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I finally took the enneagram test and found I am a type 4. I'm not happy about it.
I've hated my personality for a long time and this explains it. Apparently type 4s are self absorbed, whiny, and dramatic. The description reminds me of those snooty artist types who always think they're better than everyone.

I'd much rather be a type 2 tbh. They seem warm and loving which is what I really want others to see me as.
 

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I've often heard it said that your Enneagram type is often the type you wouldn't want to be :) I think that therein lies some of the power of the Enneagram - it allows you to engage in the kind of self-awareness that inspires you to try to see who you are if you are NOT your number. It's about recognizing your own patterns of thought and behaviour and seeing if there's anything you can work on.
 

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I feel you there; I feel almost that exact way about my typing.

I hate being a four AND I hate being an INTJ. I wish I was a straight-up Core 5 instead of a Core 4 for lots of reasons. The most obvious being that fours are so damn introspective and pessimistic, I have to mentally prepare myself to get into any other type of mind-frame; the envy and such is definitely that kind of illogical stuff that I wish I could live without. Also, as a 4 I tend to do that 'squeeze all of the emotion out of a thing until it's meaningless' and 'gotta go find me a savior' bullshit. Its almost like I can watch myself outside of myself doing this stuff and I feel illogical.

It is like watching a character you really like on a TV show wrecking their life. 'Why do they do this, day in and day out?' and 'Can't they see that they are really just (yadayada) and perform this simple task to make themselves happy? Instead of doing the exact opposite thing all the time?'

Being an INTJ also makes me feel like my feeling is permanently... Childish, at best. I hate watching all of that turmoil going on from outside of myself and being lost. Watching other INTJ's perform the same actions as I also do (arguing with others over some rather minute detail, feeling like they know everything/being self-assured in knowledge and playing devil's advocate, as well as placing 'logic' above emotion even when it would realistically be more logical to take emotion into account during a particular situation as it arises) infuriates me at times. At least I also hate these situations when they arise and I can feel myself doing them too.

I have so much conviction when oftentimes I also have an inkling that perhaps that it should not be the case. It never really changes anything, but it does keep me at permanent odds with myself it seems. I go about my day staunch in my beliefs; call them to question when I am at home alone, and then I'm back in it to win it the next day without missing a beat irregardless of the introspection. As long as no data is presented to me that can adequately prove that I am wrong, then it does not change.

I hate it; I wish everything would feel simple.


Also, why did that become a rant? Sheesh.



EDIT:

At Home:
Me: I wish people would just see that everything is so simple. Do X not Y, be happy damnit.
Also Me: I wish my life was that simple, everything is so complicated.
Me Again: Wait, everyone's life feels complicated, I just have a really shitty worldview of downplaying everyone's problems in perspective of my own.
Me: So that means I should do Z not A and I'd be happy?
Also Me: But there's no way I could do that, I just feel like doing A.
Me Again: Stop overthinking things, I'm just falling into that metaphorical Four pit again. Sheesh.
Me: I should just stop.
Also Me: But obviously I must not want to stop, or else I already would have done this one of the last times I've went through this scenario.

With Friend that asked for Help:
Friend: -this is my problem-
Me: I'm sorry for your problem dude. That's some shit right there. You should just do X not Y.
Friend: I wish I saw everything with clarity like you do!
Me:
 

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It's an interesting type to be for sure.

I've no doubt that I'm whiny. And dramatic. I've always been like that, but that doesn't make it okay. It's driven people away before, and I suspect that if I don't get it under control, it'll keep happening.

That being said, there are still definitely positives. No need to hate who you are. As a 4 you have the potential to be very emotionally in tune, compassionate towards others, creative, and imaginative. 2s are lovely, but I do think that a 4 who is compassionate towards someone who is in pain can do just as much good as a 2.
 

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There is by definition not a better or worse type in the enneagram. I see it more as aptitude. If you are type x, you are better at doing y. An eight is a good boss, a fighter, the five good in R&D etc. The four has compassion, the wounded healer and we have the guts to look into the abyss, endure and persevere. We face crises earlier than others do and this should toughen us up.

