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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
(I'm also 4w5 if this is needed at all.)


Greetings.

I hate to get venty, but essentially I am undergoing depression, or whatever. I doubt it's a clinical case and just a general sadness that I'm attached to, and I already feel great shame in even making this thread.

Essentially, I'm in a bind, I guess. I was motivated I suppose when I was little, making myself believe that I was to be a novelist and write wonderful stories. I never actually planned though, because hell, I've got plenty of time, and the apocalypse will happen before I actually grow up!

But then it happened. I'm seventeen, and preparing to undergo my final year of high school. I haven't a job, I haven't my license, and my grades aren't very good because I don't study or do much homework. I never feel motivated enough, and I get a thrill out of being rebellious. For instance, for my term paper in my history course, I was to write an essay on the battle of Dieppe. Instead, I wrote an eight-page short story that was, to spare the details (two people do stupid shenanigans, the end result is a Nazi gets raped which acts as my thesis if I would have actually written the essay) "wildly innapropriate" and "didn't cover any outcomes." I got a zero on it. I still passed the course with a 70% however, as while I didn't do any real homework, I scored eighties and a ninety on the exam, although I didn't study for any.

This is an example of my depressed apathy, but clearly there's something more if I put so much work into failing. For lulz. I feel soul crushing sadness and anger almost every day, and I'm not confident at all in myself, but when I'm doing bad things such as dropping a giant snowball in the guidance office, or hiding in the bushes outside of a Cancer Relay and screaming about how I have a cancer fetish, I feel a strange surge in said confidence.

So many of my ideals revolve around how much I hate everyone. Two of my favorite people in the world I ended my friendship with because being around them was killing me. It seemed like they liked each other more than me, and I wasn't important. I was completely jealous, because one of them was my favorite thing in life. Literally.

I don't have a good relationship with my family. They don't really understand me at all, and they insult me by calling me lazy and an asshole, anti-social etc., which isn't really that far from the truth. They tried to force me to lift weights, cut my hair, all that good stuff that hurt my feelings entirely. When I was punished for being unable to lift something, I took it as a personal attack and thus hate them entirely for not loving me as I am. I could go on for ages about my indescribable hatred for my family, but I know it's not right. They just literally know nothing about me, and that's not their fault, I guess. I mean hey, I could have done without being called ruined by my hobbies almost every day, but fuck, I guess I could at least make it seem like I'd care if they were to die.

Which I wouldn't.

Regardless, the point I'm trying to get to is that even though all this shit and unhappiness is around me, and I'm jacking off to my own stupid fucking emotional theatrics, I feel like I could rise above it all if I just had a motivation; a guiding light. It's what I wanted my friends to be, and by them not becoming it I angrily shut them out.

I just feel that I need some sort of THING to say that it wants me to be alive. It's that or I'll become a vagabond. The sad thing is that I'm too self-absorbed to kill or harm myself because at the end of the day, I still think I'm pretty super and that's how stupid I am.

So yeah. Any other INFP-4w5's, or anyone for that matter, struggle with life issues, but feel that they could overcome it with motivation?
 

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Yep! I wouldn't say life issues per se cause well...The bigger ones are yet to come. But I've just come out of a withdrawal period not that it matters but anyways yep!

Just recently I read this youtube comment which just amplified that feeling. I just reached an epiphany where I was like "Hey, what if INFPs could be motivated and courageous enough to do what they wanted to do? Wouldn't the world be so much greater?" And then I went all happy and started grinning like a fool even though I still wasn't motivated to work as hard as possible and do my best to achieve my dreams and make my life and others' better: I just liked thinking about what would happen if we were all go-getters. How nice~ :kitteh:
 

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@ saintmalo

All at once any doubts for my future and for the ones I love melt away effortlessly. Already I feel an everlasting peace wash over me.
You're going to be okay. Clearly you're a very intelligent young man, have faith in your ability to work through this. Don't expect people to understand you or accept you for who you are. My family constantly shit on my dreams and make no effort to begin to understand me... and they still tell me they love me. And I know they do love me despite not knowing me. It's no use resenting them. I'm glad you got out of those toxic friendships! I used to be the same in school about homework and studying. I spent a lot of time procrastinating and did assignments half-ass at the last minute. Even in my final year of school. Even in uni haha

And btw, I'm 23 and I haven't got my driver's license either :p I only got my learner's permit two years ago.

