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I'm curious to hear from INJs about their experiences with driving, and what anyone in general thinks about how inferior Se (or even just weak Se?) could affect one's aptitude behind the wheel.

There was a discussion about this in the INFJ forum a while back and a couple people hinted at not having much confidence in their driving, getting distracted, many near-misses with accidents, etc.

Personally, I don't like to admit it, but I'm not a great driver. I definitely find that I'm distracted, even forgetting that I'm driving altogether until I almost rear-end someone. I've fortunately never actually caused an accident. This has less to do with driving ability, but I also do strange things in the car like drive around with the radio on static.

Also, how do other INJs feel about driving? I hate having to drive. I love being in the car for a long time, but only if I can be a passenger - great opportunity for getting lost in thought. Highway hypnosis is not a good thing when you're the driver.
 

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Not a thread specifically about driving, but I think you'll see a trend where a large portion of INTJs admit to spacing out while driving... http://personalitycafe.com/intj-forum-scientists/155646-worst-experience-zoning-out-spacing-off.html

I would much rather ride than drive, because I do like to let my mind wander and I like to be able to just look out the window without having to pay attention to anything in particular. My mom thought I was crazy when I told her that I didn't really want to drive because I couldn't look around if I was driving. Now, I don't mind driving and actually enjoy it when I'm not in traffic. It's great thinking time when I'm out on the road with no other distractions, just me, the radio, and 200 miles of mostly empty road.

Also, when I was first learning to drive, it was terrible. Information overload. I couldn't pay attention to where everything was in the car control-wise and pay attention to all the other cars and trying to react instantly to incoming data. It was super stressful. Once I started to see the patterns in what people do, that they tend to telegraphy what they are going to do even before they signal, things became a lot less chaotic to me once I was able to sort all that out. I learned what was important to pay attention to, rather than trying to pay attention to everything. Also, paying attention to the traffic as far ahead of me as I can see rather than restricting myself to the 2 or 3 cars in front of me has helped me a lot too, because then it's easy to see I'm going to need to slow down soon when I see a bunch of brake lights ahead, so I'm planning ahead, rather than reacting in the moment.
 

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I never truly knew fear until a passenger in a car driven by an xNFJ.

Then, on the other hand, one of the best drivers I know is an INFJ (very confident in this typing). He takes a great deal of pride in it and is always aware.... but, one INFJ (also quite confident in the typing) drove with about the same capacity of putting a brick on the gas pedal. You had to tell her to stop, to turn, anything. She claimed she was a bit better when driving alone.

Lastly, a male ENFJ, a fine driver who also occasionally ran stop signs and red lights... which is a problem. I am not aware of any of them getting into bad accidents... though, the last one's father, who we typed an INFJ, was killed in a car accident that was his fault... the result of him being spacey and pulling into the path of a fast moving truck. He was known to be a spacey driver.

The most curious thing is the relative lack of concern they had for this problem. I'd have expected other types to panic or something.. but they seemed to do little more than shrug. They were also somewhat resistant to the suggestion that they not drive. In fact, I am suddenly aware of the fact that all the NJ types in my life, regardless of gender... tend to want to drive. Not want to drive per se, but do drive. We always seem to take their car. Like it's a given? Oh weird! Is that true? I think that's true! Hrm...

The only other genuinely scary driver I've known was an ENTP. He was pretty bad and claimed he was an incredible driver who was so confident and savvy that it just LOOKED like he was always about to get everyone killed. No one who drove with him agreed with this interpretation.
 

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It seems like it would be hard to reliably link inferior Se with poor driving skills since there are many contributing factors like hand-eye coordination, experience(s), excitability, values, awareness and consideration of costs/rewards, etc.

In my experience inferior Se plays a general role in my cautious approach to some things like switching lanes because I tend to question whether I have accurately perceived reality or not (It seems like its safe to switch lanes but is there really that much space between myself and the driver behind me? Do I want or do I know there is enough space? Did I judge their speed correctly? I don't think I've turned my head to check my blind spot far enough, better check two more times, hang on did I see one or two cars behind me? Or did I just see the rear window frame, etc). This only seems like a minor handicap when balanced against the advantages I might have over other drivers though, and them me. I generally obey the rules of the road, respect other drivers, and respond reasonably to changing circumstances. I think my beliefs on the merits of following the rules of the road has a much larger influence on my driving habits than does my experience of inferior-Se, which at its greatest impact forces me to respond safely to an option I don't feel comfortable taking.

