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Discussion Starter #1
Are the only things different about the two are:

Infj's show their true feelings when they are alone when someone that they can trust, where as the Intj's will hide their feelings all the time.

And that Infj's gravitate toward english and arts (I have a strong Ti, so I think that's why I'm so good at math and science) while the Intj's gravitate toward science and technology? (This is why I thought I was an Intj when I first started, my T/F scale is near the middle)

These are the only things right now that I can pull from off the top of my head.
Would anyone else care to elaborate?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
No....I have never meet an Intj.
Lol....so thats why I was going off of the description.
Although, there is a chance my mom is one.
My dad is an ESTJ. But we havent found out about my mom.
But I know that I act like my mom more than my dad.(He used to get in trouble by the teachers from running his mouth too much.)
For all I know.....she could be an Infj.
 
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My dad's an intj. The relationship is awesome.
Yeah, they are much much colder and much more...harsh.
 

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haha, oh ok, musun.

there's always a level of understanding between the two types.

intj's are colder, as i mentioned, and also, in person, usually more awkward of interpersonal dynamics. an intj i know, for example, has a tough time reading when people are bored or not interested in her stories. so she'll continue talking even after a conversation should have ended. along with being colder there's a general lack of sympathy, and a lack of caring about people, and their problems. also, i notice that they have pockets of expertise in certain subjects - whether that is math, technology, anime, german culture, etc, it doesn't matter... ask about a subject, and it will be difficult to get them to stop talking.
 

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This is by no means accurate, they are just my observations, please feel free to differ. :cool:

INFJ = personal, feels people, sees subtle social cues, likes emotionally charged movies, likes varied music, eclectic, calms down situations and bridges the differences(passive stance), appeasement, likes playing with abstractions.

INTJ = impersonal, understands people, sees social dynamic, likes thinky movies, likes certain similar genres, refined, accepts conflicts and resolves problems(aggressive stance), advocation, likes playing with complexities.

Both seek harmony (I think)
 

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1.) Infj's show their true feelings when they are alone when someone that they can trust, where as the Intj's will hide their feelings all the time.

This is common, but not absolute. INTJs can reveal feelings, but it seems they don't feel the need to as much as INFJs do. INFJs seem to be able to use their true feelings as a more necessary tool/approach/method/[insert 101 official PerCafe terms here] to identifying with others. In a way, it's much more of a hidden lifestyle for an INFJ than for an INTJ.

2.) And that Infj's gravitate toward english and arts (I have a strong Ti, so I think that's why I'm so good at math and science) while the Intj's gravitate toward science and technology? (This is why I thought I was an Intj when I first started, my T/F scale is near the middle)

I've never been a huge fan of English and Art, and naturally gravitate towards more technical topics. I don't think interests are type-specific. I know plenty of people with high Fe and lower Ti that do swimmingly in Math/Sciences as well, so I don't find that claim to be terribly accurate. (If only more T types were half as undeniably genius as they claimed to be on this forum, and if only more F types were good at love poetry, we might have a revelation on our hands.:laughing: )
 

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I used think I was an INTJ, probably because I suppressed my feelings when I was younger, and so my tertiary funcion Ti was used more. I used to feel oblivious to social cues compared to others. However after reading some threads on the INTJ forum, I know that I am not an INTJ, they seem to be even more oblivious to social cues, such as how to tell if someone likes you.

I sort of know one INTJ in real life and he spent an afternoon calculating pi. I find that pretty cool, yet it's not something that I would find amusing enough for a whole afternoon.
 

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Are the only things different about the two are:

Infj's show their true feelings when they are alone when someone that they can trust, where as the Intj's will hide their feelings all the time.
Not true. We're very similar to INFJ in this respect, especially a mature INTJ. Only special people get to see us vent our Fi. Usually it's piggybacking off of Te though.

And that Infj's gravitate toward english and arts (I have a strong Ti, so I think that's why I'm so good at math and science) while the Intj's gravitate toward science and technology? (This is why I thought I was an Intj when I first started, my T/F scale is near the middle)
Not necessarily true either. C.S. Lewis was an INTJ, so was Stanley Kubrick. I also know an INFJ computer scientist.
INTJs can also be pretty philosophical sometimes. Some of us also make pretty good use of Ne and Ti... so abstractions aren't out of the question.

I would say the biggest difference is in the Te vs. Fe.

