfortable with the other person. Seeing as there has been little interaction so far, I have hope for the future. I'm mainly looking to get her to be interested in me to put it plainly. For instance, how would you like to be messaged? Should I bother with greetings and small talk? Or simply rush in with a question?
This is just me, but I hate small talk. I consider it boring and just plain waste of time. If you want to interest her, try figuring out what she's interested in; just try throwing out different ideas on what you could talk about, and see what catches her attention. Once you find it, she'll probably start to open up.
 

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I am also very straightforward person and I almost never lie. I don't think I'll ever have problems not being blunt enough.

I agree with you that she probably isn't currently interested. Though the "study session" turned into essentially a 4 hr talk gives me hope. I've read that INTPs usually keep to themselves until they feel comfortable with the other person. Seeing as there has been little interaction so far, I have hope for the future. I'm mainly looking to get her to be interested in me to put it plainly. For instance, how would you like to be messaged? Should I bother with greetings and small talk? Or simply rush in with a question?
I was going to say "Don't use small talk!" But it might be better to say, turn that small talk into something with more rich and substantive. When I meet someone new, sometimes it's interesting to ask someone "What do you think about [xyz]?" and see what kind of response you get. She may still be quiet being an introvert, but depending on what you ask, it might open her up to talking about her interests. INTPs can often have a very wide range of interests. So it may not be difficult. INTPs typically like to have their ideas challenged. It gives the INTP the chance to check one's theories. Don't be argumentative just for the sake of being argumentative, but if she talks about something and you are unsure about how you agree with it, try to get her to talk about it further and express your opinion as well. If your mind has actual conflict with her ideas, investigate it further by asking her in an inquisitive way.

I think the biggest difficulty you may have related to ISTJ and INTP is going to be your S vs her N. I would do some search on Youtube, to learn to understand the differences between S types and N types. Youtube has quite a few videos of people talking about the subject.
 

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By the way, ISTJ loyalty goes a long way for INTP girls. However the bottom line is that with this comes a sort of boringness. There will be lots of other people who won't find you this way. Being with you will probably hinder her development, too.
 

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Discussion Starter #15 (Edited)
I was going to say "Don't use small talk!" But it might be better to say, turn that small talk into something with more rich and substantive. When I meet someone new, sometimes it's interesting to ask someone "What do you think about [xyz]?" and see what kind of response you get. She may still be quiet being an introvert, but depending on what you ask, it might open her up to talking about her interests. INTPs can often have a very wide range of interests. So it may not be difficult. INTPs typically like to have their ideas challenged. It gives the INTP the chance to check one's theories. Don't be argumentative just for the sake of being argumentative, but if she talks about something and you are unsure about how you agree with it, try to get her to talk about it further and express your opinion as well. If your mind has actual conflict with her ideas, investigate it further by asking her in an inquisitive way.

I think the biggest difficulty you may have related to ISTJ and INTP is going to be your S vs her N. I would do some search on Youtube, to learn to understand the differences between S types and N types. Youtube has quite a few videos of people talking about the subject.
This is my usual approach to everyone. I usually say something to the effect of "Hi, how you doing" and then lead into something specific. For people I know better, I skip the small talk and just talk about the main topic. My small worry is whether it matters that first part matters or not.

You might want to rephrase that.

Also, find what she's passionate about. certain topic she just can't shut up about once you get her started. That'show you bond with INTPs. Aside from that, you have to be really obvious. I've had girls tell me that they were into me, but since I didn't pick up on it they stopped trying.
I know it sounds bad, but I'm pretty introverted and most girls I meet are feeling types. Of course, I may be rebounding, but I will give it another two months or so before considering going further. I will try to find her passion!

EDIT: I now realize what you mean. I was not aware that T could refer to trans. I meant T as in thinking.

By the way, ISTJ loyalty goes a long way for INTP girls. However the bottom line is that with this comes a sort of boringness. There will be lots of other people who won't find you this way. Being with you will probably hinder her development, too.
What boringness would that be? I used to have quite the eccentric personality with puns/sarcasm and constant wordplay, but I toned in down in the past two years...It wouldn't be hard to bring it back though! And why would that hinder her development?

Step 1: Offer exchange of information, preferably something she doesn't know.
Step 2: Make the exchanges gradually more personal
Step 3: ???
Step 4: Profit
Makes sense, will try!
 

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What boringness would that be? I used to have quite the eccentric personality with puns/sarcasm and constant wordplay, but I toned in down in the past two years...It wouldn't be hard to bring it back though! And why would that hinder her development?
ISTJs think they're being eccentric, but usually it's all mild. INTPs will generally use multi-layered humor, whereas ISTJs usually go for easily foreseeable stuff. That said, ISTJs can still be amusing to be around, because their stable, citizen-like approach can bring about situational humor.

