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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Something I've lately thought a lot about is how you guys deal with people that you share a negative history with. This doesn't have to be something traumatizing. Let's take as example a friend you trusted that let you down so severly that you lost all respect for mentioned person.

I recently caught myself in situations with different people like this. Now after a serious hurt or let's call it betrayal I tend to back away from those specific people instantly. I tend to cut all robes to them in the second I realize what's going on and stop thinking about them, I start organizing everything but as soon as the situation is safe again, I remember that person. I have a really hot temper which I'm working on to remain more self controlled, but even if I want to be emotionless about those people, I tend to develop a horrible hate against them, after that I slip in a sort of emotional numbness towards them. It's like they are completely erased from my mind and emotions. Yes emotions, I'm talking about the kind of friends you truly trusted which I don't normally do.

After this phase the actual problem starts. It's as if my body wanted them around again but even if I try to have a normal conversation with them, my mood gets worse. I slip into that numbness again, get overly direct and push all emotions from me. No matter how hard I try, I can't ignore the knowledge that I've let them in once and they hurt me. I can't get myself to feel any respect for them, at all. Not about their person, not their ideas, nothing. It's not hate, it's literally not caring.

I wonder, sure you've been in situations like this? How do you experience this? Especially after such an incident I start acting coolly towards others, even worse than normally.
 

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Something I've lately thought a lot about is how you guys deal with people that you share a negative history with. This doesn't have to be something traumatizing. Let's take as example a friend you trusted that let you down so severly that you lost all respect for mentioned person.

I recently caught myself in situations with different people like this. Now after a serious hurt or let's call it betrayal I tend to back away from those specific people instantly. I tend to cut all robes to them in the second I realize what's going on and stop thinking about them, I start organizing everything but as soon as the situation is safe again, I remember that person. I have a really hot temper which I'm working on to remain more self controlled, but even if I want to be emotionless about those people, I tend to develop a horrible hate against them, after that I slip in a sort of emotional numbness towards them. It's like they are completely erased from my mind and emotions. Yes emotions, I'm talking about the kind of friends you truly trusted which I don't normally do.

After this phase the actual problem starts. It's as if my body wanted them around again but even if I try to have a normal conversation with them, my mood gets worse. I slip into that numbness again, get overly direct and push all emotions from me. No matter how hard I try, I can't ignore the knowledge that I've let them in once and they hurt me. I can't get myself to feel any respect for them, at all. Not about their person, not their ideas, nothing. It's not hate, it's literally not caring.

I wonder, sure you've been in situations like this? How do you experience this? Especially after such an incident I start acting coolly towards others, even worse than normally.
It's called loving yourself first. Once you've done that, you cannot feel betrayed etc. Don't know how else to put it more simply/perfectly.
 

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It's called loving yourself first. Once you've done that, you cannot feel betrayed etc. Don't know how else to put it more simply/perfectly.
If I put my trust in someone and they betray me, how does loving myself(first) stop their betrayal? I'm confused; could you clarify?
 

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Something I've lately thought a lot about is how you guys deal with people that you share a negative history with. This doesn't have to be something traumatizing. Let's take as example a friend you trusted that let you down so severly that you lost all respect for mentioned person.

I recently caught myself in situations with different people like this. Now after a serious hurt or let's call it betrayal I tend to back away from those specific people instantly. I tend to cut all robes to them in the second I realize what's going on and stop thinking about them, I start organizing everything but as soon as the situation is safe again, I remember that person. I have a really hot temper which I'm working on to remain more self controlled, but even if I want to be emotionless about those people, I tend to develop a horrible hate against them, after that I slip in a sort of emotional numbness towards them. It's like they are completely erased from my mind and emotions. Yes emotions, I'm talking about the kind of friends you truly trusted which I don't normally do.

After this phase the actual problem starts. It's as if my body wanted them around again but even if I try to have a normal conversation with them, my mood gets worse. I slip into that numbness again, get overly direct and push all emotions from me. No matter how hard I try, I can't ignore the knowledge that I've let them in once and they hurt me. I can't get myself to feel any respect for them, at all. Not about their person, not their ideas, nothing. It's not hate, it's literally not caring.

I wonder, sure you've been in situations like this? How do you experience this? Especially after such an incident I start acting coolly towards others, even worse than normally.
If they've already betrayed you once, why would you even want to let them back in at all?

Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.
 

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I am the type of person who holds grudges. Still, I recognize that people can change and if someone who has wronged me has demonstrated change and growth I will usually forgive them and be willing to repair our relationship over time.

There was a guy I grew up with who I was friends with while we were kids. When we were teenagers he started being rather mean to me for seemingly no reason. It got worse over time to the point where I hated him. We both went away to separate colleges the same year and when we returned for summer break after the first year he was really friendly towards me. There wasn't even an inkling of his previous behavior present. We never addressed the past but our relationship has totally changed to the point where I like him and enjoy spending time with him.

Anyway, I am usually willing to work things out and let those who have wronged me back into my life if they show growth or remorse.
 

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Any negative feelings you feel always start from yourself.
So letting go of resentment opens up space for content to fill its void; that way external influence has nothing to latch too?
 