You'll be fine I know it. Once you get out of this high school setting everything and everyone will be so different.
 

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Sorry, ENFP sort of invading here! I feel like a lot of XNFPs can relate to this. I know I can, with basically everything except for a rebellious streak to that extent. This might be misplaced, but I actually have some mad respect for what you did there with that essay. I've always secretly wanted to do something like that. The farthest I ever got was on this one homework assignment that I felt like was ridiculously pointless, I turned in a mostly blank sheet with just one or two sentences where I was just like "I hate this class and this is stupid as fuck."

But yeah, I totally get the motivation issue. I've felt like that my entire life! And even through all my struggles, I still haven't been able to get my butt into gear and actually try to accomplish the high goals I want for myself, which coincidentally are pretty similar to yours...or what they were. Just saying, aspiring novelist here too! If you're ever feeling better, or just whenever, I think it'd be cool if we could share some stuff with each other, one aspiring novelist to another... Or not, if that's not what you're up to at this point. If you do ever have a weird urge to share something, I'm up for that aye.

Anyway though. I agree with the above poster! You really do seem like an intelligent person and I feel like you can get through this. My family doesn't know me either, and they hate my dreams as well. I feel like that's another common thing with XNFPs. But with writing and motivation and everything, I'd suggest trying to rediscover whatever it was that motivated you to write in the first place, and have faith that whatever you were trying to accomplish was something meaningful and worth accomplishing. I've had sudden bursts of inspiration before, when I've really questioned myself on why I want to write. And the answer came to me one day, as I was doubting myself. I remembered that I want to write because I want to express myself, I want to inspire other people, I want to find answers in the characters and plots I've created. I want to make real the amazing fantasy that I've always dreamed of. I want to create some kick-ass characters with depth that overcome the difficulties they face. Something that reflects my struggle with my life and everything...so basically, a bildungsroman.

And for the record, despite the cheesiness, I wanted to say that I want you alive! I think you're someone who has something to say and that you have things worth living for, like your dreams. That's something I admire, and I know it may not mean much since I'm basically a stranger to you, but still. Know that there are people out there who understand this and believe that there will be people who care about you and can likely be that guiding light you desire. I mean, I can honestly say this because that's something I've experienced. I've wanted a sort of guiding light...something very close to that at least. And I'm going through the worst spats with my best friend (? don't know if I can call her my best friend anymore) because she's not supporting me very well, and I'm kind of leaning in the direction of what you did. Shutting her out.

As someone who's going through something similar right now (er, facing that friend issue and existential depression as well), feel free to contact me or something, y'know? Writers got to stick together! And er, if you're like, "This girl is such a weirdo and so cheesy/lame! She needs to get out of my face!!" right now, that's totally okay. Like, I'm fine with that lol. Thought I'd offer even if you totally crush it :tongue:.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Yep! I wouldn't say life issues per se cause well...The bigger ones are yet to come. But I've just come out of a withdrawal period not that it matters but anyways yep!


Just recently I read this youtube comment which just amplified that feeling. I just reached an epiphany where I was like "Hey, what if INFPs could be motivated and courageous enough to do what they wanted to do? Wouldn't the world be so much greater?" And then I went all happy and started grinning like a fool even though I still wasn't motivated to work as hard as possible and do my best to achieve my dreams and make my life and others' better: I just liked thinking about what would happen if we were all go-getters. How nice~

It'd be fantastic. I think that's why INFJ's like Hitler and Osama (I have the best examples) accomplish such...feats. I mean, they've got the emotional pile of festering trash that is NF, but they have J. Freaking J. They can actually set goals for themselves, and organize themselves.


It's a fucking superpower imo.


