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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Now that I have your attention. Here's some thoughts. A lot of them probably. This is my first thread in a long ass time so I believe I'm entitled to creating one in this section because 6 years ago this is where the current phase of my life started ;)

Well, a long story short, I found myself in the INFJ section after a random online test had me as one (it was completely wrong btw). If anyone cares (I personally don't), now I consistently type as something completely different but at the same time I've pretty much decided that typing is part of a process of self-discovery and self-improvement that brings people like me here.

It does not define me now but for a while I thought that it absolutely did. I got caught up in analysing my life and other people through MBTI but over time it turned into a house of cards and crashed. People weren't fitting into tight little boxes anymore. Individual complexity became MBTI's worst enemy.

What did define me was learning to navigate life continuing to grow as an individual. At the very ripe age of 30 I was mostly clueless about who I was as a person. I was clueless that I have some incredibly pervasive character flaws that I was blind to. I stuck to rosy accolades and MBTI at the time made me feel validated ... A kind of self-validation that included a certain amount of being respected (inspite of the flaws) that I was not receiving as a person in my real life. There was a lot that was broken.

Now, why am I creating this thread and telling you all this? I'm NOT advocating against the use of MBTI. I'm advocating against the use of MBTI to stop growing or growing only in terms of how MBTI or even Jung advises people to grow. There's more there that these systems cannot hope to cover and as a veteran of these systems I can see all that is lacking. Also as someone that hasn't stopped growing and improving as an individual (I still obviously have more blind spots but I'm aware of them instead of giving into them now).

People who remember me from 2011 probably remember what a mess I was. I was deeply suicidal and was very vocal about it. I was not in a good place. So eventually, I went to therapy for more than a year in 2012. Here too there was a mistake I made initially. I thought that they had a "fix" for me. Another big mistake.

Therapy doesn't have fixes (though some therapists ... especially the unethical pill-pushers claim that they do). I feel like ... and mostly learnt to through experience that it's based on suggestions and guidelines. Some good and some not good. Qualification itself didn't make people good therapists or psychiatrists. I went through 3 of them. 2 of them had me on drugs that obviously didn't help. In fact, several therapists tried and made things worse physically.

I mean, I was no longer suicidal for the most part because I was fighting that on my own with the help of my then girlfriend, but I was a zombie and having severe break downs and relapses.

Then I eventually realized that the mistake I was really making was believing that there's something that can be fixed by applying external methods without a real internal evaluation. Not evaluation of my instincts, attitudes and beliefs, or whether or not I "innately" like to hang out with people or not (I do). But an evaluation of everything that's broken about me and why. What is it that is broken about me. If my SO and I are arguing, what am I doing wrong. I kept that question in the back of my mind all the time during every argument, every fight, every wrong move. It wasn't self-deprecation either because that comes with low self-esteem. I keep my pride but I made sure I knew that the person in front of me has been made uncomfortable by me, is it justified, or am I just pushing against them because of some deep internal flaw that I'm consciously not aware of.

It was an inventory that made me feel like I was torturing myself, but it was work that needed to be done.

No one did that for me and I don't think anyone could have done it. It was extremely unique to me and my circumstances in life. By 2013, I had discovered that my problems were stemming from certain childhood abandonment issues. Instead of staying rooted to my comfortable life, I started taking risks. I moved out of my parents' house and moved in my then fiance halfway around the world in 2014. I applied for immigration and here I am in 2018 and we've moved on to buying a house.

Have I been "fixed". No. Is there a solution to some of my worst flaws that still exist. No. The thing that exists is my self-control and self-awareness of myself. This is what I recommend to each one of you that have found themselves here in similar situations. Find you. Inventory yourself. The systems are a great starting point. But that's all they are. One of the best things you can do for yourself is to move. Just to move and do. Keep on doing even when doing makes no sense. Keep on moving and keep on fighting ... sometimes your biggest enemy will be you. Fight yourself. Win. Do. Also, it doesn't matter if you don't win every time and / or all the time. You just have to win enough and that's all that matters.

Hope you have wonderful lives. Keep working and keep trying. I'm out ... for now.
 

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Then I eventually realized that the mistake I was really making was believing that there's something that can be fixed by applying external methods without a real internal evaluation.

It was an inventory that made me feel like I was torturing myself, but it was work that needed to be done.