ISTJs are easily figured out for INTPs. The opposite isn't true.

She needs to be developing her Ne, and, being around an ISTJ is probably the last place she will feel free to do this. Your intellect will be interesting to her, but the straight forward approach to life may end up seeming like a cage to her.

Ne really only goes with Ne. As an inferior function, I wouldn't recommend with leading with it; as it will come off as unnatural and unimpressive to other people, especially since you're young. Inferior takes about 20 years to develop.
 
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I hate to be the one to tell you, but you are building her up in a manner that even if she did like you, she could never live up to. I am not exactly sure as to the reason you smitten by her if you have such a limited understanding of who she is. Possibly there is a physical attraction on your part (which I understand you pushing aside as not to sound shallow) and her "INTP" attitude which would set her apart from the average girls you normally encounter. You are searching for commonality between the two of you, picking out things you can relate to and avoid the things you fear she will find uninteresting. You are attempting to build a character of yourself to increase your chances and that is only going to hurt yourself.

If she is a true INTP, she will be analyzing your conversations and picking out inconsistencies, ever how subtle they are. She will not be fooled by any trickery and will respond better to you acting like your true self. If she still is engaging with you after failed attempts at connecting with your humor, you nerding out over you anime fandom, and talking deeply about the most random things imaginable, then you should confront her with your feelings. But what matters is that YOU feel comfortable being yourself around her. That is the key to winning over anyone, let alone the highly guarded INTPs.

If you do not feel like taking the time to do that, then you should just tell her that you are interested in her in more than a friendly way. Again if she is truly an INTP, she will not be offended nor upset. She will either be interested in you, or interested in knowing why you have developed these feelings.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
I hate to be the one to tell you, but you are building her up in a manner that even if she did like you, she could never live up to. I am not exactly sure as to the reason you smitten by her if you have such a limited understanding of who she is. Possibly there is a physical attraction on your part (which I understand you pushing aside as not to sound shallow) and her "INTP" attitude which would set her apart from the average girls you normally encounter. You are searching for commonality between the two of you, picking out things you can relate to and avoid the things you fear she will find uninteresting. You are attempting to build a character of yourself to increase your chances and that is only going to hurt yourself.

If she is a true INTP, she will be analyzing your conversations and picking out inconsistencies, ever how subtle they are. She will not be fooled by any trickery and will respond better to you acting like your true self. If she still is engaging with you after failed attempts at connecting with your humor, you nerding out over you anime fandom, and talking deeply about the most random things imaginable, then you should confront her with your feelings. But what matters is that YOU feel comfortable being yourself around her. That is the key to winning over anyone, let alone the highly guarded INTPs.

If you do not feel like taking the time to do that, then you should just tell her that you are interested in her in more than a friendly way. Again if she is truly an INTP, she will not be offended nor upset. She will either be interested in you, or interested in knowing why you have developed these feelings.
I did admit there was physical attraction last year. It was mixed in the long post and I definitely didn't spend a lot of time talking about it. This year, I didn't feel much physical attraction. I'm unsure. Albeit, there have been few interactions.

But you are right in that there is something I am reluctant to talk about. I briefly hinted about it, but I had a really bad experience with my ex isfp about a month ago. While I no longer feel for her, her actions do piss me off. After some contemplation, I realized that most of our fights were due to her strong dependency on feelings. Most of the girls I know are feelers and after interacting with this INTP, I did alot of research about them. What swayed me were their tendencies to be honest, enjoy fair intellectual discussion and loyalty. While I'm not certain she is "the one," I definitely want to pursue her. At the very least gain this experience.

When I wrote the main post, I understood there was alot I was leaving out. I could have easily included observations and other reasons why we might be a decent match. However, I also know that there is a limit to how much one could write without completely losing one's audience. Therefore, I decided to write the most relevant details.

I am a consistent person. Further, when I talk to people, I usually know relatively how much that person knows about me. For instance, when a friend knows something about me that I haven't told them, I usually recognize that and ask where they heard said info. 9/10 a friend of a friend told him/her. In general, I am not a hypocrite regardless of the circumstance. It goes against my principles. In any case I doubt she will find inconsistencies.

That being said, I am used to keeping my nerdy interests to myself. Its natural for me to do it. Most of my college friends don't know about these interests and we get along just fine. I don't feel like I'm not being myself. I don't believe I am conforming. I realize I have a rare interest and I enjoy them in my alone time. Therefore, I don't feel like it is going to be a barrier in a possible relationship.