You're going to be okay. Clearly you're a very intelligent young man, have faith in your ability to work through this. Don't expect people to understand you or accept you for who you are. My family constantly shit on my dreams and make no effort to begin to understand me... and they still tell me they love me. And I know they do love me despite not knowing me. It's no use resenting them. I'm glad you got out of those toxic friendships! I used to be the same in school about homework and studying. I spent a lot of time procrastinating and did assignments half-ass at the last minute. Even in my final year of school. Even in uni haha


And btw, I'm 23 and I haven't got my driver's license either :p I only got my learner's permit two years ago.


You'll be fine I know it. Once you get out of this high school setting everything and everyone will be so different.

I hope you didn't get a nasty vibe from my reply. Yeah it was sarcastic, but the video genuinely made me laugh my ass off. That sort of humor I respect immensely. It genuinely made me feel better! I guess I could've dropped a smilie but a person's gotta keep up that stoic demeanor.


But either way though, I truly appreciate your kind words and helpful advice. I mean, you didn't have to read that emotional douchebaggery but you did, and I appreciate that immensely. I'm glad somebody else didn't get their driver's. Admittedly I'm terrified of the idea. You could kill someone so easily, or fuck up so majorly.


But yes. Thank you, very very much. And the fact that you had the balls--er, ovaries, to be a lazybum in university is just fantastic.


I'm sorry also that your family isn't supportive of you. I'm sure whatever your dreams are, they're completely valid and meaningful.


Sorry, ENFP sort of invading here! I feel like a lot of XNFPs can relate to this. I know I can, with basically everything except for a rebellious streak to that extent. This might be misplaced, but I actually have some mad respect for what you did there with that essay. I've always secretly wanted to do something like that. The farthest I ever got was on this one homework assignment that I felt like was ridiculously pointless, I turned in a mostly blank sheet with just one or two sentences where I was just like "I hate this class and this is stupid as fuck."

But yeah, I totally get the motivation issue. I've felt like that my entire life! And even through all my struggles, I still haven't been able to get my butt into gear and actually try to accomplish the high goals I want for myself, which coincidentally are pretty similar to yours...or what they were. Just saying, aspiring novelist here too! If you're ever feeling better, or just whenever, I think it'd be cool if we could share some stuff with each other, one aspiring novelist to another... Or not, if that's not what you're up to at this point. If you do ever have a weird urge to share something, I'm up for that aye.

Anyway though. I agree with the above poster! You really do seem like an intelligent person and I feel like you can get through this. My family doesn't know me either, and they hate my dreams as well. I feel like that's another common thing with XNFPs. But with writing and motivation and everything, I'd suggest trying to rediscover whatever it was that motivated you to write in the first place, and have faith that whatever you were trying to accomplish was something meaningful and worth accomplishing. I've had sudden bursts of inspiration before, when I've really questioned myself on why I want to write. And the answer came to me one day, as I was doubting myself. I remembered that I want to write because I want to express myself, I want to inspire other people, I want to find answers in the characters and plots I've created. I want to make real the amazing fantasy that I've always dreamed of. I want to create some kick-ass characters with depth that overcome the difficulties they face. Something that reflects my struggle with my life and everything...so basically, a bildungsroman.

And for the record, despite the cheesiness, I wanted to say that I want you alive! I think you're someone who has something to say and that you have things worth living for, like your dreams. That's something I admire, and I know it may not mean much since I'm basically a stranger to you, but still. Know that there are people out there who understand this and believe that there will be people who care about you and can likely be that guiding light you desire. I mean, I can honestly say this because that's something I've experienced. I've wanted a sort of guiding light...something very close to that at least. And I'm going through the worst spats with my best friend (? don't know if I can call her my best friend anymore) because she's not supporting me very well, and I'm kind of leaning in the direction of what you did. Shutting her out.