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I haven't a clue what kind of therapist(s) you managed to find, but having started in hypnotherapy, then moving on to some quacks without qualifications, I eventually settled for a man with a BSc degree in Psycology. Our first session was simply me arriving, asking him for a cup of tea, and sitting in silence for the hour and paying him. I took it from there. That was 25 years ago. I still see a therapist every Tuesday, for an hour, to this day. I thank my original therapist and the kindness he showed me from the bottom of my heart.

Therapy for me is free association. I just talk. We have been to places and seen some things I would not have believed. I have traversed the ages from near birth to today. My therapist asked me to draw a picture some years ago of myself and bring it along. She noticed I never drew my legs. This sent us down a path to near birth and a reintegration that was needed after trauma when very young, and so it goes on. None of it is external.

I will never be fixed, as like you, that was the thought, that was the goal. Free association therapy allows acceptance, integration, growth and renewal, and in my case, is an ongoing process which should lead to self actualisation as the flawed child and adult I truly am.

You've only just started, just like all of us.
 

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@Reap, I remember some of your older posts and some of the things you were struggling with. It’s good to see you. I am very happy to see you are doing well and continuing to grow :) *hugs*
 
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Well, a long story short, I found myself in the INFJ section after a random online test had me as one (it was completely wrong btw). If anyone cares (I personally don't), now I consistently type as something completely different but at the same time I've pretty much decided that typing is part of a process of self-discovery and self-improvement that brings people like me here.
I totally agree with a lot of your post. Well put. I wonder if your new type is ENTJ heh. You don't have to reveal this tho' if you don't want to.
 

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I totally agree with a lot of your post. Well put. I wonder if your new type is ENTJ heh. You don't have to reveal this tho' if you don't want to.
If I assume that it's based on what I am like now (even my innate preferences have changed a lot since my therapy and new-found self-awareness), then yes, I'm consistently testing ENTJ.

I think that based on what I've read, there's been very little work done on the impact of mental illness with respect to MBTI so there's not much reference left to really determine my type.
 

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If I assume that it's based on what I am like now (even my innate preferences have changed a lot since my therapy and new-found self-awareness), then yes, I'm consistently testing ENTJ.

I think that based on what I've read, there's been very little work done on the impact of mental illness with respect to MBTI so there's not much reference left to really determine my type.
Oh so I got that right. :) Your way of thinking/perceiving about things is a lot like the ENTJs I've known. :)

Mental illness can complicate things, sure.
 

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30 is a good age to start looking at personal development. It will take the rest of your life, there are no short fixes. I always quote Tagore here: It is as near to you as your life, but you can never wholly know it

I hear your comments about failed therapy quite a lot and it has the same tone. It is an impossible task to “Fix” anything or anyone. You have had 30 years of lived life and to expect therapy to heal all those wounds in a year is extreme fantasy.

You are correct in saying that therapy does not have the “fixes” It is only you who has the fixes, therapists are just guides and if you do not do the work and the direction your therapy will take you will not benefit from any type of therapy or therapist.

Therapists meet many clients “doing the rounds” visiting lots of therapists until they find one that “colludes” with what they are looking for, (we do not fall for any of that) it is very rare that they do find a therapist and always have negative views about therapy and their experience

ask yourself the same questions every 5 years and report back
 

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30 is a good age to start looking at personal development. It will take the rest of your life, there are no short fixes. I always quote Tagore here: It is as near to you as your life, but you can never wholly know it

I hear your comments about failed therapy quite a lot and it has the same tone. It is an impossible task to “Fix” anything or anyone. You have had 30 years of lived life and to expect therapy to heal all those wounds in a year is extreme fantasy.
Eh, dwelling on the "wounds" seems quite pointless to me anyway. You have to move on from the past. So the fix is, just accept them and move on. No more, no less. See also "sunk cost".


You are correct in saying that therapy does not have the “fixes” It is only you who has the fixes, therapists are just guides and if you do not do the work and the direction your therapy will take you will not benefit from any type of therapy or therapist.

Therapists meet many clients “doing the rounds” visiting lots of therapists until they find one that “colludes” with what they are looking for, (we do not fall for any of that) it is very rare that they do find a therapist and always have negative views about therapy and their experience
Sure. I think therapy is for NFs and maybe some more self-reflective NTs.

I tried it before but most of it is not really useful to me. It requires willingness to navel gaze a lot and a lot of awareness of feelings. And CBT doesn't offer much that you can't do on your own alone. Etc. Very practical approaches teaching skills are no longer in the "therapy" category to me but those are useful to some people.

I am totally ok with self-discovery otherwise, done outside therapy.
 
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