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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I'm 19, he's 27. We're both first year undergraduates.

He'd been with his girlfriend 4 years before this. They broke up officially last December but she'd still come around to college wanting to get back together, and I naively assumed he let her because he was trying to make the breakup easier for her. He said he always broke up with people on good terms. He told me he didn't love her anymore, repeatedly.

from mid January when I first started talking to him till late March I was just really happy, astonished and grateful to have met him. He was understanding, funny, easy to talk to, brought me out of my shell like few could. Perhaps naively I was swept away by how direct he was with words - 'I'm mildly crazy about you', 'drop by later for hugs and longing stares'. I was uncomfortable with verbal expression but tried to make up for it through actions - humming him to sleep, bringing chocolate, bringing poetry competition leaflets. I first became aware of problems in late March, when he brought up some of the ways I'd unintentionally said or not said stuff to hurt him. I explained that these were unintentional, that I still cared for him even if I didn't always know when to say what. He reassured me saying it was alright, it wasn't really an issue. But then holidays started and he went back home, and his distance seemed to indicate that something was wrong.

we kept in regular contact at first, then he got more and more distant, reticent about how he'd spent his day, saying he'd text and then forgetting and claiming he'd been busy. I asked if I'd done something wrong and he comforted me saying I didn't need to rack my brain wondering what I'd done wrong, that I could be secure in his feelings for me.

yet other things happened to make me realize he was spending a lot of time with his ex-girlfriend. so last Wednesday I called him, wanting to be reassured. instead I got a complete bombshell - he said he'd reconciled with his ex-girlfriend over the holidays, forgiven her for the things that'd caused him to break up with her. he bluntly stated that he loved her and saw the future with her - it was almost as if he held something against me. It was an agitated, angry conversation on both our sides. He accused me of things I didn't even know were issues - my inexpressiveness, my supposed resistance to letting him into my life. and yet he knew I'd been making efforts to be more expressive, he'd acknowledged them himself, even telling one of our mutual friends he was glad I'd gotten more expressive in his company. We'd made out twice. I'd been trying to get over my shyness and initiate physical contact because he'd said he needed physical expressiveness in a relationship... so I don't understand how he could tell me 'I thought you just wanted to be friends', or 'you had lots of opportunities to tell me you wanted me as a boyfriend'. I believed him in the moment, but all the people I talked to afterwards tell me he was just making excuses.

also, it almost felt like he was bullying me into remaining friends. he said, 'so it's either a relationship or nothing? that's quite insulting, it feels like you only valued me as a boyfriend.' I replied 'well if someone's willing to hurt me like that I don't see why I should be friends with them', and he got pissed and said 'if you want to interpret it that way, fine.' I don't see why I shouldn't interpret it that way :/ If he really valued me as a friend surely he wouldn't try to force me to stay friends.

the next day his tone was a lot gentler, more apologetic. He said he'd acted like a 'fucking idiot' and had 'really messed up'. I was crying and he asked if I wanted to talk about it. We tried having a light, humorous conversation but I couldn't resist dropping some sarcastic comments which appeared to hurt him because he said '__, don't hate me.' he said he still considered me his best friend, still wanted to see me grow as a person, said he noticed I'd gotten more confident in his company and that it'd be a shame to give that all up. A few hours later I felt especially upset and needy, so calling him up knowing he was holidaying in another city with his girlfriend and their friends was partly a way of testing his words. I texted asking when he'd be free to talk later and he curtly replied 'In 15mins', but I couldn't so I asked if I could call later instead and he didn't reply. when I finally called, the line cut short and I sent a harsh message saying not to hang up on me cuz he was obliged to deal with my emotional volatility. he replied 'it's just signal problems, why do you always assume the worst, and I'm only free to talk tomorrow morning before 10am'. I replied 'I assume the worst because I have reason to, besides I really need to talk to you, so when are you free?' He didn't reply. I guess my harshness / obsessive clinginess was a major reason he didn't want to talk, but I felt he should've made the effort. Does the fact that he ignored me indicate he's not worth having as a friend? Because the next morning he texted saying 'I'm happy to talk to you when I'm free :) Which I am right now, so feel free to call if you want.' And I replied saying 'ignoring me yesterday despite knowing how needy and hurt I was shows you don't want to acknowledge the damage you've caused, which isn't really a quality I want in a close friend. I'll see you when term starts.' In hindsight I s'pose he knew I knew he was with his girlfriend, and was pissed that I'd want to hog their time together.

the next day he texted asking if I was awake. I ignored it because I felt he was just trying to put his mind at ease the day before he went to Europe with his girlfriend. that was two days ago and I haven't heard from him since. I will, however, see him in four days when university term starts.

