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Hi there, I've been wondering a lot lately about this pattern in my life and personality. I don't know if anyone here can also relate but it would be intresting to see if it is common for the INFj personality type.
Let me elaborate a little on what I mean- after all many people do idealize other people too much- it is not INFJ special:tongue:.

The pattern I'm talking about related both to close friends/lovers/family members but also to meeting new people.
I think I have this tendency to really see a person when I first meet them- to see what they are amazing deep inside even if they don't show it (or know it).
I'm always so so excited about people and how wonderful they are until...times go by and I realize they don't see how amazing they are.
I tend to be very painfully disappointed in my personal relationships and I blame myself for having the wrong intuition about the person. I don't usually have high expectetions- just for the person to have some morals or be kind.

Who knows..maybe that is too much to expect?
I also do understand it it my fault for seeing them as beautiful and then being hurt when the illusion shatters. BUT
It got to the point where i don't want to become very close to anyone because of this.

Has anyone encountered a similar experience? What do you think?
 

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I don't really do this, ever.

I don't consider myself idealistic about people, I think that's a more typical INFP trait although anyone can do it. I'm very wary of people's perceived positive traits when I first meet them. I always know it's too good to be true, I always tell myself so because it's always correct - even the best of people have flaws. Everyone does, so I don't find myself ever caught up in idealising a person and forgetting that they aren't perfect.

I've had a few INFP friends and every one of them has had an issue with unhealthily idealising people. Partners, siblings, celebrities etc. They see traits they like, like their skills or beauty and completely are unable from that point to recognise that they have flaws as well. If you point them out, they are blind to them and don't see it or will spin their flaw into a positive somehow. And as a result of treating said person like they can do no wrong for so long, when they suddenly behave in way that comes across as uncharacteristic to the INFP, they feel so wronged, so disillusioned and hurt and lash out or isolate themselves.

I think this process would work very differently for INFJs in general. We idealise people in a way where we're disappointed in them for not being capable of certain things. We very often feel let down and like we're not getting what we want from them. Like you, I don't see myself as having standards which are unable to be met by regular people - but the situations we're in show that that isn't true.Even if we never see it. We don't think we're asking for too much, but others do. The world does. Our 'basic' standards are foreign to others - that's the idealism of NF types - we always feel people are missing something, and people feel we're unrealistic. Sometimes we are. Then we blame ourselves for not being more grounded about our aspirations for other people.

I would say where we differ is, over time I don't find myself thinking that people aren't seeing how great they are. I see people's flaws bubbling to the surface until it overshadows the positive traits I first recognised in them and I'm simply disappointed in who they've turned out to be as a whole.
 

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I don't usually have high expectetions- just for the person to have some morals or be kind.

Who knows..maybe that is too much to expect?

It is.


And I never over-idealize people. There is a wealth of ugly in everyone.

The perception of who a person is at the core, from a very short time of interacting with them, is rather clear. The only time disappointment really becomes a factor is with Fi doms. It barely qualifies as disappointment, though.

I know that they're going to end up irrationally judging me, negatively, at some point, but I just like being around them.

The fluffy loons.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
I would say where we differ is, over time I don't find myself thinking that people aren't seeing how great they are. I see people's flaws bubbling to the surface until it overshadows the positive traits I first recognised in them and I'm simply disappointed in who they've turned out to be as a whole.
Thanks for sharing your experience :)
(I would have to edit a bit what I wrote to make it clearer)
I also see the not so good qualities and dark side of a person straight away- but I still imagine them to be great. Perhaps I'm projecting qualties I find hard expressing but are in me- I have considred that to be the case.
I see what you mean about the very fact we have some value system not being met- be be too high a standard for most people.
Also feeling people are missing something...I'm starting to think the only way out of this is finding these qualties within ouselves.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I know that they're going to end up irrationally judging me, negatively, at some point, but I just like being around them.

The fluffy loons.
Oh yes! Know that one but i don't care as long as I still get to know a person learn about/from them and enjoy their company until they suddenly do that...I just accept that.
 

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It is.


And I never over-idealize people. There is a wealth of ugly in everyone.