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You lose something if you hurt me. The closer you were and the bigger the hurt/betrayal the more serious the resulting withdrawal. I can often go back to something that is cordial and 'okay'ish so that from the outside it looks like all is well but it's not. You can't go back, there's nothing to go back too. Even if I want stuff to go back to the way they were, because it was really good or because I need them or whatever I can't cuz something is missing.
 

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So letting go of resentment opens up space for content to fill its void; that way external influence has nothing to latch too?
You can see it like that if you would like, but I just see it as a shift in logic or perspective.

Once you love yourself, your life goals change, your objectives change, your perspective changes. For everyone, that is different, but I would think it will make you invulnerable to external negative forces.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
If they've already betrayed you once, why would you even want to let them back in at all?

Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.
That pretty much is the way I'm thinking. It's mostly my emotional side that unfortunately tries to make me act. The betrayal I'm talking about really did come from people I've put a lot of trust in, I valued them for pretty much everything about them and truly put my trust in them.

Thanks for your answer. That's what I was looking for. I start withdrawing from people that seriously let me down, there is just no way I get myself to trust them again. So I am asking other ENTJs if that's just some problem of mine since it sometimes may influence the way I'm analyzing situations (and I don't enjoy being influenced by the feeling of not being able to trust one of the project's members. I'd fire them but you know, school doesn't give me that possibility unfortunately)

The self loving thing really is nothing I'd care about. It's not part of the question anyhow nor does it improve my situation with mentioned people? I don't classify emotions in good or bad, all of them are annoying and all of them are equally important. "Bad" they are in the second they start influencing the way I'm making decisions which in this case sometimes might be the case.
 

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You can see it like that if you would like, but I just see it as a shift in logic or perspective.

Once you love yourself, your life goals change, your objectives change, your perspective changes. For everyone, that is different, but I would think it will make you invulnerable to external negative forces.
In my opinion it's extremely hard to always maintain that level of invulnerability without a bit of ignorance or willful blindness.

To simplify what you're saying though is, "True acceptance of yourself brings out the optimist, and fuck everything else." :d
 

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The self loving thing really is nothing I'd care about. It's not part of the question anyhow nor does it improve my situation with mentioned people? I don't classify emotions in good or bad, all of them are annoying and all of them are equally important. "Bad" they are in the second they start influencing the way I'm making decisions which in this case sometimes might be the case.
Since they are obviously a part of us whether we choose to care about them, isn't it better to have a better understanding/grasp/control over how they manifest? I think plato's suggestion is to kill the root of the problem instead of trying to mentally manage the affect/effect.
 

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Something I've lately thought a lot about is how you guys deal with people that you share a negative history with. This doesn't have to be something traumatizing. Let's take as example a friend you trusted that let you down so severely that you lost all respect for mentioned person.
This happens to me often. I'm a pretty calm person, so it takes a lot to get me angry. If someone loses my trust, they lose my friendship. Its quite simple.


I recently caught myself in situations with different people like this. Now after a serious hurt or let's call it betrayal I tend to back away from those specific people instantly. I tend to cut all robes to them in the second I realize what's going on and stop thinking about them, I start organizing everything but as soon as the situation is safe again, I remember that person. I have a really hot temper which I'm working on to remain more self controlled, but even if I want to be emotionless about those people, I tend to develop a horrible hate against them, after that I slip in a sort of emotional numbness towards them. It's like they are completely erased from my mind and emotions. Yes emotions, I'm talking about the kind of friends you truly trusted which I don't normally do.
If I were "betrayed" (very strong word), I'd walk away. Delete phone numbers, messages, pictures - everything. It's as though they don't exist to me. Sometimes I think about (reflect on) what we had in our friendship, but it doesn't make me sad (or happy) it's just a memory of something that happened once upon a time. To me, that person has served their purpose in my life (yes, egotistical...whatever) but the point is, everyone has something to offer - be happy that you got something good out of the friendship when you had it. In my world, people are not consistent, meaning, I tend to get bored very quickly and make new friends very quickly - then the cycle begins again.

After this phase the actual problem starts. It's as if my body wanted them around again but even if I try to have a normal conversation with them, my mood gets worse. I slip into that numbness again, get overly direct and push all emotions from me. No matter how hard I try, I can't ignore the knowledge that I've let them in once and they hurt me. I can't get myself to feel any respect for them, at all. Not about their person, not their ideas, nothing. It's not hate, it's literally not caring.
ENTJs have high expectations of others (generally speaking) perhaps you need to understand your emotional triggers. It's ok to cry for the loss of something, but it it's having such an adverse affect on you, you could very well be doubting your own self worth ?

I wonder, sure you've been in situations like this? How do you experience this? Especially after such an incident I start acting coolly towards others, even worse than normally.
Again, I'm the same here. One day I'll like you, and the next you don't exist. The other person would have had to do something majorly wrong for me to do this, but I have no qualms in walking away. I used to think I was a bad person for not 'feeling' sad, but now I just don't care - I do what I think is right for me. And sometimes that means walking away. That doesn't mean I'm not grateful for what that person contributed to my life for that period of time.
 
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