We're rational to a fault. We like relating to things as objects. We like to organize things and categorize them to fit into our designs for the world. Our thinking mainly comes from the inside and directs the outside.

Fe on the other hand I believe gets it's energy from the outside and goes inward.
 

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INTJs don't hide their feelings. They really really do experience fewer feelings than us because it appears that they do not develop feelings spontaneously. There was a discussion on INTJ forum about empathy and I commented that I've noticed that an INTJ needs some sort of a reason to feel. And some INTJs commented that this is indeed the case. For them it goes observation -> thoughts/thoughts/thoughts/analysis -> may be a feeling i.e. it is a long way to the feeling part. Us F-types develop many feelings spontaneously. We tend to first feel only afterwards develop thoughts and some sort of analysis about it. Feelings just pop into our mind whether we want it or not. We cannot interact with others and not automatically feel what they feel unless we try to consciously repress it. INTJs go around life not feeling what others feel unless they try to consciously develop this kind of knowledge.

Often time they will not find a reason for this kind of analysis. More introverted individuals of their type especially so. They would experience social situations and reasons to ponder about them very infrequently and can even feel that people are boring and uninteresting. For them having to deal with people can become a sort of a nuisance - having to think about other people's emotion relationships to figure out how one should respond subtracts valuable resources and time from things they are really interested in.

Just like INFJs they make extensive use of their Ni to build up sort of a database of experiences and observations, ideas, theories, and connections to figure out reality how it really is. But because they have much less experience and interest in dealing with emotions than us, their Ni database is often deficient in this respect. This is why we see them using their feeling so clumsily and often misreading feelings of others. For example, the INTJs in my family sometimes completely miscalculate the way that I feel, which has amazed me because after living with same individual under same roof for over a decade I take it for granted that one will develop a deep understanding of that person's emotions and motives. But it is because throughout their life, INTJs genuinely lack interest in processing information regarding other people and relationships and feelings. So the model of how the world works that their Ni builds up is simply lacking these data packets that have to deal with people's relations and emotions. Instead it contains extensive data packets on subjects that genuinely interest them (like cars, science, law, philosophy) about which they can talk in great detail for hours. This is also why they can appear to be so emotionally clumsy to us. The less intelligent members of their type whose Ni and Te aren't working well can simply come off as immature.

Things like boredom vs interest - the deciding factors between what bores you vs what interests you are actually also determined in part by your cognitive phenotype. So not having much interest in people, and even finding people boring and a nuisance to deal with, INTJs do tend to gravitate towards subjects like physical sciences and engineering. This is not clear-cut division because there are INTJs who develop an interest in analyzing people and can become investigators of human nature, but you will sense that they would treat people sort of like objects and their analyses will be very impersonal, and can even come off as sounding rude to us. And there are INFJs who are Ni/Ti dominant who will behave alike INTJs, think objectively and closely analyze everything they encounter. Such INFJs who are Ni/Ti dominant will actually feel an interest in stereotypical INTJ subjects. The INFJs with dominant Fe are more likely to gravitate towards things like art, theater, literature, social work and religion.

Both INFJs and INTJs are Ni dominants, so we can relate on this basis very well. We are also both introverted and need plenty of time spent alone and tend not to stress each other in the way that extraverts can stress us out. As long as one type puts in effort into trying to become more sensitive to social cues and the second type tries to be more objective and analytical, we can actually get along pretty well with them.
 

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Are the only things different about the two are:

Infj's show their true feelings when they are alone when someone that they can trust, where as the Intj's will hide their feelings all the time.

And that Infj's gravitate toward english and arts (I have a strong Ti, so I think that's why I'm so good at math and science) while the Intj's gravitate toward science and technology? (This is why I thought I was an Intj when I first started, my T/F scale is near the middle)

These are the only things right now that I can pull from off the top of my head.
Would anyone else care to elaborate?
I am a professional translator/interpreter of Arabic and Russian. I have studied 8 languages in my lifetime to verying degrees of proficiency. All of the INTJs I know in real life [3 males] are linguists, not very interested in math. So, not sure there...

INTJs do have feelings and do want to show them, but acting on feeling goes entirely against their nature, making emotional relationships and expressing them a very, very painful experience because of the inner pull between the intellect and heart. This is why they come off as cold. Some of them give up on feelings altogether, because it's just difficult to deal with. I think this is key to INTJs, they feel, but distrust their feelings and want to act on logic only.
 

