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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
(INFP) I don't want anything

Greetings, my ENFP cousins.

Here's something I posted on the INFP forum:

I was in high school when I realized I didn't want to go further on that road: college degree, master degree, one of the respectable careers, PhD... It all looked like a big scam. I haven't changed my opinion ever since, but now I'm late on my twenties, and still haven't found something I want to do. There's lots of possibilities nowadays, but I feel stuck between them without nothing actually attracting me away from the void.

Living in a shithole, working when I run out of money, reading all the time, and frying my brain with porn and, occasionally, drugs when I can't stand this anymore. And every alternative presents a bleak future: learning things I don't care about to get certificates? Working meaningless menial jobs for people I despise, since I lack the former?

As for trying something new, I feel dry. There are lots of books about "doing your own thing," becoming an entrepreneur, but I feel out of touch with myself, with my feelings, with my very soul—how could I come up with something innovative, useful, worthy? I feel myself unable to be creative right now.

Sure, in a way there's something I crave: to be left alone, away from most people I know, but "misanthrope" is not a profession, is it? I despair.
I got some great answers over there, but I realize I've been remiss in failing to also seek the advice of those who have as major strength the very function that seems to have short-circuited in my life—though @Arzazar Szubrasznikarazar was kind to contribute to the original thread.

Can you people comment on my situation?

Thank you very much.
 

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Discussion Starter #4 (Edited)
@Mick Travis, I suppose it's the same to everyone, though many don't stop long enough to realize. Anyway, I think you've just given me the missing piece: I've been unable to use my creativity (or extraverted intuition etc.) to overcome my current situation because I couldn't focus long enough on any single goal—because I didn't particular want anything—for it to start working, finding solutions to the problems that would appear and so on.

Back on the original thread on the INFP forum, @BrainontheWall had recommended that I made a list of everything I could do, but, again, I couldn't decide on anything over the other possibilities; but yours is a good one: self-sufficiency. Finding myself a place where I won't feel miserable all the time, where I can actually flourish instead of being antagonized by being myself, and becoming able to pay the price for that seems like a worthy goal. I'll still have to deal with my tendency to procrastinate—I'm inclined to put "reading Emerson's Self-Reliance at the top of my to-do list right now, and I'll know there would be more after that—but it's nice to have a direction.
 

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@bmxyszss
The way to look at this is

1) What would you do if you could for instance paint or play an instrument?

Then ask yourself what's stopping you from doing so?

The moment you sit, reflect and come to terms that the very thing that is stopping you is no one but yourself and will power.

You will go a long way.

Secondly, sat yourself something benign, odd and different every day like "today I am going to have a grilled Brussels sprout sandwich with mayo".

Why?

That is something you can answer by yourself .) if you don't try.. you will never know what you can achieve.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
@TechFreak, if I could play an instrument, make really good music, I'd probably become a hobo, and live from the change I got from playing on street corners. What's stopping me from doing so? First, I don't have money to buy a violin; also, there aren't classes for that instrument here in this town. I could overcome the former obstacle by saving money, but right now that would be better spent covering my debts; I could deal with the latter by finding some online course, but despite my usual autodidactism, musical is an area outside my experience, and it maybe it would be better to have a teacher in the beginning just so I don't acquire nasty habits. Anyway, there are more useful skills I should be learning—though so far I've been indecisive on which one to choose—and becoming a bard would most probably just worry my family, because this is terrible country and doing (or just being) on the streets is a bad thing if one can avoid it.

But if you don't mean music, specifically, but asking myself what if I could do X, then it's like I wrote above, and what I want is, for the first time in my life, to experience living in a calm place, at least somewhat safe, where I don't have to worry about getting shot for sticking my head out of the gate, where I can feel at ease and do my stuff, read, write, or perhaps just think. Well, here that would take a) working for the government, so I could b) afford living in a highly-secured closed community (which costs a lot), and c) have good health care so people I care about will stop dying because my country's health system is a butchery; the alternative is leaving the damn place altogether—which I would strongly prefer. Both options, of course, demand time and effort.

As for your final suggestion, I've being doing myself odd benign stuff for a while... Actually, that's basically all I do: there are lots of things I should be doing, but instead I read books about anything; when I'm tired of that, sometimes I even play some old games. I think I need more discipline instead of self-indulgence right now.
 

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@TechFreak, if I could play an instrument, make really good music, I'd probably become a hobo, and live from the change I got from playing on street corners. What's stopping me from doing so? First, I don't have money to buy a violin; also, there aren't classes for that instrument here in this town. I could overcome the former obstacle by saving money, but right now that would be better spent covering my debts; I could deal with the latter by finding some online course, but despite my usual autodidactism, musical is an area outside my experience, and it maybe it would be better to have a teacher in the beginning just so I don't acquire nasty habits. Anyway, there are more useful skills I should be learning—though so far I've been indecisive on which one to choose—and becoming a bard would most probably just worry my family, because this is terrible country and doing (or just being) on the streets is a bad thing if one can avoid it.
Well you could always fashion a banjo out of a tin lid, wire strings and piece of wood :laughing:. Joking aside which region do you live in? Surely it can't be that bad?