My problem with the type is the imagination aspect. I find myself acting on gut instinct, and reasoning can sometimes be clouded by emotion. Good for art, sure. But it does not make it easy to maintain relationships with people. It has always been hard to fit in.

Your type is what you make of it, see the good things as basis and the bad things as potential for improvement. The more you grow, the more awesome life will be :D
 

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I feel you there; I feel almost that exact way about my typing.

I hate being a four AND I hate being an INTJ. I wish I was a straight-up Core 5 instead of a Core 4 for lots of reasons. The most obvious being that fours are so damn introspective and pessimistic, I have to mentally prepare myself to get into any other type of mind-frame; the envy and such is definitely that kind of illogical stuff that I wish I could live without. Also, as a 4 I tend to do that 'squeeze all of the emotion out of a thing until it's meaningless' and 'gotta go find me a savior' bullshit. Its almost like I can watch myself outside of myself doing this stuff and I feel illogical.

It is like watching a character you really like on a TV show wrecking their life. 'Why do they do this, day in and day out?' and 'Can't they see that they are really just (yadayada) and perform this simple task to make themselves happy? Instead of doing the exact opposite thing all the time?'

Being an INTJ also makes me feel like my feeling is permanently... Childish, at best. I hate watching all of that turmoil going on from outside of myself and being lost. Watching other INTJ's perform the same actions as I also do (arguing with others over some rather minute detail, feeling like they know everything/being self-assured in knowledge and playing devil's advocate, as well as placing 'logic' above emotion even when it would realistically be more logical to take emotion into account during a particular situation as it arises) infuriates me at times. At least I also hate these situations when they arise and I can feel myself doing them too.

I have so much conviction when oftentimes I also have an inkling that perhaps that it should not be the case. It never really changes anything, but it does keep me at permanent odds with myself it seems. I go about my day staunch in my beliefs; call them to question when I am at home alone, and then I'm back in it to win it the next day without missing a beat irregardless of the introspection. As long as no data is presented to me that can adequately prove that I am wrong, then it does not change.

I hate it; I wish everything would feel simple.


Also, why did that become a rant? Sheesh.



EDIT:

At Home:
Me: I wish people would just see that everything is so simple. Do X not Y, be happy damnit.
Also Me: I wish my life was that simple, everything is so complicated.
Me Again: Wait, everyone's life feels complicated, I just have a really shitty worldview of downplaying everyone's problems in perspective of my own.
Me: So that means I should do Z not A and I'd be happy?
Also Me: But there's no way I could do that, I just feel like doing A.
Me Again: Stop overthinking things, I'm just falling into that metaphorical Four pit again. Sheesh.
Me: I should just stop.
Also Me: But obviously I must not want to stop, or else I already would have done this one of the last times I've went through this scenario.

With Friend that asked for Help:
Friend: -this is my problem-
Me: I'm sorry for your problem dude. That's some shit right there. You should just do X not Y.
Friend: I wish I saw everything with clarity like you do!
Me:
You remind me of my INTJ friend. Similar things were said... the way you guys come up with these perceptions of yourselves and how you deal with problems is very interesting.
 

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Once I realized I was type 4, it became very difficult to see myself as anything else. And that's what annoys me. I actually identified with type 6 and type 1 first before figuring out my connection to type 4, but I still knew those two types weren't my core. I just couldn't see how my psychological processes related to being "an artist" or type 4... until I sat down and was like oh so that's why this this this and this (for example oh so that's why my personalitycafe username is TheDarknessInTheSnow).

But at the same time you have to be careful not to put the blame for everything on your core enneagram type. You are the way you are because of a whole multitude of things interacting with each other to make you who you are. I think the best way to approach learning about yourself through MBTI or enneagram is to recognize you are a complicated being and a product of many many psychological tendencies and motivations. Don't reduce yourself. The whole is greater than the sum of its parts.
 