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I used to think I was an intj and spent a lot of time on the intj forum. Still do occassionally. I did test intj for a long time, but recently have found out that I really am an infj.

I think the main issue I found myself differing with them was the empathy issue. They seemed to need a logical reason to have it, needed reasoning behind it, needed to justify it in their heads. Not all of them of course. But for me, it's like why do you need to think through helping someone....just do it. It's the right thing to do. They discuss morals a lot and why they should not be imposed on others when they are your own abstract ideas, not something which everyone should necessarily follow. Kind of like don't tell me what is right and wrong, let me decide for myself. I don't agree with that and think deep down we all know the difference between right and wrong, even if we want to justify it otherwise and make arguments against it. You don't need to think up logical reasons and rationalize why you should do the right thing. So that was the main reason why I figured out I'm not really an intj. I can't relate to that type of thinking. Plus they have no use or interest for the most part in feelings. I do and pick up on them easily - they don't notice them or really have any interest in learning about them, except for any logical reason to do so.

I think the reason why I tested intj for so long is I do value logic and reasoning in terms of situations and finding out the best outcome....but I think when it comes to morality and human interaction you can't rely on those all the time. Feelings and intuition are much more important to me in those cases.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
WOW, this has gave me a lot of new insights. So all in all, there isn't that much of a difference between us two types.
Lol, thanks. And the mbti personality type descriptions need to be more in depth. Because after Im done reading it....I still have alot of questions about them.
And I was also VERY happy that this type fit me perfectly....because I was getting very tired of looking.
 

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I was just recently mulling this same question over about myself. When taking the test, I'm very close to F but still a J... just slightly.

I found that this page helped sort out a lot for me - INFJ or INTJ?

It's not that we INTJs find somebody in distress and stop and think "Hmm should I help them? What logical way can I justify helping this person?". From reading some posts from INTJs I'm sure there are probably some people that honestly wouldn't care one way or the other, a big part really depends on the person and the situation. It's very specified, and it takes more and more experiences to be able to relate them to each other. It isn't that INTJs dont feel or dont care, they just aren't going to let emotions make their decisions for them. They might come to the exact same conclusion as an INFJ, but had different methods of arriving there. For me... I have emotions, I try to understand the emotions, and try to figure out why X emotion happened instead of Y in a given situation. For me it isn't that if I can't find a justification then the emotion isn't valid or important (but it does become incredibly frustrating if I can't figure it out). I can't just let emotions exist for the sake of existing.


For example... a few days ago I broke up with my boyfriend of a year and a half. I've been having feelings of anxiety and confusion, but it took me a while to understand WHY I was having these emotions. I didn't want to just break up with him for nothing. It took me months of 'waiting it out' to make sure I was doing the right things and to make sure I couldn't salvage the relationship first. I loosely applied the scientific method to finally come the conclusion that I needed to break up with my boyfriend and that we weren't right for each other, even if he is a great guy and we get along great. If it wasn't for those emotions nagging at me, I'd be stuck in an unfulfilling relationship for a very long time.... but I had to understand those emotions, categorize them, and justify them before making any decisions based on them alone. It is this decision making process and 'justification' that makes it possible for me to leave the relationship feeling a little nostalgic, but not an emotional mess. It's not that I don't care about him anymore, or that I didn't constantly worry about which way to break up with him for fear of hurting him.... but I can accept my feelings for what they are, and also feel good knowing that I did what was right.


I LOVE analyzing people's emotions and feelings, figuring out why they exist - it's irrational in my mind to assume that feelings are trivial. From an evolutionary standpoint, we evolved to have them to help us survive, and they help us survive in social interactions still. It would be unwise to completely shut emotions out and pretend they are useless. I've noticed that a lot of INTJs use their "label" as an excuse to be cold and rude. The same way that I don't think it's right for an INFP to use their label as an exuse to be an emotionally abusive and volatile train wreck, I think it's weird that people accept that it's okay for an INTJ to be an ass to somebody just because they don't immediately grasp that their actions and words can be hurtful.

If all INTJs were as emotionless and cold as many of them let on to be, or as a lot of people seem to think they are, you would probably find the INTJ to be an actual disability and not just a personality type. They wouldn't be able to function in normal society, because they wouldn't be able to interpret their bosses wishes or ever be truly involved in a romantic relationship. I reject the extremes. Extremes are irrational.