As someone who's going through something similar right now (er, facing that friend issue and existential depression as well), feel free to contact me or something, y'know? Writers got to stick together! And er, if you're like, "This girl is such a weirdo and so cheesy/lame! She needs to get out of my face!!" right now, that's totally okay. Like, I'm fine with that lol. Thought I'd offer even if you totally crush it :tongue:.
Oh, it's no matter if you're not an INFP. I guess I mostly just stated that to see if this was a recurring element. Either way, the fact that you passed that in is pretty fantastic in my book. Admittedly, I'm also tickled to death you respect my stupid shenanigans.

I'm glad also that someone can relate to what I've felt. It makes me feel like less of an angsty tool. And sure, I'd love to talk. I think it'd be a valuable experience.

I'm sorry to hear that your family isn't very supportive either. It seems like there's an ST dynamic that causes that rift. My stepfather is an ESTJ, which is quite literally the worst possible parent for me in terms of compatibility. I think I'll have to think a lot to try and see if I can rediscover the reason for the inspiration. I think your reasoning is very beautiful, and the world deserves it.

Even if your post is overloading with cheesiness, not even my stupid angst could be able to buffer the amount of good feelz that completely tore that wall down. I completely appreciate all that you said; it's very, very kind of you. I think the fact that you're a complete stranger and you said that makes it resonate in a different way, so once again, thank you kindly.

I hope it does work out with your friend, though. It feels terrible, and I can't help but feel that if I weren't such a tool I would have been able to preserve it, or not be hurt my stupid little things. But either way, I hope your best friend comes around, or that you reach an emotional catharsis in terms of your relations. Whichever decision you make, I hope it makes you happier.

Writers do, indeed, need to stick together, and I appreciate and welcome the sentiment.



I need to thank Refugee as well. Even if it's a simple sentiment, it resonates. Thanks man.

But yes. Extremely sorry for the angst, and I genuinely appreciate all that was said.
 

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Ok, ok, prep talk time. I do not know why I can see it so clearly.
To me, it is a string of events which spiral out of control.

For a moment sit and think this way. You CAN still have anything you WANT in this world. You said that you are only at college, 17 or 18, and how can you already dismiss the idea that you are NOT going to be a writer ? Stop that self destruction. Cos do you not see it yourself ? You wrote that you realised that you cannot, and then these things happened one by one by one, and you said that you also deliberately sabotaged it even more. SO... BRING back that DREAM ! At least bring back the idea of it. Cos you do not know how it will pan out, and you do not know which path will lead you to be that writer.

To remember the dream alive, surround yourself with EVERYTHING that you could related to that of being a novelist and a writer. If there are friends and family who does not support you, then draw a STRICT line and bounce them into their territories. You got to learn to be assertive and protect what you love doing. You do not have to be an asshole about it. Yet, they do not need to trash and dampen your dream either. Over time, people will come to accept more and more of you. Especially when they see that the writing gives you such good vibes and smiles. :) Also, this is a little bit tricky too, but I want you to, each time, you encounter such antagonism, to write this piece of emotional connection between you and them onto paper. This is character studying. It may or may not become a part of your novel in the future, but because it is memories, and an emotionally driven piece. It will become of use to you in the future as you develop any novels. You probably will be forget in the future and cannot remember things, so this is why you must write it out.

The friendships, well, make an effort there, and actually BE truthful to them with your feelings. That you seems to be cut off from their lives, and you want to be a part of it again. Try and make an effort to do things together, and say that you do miss them. Especially when you do miss them so.

The exilaration comes when you do push yourself to go and experience things. Emotionally or physically. For jobs, can you not be working in a library or working in a magazine, or in newspaper? Anything to do with the writing world. Anything. Time for you to start doing researches and how it is best to become the best researcher. I would also prompt yourself to write down a method to do research with. Have a proper journal, and write ideas down. It will bring you such joy. Each time you open the journal and look at it, and feel it, as you are doing it, it will bring joy. :) I have one of these. It's more or less my "ideas book". When I do too much of it, and I get bored, I close it. When I feel inspired and I feel creative, I open it and I add a few more things to it, especially when I like the ideas I have seen.

