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I'm an ENTp in a relationship with an INFj and in the past she lies to me to avoid confrontation because she does things she knows I'll get mad about. So i've started to make her tell me every thing about her life and it's causing her emotional stress and fights so this approach isn't going to work. I'm not going to be okay with all the things she does but I don't want her to lie to me to avoid me getting upset. What can I do about this? She always throws it back on me because of my Fi POLR I'm easily discreditable to her...
 

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Nobody likes to have to report everything they do to someone, especially if that person isn't someone in a possition of power over them, which presumably you don't want to be, maybe explain to her that you want the best for the both of you and honesty is the way to go, forcing it isn't going to get you anywhere, if she's anything like me she'll close up more and more until enough is enough and she'll explone in your face, so what I'm saying honesty and openess :happy:
 

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If you're going to be mad at her when she tells you the truth, then she isn't going to tell you. Best you can do is get her to tell you, say you don't like it, and switch to a subject that is positive.

Also, lying like a child isn't good, but neither is being abusive by keeping tabs on your partner, and getting online to find people to help you control her is definitely abusive. You both are unhealthy. I recommend independent counseling for both of you.
 

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If she does things that makes you mad, then she obviously enjoys doing them. Telling you would be pointless because you'd just get mad. Putting her under a microscope won't really help, either. That will, as you acknowledged, just stress her out and make her retreat into herself more. The best course of action here, if her being more open is the end goal, is to make her comfortable and relaxed enough to share with you willingly, instead of it feeling like an oppressive situation. The reasons why you don't want her doing these things will be in the back of her mind, and she can choose to stop doing it because she wants to better herself, instead of (in her view) being forced by someone else to change. It has to happen more naturally with a feeling person, ya dig?
 

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Simply put, you probably can't. Ne+Fi ego types are masters of evasion, EII's even more so. Especially if you try to force them to be direct. Good luck, you're hitting their most irritating point and they're only going to react in a knee-jerk and childish way.
 

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Simply put, you probably can't. Ne+Fi ego types are masters of evasion, EII's even more so. Especially if you try to force them to be direct. Good luck, you're hitting their most irritating point and they're only going to react in a knee-jerk and childish way.
Interesting. Can you explain this a bit more; in what way are they masters of evasion?

Also, do they evade things a lot, or something?
 

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Simply put, you probably can't. Ne+Fi ego types are masters of evasion, EII's even more so. Especially if you try to force them to be direct. Good luck, you're hitting their most irritating point and they're only going to react in a knee-jerk and childish way.
NeFi yes, Ne doms, but I can't think of why FiNe would unless they are extremely confrontation avoidant like type 9s but the ambiguity and aggressive attitude makes me think there might be a hint of Ti here as this all sounds very subjective yet meant to written as facts. So I refuse to comment on this really.

Who wants to tell everything about their life? Especially if it is causing her emotional stress. A little too demanding there, no? I would want transparency too but your attitude is definitely off putting and I doubt the things you don't want her to do are open to your perception
 

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I'm an ENTp in a relationship with an INFj and in the past she lies to me to avoid confrontation because she does things she knows I'll get mad about. So i've started to make her tell me every thing about her life and it's causing her emotional stress and fights so this approach isn't going to work. I'm not going to be okay with all the things she does but I don't want her to lie to me to avoid me getting upset. What can I do about this? She always throws it back on me because of my Fi POLR I'm easily discreditable to her...
Haha making her not lie.
Give up, she will lie cause she thinks it is for the best of things.
I was in a relationship to one too, but at least there was an equality due to it being a kindred relation.
You can't make her stop.
She is your supervior, you have zero power and influence over her.
Your PoLR will rightly observed be an offbutton for you.
There is no equality, she has full control and you trying to force her to tell you everything is not working.
Accept that you will be lied to day in and out.
Or get a new relationship.
 

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So I refuse to comment on this really.
Thank you.

Interesting. Can you explain this a bit more; in what way are they masters of evasion?

Also, do they evade things a lot, or something?
Alright. I'll give it a shot. Evaders of anything they perceive as conflict; especially in regards to their emotional reaction towards people. Fi+Ne egos lack the confidence and comfort with conflicts, confrontations and stuff. We're simply more likely to just avoid the aggressor, the situation, the thing that is disturbing than to be upfront about it.

Sometimes you won't even know that you've done something or that they're avoiding you, as they might be somewhat civil towards you. Due to how opaque they can be, you might think everything is alright while they're bitching about it behind the your back.