But if you don't mean music, specifically, but asking myself what if I could do X, then it's like I wrote above, and what I want is, for the first time in my life, to experience living in a calm place, at least somewhat safe, where I don't have to worry about getting shot for sticking my head out of the gate, where I can feel at ease and do my stuff, read, write, or perhaps just think. Well, here that would take a) working for the government, so I could b) afford living in a highly-secured closed community (which costs a lot), and c) have good health care so people I care about will stop dying because my country's health system is a butchery; the alternative is leaving the damn place altogether—which I would strongly prefer. Both options, of course, demand time and effort.
Darn... that is pretty messed up.

As for your final suggestion, I've being doing myself odd benign stuff for a while... Actually, that's basically all I do: there are lots of things I should be doing, but instead I read books about anything; when I'm tired of that, sometimes I even play some old games. I think I need more discipline instead of self-indulgence right now.
I think you answered your own questions when you said "demand time and effort" and that you "need more discipline instead of self-indulgence right now". So my question to you now is what stopping you from putting the time, effort and striving to be more disciplined?

After all change can be inferred however for one to truly change it must come from with-in. Otherwise may be able affect change but you're the only person that can see it through. You can do it!
 
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Street musicians are cancer of the society. They are public nuisance bothering people working in stores and caffe houses and other places, interrupting listening to music with headphones.

I hate these fuckers. I'd love to paint walls with their blood.

Would be awesome if they'd be outlawed and police would remove them from public spaces. One of the few advantages of malls is that they don't allow these fuckers to play inside. Maybe if the state doesn't want to do what should be done, maybe the city centre should be privatised and treated like a big fucking open-air mall.
 

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There must be *some* people you don't despise. Find out what these people need, what problems they face, what comforts and entertainments they enjoy. Discover what the people you like are missing, and service them with it and have them compensate you for your efforts.

If you hate everyone, well, then you face starvation and loud music. Humans survive by interacting with other humans. It needn't be unpleasant.
 

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I went down that road. I ended up finding out I really like customer support even though hard and draining it is. I just keep trying and trying until I found something I enjoyed. I'm not particularly talented or do anything very well, I just kept trying.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
@TechFreak: An uncivilized banana republic—it's not worthy being specific, but it surely is that bad. Anyway... Yes, indeed, now that I have a goal, my questions pretty much answered themselves! Now I must overcome my addiction, eat that frog and start focusing.

@Arzazar Szubrasznikarazar: I hope you have someone to hug you when you're in whatever mood it is your post came from. Anyway, pick up a third-world country and move there—in no time you'll lots of thing more worrisome than street musicians.

@angelcarnivore: Of course, there are people I don't despise. Actually, most of them—though this doesn't preclude their way of living of harming me. But, anyway, believing that there are places out there whose inhabitants are different from what we have here is what keeps me going. So, yes, I'm sure that, ideally, human interaction needn't be unpleasant, but that's not the experience here. You might as well tell me you go to work in a floating train.

@Aya the Abysswalker: I know what you mean; what you did professionally is what I do with living: going through every single day is a trial, but I keep trying, and though I succeed—I'm alive, after all—I couldn't bring myself to like it so far.
 

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@angelcarnivore: Of course, there are people I don't despise. Actually, most of them—though this doesn't preclude their way of living of harming me. But, anyway, believing that there are places out there whose inhabitants are different from what we have here is what keeps me going. So, yes, I'm sure that, ideally, human interaction needn't be unpleasant, but that's not the experience here. You might as well tell me you go to work in a floating train.

The subconscious mind cannot differentiate between reality and a hyper detailed emotion-associated daydream. It's how prisoners of war survive- escaping to some impenetrable sanctuary of mind where they can do whatever please them and not even God can beat their vision out of them.

I don't go to work in a floating train, but I often dance barefoot the ocean's edge in a wedding gown whenever reality is unbearable.



Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk
 

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Discussion Starter #13
@angelcarnivore, what I meant is that having usually pleasant human interactions is something outside my usual experience. I know it probably exists as a possibility out there, the same way way the magnectic levitation train does, the same way that there are places where people can sit in a park bench with macbook and not be immediately mugged/sliced/shot, but for me, right now, those belong to the realm of the uncanny.
 

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You are seriously depressed. Same. I understand exactly what you're talking about. When I was a child, I would watch television, but nothing in it would interest me. The TV is a metaphor for my life. I understand what you mean. I had a while where I was trying to write, but I could never get more than a page, and nothing felt right. I had no new ideas. I could write a memoir, and a shitty one at that. I had a cognitive breakdown, I reached the full reversal of my cognitive functions. You have to actively try and re-engage each one of your missing/non-functional functions. That'll help. That doesn't mean life will have meaning. I had a four day break and now the depression is setting back in. Do new things, explore new exciting ideas and stories, learn to dream again.
 

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Discussion Starter #15 (Edited)
@LordCanada, I think so too, but I've been depressed for so long that I can't really imagine a different state, you know? Can't remember how it was. All things considered, I think I've managed it well, though. There were some good moments; many bad things have also happened, but there were times when I really was happy—some bright sparks along the way.