You are young, and right now, you need discipline. Discipline in producing a basis of how to write materials. Also, if there are any guidance in any local writing groups or whatever? Go online on internet forums on how to find that creative writing self, to be brought forward? Forget who said what and if they think you can or not. That is NOT important. That is other people's judgments of you. If you WANT something, then surround yourself with the same people who also have the same desires. You will feel so much more energised. In my world, this is called networking, BUT... I came to realised that, I am also a kind of collaborator, and I enjoy the environment to be around like-minded people. You talk shop.. and it works ! Also, maybe to bring back some of the friendships, can you not bring them into your world too, by writing poems to them, and allow them to maybe be people that you can bounce your ideas off, or critique your work ? Since you seem to trust them so much and that they are close friends. I would slowly let them know how much writing means to you though... and ask them to promise not to be too mean when criticising etc.

In terms of jobs and careers. Ask your college for career advice and see what is the proper path to become a writer. Do you need to study English literature at university ? Or a course? Can you go abroad and study? Any free programes and so forth ?

Family. They probably do not like your attitude and how this anger within you is turning you into somebody who they do not like as such. So, okay, if you do not like weight lifting, be direct and say that it is not you. Say that you prefer another form of exercise. I think they want you to be healthy and well. Go out and not always shut inside of the house. Cos walking and being with nature really helps to clear your mind as well. See them as people who cares for you, just maybe their delivery and their words are a little bit pushy. But they are still your family. Afterall. Again, it seems to me that you want them to know and accept your personality, and in order for you to achieve that, you need to draw a line on things that you do not like doing, so that they know and understand that you are now developing your personality. Be strict with yourself here. Cos it is so easy to go with the flow, and then get swept underneath it and then be annoyed at yourself instead.
 

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It'd be fantastic. I think that's why INFJ's like Hitler and Osama (I have the best examples) accomplish such...feats. I mean, they've got the emotional pile of festering trash that is NF, but they have J. Freaking J. They can actually set goals for themselves, and organize themselves.

It's a fucking superpower imo.
You have no idea of what power lies inside of you...
Why are so many INFP actors and actresses ???

You imagine it, and you incubate the feeling of doing that something, and then when you actually DO it, you can feel it too ! Everybody can do things which they do not think that they could, but that is how it happens...

You will be really surprised at the things which you achieve for yourself. Cos sometimes when I reflect back, I cannot "remember" what I did? But my memories of feelings brings me back to that place and I remember it.

It's like time travelling. I have no idea how I got there, but I find myself there. This is why so many INFP writers, directors, whatever focus on that element of mystery of their own mind. This is where it comes from. :)

Did you know that ???

If you want to be a good writer, then you also have to start reading good novels too to be inspired...
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Ok, ok, prep talk time. I do not know why I can see it so clearly.
To me, it is a string of events which spiral out of control.

For a moment sit and think this way. You CAN still have anything you WANT in this world. You said that you are only at college, 17 or 18, and how can you already dismiss the idea that you are NOT going to be a writer ? Stop that self destruction. Cos do you not see it yourself ? You wrote that you realised that you cannot, and then these things happened one by one by one, and you said that you also deliberately sabotaged it even more. SO... BRING back that DREAM ! At least bring back the idea of it. Cos you do not know how it will pan out, and you do not know which path will lead you to be that writer.

To remember the dream alive, surround yourself with EVERYTHING that you could related to that of being a novelist and a writer. If there are friends and family who does not support you, then draw a STRICT line and bounce them into their territories. You got to learn to be assertive and protect what you love doing. You do not have to be an asshole about it. Yet, they do not need to trash and dampen your dream either. Over time, people will come to accept more and more of you. Especially when they see that the writing gives you such good vibes and smiles. :) Also, this is a little bit tricky too, but I want you to, each time, you encounter such antagonism, to write this piece of emotional connection between you and them onto paper. This is character studying. It may or may not become a part of your novel in the future, but because it is memories, and an emotionally driven piece. It will become of use to you in the future as you develop any novels. You probably will be forget in the future and cannot remember things, so this is why you must write it out.

The friendships, well, make an effort there, and actually BE truthful to them with your feelings. That you seems to be cut off from their lives, and you want to be a part of it again. Try and make an effort to do things together, and say that you do miss them. Especially when you do miss them so.