In that way I find delta NF's to be somewhat hypocritical in that they'll speak of honesty and "being yourself" while truthfully not doing it themselves. I say this as one. I know it sounds bitter, I don't particularly mean for it too, but oh well. :laughing:

I think the big difference between IEE and EII when it comes to conflict is that the IEE is more likely to actively resist you and to be contrary for what seems to be the sake of it, in contrast to EII's passiveness. This is something I've been accused of, numerous times.

Kind of hope I got my point across; not doing so is another thing I get accused of :tongue:

Pretty sure his gf is an INFP/IEI.
Wouldn't surprise me; I've seen one ILE+EII couple who lasted the better part of five minutes. It certainly wasn't a healthy relationship. Of course, if that is the case then my suggestion is entirely worthless, lol.
 

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Thank you.
rofl, did I just rest your resisting case or what?

However, I never lie about things, when asked directly I can't even not talk about it, like I have no option but to talk about it even if I draw circles being indirect and try to keep it subtle. I am very confrontational too, of course it builds up until it happens but I don't refrain from it especially when it would cause me emotional stress. So I am not sure how you guys are so sure. well I wouldn't say delta NFs altogether, ENFPs are highly manipulative and hypocritical, I assure you I don't say this is a negative trait - although it is kind of <.< but I am just being objective - I know that it goes unnoticed

Then again, resisting part sounds like it just might be as well, so I think the OP's Ti language is highly questionable
 

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Trying to make sense of you gives me a headache.
Oh my bad, I thought you made a clever pun there to cite my refusal to comment on this subject to support your Fi - resisting case.
But of course, there were no clever puns. Just your very uncalled and very simplistic attempts of your bias and quoting me for extra attention.

I apologize, I should have known better not to assume a clever pun from you.
 

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@The_Wanderer

Thanks, that explains a lot! ^_^

This kind of behavior is exactly what I experienced during a previous relationship with a IEE. It drove me nuts, haha! I think it's because the way I deal with conflict is to just confront it head-on. It doesn't bother me. I like both parties to have all their cards on the table; I see conflict resolution as being impossible if we can't be direct/honest with each other. Which includes no "sugar-coating". :p

This particular relationship was a growing lesson for me as I realized not everyone values this in the same way I do. In the end, I got accused of being too "critical" and "aggressive." I still feel a little guilty for that. >_>
 

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One thing is being straightforward and honest, another is sharing every single feeling inside of me or every single thing I've done that day. Chances are I'd find it extremely stressful too, especially if I'm being forced to do so, as I think that the 'hiding' aspect of an EII is mostly based on a need to deal with personal feelings and thoughts on my own rather than letting everything out. I'm very emotionally reactive and most of the time it's just things I can't explain or that I'm full aware only exist in my head.

Being an enneagram 4 doesn't help in that regard.

I will never be as blunt and direct as a Se user but that doesn't make me a liar, I don't lie.
The avoidance of an EII can be lethal though, I've been called out on it frequently.

Avoiding pointless confrontation might be perceived as such but it's just holding back due to a need to protect one's vulnerability and not being particularly physically expressive when it comes to emotional reactions, unless something really hits me in the deep and causes an intense personal reaction. But once you win an EII over and make sure they know they can be comfortable around you without any judgement involved, the EII themselves will willingly choose to be as emotionally open possible with you and that's extremely significant. Being the only one who has access to their core and who makes them feel natural and able to break all of their natural passiveness.

This is why Te-doms and Fi-doms are so good for each other, one brings structure and clarity of expression, the other inspires emotional awareness and offers deep understanding.
 

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I think your confrontation has made her less willing to be open with you. I'm an INFj in Socionics and INFP in MBTI, and also a type 4. I agree a lot with @Hotaru here.

When I read this post, I immediately thought of how my ENTp / ENTJ father always taught me to be honest with him as a child. He told me that "as long as you come with the truth to me, I will never be angry at you." This is the reason why I have always come with the truth to him. Because I knew he would always try to understand me.

As I said, I can imagine how the way you have made her tell you everything she has been doing through her day, makes her feel controlled. I think this is the worst way of dealing with her. What exactly is she doing that you don't want her to do? To be honest, it sounds like she is doing things that goes against your own principles, but not her own. INFjs / INFPs are extremely focused on and aware of their own emotions, and causing them emotional stress can impact them in horrible ways. I don't think your relationship will last longer if this is the way you deal with this, unless she is the type to hold onto bad relationships.
 
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