And there were things that interested me; I eventually got disillusioned at them, but being interested isn't an incapacity of mine—depression may have become the usual, but being uninterested is recent. So, maybe the black dog's to blame for some of this, but perhaps things are just shitty here.

For example, I love learning. When I was a kid, I actually dreamed about college, because that meant higher education—and what a huge library it was supposed to have! Imagine that! But while you kind of have to sell a kidney to afford college in England, well, at least you get what you paid for, right? They give you the resources. It wouldn't be weird to find teachers who actually cared about their job. But not so here. No cigar. They get your kidney, you get... Marxism, the strikes, booze, marijuana... That's about it.

And most "careers" here demand going through that whole rigmarole just so you can work for some... dense individuals. Once, when I was naiver, I thought about a given profession: "I'd really like to do that." So I went through a whole lot stuff, and did it, and what happened? I discovered what it means here to do what I wanted to do. And it was terrible.

I have lots of intellectual interests, but studying psychology is one thing, working on the area, here, is a totally different thing. Every single time something comes to mind, I'll discover what it means here, and it will always amount to selling my soul—and for what? So I can serve, or please, people I don't care for. I took a lot of pain just to be who I am; I faced a lot of things, from insanity to death, so I could keep my soul, and now I don't want to part ways with it.

The same people who used to call me a faggot for reading, who used to beat me, who used to humiliated me, who made me want to die, now tell me I'm too intelligent not to put my knowledge to good use; it's my duty, they tell me, to serve society. Boy...! I dreaded getting up everyday, I thought about everything I'd have to go through, and just wanted everything to end for me, because of them; I had some dark moments... and now I'm obliged to work for their benefit? To compensate for their stupidity?

Or is it about society? But what has this place given me, except for that which it couldn't take away from me? Education? I won't get started on that. Health? All the people I knew, and cared about, who have died because of our "hospitals"? Or is it security? All the people who have got shot, their families knowing that not a thing will happen to the perpetrators, because that's that around here?

When I think about some people, individually, or about specific groups, I wish I could do something for them, but that's the tragedy of this place: it's either selling yourself and stopping to care, or going insane trying to help, but being unable to, because you're stymied every step along the way—unless you're okay with bribes and our shady ways, and I'm not.

So, yes, yes, depressed, yes, sure, but how could I not be? I'm feeling just like you describe, but how could I not? As for the functions, I think the only one missing here is extraverted intuition—I wouldn't be here if not for introverted feeling; every time I remember one of my mistakes and it literally hurts, I take that as introverted sensing making itself known (simplistic, yes, but I'm not trying to be really precise here); and of course, I'm in the grip of extraverted thinking all the time right now.

You really nailed it. I'm not looking for a sense of meaning, I don't even want to eliminate depression as a factor—I can live with that—but I must recover my touch, and at least once in my life be somewhere where it makes sense to suppose that things can get better. Where I can just be myself. I'm tired of being the only one who thinks. I takes a toll, after some time, to do all the thinking.

But never mind, never mind. Tell me more, please, about re-engaging the missing functions, as you put it. There aren't much new things I can afford to do at the moment, and I'm indeed having trouble with having dreams about the future. But please tell me more.
 
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@Arzazar Szubrasznikarazar: I hope you have someone to hug you when you're in whatever mood it is your post came from. Anyway, pick up a third-world country and move there—in no time you'll lots of thing more worrisome than street musicians.
I don't need to move to any more subhuman country. I need to remove degeneracy from here. Street musicians, unauthorised grafitti, those fuckers with petitions that use speakers, that fucking book store that blasts audiobooks from speakers, etc. all should stop polluting public spaces and disturbing peace.
 
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For example, I love learning. When I was a kid, I actually dreamed about college, because that meant higher education—and what a huge library it was supposed to have! Imagine that! But while you kind of have to sell a kidney to afford college in England, well, at least you get what you paid for, right? They give you the resources. It wouldn't be weird to find teachers who actually cared about their job. But not so here. No cigar. They get your kidney, you get... Marxism, the strikes, booze, marijuana... That's about it.
In Poland you don't need to sell anything, just study well in high school. You get solid education paid by state. Problems start if you have to stay in a dorm. Then you have to deal with fucking degenerate druggies and their parties and all sort of degenerates.
 

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I also knew very early on I had no desire to get a degree--when I was in high school I would say, "Why do I need a framed piece of paper on the wall?" Ends up now that I work in academia I get the point of the work and the paper. And, looking back, there are several things that I would have enjoyed studying, but I didn't know they were options and it was complicated.

So, I have always endeavored to be the best possible employee in order to get what I want out of life. Due to the lack of a degree, I've had to take the route of internal promotion, but I ended up replacing a disastrous MBA (NE is a great thing!). My restlessness has been challenging at times but thankfully I've stayed in the same job (against my wanderlust ways) and have carved out a great thing and have time to focus on the things that I am passionate about.

I wouldn't necessarily recommend it to others, because it was surely risky, but it's worked out perfectly for me.
 
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