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Ha, my dad's called me snooty to my face.

I don't have much to add other than this: my best friend is a 2w3, and trust me, you do NOT want to be that. It's by no means a terrible type--I personally believe that we all suck equally, just in different ways--but it's not as sunshiny and warm as you believe it is. It's unnecessary stress and worry, wondering whether or not people love and appreciate you. It's depression seeping into your heart when the nights seem too lonely and your friends are distant. It's putting up with bad friends (cough me cough) and letting them trample all over you because you don't want to put the effort into correcting them. Unless they want you to, of course. It's overworking yourself, hoping for a stranger to smile. It's the need to be dependable and inevitably curse yourself when your loved ones don't react the way you thought they would.

On the flip side, it's getting a rush of joy when people see your efforts and take time to notice and respect you as a helper. It's this unconditional love you feel for almost everyone, this agape. It's wanting to help, wanting to know how to be the perfect aid, changing your methods to best fit your "client". It's listening because you want to listen, not because you feel obligated to.

Anyway, my point is that every type has its flaws and every type has its wonders and beacons. Knowing your core better allows you to grow into a healthy person, and if you're healthy, your core becomes your ally.
 

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Yeah I think we hate our own flaws worse than others hate them. I don't really fit the "pretentious artist" trope though, so I didn't like being associated with something I clearly wasn't. But yeah, I understand what you mean. I have a hard time being compassionate to someone who reflects back to me my own flaws.
 

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I finally took the enneagram test and found I am a type 4. I'm not happy about it.
I've hated my personality for a long time and this explains it. Apparently type 4s are self absorbed, whiny, and dramatic. The description reminds me of those snooty artist types who always think they're better than everyone.

I'd much rather be a type 2 tbh. They seem warm and loving which is what I really want others to see me as.
I think it depends on how you look at the pros and cons of the type, and how healthy/well-developed you view yourself as being.

Being self-absorbed speaks for itself, but do you think it is inherently a negative thing? I'm certainly a self-absorbed person, but that's only because I've accepted the fact (based on a butt-load of evidence/experience) that I'm not very adept socially, or with the outside world in general, and so I'd rather spend more time in the richness of my own head - it's not doing anyone any harm is it? (Other than ourselves if we overindulge obviously).

And what do you mean by whiny? I feel like you mean something like "we're always indignant about something" which I would certainly say is true in my own case, but only because I always feel as though there's something to protect - the dramatism comes into play there as well, but I just don't feel like it's inherently negative; if you can articulate yourself and use that for a constructive purpose, the worst you'll come across as is passionate about something surely? I feel as though "whiny" may be the product of our type in the event that we don't have a substantial social outlet that helps up shape the "whinyness" into something useful.

Overall, I really don't mind being a type 4. Yes it can be emotionally intense, incredibly inward, and quite lonely, but as long as I can shape all that internal-intensity into something useful that I really care about and channel it through some form of self-expression, whether that be art (which it is) or rich, deep conversation with like-minds (which it also is), then I don't really care that I can be a bit of a poetic nightmare.
 

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A poetic nightmare, huh? I like that phrasing actually. The type certainly has its ups and downs. It is cocky at times, then often too moody and inward on other occasions, which makes me feel I miss out on many things in life. I like certain aspects of it -appreciation for art, music, the hidden layer of meaning, truth and expression thereof. I hate the emotional powderkeg aspect though, leading meaningful long-term relationships with others is something that seems to be well-nigh impossible for me for some reason. On we go, there's light at the end of the tunnel though.
 

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People dislike fours and being fours because there is a lot of minisformation that is spread about our type. Whatismore, people seem to often liken all 4s to the traits of less mature and unhealthy 4s.

So, maybe those of you, self-type hating 4s might feel better if we discuss the good traits of 4s that can be aspired to, instead of wishing you were another type.