For what its worth, the driver that scared me the most was an Se-dom, and his behavior was largely due to a desire to defy my expectations for how fast his car could move. He defied my expectation for how stupidly he could behave to accomplish this goal in a school zone.
 

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l will admit to being a little nervous as passenger with an INTJ driver, do you know why?

Mostly because he was visibly nervous himself, protip if you ever really want to freak people out LOL.

But l guess what l notice, was that he'd alternate between being really focused and really, not :crazy: And sort of being more concerned with the mechanical aspects of the vehicle and not so much with what was going on around the vehicle regardless.
 

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l will admit to being a little nervous as passenger with an INTJ driver, do you know why?

Mostly because he was visibly nervous himself, protip if you ever really want to freak people out LOL.

But l guess what l notice, was that he'd alternate between being really focused and really, not :crazy: And sort of being more concerned with the mechanical aspects of the vehicle and not so much with what was going on around the vehicle regardless.
If there was ever something wrong with an INTJ's car, it would be noticed and remedied immediately. I'd be worried about an INFP driving a car with the check engine light on or with screeching sounds coming from the brakes...

Not that I did it...
 

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I completely zone out and sometimes end up at my destination without remembering the drive there.
 

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INTJ sister-very good spatial orientation and navigational skills;deliberate and focused
 
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Are driving skills related to weak or inferior Se? Not sure about that. I'm a notoriously bad driver (I've had about 4 or 5 minor accidents, including one involving a cardboard cow). And it's not just the accidents; I'm so much in my head that I don't realize I've cut someone off or otherwise accidentally pissed someone off. My judgement is also a bit impaired sometimes (probably because of the issue I mention below); once I ran a red light that was broken (flashing) because I thought that it was like a stop sign. Turns out, er, no.

I hate driving because there's too much stimulus: I have to look out the front windshield while still dealing with the rearview mirrors, I have to pay attention to other drivers on the road, I get distracted by the noises both inside and outside the car... oh, and there's that blind spot which kind of bothers me. So I get really pissed off at other drivers on the road. I don't drive much anymore, and I'm lucky enough to live in a large, walkable city with good public transportation where not driving isn't a hindrance to everyday life. So I doubt that this is function-related. But of course, that's only my personal experience and opinion.
 

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The worst driver I've known was an ESTJ. Efficiency was key to her so she drove as fast as possible, tailgated everyone, and did not slow down over bumps. It was like a roller coaster ride.

One of my issues is I react slowly. Four-way stops stress me out.
 

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Driving was an issue for me when I first learned to drive, I just wanted to learn quickly as possible because I hated having to walk everywhere. I got in a crash and stopped driving for 5 years, when I started again I was extremely nervous but after a few months (and the give way rules changed for the better) it became much more natural. The only problem major problem is the roads here as so god damn narrow, the main street here doesn't give you enough room to pull out without worrying whether a car will let you get out.
 

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l will admit to being a little nervous as passenger with an INTJ driver, do you know why?

Mostly because he was visibly nervous himself, protip if you ever really want to freak people out LOL.

But l guess what l notice, was that he'd alternate between being really focused and really, not :crazy: And sort of being more concerned with the mechanical aspects of the vehicle and not so much with what was going on around the vehicle regardless.
Is this me? Could it be?!?
 

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I was worried about spacing out before I started to learn how to drive.

But on the road, I've trained myself not to do that. Spacing out on the road hasn't happened so far, pretty much at all.
 

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Quit confirming my worst fears thread!

I'm the trifecta of bad driving, Spacy, Need-for-Speed, and 'I am twelve and what is turning'?

I park like a boss though. Probably because people keep asking me to just stop and park somewhere.
 

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Ellis Bell said:
Are driving skills related to weak or inferior Se? Not sure about that. I'm a notoriously bad driver (I've had about 4 or 5 minor accidents, including one involving a cardboard cow). And it's not just the accidents; I'm so much in my head that I don't realize I've cut someone off or otherwise accidentally pissed someone off. My judgement is also a bit impaired sometimes (probably because of the issue I mention below); once I ran a red light that was broken (flashing) because I thought that it was like a stop sign. Turns out, er, no.