I'll have to patch things up somehow with him, because we're going to be housemates next year, the contract's signed and whatnot. But I'm trying not to offer my friendship easily, and I think I deserve a proper and less vague apology. I get that flinging accusations is not the way to go, but how do I unambiguously say 'I really didn't like how you tried to make it seem like my fault. I don't like the way I had to find out you guys had gotten back together.' all this assumes he even cares enough about me to apologize, but if he so desperately wants to be friends again then I'd rather make him work for it.

Also, it'd be nice to have objective opinions on his behaviour. Does he genuinely want to stay close friends? What's making him act like this? He's generally a nice guy, organizes parties (not the loud drunken sort) for people in college, was really supportive and affirming. He does have his arrogant side, having no qualms emotionally bullying people a little if he's trying to get something done fast, or telling people his assessments of their personalities to their face. (He's very perceptive and confident in his judgments about people, which is why I don't believe he thought I just wanted to be friends.)

anyway, gah I know I can be unflatteringly clingy and vindictive. I'm trying to be calmer and more adult-like about it, and this is why I'm here. and I know this has been a very long detailed post, so thanks for reading.
 

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I had an absolutely toxic relationship with an unhealthy ENFJ. They can be real projection artists if they lack the maturity to deal with their own actions.

In reality, what he accused you of, he was likely guilty of. I'm sure the accusations really took you off balance (I completely relate). If reconciling is even still an issue (ahem, over a year later), I say run.

It hurts, but there is no reason to expose yourself to more psychodrama. If he needs a reason to emotionally subjugate you, he will find it. You didn't do x therefore y, even if he said x was ok at one point.

It could have been that he misinterpreted you and sensed a kind of rejection. Dealing with rejection does not come gracefully to certain members of this type, and the courtesy, affection, and understanding they normally afford you disappears. Be wary that he does not start to work the people around you (mutual friends) to make his version of events more potent. If you are viewed as problematic or "not on board," he could charm people away from you.

/paranoid rant
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
How did it go? Are you still alive?
LOL. Still alive thank you. It was resolved for awhile, but after a few weeks of peace shit eventually blew up again. And again. And again. And at the end there were no positive feelings left for each other. Living in the same house did not help; little issues like 'could you please take out the trash' and 'okay so who didn't do the dishes this time' became so charged with emotion because of the bigger underlying issues we had with each other. Also we both tend towards passive-aggression, so unresolved feelings of resentment from previous arguments would carry over into subsequent ones. The ability to just Let Go of emotions, the ability to be more direct/honest with each other, would've helped both of us a lot. But in the end it just broke.

I'm actually a little in love with an INFJ now (though it's so not gonna work out) and I'm a little scared because of what I know/suspect about NFJs. But that's another story. Heh.

insultfashioner said:
I had an absolutely toxic relationship with an unhealthy ENFJ. They can be real projection artists if they lack the maturity to deal with their own actions.

In reality, what he accused you of, he was likely guilty of. I'm sure the accusations really took you off balance (I completely relate). If reconciling is even still an issue (ahem, over a year later), I say run.


It hurts, but there is no reason to expose yourself to more psychodrama. If he needs a reason to emotionally subjugate you, he will find it. You didn't do x therefore y, even if he said x was ok at one point.


It could have been that he misinterpreted you and sensed a kind of rejection. Dealing with rejection does not come gracefully to certain members of this type, and the courtesy, affection, and understanding they normally afford you disappears. Be wary that he does not start to work the people around you (mutual friends) to make his version of events more potent. If you are viewed as problematic or "not on board," he could charm people away from you.


/paranoid rant
hello fellow intp attracted to nfjs! (I presume! Haha.)
Yeah, agree with everything you say - 'projection artists', 'emotionally subjugate', 'bad with dealing with rejection', these all ring a bell.

Although to be fair he was not a bad person. I guess in the heat of defensiveness we can all be 'projection artists', but what matters is that the heated moments pass and sanity returns to us eventually. Which is when the apologies / backtracking come in. As it did with him.

You sound like you were in a sucky relationship. I don't even want to know what must've happened to create such paranoia.

To his credit I don't think he tried to work people around me, although I was afraid he might accidentally do that. By which I mean that simply by complaining to his friends about me, even if he wasn't consciously trying to 'work them' away from me, it might have that effect anyway. The one mutual friend we did have, however, was a complete angel - totally neutral and never taking any sides. Gotta love INTJs for that.

Anyway. Feel free to PM me if you wanna talk more about NFJs. They're such lovely / frustrating creatures.
 

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I'm 19, he's 27. We're both first year undergraduates.
... ... ...

anyways, I read through it, and personally... I'd say screw him. Who needs someone like that? That will only keep you around until the ex convinces him to forgive her. But I'm not in a relationship at the moment, so... and then after such an insulting move, has the nerve to pretend as if he holds all the cards and you are some desperate person who needs him. "It's a relationship or nothing." that's despicable. I wouldn't tolerate that kind of nerve. I can't put into words what that means to me...
 
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