I find myself relating to people very easily. I pick up on social cues and I empathize with characters in books (or from stories of friends) to an extent that I feel physically heavy from taking on the emotions. Do I still find myself to be an INTJ? Absolutely, because of how I interact with these emotions and how I let them effect me. I do sympathize with the 'protector' image, and I stand up for those who are getting picked on... but only if it isn't justified for them to be getting picked on/punished. I wont stand up for somebody if I feel they deserve it (it's the justice vs mercy argument). For most people that I don't know well, my sympathies are conditonal. If I know the person well and they mean a lot to me, it becomes more unconditional, and mercy begins to outway justice - which is still rational to me. It makes sense to protect the ones you care for, as an INTJ, I just don't extend this feeling toward every person alive.


(huge post, really sorry... got caught up in dispelling the negatives revolving around the diea of an INTJ)
 

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My INTJ friend and I were having a discussion a while back about a scenario he was in.

There were a bunch of skinhead guys harassing this black guy because his girlfriend was white, and threatening to beat him up. As he was describing it, I found it interesting how we both had the same feelings of being riled up. As he described the situation my heart started beating really fast because of the emotions I was feeling over it, and I could tell that he was feeling the same way, especially when he talked about how he got involved, and I felt as though I would have done everything that he did. Though we never see eye to eye in terms of empathy, I don't think I've ever felt closer to him besides in that moment.

This is an interesting thread, considering I've often been mistaken for an INTJ.
 

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I was just recently mulling this same question over about myself. When taking the test, I'm very close to F but still a J... just slightly.

I found that this page helped sort out a lot for me - INFJ or INTJ?

It's not that we INTJs find somebody in distress and stop and think "Hmm should I help them? What logical way can I justify helping this person?". From reading some posts from INTJs I'm sure there are probably some people that honestly wouldn't care one way or the other, a big part really depends on the person and the situation. It's very specified, and it takes more and more experiences to be able to relate them to each other. It isn't that INTJs dont feel or dont care, they just aren't going to let emotions make their decisions for them. They might come to the exact same conclusion as an INFJ, but had different methods of arriving there. For me... I have emotions, I try to understand the emotions, and try to figure out why X emotion happened instead of Y in a given situation. For me it isn't that if I can't find a justification then the emotion isn't valid or important (but it does become incredibly frustrating if I can't figure it out). I can't just let emotions exist for the sake of existing.


For example... a few days ago I broke up with my boyfriend of a year and a half. I've been having feelings of anxiety and confusion, but it took me a while to understand WHY I was having these emotions. I didn't want to just break up with him for nothing. It took me months of 'waiting it out' to make sure I was doing the right things and to make sure I couldn't salvage the relationship first. I loosely applied the scientific method to finally come the conclusion that I needed to break up with my boyfriend and that we weren't right for each other, even if he is a great guy and we get along great. If it wasn't for those emotions nagging at me, I'd be stuck in an unfulfilling relationship for a very long time.... but I had to understand those emotions, categorize them, and justify them before making any decisions based on them alone. It is this decision making process and 'justification' that makes it possible for me to leave the relationship feeling a little nostalgic, but not an emotional mess. It's not that I don't care about him anymore, or that I didn't constantly worry about which way to break up with him for fear of hurting him.... but I can accept my feelings for what they are, and also feel good knowing that I did what was right.


I LOVE analyzing people's emotions and feelings, figuring out why they exist - it's irrational in my mind to assume that feelings are trivial. From an evolutionary standpoint, we evolved to have them to help us survive, and they help us survive in social interactions still. It would be unwise to completely shut emotions out and pretend they are useless. I've noticed that a lot of INTJs use their "label" as an excuse to be cold and rude. The same way that I don't think it's right for an INFP to use their label as an exuse to be an emotionally abusive and volatile train wreck, I think it's weird that people accept that it's okay for an INTJ to be an ass to somebody just because they don't immediately grasp that their actions and words can be hurtful.

If all INTJs were as emotionless and cold as many of them let on to be, or as a lot of people seem to think they are, you would probably find the INTJ to be an actual disability and not just a personality type. They wouldn't be able to function in normal society, because they wouldn't be able to interpret their bosses wishes or ever be truly involved in a romantic relationship. I reject the extremes. Extremes are irrational.