The perception of who a person is at the core, from a very short time of interacting with them, is rather clear. The only time disappointment really becomes a factor is with Fi doms. It barely qualifies as disappointment, though.

I know that they're going to end up irrationally judging me, negatively, at some point, but I just like being around them.

The fluffy loons.
I will stick around, I promise :wink:
 

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I don't think I've ever idealized someone.

Maybe animals... in thinking of them as being superior to humans in their innocence... but then, they never open their mouths to correct me. So I don't know if I'm incorrect or not. LOL


With people. I expect them to be pretty dirty. All I'm seeking in other people is dirt I can handle. Which is something I'm pretty picky about, tbh.
I want enough dirt displayed that they seem real.

My worldview is, humanity is corrupt. Individuals can be special though, and stand out in the crowd. But no one, EVER, is perfect.
Even the best person, will someday let you down.
That's ok though, because we're ALL human. Especially myself.

On the rare occasions someone surprises me, it's by being better than I expected. Kinder, more generous, ect.
Then I end up feeling very, VERY guilty... not only because of not recognizing it, but also by not offering the same to begin with.

But that thought process doesn't last very long. I revert to expecting very little of most humans, and sooner or later, people fulfil those expectations.




I think a lot of people pin this sort of thing as "trust issues", but I don't see it that way at all.

As I see it, it's fair only to trust someone to be who they are.

Whoever someone shows themselves to me to be, if I like them, I will offer the gift of trust up to that level.
If they break that gift, they may be able to earn it back to a lesser level eventually. If they keep breaking it, I'll either be super forgiving but offer them less trust than ever, or I'll get rid of them.

If someone shows themselves to be a gossip... then it's not them I blame if I told them something and it got out. That's on me.

I might even be a friend despite disagreeing morally on a host of different & important issues. That isn't, to me, as important as the friendship dynamic itself.

But if I expected more of them than who they showed themselves as, that just wouldn't be fair... especially not to myself.



My ISFJ mother does that sort of thing, a lot. Repetitively.
She's SO sweet. But the same people will disappoint her over & over... and we have the same kind of conversation about it over & over.

Her - <all upset> "But I TRUSTED him!"

Me - <droll look> "WHY?"

Her - "Because he was supposed to follow through on his promise!"

Me - "Why?"

Her - "Because!"

Me - <raised eyebrows>

Her - "Because I WANTED him to! Surely it's not TOO much to ask!"

Me - "Has he always followed through in the past?"

Her - "No."

Me - "You already know who this person is. Accept it. Adapt."

Her - "It's not fair."

Me - "I know. But what you're doing to yourself isn't fair to you either."
 
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Hi there, I've been wondering a lot lately about this pattern in my life and personality. I don't know if anyone here can also relate but it would be intresting to see if it is common for the INFj personality type.
Let me elaborate a little on what I mean- after all many people do idealize other people too much- it is not INFJ special:tongue:.

The pattern I'm talking about related both to close friends/lovers/family members but also to meeting new people.
I think I have this tendency to really see a person when I first meet them- to see what they are amazing deep inside even if they don't show it (or know it).
I'm always so so excited about people and how wonderful they are until...times go by and I realize they don't see how amazing they are.
I tend to be very painfully disappointed in my personal relationships and I blame myself for having the wrong intuition about the person. I don't usually have high expectetions- just for the person to have some morals or be kind.

Who knows..maybe that is too much to expect?
I also do understand it it my fault for seeing them as beautiful and then being hurt when the illusion shatters. BUT
It got to the point where i don't want to become very close to anyone because of this.

Has anyone encountered a similar experience? What do you think?
It sounds kind of INFP-ish. You say you don't have high expectations about people, but that's not true, is it? You say you (want to) see how amazing and how wonderful they are. That's a lot more than just looking for some kindness and some morals.

Maybe it helps to put things in perspective. How do they rate compared to yourself? Or do you see yourself as amazing and wonderful?

Also, amazing and wonderful aren't properties of people. They can do something amazing or wonderful from time to time, but people can't simply be amazing and wonderful. Realizing that should help to look at people in a realistic way. That means that the level of amazingness and wonderfulness moves up and down with time. It doesn't get stuck at the highest level you observed and then stay there. If you get this in your system as reality, you won't be much dissapointed anymore. If you can't get this into your system,.... maybe,..... infp?
 