Healthy 4's tend to be:
honest
loving
loyal
creative
empathetic

Yes, even healthy 4s can be a little self-focused. But, I think, being naturally inclined to empathy, a healthy 4 can feel out how much a person actually wants to hear and when to focus on others. But, to be honest, besides myself, a lot of the sweetest people on this forum are 4s. I recommend people talk to @Mischievous Pirate Muffin and @LittleScreamer before swearing off 4ness, and I hope they don't mind me mentioning them. But they tend to be really sweet and well liked people that few can really say much of anything bad about.
 

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I finally took the enneagram test and found I am a type 4. I'm not happy about it.
I've hated my personality for a long time and this explains it. Apparently type 4s are self absorbed, whiny, and dramatic. The description reminds me of those snooty artist types who always think they're better than everyone.

I'd much rather be a type 2 tbh. They seem warm and loving which is what I really want others to see me as.
Yeah, this type would be easier to handle in some fairyland where you just zone out for a couple aeons. I have a type 2 friend and she definitely makes me feel self-absorbed.
 

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The majority of people seem displeased with their type at first. Why wouldn't they? It's laying bare defense mechanisms, and untelling lies, so that people can no longer rely upon them so easily. And I imagine it's sometimes going to be most shameful for image types, because, well... obvious reasons.

It was extremely difficult for me at first, not to accept my type (because I knew right away once I read it), but to feel anything but mortified about it. I even tried to deny some of the tendencies in me, up to the point of actually trying extra hard to act in an opposite way for awhile (less dramatic, less reactive) and rationalizing it. But all that did was create even harsher storms in me.

over time, learning more about it AND about the other types, everything started falling into place. It started to become empowering because I was able to understand more about *why* I was so frustrated with certain things about myself/my life, and what I could actually do about it (even though some of it seemed counter-intuitive, and I certainly haven't mastered or overcome my vices). It also helped give me more insight into making strengths out of traits I'd previously seen as weaknesses, or at least giving up pointless shame (to an extent).

For example, it used to feel like the end of the world if someone thought of me as self-absorbed or self-centered. But now, I don't really see it as a bad thing, so long as I'm not being reckless with other peoples' hearts, minds, or property. And since I'm not reckless in those ways (much more reckless with my own), I was able to start better discerning things I *should* be ashamed of (as opposed to rationalizing), versus things that *aren't* actually my fault/shortcoming (as certain power-hungry people and structures previously had me believe).

I've become more confident in showing my art to others, and more open to adopting new styles of art because I'm not so completely obsessed with expressing myself in one specific way, or with what others might think. In fact, I can laugh at myself more often in general, when I do realize I am worrying to much about what others think.

I see things in less black-and-white or perfectionist terms, because I can realize when I'm just doing the frustration type "wanting what can't have/piquing apart what I do have" thing. That helps me enjoy life a whole lot more. I'm working on utilizing my type to help me remember not to be so completely consumed by envy and insecurity, reminding myself that those mental paths won't take me anywhere I actually want to be, no matter how "good" it feels to ruminate.

It has helped reaffirm something I've always felt about myself, which is that I have a strong appreciation for individual talents, strengths, and stories. Not just of my own, but of others'. Also, that I'm comfortable with imperfection and complexity, and that I don't think it's ever really cause to give up on oneself. It has encouraged me to continue helping others see the brilliance within themselves when they are going through dark times.

I still spend too much time privately reveling in my own, festering wounds... but I also focus a lot more often on actually sublimating my pain and experiences into art, and real-life-actions.

Lots of other stuff too. Learning about the integration and disintegration points has also been tremendously enlightening for me. Basically, you're multi-faceted, so is everyone else. Some other types might have tendencies you admire and wish you could relate to, and others you can look at and say "what the heck is wrong with them? I'm glad I don't do THAT to myself...". And you'll also see that there are some common human themes that lie beyond something like personality type. Enneagram is just one tool, a very helpful tool, in learning to be honest with yourself and with others. It can help you see where you're broken - and help you grow from it, whether that means changing parts of yourself, or just finally accepting.

So basically, for me, learning my enneagram type has been both exhausting and restorative, and now I've got no problems being a Four.
 
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