I find myself relating to people very easily. I pick up on social cues and I empathize with characters in books (or from stories of friends) to an extent that I feel physically heavy from taking on the emotions. Do I still find myself to be an INTJ? Absolutely, because of how I interact with these emotions and how I let them effect me. I do sympathize with the 'protector' image, and I stand up for those who are getting picked on... but only if it isn't justified for them to be getting picked on/punished. I wont stand up for somebody if I feel they deserve it (it's the justice vs mercy argument). For most people that I don't know well, my sympathies are conditonal. If I know the person well and they mean a lot to me, it becomes more unconditional, and mercy begins to outway justice - which is still rational to me. It makes sense to protect the ones you care for, as an INTJ, I just don't extend this feeling toward every person alive.


(huge post, really sorry... got caught up in dispelling the negatives revolving around the diea of an INTJ)
Nice analysis. You seem to have a much lower T preference than me & a lot of INTJs. On the personality test I took on this site I got I,N, & T as extremes, the J part not so much XD. I'm not good at reading social cues, dislike emotional displays and emotions( they are too confusing!), don't believe in absolute morals, etc. It has always been this way for me. But I tested as INFJ..nope, I'm not XD. This was interesting to read though. The strength of the preferences greatly changes someone's character.
 

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My INTJ friend and I were having a discussion a while back about a scenario he was in.

There were a bunch of skinhead guys harassing this black guy because his girlfriend was white, and threatening to beat him up. As he was describing it, I found it interesting how we both had the same feelings of being riled up. As he described the situation my heart started beating really fast because of the emotions I was feeling over it, and I could tell that he was feeling the same way, especially when he talked about how he got involved, and I felt as though I would have done everything that he did. Though we never see eye to eye in terms of empathy, I don't think I've ever felt closer to him besides in that moment.

This is an interesting thread, considering I've often been mistaken for an INTJ.
Interesting...I've yet to experience this. How did you feel close to him and were able to put yourself in his mindset though? It all seems pretty fascinating to me =O
 

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I don't even know what cold means. It's part of a whole alien worldview.

INTJs have emotions. But it's just like...yeah, but get to the point. We never understand why people think their pain justifies acting jerkish or passive aggressive to someone. It's pain, whatever. If someone actually acted badly, they deserved repercussions, and your cruelty accomplishes something productive, then go for it. But pain....how is pain a reason to do anything? Pain is about yourself - you need a real reason to inflict it on other people. Ditto other emotions. Feelings are about you, they are a reaction to reality. It's the reality where we look for justifications for action.

We may not put your emotions on a pedestel (though we take them into consideration when we know what they are - they are data points) but we treat our own with the same lack of worship. We are also far more direct and almost never think in terms of hints, implications, non-verbal communication. 90% of the time we offend people is because they didn't listen to just our words, but assumed something else beyond what we actually said, since they're so used to communication being something other than simply words. We don't monitor the extras. Sometimes it seems like INFJs communicate through everything but words - the words are hardly relevant, the hints and the looks and meaningful silences are everything. And somehow people are expected to understand. Disorienting.
 

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I have read that INFJ preferes open ended systems more like religion and philosophy when figuring out things where an INTJ preferssystems and classifications.

also.
there is a distinct difference in work habits.
INTJ's can function much much better in the working world than an INFJ can.
INTJ's naturally work better with systems and actaully will find a job to be a natural part of who they are finding one in which to express their unique and creative fountain from within towards a system helps.

INFJ I think has a harder time because they bypass a system and shoot straight into the party scene. lol
 

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I suspect my older brother is INTJ, and "cold" is not a word I'd use to describe him. "Reserved" would be a better one. We're both reserved people, but he is so much so that, despite the fact that we're really close, I don't feel like I know him all that well below the surface. He has always been like that - even when he was a kid. He isn't particularly "tactful" the way that I am, though he's a great schmoozer when he has to be, and gets along with a lot of different types of people pretty well. And he's extremely good at seeing past the bullshit and getting to the core of something VERY quickly. The difference between him and me is that he will cut straight to the quick very bluntly, while I'm always trying to be "gentle."

And, as GreenCoyote said, he works well with "systems and classifications." He and I are very different in that respect - I thrive on open-ended systems and abstract concepts (hence, English major) - he likes things logical, rational, and defined. A perfect example is an instance in which he asked me to explain Postmodern theory to him. I went through this whole spiel, and his response was, "Huh...yeah, that sounds like a bunch of crap some snobby people made up to make me feel stupid at cocktail parties."

In fairness, he wasn't entirely wrong about that. :wink:
 
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