The exilaration comes when you do push yourself to go and experience things. Emotionally or physically. For jobs, can you not be working in a library or working in a magazine, or in newspaper? Anything to do with the writing world. Anything. Time for you to start doing researches and how it is best to become the best researcher. I would also prompt yourself to write down a method to do research with. Have a proper journal, and write ideas down. It will bring you such joy. Each time you open the journal and look at it, and feel it, as you are doing it, it will bring joy. :) I have one of these. It's more or less my "ideas book". When I do too much of it, and I get bored, I close it. When I feel inspired and I feel creative, I open it and I add a few more things to it, especially when I like the ideas I have seen.

You are young, and right now, you need discipline. Discipline in producing a basis of how to write materials. Also, if there are any guidance in any local writing groups or whatever? Go online on internet forums on how to find that creative writing self, to be brought forward? Forget who said what and if they think you can or not. That is NOT important. That is other people's judgments of you. If you WANT something, then surround yourself with the same people who also have the same desires. You will feel so much more energised. In my world, this is called networking, BUT... I came to realised that, I am also a kind of collaborator, and I enjoy the environment to be around like-minded people. You talk shop.. and it works ! Also, maybe to bring back some of the friendships, can you not bring them into your world too, by writing poems to them, and allow them to maybe be people that you can bounce your ideas off, or critique your work ? Since you seem to trust them so much and that they are close friends. I would slowly let them know how much writing means to you though... and ask them to promise not to be too mean when criticising etc.

In terms of jobs and careers. Ask your college for career advice and see what is the proper path to become a writer. Do you need to study English literature at university ? Or a course? Can you go abroad and study? Any free programes and so forth ?

Family. They probably do not like your attitude and how this anger within you is turning you into somebody who they do not like as such. So, okay, if you do not like weight lifting, be direct and say that it is not you. Say that you prefer another form of exercise. I think they want you to be healthy and well. Go out and not always shut inside of the house. Cos walking and being with nature really helps to clear your mind as well. See them as people who cares for you, just maybe their delivery and their words are a little bit pushy. But they are still your family. Afterall. Again, it seems to me that you want them to know and accept your personality, and in order for you to achieve that, you need to draw a line on things that you do not like doing, so that they know and understand that you are now developing your personality. Be strict with yourself here. Cos it is so easy to go with the flow, and then get swept underneath it and then be annoyed at yourself instead.
Thank you very, very much for the informative, detailed, and analyzed responses. You're very kind to do so. It means a lot that you read all of that emotional garbage.

For starters, the inspirational bits were hilariously moving. Thank you for those.

I think a problem is that I can't surround myself with my dream because my internet access is limited due to my parents existing. But I can still sure as hell try. And the notebook idea sounds fantastic. I think I'm gonna try it. Thank you!

Admittedly, I did do sappy stuff like that with my friends, but just...it felt like it was falling on deaf ears, and it's not their fault. They're not overly emotional, and I generally did accept them for it, but being around them and just...it was like an allergy in the end. No matter how sweet Peanut Butter is, little John-John can't have any because it hurts him. And it doesn't mean that Peanut Butter is a bad guy. But thank you anyway!

I live in a very rural area, and sadly I'm unable to work at a library or a newspaper place. I mean, it's probably all excuses, but still, these are valid suggestions nonetheless. I think I should though definitely do some research.

Yes, I agree that walking around helps a lot. I often go on long solitary walks in the woods with my baseball bat (for protection against coyotes, if I should ever cross paths). It is very, very enjoyable although introspection usually sneaks up on me.

I agree that I need to be strict with myself. I need discipline, and I need an old man to walk into my room, wap me with a newspaper, tell me to "SHHHAHT UP" and get to work.

And, well, I didn't quite know that, I don't think. I greatly appreciate that you think that there's power inside me. It's very kind.

Thank you very much for your detailed response and logical advice. I greatly appreciate it. I must sound like a broken-record, but it really means a lot. I'll try to act out all that you said.
 
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