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The pattern I'm talking about related both to close friends/lovers/family members but also to meeting new people.
I think I have this tendency to really see a person when I first meet them- to see what they are amazing deep inside even if they don't show it (or know it).
I'm always so so excited about people and how wonderful they are until...times go by and I realize they don't see how amazing they are.
I'm not INFJ and won't pretend to have the sensitivity you guys do but I've experienced this exact thing every time I meet someone. I see their beauty, inward potential and subsequently have reality crush my idealization like a pack of bricks. It's happened so frequently that only in recent years have I been able to reign my ideals back in and mutter to myself "just you wait." The result has been to become cynical, which I dislike.

Isn't idealization an IFNP thing? My INFJ friends don't seem to have this problem so much...

Ok, sorry to derail. Super interesting thread :)
 

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I also do understand it it my fault for seeing them as beautiful and then being hurt when the illusion shatters
I personally think it is a great quality to be able to see the beauty in people, just wanted to let you know. And that is why it would be a shame if you decided to barricade yourself from the world.
The way I see it, you're like a young super hero who's got this wonderful power but who doesn't know how to master it yet. The only way to learn is practice, again and again, get hurt, stand up, learn, get hurt again, learn better, etc.

If I were to give you any advice (which I usually don't like to do because I think the best person suited to know what you should do is yourself), I'd ask you this : have you ever been idealized by someone? If yes, how did you feel? It's quite flattering first, right. But as the time goes on, there's this insidious fear growing "What if I disappoint them?", "Am I really that good?"... and slowly the fear turns into anger "Why did they have to think I was all that?", "Can't they see I'm just human?"...

See, when you idealize someone, and then that someone fails to meet your expectations, you're probably not the only one to get hurt.
 

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I don't always idealise people, but I do have a naive and overly positive view of most people (its different!! - more like a 'fair go' approach, everyone starts at the same level), which is a very delicate perception. For this reason it often discourages me from getting to know them as well as I could because when I find things out about them that I disprove or that shocks me etc my feelings of ease around them is (potentially) shattered. When I do idealise people and I'm aware I'm doing so, I just imagine them in a scenario that they're out of control with anger or out of their depth in one way or another just to balance out my perceptions. I find that helps me keep a healthy balance as I do not start to overly trust them this way. But I do my best to over look flaws in people and the highlights they try to convey about themselves - they are all the same as me.

Another thing I hate is when someone offers an opinion, good or bad, of a person who I have not yet met. This carries so much weight in my mind about them that when I do meet them, takes an extremely long time for whatever the person said to be (usually) disproved.
 

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I do this, except for giving up on getting close to others.
It's easy for me to see the beauty in others, and then jump to the assumption that there is no darkness.
 

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I idealize people constantly. I idealize certain characteristics or traits that other people have that seem out of reach to me. I idealize strangers, wondering about their internal world, and probably placing too much of my own fantastical expectations in them, which aren't real. When I idealize people it puts them at an inaccessible distance that makes it impossible for getting close to me. Maybe because I know my vision of them will easily be shattered and I don't want it to. That isn't to say my idealizations of them elevate them to being more than human. It's the opposite, sometimes flaws are idealized, making them even more human.
 

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I did this a lot more when I was younger (but I'm still young, so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯), however it still does happen occasionally with new people. If there is a discrepancy between my hopes and reality, it is very quickly addressed, and then I shrug and file them into the large folder of people who made a good impression that didn't last.

I'm not really crushed by it anymore, as it happens far more than the alternative, and people are people and people are flawed. I think it's still a worthwhile exercise to appreciate the good things they've got going on, but I try to avoid placing unrealistic expectations on anyone.
 

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I don't idealize people, but I do find myself constantly disappointed to some degree or another with those around me. I'm working on it, I promise, but I'm positive it stems from the fact that I set such an impossibly high bar for myself and my behavior that, by default, I tend to impose it in a small way on everyone I meet. I'm really something of a raging perfectionist and can be intimidatingly disciplined, so I've been told by too many people. Don't know if that's common to the INFJ experience, or just my own private brand of neurosis.
 
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