I hate driving because there's too much stimulus: I have to look out the front windshield while still dealing with the rearview mirrors, I have to pay attention to other drivers on the road, I get distracted by the noises both inside and outside the car... oh, and there's that blind spot which kind of bothers me. So I get really pissed off at other drivers on the road. I don't drive much anymore, and I'm lucky enough to live in a large, walkable city with good public transportation where not driving isn't a hindrance to everyday life. So I doubt that this is function-related. But of course, that's only my personal experience and opinion.


I'm also a disaster with driving. Basically verbatim the same reasons. I actually think I have good hand-eye coordination, but the fact that you have to pay attention to all these things for your safety, i.e. work for disaster-prevention, takes a lot of the fun out of that.

I think it's not ultimately explained by your function, because there's a lot of ways the functions can actually manifest. Sensation can be used more as a data-gathering tool than as a means for athletics or driving.


 

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I can drive pretty well, being an INTP with a fair amount of Se. I generally have good awareness and reaction speed. My main problem is dealing with slow drivers or obstructive traffic (especially semi trucks and buses directly in front of me, I really hate not being able to see directly in front of me in order to make a plan to get around). I hate having to pay attention to something so boring and have to go at my own pace (which is typically a little bit over the speed limit).
 

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I had been curious about this topic myself. I've noticed the town I work in seems to have quite a number of INFJs, and a great mass-transit system that they seem to rely on rather than driving.

Also how does inferior Si affect driving?

I often zone out while driving too, but I go on autopilot- driving isn't something I need to think about unless I'm somewhere I don't recognize or with a complex traffic pattern. I get where I need to go, don't have near misses, etc.
 

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Driving is... easy?

You have to learn to absorb ALL the information (cars in front of you, rearview mirror, sideview mirrors, engine sound, speed, revs, fuel meter, engine temperature), but have filters so that only URGENT information (car in blind spot, flashing lights, car in front is braking, etc) set off the alarms.

I've been in 2 accidents, one of them major that totaled my car (neither of them my fault), and am extremely paranoid and jumpy when I'm a passenger with anyone other than my ESTJ dad (best driver i know).

Also how does inferior Si affect driving?

I often zone out while driving too, but I go on autopilot- driving isn't something I need to think about unless I'm somewhere I don't recognize or with a complex traffic pattern. I get where I need to go, don't have near misses, etc.


I think inferior Si manifests itself for me as muscle memory. I only need directions once, after that I just know when to turn, what lane to be in, etc. On my morning commute that I've done hundreds and hundreds of times I spend most of my time deep in thought, listening to music, because I don't actually need to pay that much attention to the driving. I know the route down to the minute details (at 75mph, the 3rd straightaway after exit 37 takes approximately 27 seconds).

Driving is so liberating!
 

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I space out easily while driving. I play loud music to keep me in tune with my surroundings. I believe this is different from being a bad driver, though. The driving itself, when I'm in tune-- I react quickly, I'm purposeful about where I choose to be on the road and at what speed, I know what other cars are in the vicinity, and in general it's a very smooth one-thing-into-another ride.

The problem is just keeping myself in that mind space, but when I do, I'm not a bad driver. Many of the people/friends that I know feel safer riding with me than with my other friends who are more likely to overlook things or be reckless.


Directions, on the other hand, are another matter entirely. I am crap at knowing where I'm going, when to turn, which way to turn, how to get from x to z, or any of that :tongue:, but that's due to poor memory.


I enjoy driving by myself at night when the streets are empty-- Just me, myself, the music, and the road in front of me.
 

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I'm actually a pretty good driver; I generally accelerate and brake smoothly and can recover from near-accidents and mistakes pretty easily. Though I did get in one "wreck" while backing out of a parking space in heavy rain...

It's strange though, because when I drive it feels as if my Ni and Se are equal. When I'm on a road trip, or really any drive without heavy traffic I can seemingly drive safely and successfully while on "auto-pilot" as my Ni and daydreams run wild. I feel present, yet not present.

But perhaps this is just further evidence that Se is my tertiary rather than inferior function.
 
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