Your feedback is definitely interesting and gave me a lot to think about. Thanks!
 

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Discussion Starter #19
ISTJs think they're being eccentric, but usually it's all mild. INTPs will generally use multi-layered humor, whereas ISTJs usually go for easily foreseeable stuff. That said, ISTJs can still be amusing to be around, because their stable, citizen-like approach can bring about situational humor.

ISTJs are easily figured out for INTPs. The opposite isn't true.

She needs to be developing her Ne, and, being around an ISTJ is probably the last place she will feel free to do this. Your intellect will be interesting to her, but the straight forward approach to life may end up seeming like a cage to her.

Ne really only goes with Ne. As an inferior function, I wouldn't recommend with leading with it; as it will come off as unnatural and unimpressive to other people, especially since you're young. Inferior takes about 20 years to develop.
You may be right. Eccentric is subjective so it wouldn't be strange for me to be mistaken. To be forthright with you, I'm also skeptical about these sort of claims so it is best to explain myself.

Ever since I can remember, sarcasm, puns and dark humor have been my favorite things to read/watch. As such, I became quite the troll in high school. For instance, I would say plausible, yet ridiculous things with a straight face to my classmates and they would all believe me...till they knew me better. Then, they could never tell whether or not I was telling the truth. (they often told me this). After high school, I stopped because at heart, I am a responsible and honest guy and I didn't want people not to trust me because of those antics. This may seem contradictory, but when I "lied," I made sure it was really obvious or let the person know right away that I was joking. Also, I assigned random acronyms to my friends which seems strange looking back. For instance, I would always tell this one friend RTTS whenever he had to give a speech. (Randy's Time To Shine)

Anyways, I could give some more examples, but those are basically my reasons. I could be wrong, but I've always considered myself quirky at least.

As far as multi layered humor goes....I LOVE IT! The thrill of "getting it" never ceases to amuse me. I probably can't make these kinds of jokes constantly, but I am confident I can understand it if I hear/see it.

In a recent test, I scored 53% for observant. Not exactly sure if that is high, but 47% isn't that far from a majority in my opinion. Granted, I've only started reading about MBTI recently... I have read that INTPs match best with Ne, but why exactly is that? If its theorizing, I don't think I would have a problem. I often find myself concocting plans and courses of actions in my mind that I know I will never actually take. I write plausible stories in my mind. When there is a hole in a TV show, I imagine how the story might have changed had the protagonist used his/her power better. My point is that I can theorize. Perhaps not amazingly now, but I have faith I can learn in the long run.

I'll take your advice about not leading with Ne. Definitely something I want to practice, but its probably better to stick with my strong suit.
 

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You may be right. Eccentric is subjective so it wouldn't be strange for me to be mistaken. To be forthright with you, I'm also skeptical about these sort of claims so it is best to explain myself.

Ever since I can remember, sarcasm, puns and dark humor have been my favorite things to read/watch. As such, I became quite the troll in high school. For instance, I would say plausible, yet ridiculous things with a straight face to my classmates and they would all believe me...till they knew me better. Then, they could never tell whether or not I was telling the truth. (they often told me this). After high school, I stopped because at heart, I am a responsible and honest guy and I didn't want people not to trust me because of those antics. This may seem contradictory, but when I "lied," I made sure it was really obvious or let the person know right away that I was joking. Also, I assigned random acronyms to my friends which seems strange looking back. For instance, I would always tell this one friend RTTS whenever he had to give a speech. (Randy's Time To Shine)

Anyways, I could give some more examples, but those are basically my reasons. I could be wrong, but I've always considered myself quirky at least.

As far as multi layered humor goes....I LOVE IT! The thrill of "getting it" never ceases to amuse me. I probably can't make these kinds of jokes constantly, but I am confident I can understand it if I hear/see it.

In a recent test, I scored 53% for observant. Not exactly sure if that is high, but 47% isn't that far from a majority in my opinion. Granted, I've only started reading about MBTI recently... I have read that INTPs match best with Ne, but why exactly is that? If its theorizing, I don't think I would have a problem. I often find myself concocting plans and courses of actions in my mind that I know I will never actually take. I write plausible stories in my mind. When there is a hole in a TV show, I imagine how the story might have changed had the protagonist used his/her power better. My point is that I can theorize. Perhaps not amazingly now, but I have faith I can learn in the long run.

I'll take your advice about not leading with Ne. Definitely something I want to practice, but its probably better to stick with my strong suit.
More later, but for now: what is your strong suit?
 
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